Goodbye Mint on Jan 1st... Hello to...? reddit / selfhosted ---------------------------------------------------------------------- pompeiitype · 2023-11-03 13:56 Mint budgeting by Intuit will shut down on Jan 1: https://www.theverge.com/2023/11/2/23943254/mint-intuit-shutting-down- credit-karma. What do you all recommend that has the closest features these days? I've peeked the wiki but I'd like to learn about anything else that might be out there! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Anejey · 2023-11-03 14:07 I haven't used Mint, but budgeting apps that come to mind are Actual and Firefly III. Firefly seems to be more feature-rich but from what I've tried Actual is generally easier to use. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ikenread · 2023-11-03 14:15 I know this is the selfhosted sub, but YNAB has literally changed my life. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- XxNerdAtHeartxX · 2023-11-03 14:18 Describe what Mint is to us that don't use it. Does it sync from bank accounts to show you a breakdown of spending? Then, there is no replacement. Is it an Envelope style budgeting app? Then Actual is the replacement Is it something you put every transaction into for an overview of where your money goes? Then Firefly III is the answer. --- Everyone around here who asks about finance apps always wants it automated, but I think using Actual manually is the best way to do it. If you just automate something in the background, how much does it really become a habit, or something you consciously do? Finances should be hands on, and not forgotten, because otherwise it'll end up like those 30 shows you added to Sonarr and told yourself you would watch one day before the next 15 came out that you added afterwards. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- CactusBoyScout · 2023-11-03 14:21 This is really why I love being able to self-host things. I know that it will never go away... the service or the content. Unless my NUC gets hit by lightning again :-( ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Greirson · 2023-11-03 14:24 Can confirm YNAB changes lives. Helped me get from massive debt to owning a home. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- -defron- · 2023-11-03 14:30 Firefly also has a plaid connector: https://github.com/dvankley/firefly-plaid-connector-2 making it the higher one on my list for checking out since it can at least auto- import most of my accounts. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- TheCudder · 2023-11-03 14:43 Penny pinching minded people like me have a tough time seeing past the $99 a year or $14.99 per month price tag. I'd be willing to pay, but that's up there. Mint could have been a middle ground competitor as opposed to just shutting down and offering what sounds like a half- baked alternative in Credit Karma. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Zanish · 2023-11-03 14:49 Self hosted - go for firefly. It's not going to be as seamless though and I gave up on it. Replacement - monarch money has been good to me. Better than mint and built to do household money management. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- TiGeRpro · 2023-11-03 14:52 If you're okay paying for a similar service [Monarch Money (referral)](https://www.monarchmoney.com/referral/42ztupsorq) is a good replacement. I've since switched from mint and it seems like a much better version. Plus you can define rules to change transactions into different categories which is something mint was always missing. I did want to mess with Firefly though in the near future. Which if you're looking to self host is probably a good option I hear. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- jakerake · 2023-11-03 14:53 Sounds nice in theory, but in reality, if I have to enter everything manually, I simply won't do it. I may for a week or two, but as soon as I miss a couple days (which absolutely will happen), I'll get overwhelmed and never catch back up. If everything is auto imported and I just have to approve and categorize, that's not so bad. The data entry part is too much of a deterrent for me. For myself and people like me, having it automated and just requiring approval and categorization is far better than the alternative of just not doing it at all. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Cetically · 2023-11-03 14:54 Even though Firefly III is definitely not automated, the importer + rules part does allow somewhat automatic sorting of data. As in: You can periodically (manually) export transactions from your bank and import them into Firefly which will then automatically add categories, piggy banks, ... to most transactions. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- TheCudder · 2023-11-03 14:57 Mint links to all of your financial accounts. So you're seeing... * Every transaction from credit cards, debit cards, banking accounts, direct deposits, etc. * That data is pulled in and categorized (Groceries, Mortgage, Internet, Entertainment, etc.). Plus there's sub-categories. * You're able to create spending budgets for each category to assist you with budgeting. Alerts are triggered when you're close or overspending for each category. * The overall app view gives you a glance at net worth, cash "on- hand", credit cards balances, investment balances, loans, property value & on-going spending transactions. * You're able to export spending reports (csv), view monthly spending trends, etc I've been using Mint since 2014 and I'm going to miss it. It's been great & I've always recommended. Most people tend to ditch it after a month because they hate seeing/being reminded how much they're spending/overspending...the reason I recommended it in the first place. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- TheCudder · 2023-11-03 15:00 >Plus you can define rules to change transactions into different categories which is something mint was always missing. Pretty sure Mint has had the for years...I've used it. Unless you're saying Monarch allows for more control in the definitions? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- starbuck93 · 2023-11-03 15:07 I pay for YNAB because no ads. I used Mint for years and used uBlock origin to hide the ads. Then eventually did a trial of YNAB and never looked back. Plus Intuit sucks. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- TiGeRpro · 2023-11-03 15:25 I actually forgot about that but you're right they do exist in mint. IIRC its only based on the exact name of a transaction and you can change the category. But in monarch you can base it off many different conditions and also change more than just the category. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- hclpfan · 2023-11-03 15:30 Not selfhosted but I have been using Tiller for years and am a huge fan. It imports all your data into a spreadsheet (google or Microsoft) and then you can do whatever you want with it. They have a bunch of great dashboard templates you can use or just build your own that fits your needs. Empower recently bought Personal Capital which is the closest free Mint competitor if you wanted to stick with something similar. And if you really wanted selfhosted then as others have said Firefly is your best bet. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- xAtlas5 · 2023-11-03 15:34 Firefly is nice but damn is it finicky. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ikenread · 2023-11-03 15:53 I had the same problem convincing myself! But I more than saved $100 using it. Also with YNAB together 6 ppl can use the same subscription! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ChloooooverLeaf · 2023-11-03 15:59 For people who are good with money and just want a convenient way to log/track overall spending YNAB, literally, doesn't belong in our budgets lol. 100/yr for a commodity is a steep ask. Mint was PERFECT until it stopped working well with my main bank. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- TheCudder · 2023-11-03 16:03 Is that with separate accounts? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ikenread · 2023-11-03 16:12 It is separate accounts! I believe the main account can see everyone’s budgets though, so might not be the best solution for everyone. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- AstralProbing · 2023-11-03 16:21 Eww, plaid ---------------------------------------------------------------------- paripazoo · 2023-11-03 16:26 Not selfhosted as such, but GnuCash or the various plain text accounting tools (ledger, beancount, etc) would work. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- guhcampos · 2023-11-03 16:26 Depends way too much on the features you rely on. I'm a r/YNAB person and recommend it over anything else, but it's SAAS. I started using it when it was a desktop application you could sync between devices over dropbox, ended up staying when they moved to the cloud. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Salt-Citron-5628 · 2023-11-03 16:41 Gnucash combined with some type of off device backup is the way… ---------------------------------------------------------------------- -defron- · 2023-11-03 16:43 You don't have to use it, but people who used mint are generally already comfortable connecting to aggregators in the name of simplification. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- readit-on-reddit · 2023-11-03 17:26 Recently loomed into this and the only good alternatives are Actual and Firefly III. If you like the envelope system for budgeting I think your only option is Actual. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- acid_etched · 2023-11-03 17:36 Lightning is what offsite backups are for! (I say as someone who barely has onsite backups) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- CactusBoyScout · 2023-11-03 17:37 It didn’t even fry the storage, amazingly. I’m still using the same SSD in a new NUC. But yes I have offsite backups. The lightning basically took out every Ethernet-connected device. Truly a sad day. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- acid_etched · 2023-11-03 17:40 Oh dang! Before I started doing homelab stuff we had lightning take out a TV, stereo, a router, and a ps3. Definitely a bit of a wake up call ---------------------------------------------------------------------- zachok19 · 2023-11-03 17:41 I'm not a Mint user so forgive me if I'm missing something, but a lot of Bank/credit unions offer services that will apply categories, and will aggregate accounts using 3rd parties such as Plaid. You can typically export transactions from those online banking systems. Overall net worth could be more of a manual calculation. Especially if you want to include cars, home, or other assets. So what makes Mint so special? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- CactusBoyScout · 2023-11-03 17:43 Yeah now I have some pretty beefy UPS and surge protectors on anything valuable. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- acid_etched · 2023-11-03 17:47 Same! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- 120pi · 2023-11-03 17:50 It pays for itself after a month simply from peace of mind, and moreso each month from time saved and actually having a good tool to save and budget with. I didn't need to get out of debt, but it made managing my finances so much easier and budgeting for savings goals and other projects is so much easier than how I used to do it. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Positive_Pass9675 · 2023-11-03 18:03 I use Actual Budget and I think it's really great. Works really well. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- typkrft · 2023-11-03 18:05 You can get an aggregate overview of balances and transactions at some banks for sure. But mint also does loans, properties, credit cards, brokerages, etc. and gives you pertinent data based on all your accounts as well as individual accounts. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Positive_Pass9675 · 2023-11-03 18:09 YNAB is two different things: It's a way of budgeting ('envelope method') and it's a website with a paid subscription. People shouldn't confuse those two things. There are plenty of free and selfhosted alternatives to the paid website that work exactly the same as YNAB, with the big difference that you don't have to pay $10 a month (and your data is stored locally instead of YNAB's servers). I myself use [Actual Budget](https://actualbudget.org/), but there are others. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- coldblade2000 · 2023-11-03 18:28 I'm waiting on Actual Budget's mobile experience becoming bearable to actually start using it ---------------------------------------------------------------------- coldblade2000 · 2023-11-03 18:38 Yeah, I've got to agree. I'm on low wages in Colombia (so my usable monthly income is something like $250USD, and even then I've done my best to find an alternative to YNAB that's cheaper, yet a couple of weeks ago I just paid for my 5th year. It really is completely essential for me, and the self-hosted alternatives don't really compare yet. I hope Actual Budget will keep improving (I want to contribute to it once I'm out of university and have some free time), but until then I'll continue paying a premium for YNAB's bank integration that I can't even use ---------------------------------------------------------------------- columbus_uncle · 2023-11-03 19:07 You can still download the older version, ynab4 here: https://web.arch ive.org/web/20190122064610/https://classic.youneedabudget.com/ Works great for my needs ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Positive_Pass9675 · 2023-11-03 19:16 Still read only unfortunately, although I do believe they are working on it. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- psbankar · 2023-11-03 19:52 Firefly is too advanced but gets a few things wrong and the dev doesnt take any suggestions for improvements from what I've seen on GitHub. So youre kinda stuck with what he wants. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- 5N4K3ii · 2023-11-03 19:58 I've been using GnuCash for almost 15 years on our desktop PC. It does what I need it to without fuss. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- AstralProbing · 2023-11-03 20:32 I know you don't have to use it, but you really shouldn't. Unless something has changed, everything is basically plain text. It's convenient, but because it's talking to a bunch of banking systems, many of which just plain don't have APIs, plaid is basically the hackiest hackfest of web scrapers. Beyond this, Plaid can keep and share the data they scrap, after it's "anonymized" of course I barely trust my password manager with saving my bank info, not sure why I would trust some random third party, but at least my password manager isn't going to keep the data it scrapes and share it for cash. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- r3tryfail · 2023-11-03 20:38 Mints budgeting features were garbage though. Mint was perfect for being about to track all your accounts and transactions in one place... Doesn't credit karma or whatever do that? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- thepenis_mightier · 2023-11-03 21:23 Except none of that matters when you have to go in and manually fix a bunch of categories. Easier just to use a spreadsheet. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- -defron- · 2023-11-03 21:33 First you're wrong on the plain text part. Plaid offers API integration with many institutions, OAuth integration, etc, so it doesn't always do scraping and doesn't always need your passwords. It depends on if your bank offers API integration with third parties or not. Many large US banks like Chase, Capital One, Discover, etc integrate with aggregators (like plaid and mint) via OAuth and API. All aggregators prefer OAuth and API integration as scraping is a PITA for them too and storing credential is a risk they'd rather not take. Second, everything you said is equally true for mint... so again, people that used mint before are already ok with all those things (which is everyone in this thread except you). If you wanna stay on your high horse, by all means feel free to. Options are good, plus you can feel much more smug knowing other people are using plaid and you're superior for not using it. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- zachok19 · 2023-11-03 21:52 That's been my personal experience. Even if it gets it right most of the time, there's always that exception where you go to Walmart and buy something that doesn't fit the normal "household" or "grocery". Like last weekend I spent almost $200 on oil, filters, wipers, and stuff for the vehicles. I'm just floored by everyone freaking out over Mint, and I'm trying to get my head wrapped around it. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- thepenis_mightier · 2023-11-03 21:55 Exactly. It's a gross oversimplification that just doesn't work for some people. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- TeH_MasterDebater · 2023-11-03 22:32 Mint is seemingly the only app that supports Canadian Wealthsimple accounts, I wasn’t able to find an alternative so i just hope that they partner with someone else ---------------------------------------------------------------------- knifesk · 2023-11-03 23:50 +1 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Jumile · 2023-11-04 00:47 I've been using [HomeBank](http://homebank.free.fr/en/) ever since Quicken pulled out of the UK market. Works on Windows, Mac and Linux, can import data, etc. Have zero plans to try anything else. It's great. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- stab244 · 2023-11-04 01:33 What are you moving to then? Self hosted or otherwise. Been using since around 2015 and am saddened by this news. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- spartnjohn · 2023-11-04 01:56 Not self hosted but Monarch is wonderful. Second year using it, and you’ll appreciate the functionality given the price tag ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Bagelsarenakeddonuts · 2023-11-04 02:45 Highly recommend Actual. Its all the best parts of Ynab but free, and actually better ---------------------------------------------------------------------- LoungingLemur2 · 2023-11-04 02:54 Mint seems to be best known for its budgeting tools, but I’ve always felt it was most helpful for its ability to link to both transactional accounts that are used for budgeting, but ALSO to financial accounts to help track net worth. I wish there was a self hosted option that combined those two features. The best I’ve been able to come up with so far is Actual/Firefly for budgeting and Ghostfolio for net worth tracking. If anyone has better recommendations I’d love to hear them! For me personally: the important feature is less that it has a nice suite of budgeting tools, and more that it’s a one-stop-shop for all my financial details. I can create and manage budgets on my own once all my data is in the same place and format. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- yakultisawesome · 2023-11-04 09:33 This just gives me more motivation to write my own personal finance app ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Jwiggins0123456789 · 2023-11-04 10:05 So saw this thread and I am an avid selfhoster.... 50-60 containers running on my docker hosts.... I have been looking for a self hosted family budget container recently and like the Actual Server. Just deployed it. Do most of you pay for the GoCardless banksync setup or just download file from your bank? And if you download the file I assume it is smart enough that if you get "overlapping data" it would not double- post those transactions? Thanks.... really enjoy this group and found several good solutions to a few problems... hope this will be one as well ---------------------------------------------------------------------- CheebaSweets · 2023-11-04 12:38 Actual is amazing, haven't looked back since. Its a lot simpler and does what it needs to when comparing to Firefly for example, at least for me. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- blinger44 · 2023-11-04 13:52 YNAB ---------------------------------------------------------------------- dtk20 · 2023-11-04 14:24 Is actual even maintained? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- janus_quadrifrons · 2023-11-04 14:27 I'm mostly the same way (adhd ftw) but I've found that being able to export statements from my bank and import them into Actual works well for catching up. It means I have to do a little work before checking where I am, but honestly I wasn't good enough at budgeting for fully automated alerts to be useful anyway; at least this way I get a detailed look at least once a month and am able to plan ahead a little. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- techmattr · 2023-11-04 20:52 I've never found an app that fit my needs. I use an Excel sheet that works really well. Built off a budgeting Excel I found online about 15 years ago that I've added and modified over the years. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- falcorns_balls · 2023-11-05 05:15 I think I’d be ok if i only had a couple bank accounts. But I have my money spread out all over the place to the point seeking out all the csv files is also a time suck. I had to bail on firefly and actual because of it even though I liked both of them, more so Actual. Plaid doesn’t cover my banks so I’m kinda SoL on that for the time being. Mint worked for me even though I despised it for many reasons. it was just a crap app that barely worked, and I didn’t like my data being in the cloud. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Intelg · 2023-11-05 22:36 >Actual link? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Intelg · 2023-11-05 22:58 >Actual Budget does actual budget sync with your US banks? The connector they have available seems to be EU bank only. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Intelg · 2023-11-05 23:12 whats your experience using this connector? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- -defron- · 2023-11-05 23:40 It worked fine with my CU but apparently for institutions using oauth flow you need to get production approval. Firefly itself didn't scratch my itch on reporting so just debating if I wanna go all in and figure out plaids API, get production access, and write something myself in vue + flask or . Net core ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Bagelsarenakeddonuts · 2023-11-06 03:39 https://github.com/actualbudget/actual-server ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Bagelsarenakeddonuts · 2023-11-06 03:40 Doesnt work in canada. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- AstralProbing · 2023-11-06 17:17 Fair enough, but I noticed you didn't say anything about this bit from my text. > Beyond this, Plaid can keep and share the data they scrap, after it's "anonymized" of course Care to comment? * [4 (almost 5) years ago](https://security.stackexchange.com/questions/198005/is-plaid-a- service-which-collects-user-s-banking-login-information-safe-to-use) * [1 year ago](https://old.reddit.com/r/personalfinance/comments/sceg1 a/heads_up_if_you_linked_your_account_with_plaid/) I'm not sure if this has changed in the last few years, but not all banks offer OAuth and considering that Plaid is not open sourced, I'm not sure how much I can trust it until that trust is betrayed. I'm not saying people can't use Plaid, but considering idk how much I'm giving up by using the service, I'd rather not find out. I'm already doing enough things without having known how much I'm giving up simply for the sake of simplicity, but giving a third party with enough money to wrangle their way out of individual lawsuits via attrition doesn't seem like a good trade off money management. Especially if your whole goal is to get your financials back on track, automating it just seems to run counter, considering that's pretty much just likely how you got into the situation in the first place. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- -defron- · 2023-11-06 17:44 There are so many bad assumptions here... First I've already answered your "care to comment" line multiple times: people who used mint are already ok with their data being collected, aggregated and sold. Likewise, people who use mint are ok with giving their password in the name of data access. I just finished talking to a developer support representative from JP Morgan Chase and at this time they have no interest in allowing personal data automation and only will support aggregators. If I didn't have to go through an aggregator to be able to automate accessing my own information I'd be fine with that. Finally it isn't about simplicity, it's about completeness. My finances have always been great thank you very much, but credit card fraud is a very real thing. Being able to check ALL my transactions for ALL my accounts is the point of personal finance management for me, and that's not feasible without data aggregation (whether done through an aggregator or done on a personal level through something like OFX servers if institutions still supported that) as the hours at some of these institutions are impossible (for example one I use goes into maintenance from 8pm to midnight every day -- because they're east coast and I'm west coast, making manual access and review of my information impossible 5 days of the week due to my schedule if were to be forced to log in manually) If you actually care about peoples privacy and want to make a real difference instead of just beating your drum, pick up the phone, write some emails, and complain to relevant financial institutions why they don't allow you to automate accessing your own finances and force us to go through aggregators. Hell I'm even thinking of sending the information I've found so far to the EFF to see if they can help put pressure to change the current situation, but that won't change the way things are today, and so for today I'm forced to use aggregators ---------------------------------------------------------------------- kmisterk · 2023-11-06 18:41 ## Post Removed hey, TiGeRpro! Thanks for your comment on selfhosted. Your post has been removed due to a violation of **Rule #2.a:** ## Affiliate Links Affiliate links are not allowed in this subreddit. If your link is *not* an affiliate link, and we made a mistake, you're welcome to [message the mods](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/? to=/r/selfhosted&subject=Affiliate Links Removed&message=[Removed Post ](https://www.reddit.com/r/selfhosted/comments/17mvo8w/-/k7nop4m/\)) for us to take a closer look. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- fedroxx · 2023-11-09 01:11 I'd go back to Quicken before I ever did YNAB. At least my data is local with Quicken. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- sesyom · 2023-11-13 23:47 Using Buxfer.