Netcup worth it in 2023? reddit / selfhosted ---------------------------------------------------------------------- DjAmadej · 2023-10-11 19:41 Hi, I know this topic already had some posts, but they are some time old, so I am starting another one... Does anyone know if Netcup is worth it in 2023? Basically I have heard there are some issues with cancellations and such... I want to move away from my Windows web hosting at another company, because I didn't have enough possibilities.... (Basically [ASP.NET](https://ASP.NET) Core and PHP and that is it), but I want to try more stuff, so I though about moving to Netcup to a root server (Either 1000 or 2000 one). What do you guys think, is it worth it? Any better alternatives for similar performance for the price? I am from Slovenia, and I am looking at a max budget of around 16€ after tax per month... ---------------------------------------------------------------------- NekoLuka · 2023-10-11 19:51 I run some of my servers on a linux VPS, with the cheapest tier having 2GB ram, 1 CPU core, 50GB storage and unlimited bandwith for rougly €5 per month. It satisfies all my needs since I tunnel most heavy duty to my homelab. The provider is called Vimexx. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- DjAmadej · 2023-10-11 19:54 And did you ever had any issues with them? Also do you happen to know... when they say cores do they really mean cores or are they threads... the root server with dedicated cores I am looking at says 6 or 4 for the cheaper ---------------------------------------------------------------------- NekoLuka · 2023-10-11 20:34 I've never had an issue so far. I think it's a virtualized core, but it functions a fully working cpu with the loads i've thrown at it. I do run some light services only, but it works for me. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Mr_Zomka · 2023-10-11 20:35 I used their 8GB Root server for a month a while back. I was happy with it :) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- DjAmadej · 2023-10-11 20:38 Great to know ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Throndrache606 · 2023-10-11 20:40 I currently have 2 Root Servers and 1 Storage Server with Netcup for quite a while now. I haven't had any issues so far. RS 1000, RS 2000 and S 1000. Now for your questions. Yes you can use Let's Encrypt with the server. As far as I know you can set up a mail server on there. Maybe write the [support team](https://helpcenter.netcup.com/en/support) or ask in the [forum](https://forum.netcup.de/) if you wanna be 100% sure it works. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- DjAmadej · 2023-10-11 20:56 Thanks for the answer, how do you find the performance on those root servers? Is 2000 worth it? Or should I save a buck and go with 1000? I mean I would like to run a container or two in the future but that is all a big question if I actually will... ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Throndrache606 · 2023-10-11 21:02 I run Matrix/Element on my RS 1000, and it is more than I need. Only uses about 4 GB of RAM at most. On the RS 2000 I currently run 44 Docker containers with no problem. But to come back to your question, if it is worth saving the buck, then for your use case of 1 or 2 containers, it will probably be fine. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Druxtar · 2023-10-11 21:05 Before i switched to the Hetzner Server Auctions i was a big netcup fan. Especially when they have their christmas offers in december. With root access to a server you can achieve everything, free SSL Certificates with let's encrypt as well. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- DjAmadej · 2023-10-11 21:11 Do you maybe know... is it worth registering a domain with them or should I register it somewhere else? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Throndrache606 · 2023-10-11 21:16 I don't have a domain with them. I use Namecheap. But I have heard from colleagues that use Netcup for their domains that it is quite cheap for some tlds. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- DjAmadej · 2023-10-11 21:18 I mean I just have a .com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Throndrache606 · 2023-10-11 21:22 You can check the price on the [site](https://www.netcup.eu/bestellen/domainangebote.php). If you already have one, it depends on whether you want to transfer it to them, so you can manage everything in one place. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- DjAmadej · 2023-10-11 21:50 Do you think I could buy like 1 month of 2000 and in a day or two of using it expand to yearly? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- olluz · 2023-10-11 22:03 I have a mail server and Proxmox mail gateway there. No problems whatsoever. Initially the gateway IP was on one blacklist and blacklisted (or not explicitly white listed) at Microsoft and German Telekom. But it was no hassle to get it unlisted. Make sure to configure everything properly. I can only recommend running a gateway so that you can run your Mailserver from where you want from and can easily move it if necessary ---------------------------------------------------------------------- CeeMX · 2023-10-11 22:13 Netcup is quite cheap, but worth the price. Only thing I had issues with is how they were billing partial months. Basically if you rent a server for a day, they bill you for the whole month and then give you credit for the rest of the month if you cancel early. Hetzner does this better imo, they bill you at the end of the month. Also backups are better with hetzner. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Throndrache606 · 2023-10-11 22:27 That should work as you have a satisfaction guarantee for the root server. Support will probably be able to change if for you. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- NikStalwart · 2023-10-12 01:15 > What do you guys think, is it worth it? Any better alternatives for similar performance for the price? I am from Slovenia, and I am looking at a max budget of around 16€ after tax per month... You are going to have a hard time finding a dedicated server for under €16/month. You might be able to get some cheap Intel ATOM boxes from OVH or Online.net. I believe OVH's N2800s are slow AF, while Online.net C270 Avatons "feel" anecdotally better. But this price range is fairly low. The good news is that you can get a lot of VPS servers for that budget. I would recommend using lowendbox/lowendtalk to look for deals in the field. Wait a few months for Black Friday and try to get on an annual deal. > Would I be still able to have the free SSL via Let's encrypt? Yes. No matter what marketing gimmicks people use, Let's Encrypt certificates come from Let's Encrypt, not a special feature of the provider. So, if you can serve a file over HTTP or publish a TXT record to your DNS zone, you can have free SSL certificates from Let's Encrypt or any other ACME-compliant provider. > Could I set up the right things to have a mail server set up, so it doesn't go to spam? Short answer: yes. Long answer: it takes effort. Some things to look out for: * Some VPS providers block SMTP port; * Some VPS providers have "dirty" IP addresses — not much you can do about that, the owner of the IP needs to get it removed from spamhaus et al * It helps (for spam reasons) if you can set a reverse DNS / PTR record to match your MX hostname. Not all providers allow that, but many do. * You can always use an external SMTP gateway like AWS SES, and, for personal use, this should be well within your budget. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- AristonPost · 2023-10-12 05:23 IMHO with netcup you get a lot for your bucks. I'm running a RS2000 and I'm running a mail server on it. However, this was quite some work as some IP ranges may be burnt by spammers and you might need to deal with some DNS blocking lists to get yours removed. In the end it works fine if you do all the stuff with DKIM,DMARC, SPF etc. and have IPv6 configured for your MTA. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- TBT_TBT · 2023-10-12 08:44 I have 2 servers there, had both for quite some time (one RS3000 equivalent, one RS8000+). If you want to maximize your bucks, wait for some special offer, the next might be Helloween in 2 weeks, black Friday in several more weeks or the „Christmas calendar“ (one special offer every day until 24.12.). You will get more resources like cores, Ram and SSD space. If you don’t want to wait, you call always have a look in the „Biete“ offers in the forum; or ask for something in the „Suche“ section. You can also get a good idea of what to expect there and on https://www.netcup-sonderangebote.de . ---------------------------------------------------------------------- arcadianarcadian · 2023-10-12 08:55 I'm using NetCup for 4-5 months right now and have no problem. Pros: \- Cheap ​ Cons: \- Their IP addressess blacklisted for email operations. (I had to create a server on Hetzner to host my email server) \- There is no centralize firewall, you have to manage your own. (Hetzner does.) \- Control panel is crap. (I miss Hetzner) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- florianhoss · 2023-10-12 09:13 Why the move? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Druxtar · 2023-10-12 12:24 Hetzner: 128GB RAM + 9900k + 2TB SSD = 47€, 100GB Backup Space included, Monitoring with Email Alarm + external Firewall included, monthly cancellable Netcup: (biggest root) 64GB RAM, EPYC 7702, 2TB SSD = 68€, monthly cancellable Biggest issue with Netcup: No nested virtualization. I'm running proxmox with multiple VMs on my Root. So i can have my own Firewall VM everything has to pass through, behind that my gaming and webservers and stuff. Netcup is not allowing nested virtualization so you can only run docker but no real VMs on your root. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- cynic2912_dev · 2023-10-12 12:38 i had a couple of diffrent servers from Netcup over the last couple of years (basically switching depending on the christmas daily deals). So far my experience is quite positive with them (but i also only tried 2 or 3 other hoster years ago, never a bigger one like hetzner). Also have 2 .de domain there where i also hadn't any problems. >Would I be still able to have the free SSL via Let's encrypt? Shouldn't be a problem, i am using lets encrypt on my current netcup server. They also have a small tutorial for this: [https://helpcenter.netcup.com/en/wiki/web-hosting/enabling-ssl- tls](https://helpcenter.netcup.com/en/wiki/web-hosting/enabling-ssl- tls) (i didn't use this tutorial, so can't say anything about it). ​ >Could I set up the right things to have a mail server set up, so it doesn't go to spam? **As far as i know** this depends less on the hoster and more on the "history of the ip" of the server you are going to get. Basically what others did on a server with the ip before you. You can check on [https://www.spamhaus.org/](https://www.spamhaus.org/) , this is one of the bigger blocklist provider, if an ip is blocked and you can start an unblocking procedure. ​ In conculsion, i hadn't any problems with Netcup so far and i am quite happy there. Ff your aren't in a hurry wait till the start of december for the christmas deals, there they have every day a different product discounted (including root server). ---------------------------------------------------------------------- florianhoss · 2023-10-12 12:51 Thanks! I moved from hetzner to netcup now and got the RS4000 with 2TB space and 32GB RAM in a deal. Nothing really with that kind of storage at hetzner… Otherwise missing the hetzner UI/API. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Druxtar · 2023-10-12 13:13 Yeah the issue with server auctions are that they are time limited. When i check now there are serveral Servers with 32GB and 2TB. If you configure the drive size to 2TB you will see plenty. [https://www.hetzner.com/sb?ram\_to=32&drives\_size\_from=0&drives\_si ze\_to=2000](https://www.hetzner.com/sb?ram_to=32&drives_size_from=0&d rives_size_to=2000) You can also find servers with 64GB RAM and 2TB and they are only 34€ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Oskar_Petersilie · 2023-10-12 15:20 I also running 2 vServer 2Gb version since 2021 so \~2years. never had an problem. i also use a hosting package. there the email server sometimes downed for 5-10minutes. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- lilolalu · 2023-10-12 15:28 I don't know netcup but contabo looks cheaper ---------------------------------------------------------------------- DjAmadej · 2023-10-12 16:23 Are you sure waiting till december is worth it? Because my domain and server currently expires at the end of this month so I wouldn't have hosting till then.... ---------------------------------------------------------------------- one-juru · 2023-10-12 18:09 I once found a server with 4 x 10TB HDDs for 36€ / month. Naturally I bought it xD I canceled it a few months after though because even my Plex library wasn't reaching that size and I just didn't have anything useful to do with it. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- cynic2912_dev · 2023-10-12 20:34 >Are you sure waiting till december is worth it? Because my domain and server currently expires at the end of this month so I wouldn't have hosting till then.... Depends what they normally offer is a discount or server with specifications which are normally not on sale. In your case it then maybe better to not wait ---------------------------------------------------------------------- thering1975 · 2023-10-30 19:21 I have several root servers and VPS with them and i have tested them all from OVH (inc SYS) Hetzner as well as a load of lesser knowns. I have virtually moved all my hosting stuff to them for several reasons: **Websites** I host several websites i manage using HestiaCP and they have been flawless in their operation, their network peering is top notch (hetzner peering was hit and miss) I would go as far as saying even there basic tier performed better than OVH option in my home country which is not Germany. Someone i design websites for also switched from OVH to Netcup and have never looked back **Self Hosting Fun** These are perfect for the price, i chuck everything at them and they just sit there and handle it all. The root servers have the benefit of peaking network bandwidth upto 2GBPS although you are limited to how long you can run at full pelt network wise otherwise you get 1GBPS as standard (compare that to heztner, contabo ovh who restirct bandwidth) . The VPS come with 1GBPS even on there 3 euro model. Uptime has been spot on no downtime at all in 2 years (exe circa 30s for my next statement), one Root VPS i had was on a faulty server, the first i knew about it was an email stating they noticed a fault and are seamlessly migrating everyone across to a new server. 30 minutes later all was done downtime circa 30s **Invoicing** As others have mentioned and many threads from years ago complaining about there approach. It's quite simple unlike hetzner etc which bill at the end of the month, netcup wants you to pay up front. I prefer this as it puts off those who want to abuse the system (inc Germany's 14 Days no quibbles cancellation) from spamming the system. So it's quite simple pay your invoices and you will have no issue, dont pay and they willl send debt collectors after you and so they should. Cancellation dates are clearly shown so if you want to cancel do so before the date or expect to pay **Deals & Transfers** Look out for the special offers page often have root servers at great prices. Lets say you pay up front for a non hourly billed server (root servers) on a 6 month contract, but no longer need it after 2 months then just pop into their forums and you can offer the server up to someone else at a price you think people will pay ( especially if you have one of the higher spec discounted special offers package), take payment via paypal, then you transfer ownership in the control panel and they take on the contractual obligations, pretty seemless So yeah i cant fault them. With regards to self hosting mail, as others have said IP blacklists can be a problem, the 4 IPS i have arent on a blacklist but that could be down to luck. However i had enough of trying to work out the dark arts of self hosting email and not ending up in spam i just ended up taking out a workspace account and using Googles SMTP servers / dkim and aliases to ensure all my sites get into the inbox lol Regarding Letsencrypt, any server can obtain certs, different means for different setups but most of my self hosted stuff is in dockers so i use Swag Docker to obtain mine, but have used Certbot at an os level for other setups