Paperless ngx 2.0 released reddit / selfhosted ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Adde15100 · 2023-12-03 10:23 Hey guy, Just came across the news that they released version 2.0 of paperless ngx https://github.com/paperless-ngx/paperless-ngx/releases Maybe also helpful for some other here :) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- thekrautboy · 2023-12-03 10:26 > Breaking Changes > Breaking: Rename the environment variable for self-signed email certificates @stumpylog (#4346) > Breaking: Drop support for Python 3.8 @stumpylog (#4156) > Breaking: Remove ARMv7 building of the Docker image @stumpylog (#3973) Cannot wait for the Watchtower users to come crying... ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ElevenNotes · 2023-12-03 11:06 I'm 100% none even have a dev setup to test new releases before they activate them in prod. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- No_Dragonfruit_5882 · 2023-12-03 11:57 Lets wait for the "how to restore my data" posts. Meanwhile, some tea and some cigs ---------------------------------------------------------------------- TheFumingatzor · 2023-12-03 12:07 Watchu mean? My watchtower updated paperless-ngx flawlessly. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ElevenNotes · 2023-12-03 12:22 How about 🍻 and 🍔? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- No_Dragonfruit_5882 · 2023-12-03 12:24 Sure. Head over to u/thekrautboy 's place? Ill get the beer and you guys get the burgers? Maybe some popcorn aswell while people wreck their Homelabs? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- azukaar · 2023-12-03 12:39 TBF if updating the software, even with a breaking change lose your data, it's the on the dev But I wouldnt imagine it would be the case here ---------------------------------------------------------------------- No_Dragonfruit_5882 · 2023-12-03 12:40 Its not on the Dev what the fuck?!?!?! If people are too fucking stupid to read the damn changenotes thats 100% on you. Its the same as filling your Car up with oil because you didnt read the manual ---------------------------------------------------------------------- azukaar · 2023-12-03 12:41 And that's fine, I also don't have a spare phone to test before I update my apps ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Alles_ · 2023-12-03 12:46 I think every dev has to acknowledge that some users won’t read the breaking changes, while I agree it’s not on the dev if a software breaks. the user above asked for at least not have a loss of data, which is a fair request in my opinion. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- No_Dragonfruit_5882 · 2023-12-03 12:50 True, but even if it loses all your Data thats on you and not the dev. 1. Everyone needs to do Backups 2. Its a fully new Version, its not 1.1.1 or 1.5.x Its 2.0, it has to be treated like a new product in my eyes. How would the dev ever be able to update something if he didnt drop Support for some products? As example win7, the librarys on win 7 do not get any Updates anymore etc. Its either => Throw some Systems out or never Update your product. And iirc there should be some legacy Containers etc for ARM for paperless. Your right, data should not get lost, but if people just plainly delete their new Container + the datafolder of the old Container, thats 100% a User issue ---------------------------------------------------------------------- azukaar · 2023-12-03 12:51 No it's definitely on the dev, it's up to the dev to make sure the app won't blow up upon update, and is rollbackable. In any system any users expect to be able to leave apps on auto-update mode, there's no reason why server application would be different. It's ok for the application to "break" on update as long as the app take the right step to explain to the user why it's failling "Hello, in this version XYZ is removed please do this and that". and as long as the dev did the due diligence of educating the users (changelog after the update is published is not enough). Developing an app that is used by many users on their servers with everyday life stuff on it, is a responsability to be taken seriously ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Alles_ · 2023-12-03 12:52 I agree 🤝 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- No_Dragonfruit_5882 · 2023-12-03 12:54 Its a Version jump from 1.x to 2.x, you gotta read changelogs. I hope for everyone that doesnt read the changelogs that their System breaks, they still should have the Datafolder (my guess with the deleted data was that some Users remove every folder from the new Container and delete their old files). People need to learn its not the devs fault for making Systems not work on other Systems. Read the changelog or its 100% up to you. This is exactly the reason why 95% of EVERY Software does not do Version Upgrades automatically. Minor Releases can be auto updated, but not a whole Version jump. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- azukaar · 2023-12-03 13:00 \- once again, as long as the system break with a verbose error, that's acceptable. Corrupting your data is not \- and once again, any system should be able to work is auto-update, like your computer, your phone, and all your hardware. Servers do not deserve special treatments \- Changelogs are post-updates infos they're not warnings. I have 2 dozens containers working on auto-update, and I don't care about changelogs. I treat them as any other applications on any other devices and that's the way it should be for mainstream usage of selfhosting Asking users to be sysadmins, with manual testing on multiple environment is not a realistic outcome for selfhosting ---------------------------------------------------------------------- No_Dragonfruit_5882 · 2023-12-03 13:10 Its not corrupting your Data... i was talking about the idiot Users that delete every folder to back a Version and fucking their data folder. Why the fuck do you think in enterprise Business people have manual Updates enabled on proxmox / Vmware? If you are going to play with fire, thats fine. You dont seem to care if your shit is going down. I dont, i dont have the time to recover Services instantly cause my time is valuable. And for not reading the changelos thats 100% on you and not the dev. Dont fucking use autoupdate on any other shit than your test Containers, its asking for stuff to get broken ---------------------------------------------------------------------- azukaar · 2023-12-03 13:15 > i was talking about the idiot Users that delete every folder to back a Version and fucking their data folder. I dont think anyone does that, especially because the original comment was about Watchtower, which does update properly > Why the fuck do you think in enterprise Business people Yeah but we're not them, we're random people with home servers to backup our photos and watch our linux isos on Plex > i dont have the time to recover Services instantly cause my time is valuable. But you have time to manually test every updates one by one while keeping up with every updates of every apps within a few days of their release? hmm.. > Dont fucking use autoupdate on any other shit than your test Containers, its asking for stuff to get broken No.. it's asking for mentalities to change, and for dev to take the responsabilities that are theirs (Again, I never had a mobile app break after an update). And this shift will happen, because otherwise selfhosting will never be a viable maintstream alternative to the cloud / SaaS ---------------------------------------------------------------------- No_Dragonfruit_5882 · 2023-12-03 13:18 Yeah imma stop arguing. Be happy and break your shit, but dont say changelogs are for any post update process.... ---------------------------------------------------------------------- azukaar · 2023-12-03 13:18 He's right, if your CPU is ARMv7 an update will break your setup (as in the container wont start anymore) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- senectus · 2023-12-03 13:21 Had this happen once. I promptly uninstalled watchtower. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- thekrautboy · 2023-12-03 13:22 Its not Watchtowers fault tho. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- senectus · 2023-12-03 13:24 not really no. but watchtower was sold to me ("sold") as a bullet proof way to keep my docker images up to date. I was already fairly suspect on that (still learning how docker works), and this confirmed my suspicions. Docker is "nearly" magic... but it aint so magic that I can just point watchtower at it and ignore it. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- TBT_TBT · 2023-12-03 13:33 >ARMv7 If your CPU is ARMv7, which was introduced in 2004, you have slept for 20 years. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Whitestrake · 2023-12-03 13:45 Watchtower, like any other tool, is useful if you apply it with care. Two main ways I use it: 1. I have it on alert-only mode. It emails me when there's updates for me to go have a look over and run. 2. I have it on auto-update mode, but I don't use `latest`, I pin a major version. I do this with projects for whom I trust to follow semantic versioning (i.e. no breaking changes on a minor revision). ---------------------------------------------------------------------- RefrigeratorWitch · 2023-12-03 13:50 My CPU is an AMD64. AMD64 CPUs were introduced in 2003... What do you propose to replace it with? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Akujinnoninjin · 2023-12-03 14:04 ARMv7 was 32bit only, and supplanted by the 64bit ARMv8 in 2011, and now ARMv9. x86-64 has had *multiple* revisions and extension in that same time period: v2 in 2009, v3 in 2015, and v4 in 2017. If you have some software that requires AVX (added in v3), then it's not going to work on a first gen Opteron. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- RefrigeratorWitch · 2023-12-03 14:08 Fair enough. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ElevenNotes · 2023-12-03 14:18 You run paperless-ngx server on your phone? Cool, how do you do that? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Not_your_guy_buddy42 · 2023-12-03 14:31 ಠ\_ಠ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- -rwsr-xr-x · 2023-12-03 14:33 I only just started looking at paperless-ngx a few days ago at the recommendation of a colleague. I have quite literally several thousand scans of documents, hundreds of other random documents going back ~30+ years and have a battery- bank powered ScanSnap S1300i I use to keep everything topped off. These all live in a ZFS snapshot'd NAS. I started testing ngx late last week, and while it looks interesting, it still has at least a few blind spots (which I intend to try to PR/help fix), including lack of rendering of some pretty common file formats. A simple `pandoc` or similar transformation of Markdown for example, could be an easy fix ([#3674](https://github.com/paperless- ngx/paperless-ngx/discussions/3674) addresses this FR). The [lengthy list of feature requests](https://github.com/paperless- ngx/paperless-ngx/discussions/categories/feature-requests) is going to slow down delivery of some of these, but it would help if we could help the paperless-ngx community with testing, prioritization and coding/PRs where possible, to help accelerate these features. It really does seem like one of the best self-hosted apps for what it does, but I suspect they're going to get drowned by the backlog soon enough. What are your most commonly needed features of paperless that aren't in the main project yet? What would you add if you had the means? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- marbonmb · 2023-12-03 14:49 And the source code is available, it can be compiled. Compatibility platforms exists to, like x86 to ARM ---------------------------------------------------------------------- mss-cyclist · 2023-12-03 14:50 That is the major reason you might not want to use unattended updates. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- sudden_flatulence · 2023-12-03 14:51 I haven’t checked out the new release yet, but just wanted to say thanks for being willing to jump in with an organized approach to improving the project. I wish I could code so you could be my PM lol ---------------------------------------------------------------------- stringfellow-hawke · 2023-12-03 14:52 I appreciate the substantial post and not just dunking on users of a popular update utility. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- -rwsr-xr-x · 2023-12-03 15:02 > and not just dunking on users of a popular update utility Anyone who is running tools like paperless-ngx in production with real data, should already have a testing, backup and restore/rollback process in place for their important data. If you're not testing your application updates in an isolated way, what are you doing? If you're not backing up your important data on a regular basis, and certainly before any application change or upgrade, do you really care about your data? The people who may pile on and sandbag updates to the core of any software, should be reminded of the proper process to maintain, update and secure their data especially during changes of applications they rely on. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- reddit-toq · 2023-12-03 15:08 Hello fellow Neat refugee! I started with them as an employee and scanned in everything I owned. I actually took a side detour to Paperless by Mariner software for a bit but the pandemic was not kind to them and they seemed to have EoL’d their Paperless. Currently on Paperless-NGX on Synology and it’s working great but I agree there are some features like you mention that would be welcome additions. Determining which feature is needed first is the tricky bit. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- thekrautboy · 2023-12-03 15:15 The downvotes on you two... love it. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- No_Dragonfruit_5882 · 2023-12-03 15:16 Seems like some Services are already down xD ---------------------------------------------------------------------- pastelfemby · 2023-12-03 15:25 To give benefit of the doubt, there are probably quite a few raspberry pi users running an armv7 build of their distro, even if their pi supports armv8. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- botterway · 2023-12-03 16:11 What I'd really like, but unsure if it's part of 2.0 or not, is the ability for paperless to run by scanning a readonly/immutable folder of documents, without having to ingest those docs into a storage structure that paperless manages. ie, I have my folder of docs that I organise, and all paperless does is scan those docs and make them available for its search and rendering. It would be awesome. If you could add an option for paperless to run like that. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- scalyblue · 2023-12-03 16:43 There’s also Mayan EDMS but I’ve never been able to get it running well enough to use it ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Lobbelt · 2023-12-03 16:50 It’s the main reason why you can have Watchtower notify you of updates instead of automatically performing them. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- thekrautboy · 2023-12-03 16:53 I know... but a lot of people around here dont seem to do it and hop on the "easy automatic updates" train. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- -rwsr-xr-x · 2023-12-03 17:01 > There’s also Mayan EDMS but I’ve never been able to get it running well enough to use it Thank you for this recommendation. I just spun it up and threw some test documents at it. It has some pretty nice features straight out of the box that paperless-ngx doesn't have, but it's quite a bit slower to process those same documents, and clicking around in the UI while those documents are uploading/processing, seems to stall for 30-45 seconds. Conversely, with paperless-ngx, the UI continues to be snappy and responsive, even while churning through 900+ files with dozens of parallel threads. I'll have to give these both a proper head-to-head and see who comes out on top. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- stringfellow-hawke · 2023-12-03 17:12 Yeah, I get that, but I've been tinkering with Paperless and was interested to see that there was a bunch of comments on the new version... only to find it was all about Watchtower. Reddit can be annoying and wanted to draw attention to your post that was on topic. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ericstern · 2023-12-03 20:22 for the rendering issue for other formats, did you try setting the option to use the browser rendering instead? I believe on settings its a check option "Use PDF viewer provided by the browser" ---------------------------------------------------------------------- CmdrCollins · 2023-12-03 20:39 The AArch64 version of Raspbian was released in early 2022 - there's bound to be *a lot* of devices with a Armhf-based OS still in the wild as a result. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- prone-to-drift · 2023-12-03 21:26 But at the same time, backups are pretty trivial too for 90% of people. Just backup your daughter volumes and update the container unless you need 100% uptime. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- scalyblue · 2023-12-03 21:34 Yeah that’s the experience I had I didn’t want to trade accuracy or other stuff for those huge delays. Maybe if I had given it its own database, but I wanted a solution that worked enough to be functional for my use case ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Darth_Agnon · 2023-12-03 22:45 Is Paperless NGX related to the [defunct offline Windows/Mac program called Paperless](https://web.archive.org/web/20190508081018/http://ma rinersoftware.com/products/paperless/)? I've long wanted paperless software, but Paperless NG/X being a server application meant I couldn't use it. Then I found that program, also called Paperless, and was wondering if it was related, as it looks and works more or less the same, but is offline and for end-user PCs rather than servers... ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Nolzi · 2023-12-04 00:27 It came from https://github.com/the-paperless-project/paperless ---------------------------------------------------------------------- m2ellis · 2023-12-04 00:28 No, though they appear to both be document management applications. Paperless-ngx is a fork of paperless-ng which is a fork of https://github.com/the-paperless-project/paperless originally. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- thefpspower · 2023-12-04 02:35 I think it would just not update because there isn't an update for your architecture. No? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- DeadEyePsycho · 2023-12-04 03:26 They stopped building the image for ARMv7 so there is no image for Watchtower to pull because, regardless of tag, Docker checks architecture compatibility. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- DeadEyePsycho · 2023-12-04 03:30 Correct, architecture is independent of tags despite many people creating tags for specific architectures. It's why, presuming multi- architectural builds at all, the latest tag will generally work on any system. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- CmdrCollins · 2023-12-04 03:37 > x86-64 has had multiple revisions and extension Worth noting that people are largely *still* building against baseline x86-64 (especially in the Linux world), unless they massively benefit from one of the extensions introduced since. Comparing it to x86-64's own struggle for adoption makes a far better case though - the Windows world is still building 32bit versions of most things *17 years* after it first shipped a decent 64bit OS with Vista. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Darth_Agnon · 2023-12-04 03:38 Thank you for confirming. I was just surprised, as they're both almost identical-looking tag- based scanned-document management systems with OCR. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- No_Bee_7194 · 2023-12-04 04:44 This project has some many sub projects...I am confusing and don't know how to deploy😥 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- suddenlypenguins · 2023-12-04 06:34 Awesome, it's nice software. Still no replace existing PDF feature or rotate feature though, which really kills it for me. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Significant-Neat7754 · 2023-12-04 07:51 Love paperless-ngx! Thanks for the update. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- m_torak · 2023-12-04 07:59 I would love an Integration of stirlink PDF right into paperless-ngx! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- d662 · 2023-12-04 17:24 I believe I remember reading about how they handle your use case. It was something around being able to configure it to use "non-standard" directories. I think the steps would then be: - on install, tell Paperless to put the storage directories on your NAS or wherever. - modify the default directory structure that is created to match your preference. - config Paperless to use the "non-standard" directories - manually file things into the directories as you've been doing. - update Paperless with the cron job or kick off manually and never "ingest" anything via the import or upload or they won't end up in your desired directory structure. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- PovilasID · 2023-12-04 21:48 This is literally the reason why I went with docspell. It has some other handy features but non-distructive consume would be ideal with something like rclone mounting a google drive folder. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- VettedBot · 2023-12-04 22:26 Hi, I’m Vetted AI Bot! I researched the **Fujitsu ScanSnap S1300i Portable Color Duplex Document Scanner for Mac or PC Classic** and I thought you might find the following analysis helpful. **Users liked:** * Scanner is fast and portable (backed by 2 comments) * Scanner software needs improvement (backed by 2 comments) * Scanner feed sometimes crooked but good value (backed by 2 comments) **Users disliked:** * Scanning speeds slower than advertised (backed by 1 comment) * Paper handling issues with larger stacks (backed by 2 comments) * Software compatibility issues with newer operating systems (backed by 2 comments) If you'd like to **summon me to ask about a product**, just make a post with its link and tag me, [like in this example.](https://www.red dit.com/r/tablets/comments/1444zdn/comment/joqd89c/) This message was generated by a (very smart) bot. If you found it helpful, let us know with an upvote and a “good bot!” reply and please feel free to provide feedback on how it can be improved. *Powered by* [*vetted.ai*](http://vetted.ai/reddit) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- azukaar · 2023-12-08 14:54 You guys are right! I went ahead and published an image to test, and removed the tag I got confused because Docker does not check architecture if pull a single-architecture tag (you can pull an arm image on x86), but if it's a multi-architecture image, it will check to select the arch and will throw a manifest not found error on failing ---------------------------------------------------------------------- CulturalTortoise · 2023-12-31 12:58 Curious. Do you manually tag each item you scan or leave it to be automatically tagged?