[22:00] melkor: not what I'd call violent ...
[22:00] Global announcement from wushin: ok I'd like to call this meeting to order.
[22:00] Kaska sticks a tree up wushin's farting place ... :)
[22:00] wushin: First on the list. The Holiday.
[22:01] wushin: We are working on this currently and attempting to get it in by sometime next week.
[22:01] wushin: We have a couple of different things going on in there this year.
[22:01] wushin: You may see familiar faces asking for help
[22:01] wushin: And new faces appearing with new problems.
[22:02] wushin: The General Plot line follows previous years of Jenalya's Quests
[22:02] iceslice: I won't mind helping to my best
[22:02] wushin: As she is the one who left is with the story
[22:03] wushin: We kept the Naughty/Nice theme to the quest lines.
[22:03] wushin: So rewards will change based on your behavior
[22:03] wushin: not more or less
[22:03] wushin: but different
[22:03] Kaska is very naughty girl... :)
[22:03] wushin: For example: Nice will get something like Iron Ore
[22:04] wushin: Naughty would get Coal
[22:04] wushin: So comparable
[22:04] wushin: but you'll have to alter your behavoirs to figure out which you want
[22:04] wushin: Some of the Holiday Quests are under discussion to stay year round.
[22:05] wushin: As it's a shame to waste such quests like helping get stuff to wrap presents
[22:05] Qwerty Dragon: One that gives turtleneck sweater would be nice year round
[22:05] wushin: Granted it will be left such that a Holiday can still go one along side it
[22:05] wushin: Some of the regular quest NPCs have had content extended
[22:06] wushin: Speaking of Turleneck Sweater
[22:06] dragonslayer alex: i am on mana plus but my buy and sell iss not showing up
[22:06] wushin: So that players who finished last years can redo it again for a New Reward.
[22:06] o11c: at least easter is already fully redoable
[22:07] wushin: Like I said Some parts will stay in to some extent.
[22:07] wushin: So Some Quest NPCs will Allow you to Repeat
[22:07] wushin: Like Dailys
[22:07] wushin: But a chance at random list of awards
[22:08] wushin: Easter is also a bit easier
[22:08] wushin: Also on that note
[22:09] wushin: We are working on adding Timed, festive flavor to the cities for the Holiday
[22:09] Octer: Good night all!
[22:09] MadCamel: I want a santa hat that just sounds like a jackhammer the entire time you wear it.
[22:09] wushin: As we want to signal to Players New and Old it has begun
[22:10] wushin: MadCamel Move to NY, NY
[22:10] wushin: All the hats will sound like that.
[22:10] Qwerty Dragon: festive lights in windows of buildings?
[22:10] wushin: With luck.
[22:10] wushin: Currently we are just working on Putting a Tree up in each city
[22:10] SecretMogge: liking this
[22:11] wushin: So good news Confused Tree you'll be getting a upgrade
[22:11] wushin: granted not the same tree
[22:11] Qwerty Dragon: love that big x-mas tree
[22:11] wushin: As the one in nivalis has snow
[22:11] wushin: but the cities are being looked over for a tree.
[22:11] SecretMogge: prsn
[22:11] SecretMogge: prsm
[22:11] wushin: So you might see a christmas Palm in Tulimshar
[22:11] SecretMogge: cool
[22:12] wushin: Thats what we have currently for holidays.
[22:12] wushin: Questions on the Holidays?
[22:12] wushin: poo
[22:12] wushin: Wait
[22:12] wushin: Forgot about the new mobs for Holidays
[22:12] SecretMogge: ooh
[22:12] Tintin_: hi young
[22:13] wushin: As per last Meeting and Fothers work we have a couple new mobs for the holiday events
[22:13] MadCamel: not to interrupt but it could be cool to make the trees NPCs(would have to anyway, right?) and players have to do a group-quest to enable them. Something to bring everyone together for a goal, but not too hard to implement. Random thought. Carry on.
[22:13] SecretMogge: awesome !
[22:13] wushin: Candied Slime and Pollett
[22:13] wushin: MadCamel They will be NPCs
[22:13] wushin: So yeah, wouldn't be hard/
[22:13] Hello=): MadCamel nice idea ☺
[22:13] wushin: Just need someone to code
[22:13] SecretMogge: i caaaaaaaaan't waaaait for this
[22:13] wushin: er script
[22:14] wushin: The Candied Slime is to help offset the burden of the SantaSlime/ReinSlime drops
[22:14] wushin: and provide a bit more challenge then mashing x
[22:14] wushin: The Pollett is planned to be summonable
[22:14] wushin: and it's a Penguin
[22:15] wushin: moves on diagonals and looks reall cute
[22:15] wushin: makes ya want to stick um
[22:15] wushin: The Pollett will be staying year round, but making it's first appearence in the Holiday release
[22:15] wushin: Candied Slime might only be holiday.
[22:15] melkor: ummm ,,, is that the one that looks like Gunther?
[22:16] wushin: NO, it's a completely different penguin that happens to look like him.
[22:16] wushin: but yeah. that one
[22:16] wushin: We have it smaller and to better size now
[22:16] wushin: Before it stood as tall as a preson
[22:16] wushin: Now it's a bit bigger then a fluffy
[22:16] melkor: cute
[22:17] wushin: Ok, so thats Holiday.
[22:17] wushin: Questions on Holiday?
[22:17] Ablu: when do i get holiday?
[22:17] SecretMogge: Again .. i caaaaaaaaan't waaaait for this
[22:17] Ablu: i am having far too less time. i would like to have holiday too
[22:17] wushin: Well Hopefully next week
[22:17] medave: which holiday
[22:18] wushin: The one for December
[22:18] iceslice: holidays are weekends only
[22:18] wushin: ok, no real questions?
[22:18] iceslice: well
[22:18] Ablu: na. weekend is work for me atm :/
[22:18] medave: oh that jewish one with the candle stand thingy
[22:18] HariRama: we already got candle helmet for it
[22:18] wushin: lol
[22:18] MadCamel: just need a flock of 8 players. All good.
[22:18] SecretMogge: wushin thanks for info
[22:19] medave: now we need matches
[22:19] Hello=): wushin would you consider some idea of MadCamel with multiplayer quests to enable trees, etc? Sounds like nice idea ☺
[22:19] wushin: I'd pose for the CandleHelmetObra
[22:19] wushin: If he can script it.
[22:19] wushin: Currently we are kinda slammed.
[22:19] wushin: As Cassy^ and Tux started continuing Tulimshar
[22:19] Mannekepis: wushin Gone by there a christmas Quest?
[22:19] wushin: Which is next topic
[22:20] MadCamel: Me too, with non-tmw stuff. End of the year's always rough. Oh well.. Save that one for the ideabox unless a player here wants to turn developer :)
[22:20] wushin: next year
[22:20] wushin: there is always next year
[22:20] medave: downgrading warriors and archers more
[22:20] wushin: ok, next topic
[22:21] wushin: New Map/Mobs in Tulimshar being done
[22:21] wushin: once again Fother gave us a new mob
[22:21] HariRama: is it true that cassy is a guy irl?
[22:21] wushin: A long overdue one for this game IMO
[22:21] o11c: HariRama: doesn't act like one ...
[22:22] wushin: Rule of the Internets state everyone is a dude on internet even the women
[22:22] o11c: but haven't done video chat yet
[22:22] HariRama: ^^ naughty rumor
[22:22] wushin: ANYWAYS
[22:22] veryape: wushin: btw, if you need testers better warn them now
[22:22] wushin: The New area will be under the current slime hive SW of Tulimshar
[22:22] veryape: since the forum email notification stuff still don't work?
[22:23] wushin: veryape save bug reporting for later I'll get to it
[22:23] wushin: any whoo
[22:23] wushin: the new area will be southwest of tulimshar in the new are tux added deeper underground
[22:23] wushin: it will add some mobs your are used to seeing
[22:23] HariRama: u heard of a brown t. nexk shirt or do you want to keep spoilers for now?
[22:23] wushin: but the new long overdue mob that TMW needed along time ago is The Troll
[22:24] MadCamel: oh. You mean lamb?
[22:24] Star Cinderweb: what lvl will the new area be made for?
[22:24] wushin: The new area will be meant to for 60-80
[22:24] wushin: primarly helping fill out alternative areas to farm Xp with more quests
[22:25] wushin: As 60-80 seems to be a struggle for people
[22:25] wushin: If you have questions or comments about that please bug Cassy or Tux
[22:26] wushin: The main purpose of that is to spread some of the levels out to cause more interaction amongst the maps and players
[22:26] wushin: Granted Hurnscald is currently the sitting capital
[22:26] wushin: but I understand that happens in a MMORPG
[22:27] medave: when will we start getting exp for sitting here?
[22:27] wushin: haha
[22:27] Hello=): medave you gain daily points already :P
[22:27] wushin: Sitting is already OP it needs to be nerfed
[22:27] ebattleon: maybe the gm's need to move ops
[22:27] ebattleon: to tulim
[22:27] wushin: meh, GMs go where players are
[22:27] wushin: players go where the action is
[22:28] HariRama: Villain suggested once gaining the sitting skill only at 99
[22:28] wushin: gotta make more action like the GYs and Candor
[22:28] Hello=): oh, idle kick like on DM servers :)
[22:28] Hello=): just a joke :))
[22:28] wushin: The main point of new development is enticing you players to new areas
[22:29] Hello=): [22:28] wushin: gotta make more action like the GYs and Candor <- Like illia would be the best.
[22:29] wushin: yerp more group action is planned
[22:29] ebattleon: how about more town raids.?
[22:29] MadCamel: it'd be cool if some people could spend their idle time in tulimshar. To a noob, TMW looks like a barren desert wasteland.
[22:29] wushin: Almost all the developers love the concepts and gameplay of illia
[22:29] wushin: MadCamel Right
[22:29] Hello=): wushin speaking of group actions.... maybe make Cindy repeatable?
[22:29] wushin: then they get stuck there
[22:29] o11c: hm ... just a thought: should resetting your stats have some sort of serious penalty instead of money?
[22:29] Hello=): but of course without extra rewards?
[22:30] wushin: So next topic
[22:30] Hello=): players start Cindy with never-winning mules anyway.
[22:30] Hello=): and it's team action... ☺
[22:30] wushin: Ideas -> Concepts -> ? -> Profit
[22:30] MadCamel: o11c: Maybe when game balance doesn't require 2-3 stat resets(at least!) through the lifetime of the character..
[22:30] wushin: Ideas -> Concepts -> ? -> Profit
[22:30] wushin: So you notice all these ideas
[22:31] wushin: floating around everywhere
[22:31] medave: doing cindy like candor would work as an option to making multiple chars
[22:31] Hello=): [22:30] o11c: hm ... just a thought: should resetting your stats have some sort of serious penalty instead of money? <- losing couple of levels :))
[22:31] wushin: currently I love the discussion but most methods the dev team have tried haven;t worked well
[22:31] o11c: MadCamel: it would still be cheap enough that you can afford to do it occasionally
[22:31] wushin: Most idea/art/concepts get buried on the forums
[22:31] melkor: resetting stats is one of the things which allows players to change classes at will, that;s a major advantage in rmw. why destroy that?
[22:31] melkor: *tmw
[22:31] o11c: just because everybody does it, doesn't mean it's not an exploit
[22:32] wushin: I'm still looking for a better way to get a strong Feedback loop into content
[22:32] o11c: "lose 1 level" would probably be fair (though not popular)
[22:32] Hello=): [22:31] wushin: Most idea/art/concepts get buried on the forums <- well, there is no bug tracker or something like that to keep it organized...
[22:32] o11c: maybe save that idea for the next world
[22:32] o11c: we have a bugtracker
[22:32] medave: raise the gp cost more on higher levels
[22:32] wushin: Correct you can open issues on Github
[22:32] ebattleon: but do you have an idea tracker
[22:32] wushin: if there is a bug in the client or server data
[22:33] wushin: No we do not have a good way to collect ideas
[22:33] Hello=): [22:32] o11c: "lose 1 level" would probably be fair (though not popular) <- hmm, well, maybe old time players would not mind leveling a bit? ☺
[22:33] wushin: nor impliment them
[22:33] Hello=): [22:32] wushin: Correct you can open issues on Github <- it's piece of sh*t, not a bugtracker. Unusable to track bugs and features requests.
[22:33] medave: would be a heck of a penaty for a level 99 player
[22:33] Hello=): [22:33] medave: would be a heck of a penaty for a level 99 player <- just 99M XP to go :)
[22:33] MadCamel: #itenplz
[22:34] melkor: lose 1 level's okay, i thought you meant something on the lines of losing some character points
[22:34] wushin: Everything seems terrible but its the best tool I know we have available
[22:34] Hello=): since I've got 300M extra xP, its not like if I would mind getting 99M once more.
[22:34] o11c: no, nothing permanent
[22:34] melkor: then that's quite a nice idea
[22:35] MadCamel: experience shows me that good ideas filter through anyway, even without an issue tracker. It's hard to forget the really good ideas.
[22:35] HariRama: still at higher levels its a huge penalty
[22:35] wushin: On that note, I'm quite open to better ways to manage ideas -> concept.
[22:35] medave: we should probably reset everyone to level 0 every 6 months too
[22:35] wushin: AS currently trello works fine for WIP and Beyond
[22:35] Hello=): [22:34] o11c: no, nothing permanent <- to my taste these resets are quite synthetic thing and should not be that easy (er, okay, guess some players would eat me alive for this)
[22:35] wushin: It's just the Reqs and CPT get buried
[22:35] o11c: no I just need to see if level-down actually works
[22:36] Hello=): wushin I've attempted to use github tracker on other project with nearly zero success. Worst bugtracker ever, IMO.
[22:36] medave: and randomly delete invys
[22:36] Ablu: Hello=) github is a better bugtracker than the forums :)
[22:36] MadCamel: use reddit. Make a TMW subreddit. People can up/downvote ideas, and post status updates in the comments.
[22:36] Ablu: also githubs bugtracker is quite fine
[22:36] o11c: I've never used reddit ... it does have some really nice traits though
[22:36] MadCamel: zero administration overhead and simple.
[22:37] o11c: as somebody who actually works on and investigates bugs, I haven't hit any limits on github issues
[22:37] veryape: as much as i love reddit i think this project has things going on in to many different places as is
[22:37] wushin: Well if you have a proposal, please submit it with a working example we can all look over
[22:37] MadCamel: and yes veryape I kinda agree.
[22:37] Ablu: o11c: file upload was annoying for a long time
[22:37] veryape: make a trello suggestion board that is free for all?
[22:37] Hello=): [22:37] o11c: as somebody who actually works on and investigates bugs, I haven't hit any limits on github issues <- because you havent attempted to FILE them and track their state...
[22:37] Ablu: o11c: and users cannot set any tags
[22:37] o11c: I've filed plenty of bugs on github
[22:38] wushin: Well if we started to use github we would have to be more proactive about it.
[22:38] Hello=): there're literally no filters (or I failed to find ones?) and overall it's so simplistic and crappy it could work for some "hello world" things but not more than that
[22:39] o11c: what do you mean by filters?
[22:39] Hello=): Even simplistic mantis is far more usable as I can immediately see fate of bugs I've entered, etc.
[22:39] wushin: Cassy!
[22:39] MadCamel: bridges to be crossed when we come to them. Don't waste time/resources on better tools unless there is an explicit and pressing need. If I setup a real issue tracker right now, nobody would use it. Too complicated. Yet another thing to keep track of.
[22:39] Cassy: what did i miss?
[22:40] wushin: The whole meeting
[22:40] o11c: we stopped using mantis
[22:40] o11c: because it wasn't doing us any good
[22:40] Hello=): For example bugs created by me. Or closed bugs. Or active. Or unassigned, Etc.
[22:40] Cassy: yeah, sorry told you i will be late :(
[22:40] wushin: I talked about the holidays Cassy and What you and Tux are doing
[22:40] o11c: thought you would be here 40 minutes ago
[22:40] Ablu: you can filter that stuff
[22:40] Ablu: well not sure about assignment
[22:40] wushin: Cassy if you want to explain whats going on with that we be all ears
[22:40] o11c: I tried casting #kaCassy but it didn't work
[22:40] Ablu: but other things works
[22:41] Ablu: by assignee also works
[22:41] Cassy: explaining right now or would i interupt a different topic?
[22:41] Ablu: gn8
[22:41] wushin: Ablu and o11c are debating the merits of bugtracking with git
[22:41] MadCamel: we're just arguing the merits of our favorite bug tracking systems. go ahead
[22:41] Hello=): [22:40] o11c: because it wasn't doing us any good <- well, okay. Though I can remember I used it to file bugs and it worked mostly. But it has been about 3+ years ago though.
[22:42] Cassy: o11c: the correct spell should be #kassy iirc
[22:42] wushin: ok, let Cassy speak
[22:43] ebattleon: is cassy spaking?
[22:43] MadCamel: yes, very quietly
[22:43] ebattleon: oh
[22:43] Cassy: no big deal, tux and me created a new map which will fill the big hole between high level maps (mainly graveyard) and low level maps
[22:44] Cassy: comparing exp gain from mops there is a huge hole between e.g. snakes and skeletons
[22:44] Cassy: we want to fill this hole
[22:44] MadCamel: (heh)
[22:44] wushin: yeah, stuff that hole
[22:44] Cassy: new mobs will be "undead witch" (name not 100% sure yet) and a troll, created by Fother
[22:45] HariRama: sausage witch?
[22:45] Cassy: not that one :D
[22:45] MadCamel: well I'll be happy to see it. You two are a class act, both of you. Mobs by Fother is some extra-sweet icing on the cake too
[22:45] TasogareAkira: will the troll be 10 times larger than players
[22:46] wushin: no but the damn sapheart will be
[22:46] TasogareAkira: heh
[22:46] Cassy: :)
[22:46] wushin: Fother is working on finishing that as well
[22:46] melkor: is the sapheart really going to be ingame?
[22:46] wushin: With any luck
[22:47] wushin: Mind you I'm crazy as hell
[22:47] TasogareAkira: don't know if anyone here remembers shinobi on sega genesis but there were bosses that took up like half the screen
[22:47] wushin: I remember Shinobi in the arcade before the genesis existing.
[22:47] wushin: I'm a old man.
[22:47] TasogareAkira: heh
[22:48] MadCamel: there's an ongoing push to get all finished high-quality art into the game (if compatible)
[22:48] TasogareAkira: I'm 27, and I never played arcades only consoles
[22:48] wushin: My first RPG was Ultima IV on the c-64
[22:48] ebattleon: vic 20
[22:48] MadCamel: trash80. We're all old. haha
[22:48] wushin: the TI-99a didn't have anything I'd call an RPG
[22:48] TasogareAkira: how old are you guys
[22:49] wushin: 87
[22:49] TasogareAkira: sounds about right
[22:49] wushin: really im 36
[22:49] oddshocks: Can anyone point me in the general direction of the cave beneath this town which contains one of the two magic swords?
[22:49] wushin: going on 37
[22:49] ebattleon: kid
[22:49] wushin: I had a computer since I was 6 though
[22:49] iceslice: Nelson Mandela died -.-
[22:49] TasogareAkira: that makes sense, talking about old ass computers
[22:49] wushin: on a BBS since I was 10
[22:49] veryape: oddshocks: follow me
[22:50] Global announcement from wushin: Dev meeting adjorn Please feel free to stick around to ask question and smack talk
[22:50] Fortunato nods
[22:50] melkor: why does the road hide items?
[22:50] Hello=): TasogareAkira IMO TMW desperately needs large bosses for teama actions as well. But it's not going to work unfortunately.
[22:50] wushin: Cause I think it's fringe
[22:50] TasogareAkira: oh
[22:50] wushin: I believe Hurnscald is a 4 layer map
[22:50] MadCamel: I'd like to ask everyone what they think about the graveyard mob resets and the ideas I have on the forum to prevent mob-penning in the future without making gameplay feel too weird.
[22:51] melkor: oh
[22:51] wushin: meaning 1 ground 1 fringe, 1 over, 1 collision
[22:51] wushin: Old rescriotion from client
[22:51] iceslice: how about day/night period in game ?
[22:52] wushin: not yet. but maybe one day
[22:52] wushin: We still have to straighten out a bunch of NPCs
[22:52] Fortunato: MadCamel: No offence, but i hate it, flat out. Your idea on the forums (if it really works like that) sounds like a good compromise though.
[22:52] wushin: IT be too wonky story wise at this point
[22:52] TasogareAkira: how about a spell where two players can temporarily morph into one super strong player to take on bosses
[22:52] wushin: lol
[22:52] TasogareAkira: you laugh, but I'm serious lol
[22:53] medave: wouldn't that be like stacking
[22:53] iceslice: How about converting this 2D game to 3D ?
[22:53] medave: i vote 4D
[22:53] MadCamel: Fortunato: None taken. It's a test and is serving it's purpose until I can do something better.
[22:53] medave: more is always better
[22:53] TasogareAkira: wouldn't you have to get into some heavy mathematical-physics based programming
[22:54] medave: hi verdo
[22:54] verdo: hiya dave
[22:54] TasogareAkira: trying to simulate real world conditions
[22:54] TasogareAkira: and physics
[22:54] iceslice: unitry 3D framework supports 3D by default
[22:54] wushin: This game is about preseving the style we loved from childhood
[22:54] TasogareAkira: yeah
[22:54] wushin: You want fancy flashy 3-d graphics go buy a new game
[22:54] ebattleon: in a fantasy game...real world physics
[22:54] iceslice: wushin, right
[22:54] wushin: realize it's broke a year after you bought
[22:54] wushin: and you can't do anything to fix it
[22:55] wushin: it's laggy
[22:55] wushin: horribly balanced
[22:55] ebattleon: lol...
[22:55] wushin: But here if shits crap we hand you a hammer and let you fix it
[22:55] TasogareAkira: do a power ranger themed spell, you get a rare morpher drop and can call upon a zoid to aid you in battle
[22:55] TasogareAkira: but don't call it power rangers
[22:55] TasogareAkira: just take the idea
[22:56] iceslice: wushin: legend is fine, still you got to think abuut moving forwarding
[22:56] TasogareAkira: zord
[22:56] iceslice: as an open source game, I think it's enough what it has now
[22:57] TasogareAkira: yeah, but you should add one crazy thing that's just insane and completely unexpected, just to be weird
[22:57] iceslice: playing with game codes are fun at free times
[22:57] TasogareAkira: I say the power rangers thing
[22:57] wushin: TasogareAkira, I would have called it voltron force anyways
[22:57] the manaworld buddy: Theres a sling shot
[22:57] the manaworld buddy: ?
[22:57] iceslice afkish
[22:57] TasogareAkira: oh ya, the original
[22:57] wushin: yeah
[22:57] wushin: in game now
[22:57] the manaworld buddy: Theres a sling shot?
[22:57] Hello=): iceslice aren't there enough 3D games already?
[22:57] Hello=): and in 3D games there is too much struggling with interface/camera IMO.
[22:57] ebattleon: the sling shot is...crap
[22:58] Cassy loves tmw for 2d
[22:58] TasogareAkira: I'm not concerned about 3D, I just want some badass power ranger or voltron stuff in the game, just to be silly
[22:58] wushin: Well it is for a level 1
[22:58] MadCamel: maybe the slingshot might get some lvl90+ terranite ammo at some point :D
[22:58] iceslice: how to get the slingshot ?
[22:58] Hello=): also 3D would be more demanding... though well, best output for me is opengl in manaplus :)
[22:58] wushin: And it was meant to prove the concept of different launchers <-> AmmoTypes
[22:58] wushin: It's in Tulimsahr
[22:59] iceslice: thanks, will check wiki
[22:59] wushin: for sale in the NE market
[22:59] Hello=): [22:58] MadCamel: maybe the slingshot might get some lvl90+ terranite ammo at some point :D <- btw... could be there different types of damage?
[22:59] wushin: 500 gp
[22:59] ebattleon: not balanced at all...its too slow
[22:59] Hello=): say logically skeles should suffer more from rocks rather than arrows.
[22:59] MadCamel: Hello=): It's something to ponder for sure.
[22:59] melkor: different types of damage? like in Wesnoth?
[22:59] Cassy: .#kalo11c
[22:59] Hello=): melkor yes
[22:59] TasogareAkira: have you gusy ever considered adding special maps that while on them affect how your skills and items abilities are expressed
[22:59] Hello=): and not just wesonth...
[23:00] Fortunato: since elemental damages are enabled now, different ammo types sound good.
[23:00] SecretMogge: R.I.P Nelson Mandela
[23:00] Cassy: hey tuxtux
[23:00] MadCamel: I'd like to change the gameplay dynamics. A lot. TMW is a boring grind-fest. Thing is.. You guys will kill me if I try
[23:00] iceslice: bad news
[23:00] tux9th: hi
[23:00] iceslice: btw, tmw is 2.5 D  I suppose
[23:00] iceslice: camera angle projecting at 45 degree angle to my eyes
[23:00] Hello=): [23:00] MadCamel: I'd like to change the gameplay dynamics. A lot. TMW is a boring grind-fest. <- yep, it is...
[23:01] TasogareAkira: have you gusy ever considered adding special maps that while on them affect how your skills and items abilities are expressed, seems like a cool idea
[23:01] o11c: grumble, not detecting disconnect
[23:01] melkor: yeah, i like that idea. also means that different mobs are better fought against using specific weapons. might help in balancing things
[23:01] Hello=): and wasn't TMW adveantures meant to test new dynamics?
[23:01] wushin: I said it before, You kids and you 256 colors. Why back in my day we had 2; Green and black
[23:01] o11c: TasogareAkira: we can experiment with things in tmwa-adventures
[23:01] o11c: mob/weapon elements will probably happen sometime after that
[23:01] o11c: (I mean, we already have mob elements)
[23:01] ebattleon: how about consuable items that give magic defence for balance in pvp
[23:02] o11c: butI don't trust tmwa's current stats
[23:02] iceslice: though char seems to be seen horizontally, other objects 45 degree around
[23:02] TasogareAkira: oh, I've only connected to the main server
[23:02] wushin: mainly its finishing the player sprite 1.5 to add more attacks to add more weapons
[23:02] o11c: ebattleon: IIRC Cassy was workong on *something* in that area
[23:02] o11c: I made the necessary code fix in the big update
[23:02] ebattleon: cool
[23:02] wushin: Which is the current long term project of content dev
[23:02] Cassy: yes i was
[23:02] wushin: getting that player sprite 1.5 finished
[23:03] wushin: So we can have axes long sword and halberd and more
[23:03] wushin: That is just waiting on me to finish the weapons.
[23:03] Cassy: but you can't imagine how annoying it is for a dev who wants to fix pvp when 50% of players say banshee archers are imba and 50% say mages are
[23:03] Cassy: i stopped it
[23:04] Cassy: not blaming players though :D
[23:04] wushin: IMO, balance is hard without being able to add stuff
[23:04] ebattleon: true
[23:04] wushin: So many giant gaping holes in equipment
[23:04] Cassy: yeah
[23:04] Hello=): [23:02] ebattleon: how about consuable items that give magic defence for balance in pvp <- in PvP banshee pwns all :P
[23:04] wushin: and some equipment you get early is better then endgame
[23:05] Cassy: see?
[23:05] melkor: won't implementing Hello=)'s idea work towards that goal?
[23:05] ebattleon: i die real good with banshee:D
[23:05] TasogareAkira: have to go, talk to you guys later
[23:05] Cassy: bye
[23:05] ebattleon: bye
[23:05] Hello=): melkor with different resistances?
[23:05] wushin: Yeah, PvP complicates a number of things
[23:05] melkor: yeah
[23:05] Hello=): melkor hm... maybe!
[23:06] wushin: As betsanc on a archer PvP helps slow them down
[23:06] Hello=): so heavily armored warrior should be hard to pierce with arrows, doh.
[23:06] tux9th: there was an idea for a mental potion once (raise m.def) but I have no idea what happened to it. we already have an icon for it.
[23:06] melkor: plus, armour could also play a part.
[23:07] ebattleon: well metal armor should resist lightening strikes quite well but they don't:S
[23:07] HariRama: armor plays a part, it reduces non critical dmg
[23:07] veryape: one of the things needed imo is something to counter the crits from the banshee + some kind of asorm-thing for warriors
[23:07] ebattleon: like a temp shield
[23:07] MadCamel is pondering dynamic mob spawns..
[23:08] Cassy: another problem is you can't increase crit def for pvp without increasing it for pve like luvia
[23:08] MadCamel: more players in area = more mobs. If players die/leave, the mobs that were spawned for them get very weak and easy to kill.
[23:08] ebattleon: nice idea...
[23:08] veryape: Cassy: true
[23:08] wushin: lol
[23:08] Hello=): [23:07] ebattleon: well metal armor should resist lightening strikes quite well but they don't:S <- reasonable as well. It even weakens magic on caster?
[23:09] wushin: I'm loving this discussion
[23:09] ebattleon: faraday cage...
[23:09] medave: maybe a fiberglass shield
[23:09] tux9th: I'm not sure if we can base effects on items off of map flags. I think this should be possible. might want to talk to o11c about this.
[23:09] ebattleon: electric chatces flow on the outside of a hollow conductor
[23:09] Cassy: I'm wondering about all of this pvp stuff anyway
[23:09] ebattleon: charges*
[23:09] medave: or carry a ground rod
[23:09] Hello=): [23:09] ebattleon: faraday cage... <- agree. Also heavy armor probably should reduce speed and dex. Its unnatural to run fast in heavy armor and shoot arrows storms :P
[23:10] Cassy: in another game i once played before tmw pvp is always dmg/7
[23:10] Cassy: regular dmg/7
[23:10] Cassy: makes fights far more interesting and last longer
[23:10] tux9th: ebattleon physically speaking metal gear doesn't protect you more from lightning but makes your resistance less... so it is easier to strike you with lightning
[23:10] MadCamel: to me pvp is a writeoff. TMW's stats and spells are so screwy I don't know there's any fixing it. There's band-aid solutions though
[23:10] Hello=): Cassy there is also problem warrior can't catch ranged shooters.
[23:10] ebattleon: hmm...it would mean no one shot mage kills
[23:10] veryape: Cassy: that sounds like a nice idea, much easier than giving the player *x hp and change all the monsters damage etc
[23:10] Cassy: yes Hello=)
[23:11] Hello=): [23:11] MadCamel: to me pvp is a writeoff. TMW's stats and spells are so screwy I don't know there's any fixing it. <- different resistances.
[23:11] wushin: Also... Adding more status effects in general
[23:11] Cassy: dmg/7 would also reduce the imbalance (but not solve it of course)
[23:12] HariRama: dmg/7 sounds like a neverending fight
[23:12] tux9th: #inma wushin
[23:12] HariRama: tank mage vs banshee archer can also be as it is right now never ending fight
[23:12] veryape: HariRama; not really, think about it, it is like some of the tougher mobs in game, i see no reason why a high level player would be faster to kill than say a fallen
[23:13] Cassy: heh, maybe not /7, you're right  ^^
[23:13] tux9th: #inma MadCamel
[23:13] HariRama: cause player heals
[23:13] veryape: hrm, yeah
[23:13] veryape: anywho i like the damage/x concept
[23:13] wushin: Well that and if your opponent has a healer nearby
[23:13] Hello=): HariRama IMO heals in TMW are horribly overpowered.
[23:13] wushin: and you dont
[23:13] wushin: Yar Hello=)^
[23:13] HariRama: i tested with willee tank mage vs banshee it could never ending fight
[23:13] tux9th: #inma Avenn
[23:13] Hello=): especially magic ones.
[23:13] veryape: however everything must be teste extensively
[23:13] HariRama: be*
[23:14] HariRama: mage waits for the right moment to ingrav when asorm is off banshee tries to nails enough arrows to kill, if mage still runs around all the time he can survive much time
[23:15] tux9th: #inma melkor
[23:15] HariRama: nail*
[23:15] Hello=): HariRama from my experience banshee tends to win.
[23:15] tux9th: I g2g to bed. see you some other time
[23:15] veryape: HariRama: yeah, would be even harder to get a mage that has teamed up with a warrior
[23:15] Hello=): though in general one who plays stupid loses :)
[23:15] melkor: and where does the poor warrior come in all this? I can't see any situation in which s/he wins
[23:17] verdo: a speed warrior can actually get a few hits on a banshee archer
[23:17] veryape: melkor: an arhcer must stand still to fire his arrows, if that damage is lessened the warrior can reach him and his healing will be more powerful vs the damage he takes
[23:17] Hello=): melkor that's the worst parf of TMW's PvP...
[23:17] veryape: but yeah, that needs a lot of numbercrunching and testing to be balanced
[23:17] wushin: Yeah, a long road ahead of us
[23:18] Hello=): [23:17] verdo: a speed warrior can actually get a few hits on a banshee archer <- hehehe, but it does not prevents death. Then with mages it's an issue as well.
[23:18] wushin: but before balance it's best to get enough gear into game and correctly
[23:18] wushin: more weapons will help not having to nerf weapons
[23:18] wushin: Cause we all know if we touch the forest bow we are dead
[23:18] HariRama: but yeah insta heal also complicates things when fighting in groups
[23:18] melkor: btw, the wiki says something about a hidden m. defence bonus from vitality, which isn't implemented in tmw. is it ever going to be implemented?
[23:19] wushin: not sure
[23:19] melkor: k
[23:19] Hello=): [23:19] HariRama: but yeah insta heal also complicates things when fighting in groups <- it wrecks quite a lot of things.
[23:21] Hello=): in fact it's almot god mode which allows some player to be nearly unkillable for a while, no matter what. Except maybe some most blatant swarmings.
[23:21] wushin: I just don't like how few heals there are
[23:21] wushin: or that 1 INT does full health
[23:21] Hello=): IMO they should heal only part of health of typical player at once and have some delay.
[23:22] wushin: Yeah, HOTS or long casting time
[23:22] Hello=): btw ... can mage be required to stop to cast spell, without ability to move without interrupting spell or so?
[23:23] MadCamel: wouldn't be hard to add. Would be harder to get people to write spells/quests for it
[23:23] wushin: channeling yes
[23:23] verdo: would that be with every spell Hello=)?
[23:23] Hello=): MadCamel hmm...wait I think it can be done even in scripts...
[23:24] Hello=): verdo it's just an idea :) it can make healing a bit more balanced and healer could be quite vulnerable so it would be really valued member of group.
[23:25] Hello=): could improve team actions again, making them more diverse.
[23:25] melkor: ot also means that archers won't be able to heal as well as mages, a plus point
[23:25] Cassy: tink tink tink... :)
[23:26] Hello=): [23:24] verdo: would that be with every spell Hello=)? <- not sure about that btw. Requirement to stand still for some few seconds can give warrior chance to catch up and hit nasty mage with a sword before it's too late.
[23:26] verdo: can also be a pain in candor or with illia...
[23:26] HariRama: maybe only attack spells
[23:27] veryape: if it was implemented with #itenplz illia wins would be quite rare :P
[23:27] Hello=): it's not really fair I can shot any warrior I want at PvP without even slightest chance to face retribution
[23:27] ebattleon: power up period...for the big strike
[23:27] Tinker Bell: hi Verdo
[23:27] verdo: hiya tink
[23:27] veryape: hey tinker
[23:27] Tinker Bell: ha Ape-Very
[23:27] HariRama: illia wins would drop to 0
[23:27] wushin: Also one other note.
[23:27] Hello=): [23:27] ebattleon: power up period...for the big strike <- something like this. Also for healing spells?
[23:27] Tinker Bell: hi cassy
[23:28] Skragar Cinderweb: Hi Tinker bell
[23:28] Hello=): [23:27] HariRama: illia wins would drop to 0 <- I don't mind itenplz.
[23:28] wushin: Magic has more levels then it uses
[23:28] Tinker Bell: hi dave
[23:28] Hello=): IIRC it meant to be 5 levels. There'are some spells already in code.
[23:28] wushin: During balance I was going to try and open those levels
[23:28] Tinker Bell: sug, i got GREAT news today
[23:28] Hello=): but seems to be quite incomplete
[23:28] wushin: yeah, plenty need to be written yet
[23:28] wushin: and NPCs to teah them
[23:29] ebattleon: i have seen waht kaboom spell can do
[23:29] Hello=): but I can see  fireball here and some few others
[23:29] ebattleon: what*
[23:29] Tinker Bell: as u may remember, I been working for a bank for last 7 months....
[23:29] Cassy: hey tinktink
[23:29] wushin: Tux also wrote some new highlevel spells for dark magic too that we can't learn yet
[23:29] HariRama: anyway when changing mob AI candor and illia needs to be taken into consideration also, depends how radical the changes will be
[23:30] Hello=): wushin ah btw... why kalboo and kalgina are DARK spells?
[23:30] Cassy: maybe also cindy
[23:30] Tinker Bell: i got a promothin, starting Jan 6th, I will be dealikng with moertgages
[23:30] Tinker Bell: YAY
[23:30] wushin: nice
[23:30] veryape: congrats tinker!
[23:30] HariRama: Hello=) they are not
[23:30] Ladysugar: hope it doesnt require spelling
[23:30] HariRama: try kalboo yourself
[23:30] wushin: ok, later. Baby Time for me
[23:30] Ladysugar: but congrats Tink
[23:30] Tinker Bell: ty wush and v-ape
[23:30] Hello=): HariRama they are, if you'll look to code. They depend on dark magic control level rather than usual one.
[23:30] Tinker Bell: ty sug
[23:31] veryape: later wushin
[23:31] Skragar Cinderweb: bye wushin
[23:31] Tinker Bell: it will mean 2 dollers more and hour plus comission
[23:31] HariRama: i thought you meant choosing the path not the ability to cast them (i dont read code)
[23:31] veryape: and thanks for the info/discussion
[23:31] melkor: thx for conducting this meeting
[23:31] Tinker Bell: hi melkior
[23:32] melkor: umm . NOT melkior
[23:32] Hello=): HariRama I meant they're invoked by dark magic code and check level of dark magic skill. Though IIRC sagatha likes these creatures so it looks really incoherent.
[23:32] Tinker Bell: noy el?
[23:32] Tinker Bell: not melkioe?
[23:32] Tinker Bell: bay
[23:33] HariRama: <wushin> Baby time
[23:33] HariRama: so i think it is only us now
[23:33] Hello=): yeah
[23:33] Tinker Bell: wushin, u are o11c assisitant?>
[23:33] melkor: melkor = ultimate silmarillion villain. chose name before i even knew melkior existed. sorry for the confusion