Received: (from ptownson@localhost) by massis.lcs.mit.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) id AAA15011; Tue, 4 May 1999 00:07:15 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 00:07:15 -0400 (EDT) From: editor@telecom-digest.org Message-Id: <199905040407.AAA15011@massis.lcs.mit.edu> To: ptownson Subject: TELECOM Digest V19 #70 TELECOM Digest Tue, 4 May 99 00:07:00 EDT Volume 19 : Issue 70 Inside This Issue: Editor: Patrick A. Townson Telecom Update (Canada) #181, May 3, 1999 (Angus TeleManagement) Book Review: "High Noon on the Electronic Frontier", Ludlow (Rob Slade) Slamming or Honest Mistake? (Andrew Hoerter) Re: A New SPAM Problem (Tara D. Mahon) Re: Telephone Pairs and Lines (Herb Stein) Re: "Internet Pioneers" (Dave Garland) Archives Update: Opera Browsers Now Included (TELECOM Digest Editor) TELECOM Digest is an electronic journal devoted mostly but not exclusively to telecommunications topics. It is circulated anywhere there is email, in addition to various telecom forums on a variety of networks such as Compuserve and America On Line, and other forums. It is also gatewayed to Usenet where it appears as the moderated newsgroup 'comp.dcom.telecom'. TELECOM Digest is a not-for-profit, mostly non-commercial educational service offered to the Internet by Patrick Townson. All the contents of the Digest are compilation-copywrited. You may reprint articles in some other media on an occassional basis, but please attribute my work and that of the original author. Contact information: Patrick Townson/TELECOM Digest Post Office Box 765 Junction City, KS 66441-0765 Phone: 415-520-9905 Email: editor@telecom-digest.org Subscribe/unsubscribe: subscriptions@telecom-digest.org This Digest is the oldest continuing e-journal on the Internet, having been founded in August, 1981 and published continuously since then. Our archives are available for your review/research. 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Please make at least a single donation to cover the cost of processing your name to the mailing list. All opinions expressed herein are deemed to be those of the author. Any organizations listed are for identification purposes only and messages should not be considered any official expression by the organization. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 12:11:18 -0400 From: Angus TeleManagement Subject: Telecom Update (Canada) #181, May 3, 1999 ************************************************************ * * * TELECOM UPDATE * * Angus TeleManagement's Weekly Telecom Newsbulletin * * http://www.angustel.ca * * Number 181: May 3, 1999 * * * * Publication of Telecom Update is made possible by * * generous financial support from: * * * * AT&T Canada ............... http://www.attcanada.com/ * * Bell Canada ............... http://www.bell.ca/ * * Lucent Technologies ....... http://www.lucent.ca/ * * MetroNet Communications ... http://www.metronet.ca/ * * Sprint Canada ............. http://www.sprintcanada.ca/ * * Telus Communications....... http://www.telus.com/ * * TigerTel Services ......... http://www.citydial.com/ * * * ************************************************************ IN THIS ISSUE: ** Shaw Buys Fundy Cable Operations ** ISPs Demand Cable Access, Charge Bad Faith ** CRTC Cautions Payphone Suppliers ** Nortel Says Canada's Taxes Drive Out "Scarce Skills" ** Mobility Companies Pass Three Million Subscribers ** BCE Buys Infosat ** Losses Grow at Iridium ** Clearnet Raises $729 Million ** CRTC Exempts Local Resellers From Equal Access ** Telehop to Sell Optel Local Service ** Number Portability For 500, 900 Service Codes ** Bell Pay Equity Hearing Ordered ** Open Text Ups Its Bid for PC Docs ** QuebecTel Restructures Local Rates ** Macdonald Dettwiler to Operate BC OnLine ** NBTel Employees Authorize Strike ** Consultants Elect New Officers ** First Quarter Financial Results BCE Nortel MetroNet MTT ** Secrets of Call Center Outsourcing ============================================================ SHAW BUYS FUNDY CABLE OPERATIONS: Fundy Communications has agreed to sell its New Brunswick/Nova Scotia cable television business (192,000 subscribers) and fiber network to Shaw Communications for $460 Million. ** Fundy shareholders have formed a new company, C1 Communications, which will continue Fundy's commercial telecom business in New Brunswick and Nova Scotia and extend it to Quebec and Ontario. C1 Communications has rights to use 50% of Fundy's former fiber capacity. ISPs DEMAND CABLE ACCESS, CHARGE BAD FAITH: The Canadian Association of Internet Providers has asked the CRTC to order cable TV companies to stop offering Internet service unless they allow other Internet Service Providers to use their facilities by June 1. ** In July 1998, the Commission ordered cablecos to allow third party access "as soon as possible." CAIP charges the Canadian Cable Television Association with deliberately delaying the process and negotiating in bad faith. CRTC CAUTIONS PAYPHONE SUPPLIERS: Noting that it has received hundreds of complaints and inquiries about the tactics of competitive payphone suppliers, the CRTC has issued a checklist of the payphone rules and consumer safeguards set by Decision 98-8. (See Telecom Update #140) http://www.crtc.gc.ca/eng/news/releases/1999/r990426e.htm http://www.crtc.gc.ca/internet/1998/8045/D98-08.doc NORTEL SAYS CANADA'S TAXES DRIVE OUT "SCARCE SKILLS": Nortel CEO John Roth says that while Nortel remains committed to Canada, high taxes make it hard for the company to attract and retain scarce skills. ** The company has appointed former U.S. Defense Secretary Frank Carlucci as Chairman and changed its official name from Northern Telecom Ltd. to Nortel Networks Corp. MOBILITY COMPANIES PASS THREE MILLION SUBSCRIBERS: The Mobility Canada companies report 109,000 net activations in the first quarter, up 79% from last year, raising their wireless subscriber total to 3,098,000. Mobility pagers now total 841,000, a 13% increase. BCE BUYS INFOSAT: BCE Media Business Solutions is paying $25 Million to buy Infosat Communications, a Vancouver-based provider of mobile and fixed satellite services. BCE says it will retain Infosat's President (Brian Nixon), staff, and brand. LOSSES GROW AT IRIDIUM: Iridium posted losses of US$505 Million in the first quarter on sales of US$1.45 Million. The satellite phone supplier has 10,000 customers worldwide; its head of marketing, Mauro Sentinelli, is leaving the company. CLEARNET RAISES $729 MILLION: Clearnet Communications has raised an additional $730 Million in debt, increasing the total raised in equity and debt since 1994 to $2.75 Billion. CRTC EXEMPTS LOCAL RESELLERS FROM EQUAL ACCESS: In Telecom Order 99-379, the CRTC exempts resellers of local phone service from the requirement to offer equal access to all long distance providers. http://www.crtc.gc.ca/internet/1999/8045/04/o99-0379.htm TELEHOP TO SELL OPTEL LOCAL SERVICE: Telehop Communications, a Toronto-based long distance carrier, has signed an agency agreement to offer local line service from Optel Communications to its customers. NUMBER PORTABILITY FOR 500, 900 SERVICE CODES: CRTC Public Notice 99-12 sets a framework for a CRTC Interconnection Steering Committee study of number portability for Canadian 500 and 900 Service Access Codes. To take part, register by May 10. http://www.crtc.gc.ca/internet/1999/8045/03/pn99-12.htm BELL PAY EQUITY HEARING ORDERED: The Canadian Human Rights Tribunal has ordered hearings into a pay equity dispute between the Communications, Energy and Paperworkers Union and Bell Canada. Bell had asked the Tribunal to delay action until the Supreme Court rules on its application to have the case dismissed. ** Bell and its striking employees, members of CEP, will resume bargaining today, under a media blackout. OPEN TEXT UPS ITS BID FOR PC DOCS: Open Text Corp, a Waterloo, Ont.-based software maker, has increased its bid for PC Docs Group International to $205 Million. Hummingbird has also bid for the Toronto firm, which makes information management software. (See Telecom Update #173) QUEBECTEL RESTRUCTURES LOCAL RATES: CRTC Telecom Order 99-378 approves restructured QuebecTel local rates of $23.50 (residential), $49.50 (business), $66.50 (business multi- line), and $46 (Centrex plus). http://www.crtc.gc.ca/internet/1999/8045/04/o99-0378.htm ** Overruling objections from Videotron, the Commission has deregulated Quebec-Telephone and Telebec's Datapac, X.25, packet data, and frame relay services. (Telecom Order 99-392) http://www.crtc.gc.ca/internet/1999/8045/04/o99-0392.htm MACDONALD DETTWILER TO OPERATE BC ONLINE: MacDonald Dettwiler is paying the BC Government $55 Million for a 10-year license to operate, develop, and market BC OnLine, the government's electronic information and payment system. NBTEL EMPLOYEES AUTHORIZE STRIKE: Members of the Communications, Energy and Paperworkers Union at NBTel, now negotiating a new contract, have voted to authorize strike action. CONSULTANTS ELECT NEW OFFICERS: On April 30, the Canadian Telecommunications Consultants Association (CTCA) elected new officers for the 1999-2000 year. Henry Dortmans (Angus Dortmans Associates) is President; Jeff Laskoski (Sierra Systems Consultants) is Vice-President; and Teresa Eng (Sovereign Technologies) is Vice-President and Secretary- Treasurer. http://www.ctca.ca FIRST QUARTER FINANCIAL RESULTS: ** BCE: BCE reports baseline earnings of $367 Million, up 14% from last year. Revenue (excluding Nortel Networks) rose 7%. Bell Canada's revenue from data services was up 16%; from long distance, down 9%; from local services, up marginally, based on a 3% increase in total lines. BCE Mobile revenue per subscriber dropped from $60 to $50 per month, in part because of difficulties with prepaid billing. ** Nortel: Nortel Networks' net income from operations rose 59% to US$222 Million, offset by a US$692 charge related to the Bay Networks purchase. Sales increased 26% to US4.4 Billion; sales in Canada rose 3%. ** MetroNet: Compared with the previous quarter, access lines in service increased 51% to 89,700; revenue increased 17% to $41 Million; EBITDA losses declined 2% to $9.06 Million. ** MTT: The Nova Scotia telco (formerly MT&T) posted net income of $12.0 Million, down 26% from last year. Revenues rose 2.3% to $173.4 Million; long distance revenues fell 14% SECRETS OF CALL CENTER OUTSOURCING: The May issue of Telemanagement, available this week, reports front-line experiences in building effective partnerships with call center outsourcers. Also in Telemanagement #165: ** Rob Slade examines what we have learned -- or failed to learn -- from the Melissa computer virus. ** Henry Dortmans tells how Yogi Berra helped him set right a puzzlingly dysfunctional call center. To subscribe to Telemanagement call 1-800-263-4415, ext 225 or visit http://www.angustel.ca/teleman/tm.html. ============================================================ HOW TO SUBMIT ITEMS FOR TELECOM UPDATE E-MAIL: editors@angustel.ca FAX: 905-686-2655 MAIL: TELECOM UPDATE Angus TeleManagement Group 8 Old Kingston Road Ajax, Ontario Canada L1T 2Z7 =========================================================== HOW TO SUBSCRIBE (OR UNSUBSCRIBE) TELECOM UPDATE is provided in electronic form only. There are two formats available: 1. The fully-formatted edition is posted on the World Wide Web on the first business day of the week at http://www.angustel.ca/update/up.html 2. The e-mail edition is distributed free of charge. To subscribe, send an e-mail message to majordomo@angustel.ca. The text of the message should contain only the two words: subscribe update To stop receiving the e-mail edition, send an e-mail message to majordomo@angustel.ca. The text of the message should say only: unsubscribe update [Your e-mail address] =========================================================== COPYRIGHT AND DISCLAIMER: All contents copyright 1999 Angus TeleManagement Group Inc. All rights reserved. For further information, including permission to reprint or reproduce, please e-mail rosita@angustel.ca or phone 905-686-5050 ext 225. The information and data included has been obtained from sources which we believe to be reliable, but Angus TeleManagement makes no warranties or representations whatsoever regarding accuracy, completeness, or adequacy. Opinions expressed are based on interpretation of available information, and are subject to change. If expert advice on the subject matter is required, the services of a competent professional should be obtained. ============================================================ ------------------------------ From: Rob Slade Organization: Vancouver Institute for Research into User Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 08:30:43 -0800 Subject: Book Review: "High Noon on the Electronic Frontier", Peter Ludlow Reply-To: rslade@sprint.ca BKHGHNON.RVW 990320 "High Noon on the Electronic Frontier", Peter Ludlow, 1996, 0-262-62103-7, U$32.50 %E Peter Ludlow ludlow@well.com %C 55 Hayward Street, Cambridge, MA 02142-1399 %D 1996 %G 0-262-62103-7 %I MIT Press %O U$32.50 800-356-0343 manak@mit.edu www-mitpress.mit.edu %P 536 p. %T "High Noon on the Electronic Frontier" I found Ludlow's account of the creation of this volume very interesting. Wanting material for a course on philosophical issues in cyberspace, he turned first to the more academic readings in computer ethics. Having read most of these myself, I am not surprised that the project was not a raging success. Undaunted, he turned to a very interesting source for content: the net itself. Actually, the versions appearing in the book primarily appeared in print journals of one sort or another, but usually developed drafts on the net first. In any case, the authors all have direct experience of online life, and opinions that are generally more passionate than academic. The material covers many points of view, and, where possible, contrasting positions are presented. For example, a well researched and articulate couple of papers, one an official institutional brief, is just slightly less impressive when someone comes along and points out that the quotations cited are taken very much out of context. Because of the personal nature of many of the documents, they are much more readable and interesting than "surveys" or "position papers" with all the juice drained out. Given the informal nature of the texts, Ludlow has done a very superior job of collecting the most articulate of the available content, although, in an attempt to represent all points of view, a few less convincing voices are included. Not all the articles are that good, but the number of pedestrian items of standard magazine fodder are few. The essays are grouped under the topics of intellectual property and rights, system intrusion, encryption and privacy, censorship, and the self online. Intellectual property and system intrusion are covered very well, with good presentations for opposing positions. Encryption is rather one sided, and the additional topic of privacy is not addressed terribly well. Censorship is likewise viewed from a single perspective. The section on self is the weakest in the book. Most of the pieces are personal, as might be expected, but also tend to deal only with a single system, and do not get into larger, more conceptual, issues. Two do stand out: Julian Dibbell's rather classic "A Rape in Cyberspace" and James DiGiovanna's excellent "Losing Your Voice on the Internet" that deserves to be more widely known. While there are some gaps that could be filled, overall this serves the purpose very well: it is a good series of discussion starters, written by people who know the online world well. copyright Robert M. Slade, 1999 BKHGHNON.RVW 990320 ====================== (quote inserted randomly by Pegasus Mailer) rslade@vcn.bc.ca rslade@sprint.ca slade@victoria.tc.ca p1@canada.com GOVERNMENT.SYS corrupted, reboot Ottawa? (Y/N) http://victoria.tc.ca/techrev or http://sun.soci.niu.edu/~rslade ------------------------------ From: ahoerter@netcom.com (Andrew Hoerter) Subject: Slamming or Honest Mistake? Organization: Netcom Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 14:28:56 GMT Recently I got an up-close and personal view of just how tangled this "consumer choice" idea has become in the telecom world ... Prior to the 4th of April, I received both local and long distance service from one company, which I'll call Company A. On the 28th of April, I received a phone bill from Company A with $5 of change fees to alter my interstate and intraLATA carrier, which had suddenly become Company B. Having given no verbal or written authorization for this change to take place, I called Company A to inquire what had happened. They informed me that on April 4th a letter of authorization was received from Company B ordering the transferral. Upon calling Company B, I learned that it wasn't really Company B's problem, but rather Company C's (apparently C purchases trunk space or billing services from B). C's service department was closed over the weekend, so this morning I called and finally got someone who agreed to look into the matter. After a three-way conference call between myself, the rep from C, and another rep from A, it transpired that my phone number had somehow become attached to a local business in my prefix which had an account with C. C's rep claimed that this must have been a mistake on A's part for not realizing that my line was residential, while the A rep contested that they were merely acting on the LOA from B, and that the transfer charges on my bill were being charged by proxy on behalf of C. I never said the word "slam" once, but the reps from A and C proceeded to argue (with me on the line) about what had happened, whose fault it was, and whether or not I had in fact been slammed. Finally the rep from A decided to be more professional and simply asked for my desired carrier, saying that she would take it from there. I'm still not sure what happened or whether I was slammed, but I definitely gained some insight into the degree of squabbling and infighting between carriers for each customer dollar. Perhaps placing a freeze on my account would prevent this in the future, but I'm unsure as to whether even that would protect against a LOA that appears to be valid. -andrew | amh@pobox.com "Head transplantation is not theologically inconsistent with any of the Catholic Church's tenets." -- Robert West [TELECOM Digest Editor's Note: A freeze would be a good way to start; like so many other things relating to the telephone network these days it would probably work most of the time, enough that you would not have to worry about every agressive telemarketer that called you. Things are agressive and tough in the telecom business these days. Regardless of how big the pie might have been to start with, I am thinking maybe they have cut too many slices out of it now. Too many carriers, with all their marketing services working for them, grabbing customers from each other as quickly as they can. Prices have come down so much that very few customers see any significant difference, regardless of which carrier, sub-carrier, marketing agency or MLM 'downline' they go through to purchase their long distance service. In another related item, I see where Qwest Communications in Denver, and its recently acquired LCI International are being sued for about 25 million dollars by National Communications Network in Chattanooga, TN, based on allegations by NCN that Qwest stole thousands of their customers by illegally converting them from being NCN customers serviced by Qwest to direct accounts of Qwest itself. I'll say more about this in a day or so here. The lawsuit was filed in mid-February. PAT ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 11:13:21 -0400 From: Tara D. Mahon Reply-To: tara@insight-corp.com Organization: The Insight Research Corporation Subject: Re: A New SPAM Problem Ben Bass wrote: > My employer received a number of unsolicited, junk faxes this > morning. Earlier this year we received a phone call from someone claiming to be the "International Business Directory" asking us if we wished to "renew our listing." (Renew? We never listed in the first place. A similar squirrel-y sales pitch for photocopiers begins like this: "could you go over to your copier and check the model number for me...". Both sales geniuses expect a receptionist or intern who don't necessarily know any better to answer the phone and give them the information they need to make their pitch.) When we asked several questions to probe further, we found out that this is a directory of fax numbers and it costs around $144 to be listed for two years. The price includes a copy of the directory. We said no, immediately remove us from your directory entirely. The calls are definitely being made from a large call center operation, you can hear the monotonous script echoing. Then a few weeks later, we became innundated with unsolicited faxes. Realtors, travel agents, vending companies, MLMs, work-at-home-get- rich-quick etc. They all go in the recycling bin. Eventually, the faxes thinned out and we receive maybe one fax per month now. We have not been able to locate this fax directory, but believe our information has been printed against our wishes. If anyone is familiar with this directory, please send me the details so we can contact them. Thanks, Tara D. Mahon tara@insight-corp.com The Insight Research Corp. http://www.insight-corp.com (973) 605-1400 phone [TELECOM Digest Editor's Note: Oh Tara, listen, by now some other bunch of charlatans have purchased a copy of the book you were asked to buy, and they are busy copying it all over so they can sell it as their fax directory. You will be listed forever in the thing. About two years ago I found a copy of a fax directory that someone had pitched in the trash as worthless, and took it home with me to look at. Guess what? It had an *old* fax number of mine in it from six or seven years prior; a number that I had not had for at least a few years. And as for the copy machine toner and paper supply racket, I sure hope none of the readers here fall for that one. Talk about social engineering! The receptionist at a large company gets a phone call that goes like this: 'Oh hi, honey, this is mumble.I handle the toner and paper purchases for the copy machines.' (implying, but not actually stating at the large company). 'Would you do me a favor and go get the serial number and model number from the copy machine for me? I need to make sure we have the right kind of toner and paper in stock.' The receptionist, probably not the brightest person in the world herself goes to get the information and supplies it to the caller. The next day, or maybe a couple hours later a call comes for the person in the company who purchases copy machine supplies. The caller is already armed with all the details, etc and delivers a pitch saying they have been authorized by the company (where you got your copy machine) to provide you with the 'surplus inventory' if you want it for some price. They have been running that scam for at least twenty years. Then there are the compilers of toll-free directories who gather their data by just dialing one toll free number after another in rotation, and writing down whatever answer phrase was given; i.e. 'Good Morning, this is the Acme Universal Corporation.' Usually they have an autodialer make the calls and tape record whatever is said in the first twenty seconds or so before hanging up and moving on to the next number. Then later the names are punched into the computer by people listening to the little twenty second taped replies one after the other. Naturally some of the responses are unclear, or perhaps the number does not answer or was busy. If repeated automatic attempts to get something fail, then a human bean works on the leftovers. So if your 800 number rings sometime, you answer, and an anonymous man on the other end demands to know, 'who is this, what company did I reach?' you will provide an appropriate answer phrase, I am sure. Try not to be too profane. PAT] ------------------------------ From: herb@herbstein.com (Herb Stein) Subject: Re: Telephone Pairs and Lines Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 16:37:19 GMT Organization: newsread.com ISP News Reading Service (http://www.newsread.com) In article , Curt V wrote: > Hey, as long as you are talking about lines to a house, I have been > trying to find one of the old devices that Bell used to use which > allows two POTS lines to be muxed together over one pair of wires so that > they could actually be used at the same time. I have an application > that doesn't allow me to use a digital line (e.g., ISDN BRI) and I > can't pull another pair of wires into the location. Anyone have any > idea where I can find one of those? There were/are various different type of hardware. AML (added Main line I believe) was, I'm pretty sure, analog. Western Electric made a SLC-1 which may have been digital. AFAIK, Southwestern only uses digital stuff today. There was also a couple of different type of 5 and 6 channel carrier systems used in the rural areas to drop a circuit at widely seperated locations along a cable route. They were also probably analog. I must be getting old. I used to design these things as an outside plant engineer with SWBT but that was 20 years ago. Herb Stein The Herb Stein Group herb@herbstein.com 314 215-3584 ------------------------------ From: dave.garland@wizinfo.com (Dave Garland) Date: 02 May 99 22:44:50 -0600 Subject: Re: "Internet Pioneers" Organization: Wizard Information Robert Eden asked: > UUCP - (anyone update the maps lately?) Still in occasional use. This post will leave my server by UUCP. There's a mailing list I can't unsubscribe from because the list manager software looks in the header and retrieves a bangpath address (wizinfo!dave.garland@inet-serv.com), then says it can't unsubscribe me because I'm not subscribed under that name. RE> FIDONET - BBS network ... Still around, though ailing. (I run one myself.) Remember when a Fidonet address was the Internet's email gateway to most of Africa? Dave dave.garland@wizinfo.com [TELECOM Digest Editor's Note: I sure do remember when Africa was served by Fidonet and as a sort of flip-flop to how things were usually done with everyone coming into Internet gateways to send email, we had to come to you guys to get email to Africa. It left a situation where if someone on Bitnet wanted to send email to Africa, they had to come through the Bitnet gateway to Internet, *use the first line of the text area as an additional address line* and there, give the Internet gateway address to Fidonet and the appropriate Fidonet zone and node information. Regards your inability to get off the mailing list because of the way the list software handles your request, I would suggest in this one instance try writing the moderator or maintainer of the list personally and ask if he would force it out for you. Or perhaps a note to postmaster@inet-serv.com asking if he would kindly reformat your address in a way his list server software would understand and then just 'drop it in the top' ... I used to get that sort of thing frequently for the Telecom Archives Email-FTP server where a so-called 'smart mailer' along the way somewhere would see a UUCP 'bang' address and re-arrange things to suit itself as the mail was passed along. The person would never get a reply from the archives because my scripts could not understand who to respond to. But when mail daemon returned it to me undeliverable, (I use extensive filter rules saying what I want done with email from 'postmaster' 'mail daemon' and several other automated things) I could generally look at the log where his original entry was, and reconstruct it enough to make up his request myself. Then, since my scripts for the server sit right in one of my own directories, it was simple enough to just cat my reconstructed file of his request down the pipe into the top of the script. The script saw no difference between his stream and mine, it just started filling the order. The only difference is I had to forge his address to it, taking care to backslash or escape anything in the address that might have had special meaning to the shell or caused the script or shell to become confused. Then the log entry would say response to (whoever) forced by ptownson and the date, etc. None of that happens much now, with standarized addresses for most people. Your example is one reason I *refuse totally* to automate the mailing list for TELECOM Digest. Oh yes, I have some small scripts called 'add' and 'delete' which do as they imply by appending $1 and $2 to the list, as in 'add joeblow@spamhive.com "Joe Blow 050399". It automat- ically mails out new user files, resorts the list in a way that sendmail seems happiest with, etc. If I say 'delete joeblow@spamhive.com' that script will do grep - v the mailing list, meaning find everyone on the list *but* Mr. Blow, leave him out of it, get rid of the empty line where he used to be, show me who you deleted to make sure it is correct, then cat my goodbye letter piped through sendmail to Mr. Blow and be sure to add an X-warning saying that 'user ptownson set -f to editor@telecom-digest.org'. Oh how I hate that and wish LCS/MIT would quit doing it. The old version of sendmail never did it. I think some sites are around that sit there watching for X-warnings that 'user set -f' (meaning a user forced sendmail to change his name and address for that mailing, as I do when I sent things to you) so that they can bounce the mail to postmaster@lcs.mit.edu to snitch on me saying 'we do not accept spam mail'. I should not complain too much I guess, I am the guest of LCS, not the other way around. I even got automated email once sent to abuse@telecom-digest.org and cc'd to postmaster@telecom-digest.org asking them to 'make your user ptownson quit spamming us every day'. I wrote back (forcing sendmail to refer to me as 'abuser@telecom-digest.org') to tell the site I would take care of it immediatly. "I will close Mr. Townson's account, tar up his directories and send them to him in South America, where he went when he ran off with all the money sent to him by people reading Usenet. He Made Money Fast on the Web you know ... " At the bottom of the email I added a bogus little anchor to a non-existent link which said 'click here to enter your credit card information'. I got email back from a live person saying, 'something does not sound quite right here ...' I said, 'oh really?' ... I do not want my mailing list automated. Too many things can go wrong. I want it where I can see it, and look for problems with it and the people on it, even if I do have to administer it with scripts which I manually start. I read add and delete requests from readers closely. PAT] ------------------------------ From: TELECOM Digest Editor Subject: Archives Update: Opera Browsers Now Included Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 23:00:00 EDT As of today, the script which drives /telecom-archives/index.html has been adjusted so that users of Opera 3.0 or later browsers can participate. Any other browsers I should consider? I would think that IE4/5, Netscape 4 or better, Opera 3.0 and Lynx would cover almost everything. Should I look at Mosaic also? Feel free to dump the script to your end if you want to look at it or consider it for use on your own sites, etc. There are still a few buggy things in it; I will discuss those later. When I say /telecom-archives/index.html of course I am referring to directories here on massis which answer to calls made to http://telecom-digest.org PAT ------------------------------ End of TELECOM Digest V19 #70 *****************************