Subj : Re: The Mystery Almost Solved To : Michael Grant From : Jeff Snyder Date : Fri Jul 03 2009 01:40 pm On 07/03/09, Jeff Snyder quoted Michael Grant: The Mystery Almost Solved. MG> It very likely is nitrates in the substrate that's the problem, but it's a MG> lot bigger problem than a turkey baster or a gravel vaccum (which I /have/ MG> used recently) can take care of. That's why I need to do a teardown, to MG> remove the substrate and completely clean it, in order to get the situation MG> under control. Just curious...Do you use undergravel filters in your tanks? When I setup my 45-gallon tank again this past April, I decided to forego using a UGF, and just laid down a sand substrate, over which I built a rock pile full of tunnels and caves from one end of the tank to the other. All of the large base rocks sit on smaller support rocks, which sit directly on the glass bottom. This allows water flow under and all around the rocks. As for the sand, my fish are constantly moving it and stirring it up, so there are no anaerobic pockets as far as I know. Between my filtration system -- two Penguin 330 Bio-Wheels each powered by a Penguin 1140 powerhead -- and weekly water changes of 25% or more, my nitrate level has been very good at 0 to 12.5 mg/l. In fact, I never saw it that good in an established tank when I was using UGF's. In addition to my turkey baster technique, I also stay on top of making sure that the filter pads don't become excessively clogged. Just a few thoughts for your consideration. Jeff Snyder, SysOp - Armageddon BBS Visit us at endtimeprophecy.org port 23 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Your Download Center 4 Mac BBS Software & Christian Files. We Use Hermes II --- Hermes Web Tosser 1.1 * Origin: Armageddon BBS -- Guam, Mariana Islands (1:345/3777.0) .