Best BBS clients for MS-DOS? And what about active BBSes? reddit / bbs ---------------------------------------------------------------------- LutesAndLasers · 2019-06-20 06:09 Hello y'all! I'm still pretty a noob into BBSing, but really want to be part of a friendly, active one. I've used SyncTERM before, but I wanted something similar for MS-DOS. What's the best client for it? And about the BBSes, does anybody have a good one to recommend it? ​ Thanks in advance! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- gklinger · 2019-06-20 09:10 Telix and Telemate were two of the most popular terminal programs for DOS. As for boards, [take your pick](https://www.telnetbbsguide.com). ---------------------------------------------------------------------- scrutinizer80 · 2019-06-20 10:14 Terminate. The final Terminal. :) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- [deleted] · 2019-06-20 12:54 I used to love Terminate but I found it has issues with Mystic systems. The keyboard acts all wrong. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- djwyldeone · 2019-06-20 13:16 NetRunner ---------------------------------------------------------------------- scrutinizer80 · 2019-06-20 13:18 Never had any issues with it. You can try using it in doorway mode. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- [deleted] · 2019-06-20 13:23 You mean you currently still use it and tried any BBS with the latest Mystic and things like your arrow keys work? What is doorway mode btw? I never used that. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- [deleted] · 2019-06-20 13:25 That's not for DOS like the OP requested. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- scrutinizer80 · 2019-06-20 13:42 I still have it running on dosbox. Doorway mode puts you in complete keyboard control. You can activate it by pressing scroll-lock. It used to be useful back in the day when we used a software called Doorway to remotely drop you into shell. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- [deleted] · 2019-06-20 14:10 I'll try that and see if it helps. It's really been driving me nuts. It does not happen in anything but Mystic boards. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- LutesAndLasers · 2019-06-20 17:14 Thank you, I'll look for them! Do you have any personal recommendations for a board? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- LutesAndLasers · 2019-06-20 17:17 Nice, I'll look for it! Thanks! :D ---------------------------------------------------------------------- dperry324 · 2019-06-20 17:19 When I ran DOS, I used Boyan. It was a shareware app. [https://xpda.com/floppies/](https://xpda.com/floppies/)boyan.zip ---------------------------------------------------------------------- SqualorTrawler · 2019-06-20 17:42 The DOS client I used most frequently over the years and still use sometimes is Telemate. Terminate was another one, but I think Telemate is for me the DOS index client; the one I compare the others to. Works well in DOSbox + tcpser. As for boards, you might find this one interesting (I did): I do. (And I use Telemate w/tcpser in DOSbox) - I just telnetted to this PCBoard the other day and it was a trip; the best looking PCBoard I've ever seen (I mean, ever.) https://www.telnetbbsguide.com/bbs/danger-bay-bbs/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Kodiak01 · 2019-06-20 18:31 Everyone always seems to forget Procomm :P ---------------------------------------------------------------------- resmungomandinga · 2019-06-20 19:58 Terminate was definitely my go-to. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- blakespot · 2019-06-20 20:27 I BBS on my Tandy 1000HX (7.16MHz NEC V20, 640K RAM, 16550-based serial card, WiFi232 modem) as much as I can, and I mainly use a program called Commo. I get some ANSI drop-outs at 9600 baud in Telix. I also sometimes use Qmodem and ProComm. SADLY -- none of these programs' "Doorway mode" works in such a way that it can navigate menus with the "lightbar" (i think it's called) UI for Mystic BBS. SyncTerm works flawlessly. Some examples can be seen in calling the BBS that has the most feeds/areas of any I've seen, Black Flag at blackflag.acid.org. Try moving through the list of messages in Message area with arrow keys in door mode on a DOS PC vs. SyncTerm. Sad I can't find a solution. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- blakespot · 2019-06-20 20:29 THIS. I commented elsewhere in this thread with the same. In doorway mode in any term program I try, the arrows won't work properly in Mystic BBS' Message area. SyncTerm works fine without even specifying doorway mode. I can't get them working with JR-Comm on my Amiga either. IS there a DOS terminal program that can handle arrows in Mystic?? It's driving me nuts! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- blakespot · 2019-06-20 20:29 ++ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- [deleted] · 2019-06-20 20:30 Wow I am glad I am not the only one! This is either a Mystic BBS bug or maybe it has to do with how we set the keyboard up in DOS? Anybody has any clue? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- blakespot · 2019-06-20 20:38 Man, I have spent HOURS signing up for new BBS' and downloading every conceivable terminal program for my Tandy 1000HX. Nothing will work with Mystic, and yes I've turned door mode on (to others who may suggest I check). I want to BBS on boards with FidoNET and RetroNet and such and use vintage hardware. Only SyncTerm on modern hardware seems to work. [This Tandy](https://www.flickr.com/photos/blakespot/47986444467/) is a 7.16MHz machine (640K tho). I tried the term progs on [my more powerful 5x86 160MHz machine](https://bytecellar.com/2014/03/11/behold-the-5x86-system- build-is-complete/) (32MB) and it's the same deal. It's to do with, in Mystic settings, the "Lightbar" message reader which is set in Account Settings. I can choose the other reader but it's terrible when trying to sift through lots of messages (it presents no list at all). You may be aware of this. I use Black Flag BBS as my go to for feeds, btw. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- [deleted] · 2019-06-20 21:02 My friend, not sure what hardware you are running, but if you have a Windows 9x capable machine and that's acceptable for you, mTelnet will run pretty good and does not have this problem. http://mt32.bbses.info/ So far this has been the only "solution" for me to be able to BBS in my Pentium rig. I liked it better with the wifi modem and 9600 speeds, more "authentic", but this Mystic BBS issue just drove me nuts enough to drop all that, put in a NIC and use this software. From what I hear the Mystic author is very much open to listen to this sort of problems but I don't know how to reach out. maybe you know best, you seem to have been around modern BBSes longer than me. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Galileo228 · 2019-06-20 22:38 Qmodem Pro all the way! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- recourse7 · 2019-06-20 23:47 ugh Procomm sucked. Telix was the best dawg. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- bwann · 2019-06-21 00:59 I loved using Qmodem as my main terminal, and OLX for my offline QWK/REP email. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- nevarro · 2019-06-21 21:54 As far as active BBSes, there are a couple of services online that maintain a list of active BBSes. I'm not aware of a service for Mystic BBSes, but there is one for Synchronet BBSes: [http://synchro.net/sbbslist.html](http://synchro.net/sbbslist.html) Another website to check out for active BBSes would be: [https://www.telnetbbsguide.com/](https://www.telnetbbsguide.com/) Another option is just to browse this sub reddit. There are sysops that advertise their BBSes here from time to time, including myself. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- bbs-user-2 · 2019-06-25 17:17 > Anybody has any clue? [Yes.](https://github.com/klamonte/qodem/issues/65#issuecomment- 314786879) The issue is on the Mystic side. Specifically, the main input loop ultimately gets down to TBBSIO.InKey ([Linux version](https://github.c om/klamonte/mysticbbs/blob/f5ff7e016964bd94b3e15fd7a4399253a4c84ab3/my stic/bbs_io.pas#L1433) [Windows version](https://github.com/klamonte/m ysticbbs/blob/f5ff7e016964bd94b3e15fd7a4399253a4c84ab3/mystic/bbs_io.p as#L1457) ) and tracking on the Windows version receives an ESC denoting the start of one of the arrow key sequences [here](https://gi thub.com/klamonte/mysticbbs/blob/f5ff7e016964bd94b3e15fd7a4399253a4c84 ab3/mystic/bbs_io.pas#L1531). At that point: * It waits up to 50 milliseconds for an additional byte. If that byte is not present by then, and not '[', then it falls through and does not look for another byte. * When it looks for that other byte, it calls [TSocketClass.PeekChar]( https://github.com/klamonte/mysticbbs/blob/f5ff7e016964bd94b3e15fd7a43 99253a4c84ab3/mdl/m_socket_class.pas#L426), which in turn calls [DataW aiting](https://github.com/klamonte/mysticbbs/blob/f5ff7e016964bd94b3e 15fd7a4399253a4c84ab3/mdl/m_socket_class.pas#L176), which finally calls [WaitForData](https://github.com/klamonte/mysticbbs/blob/f5ff7e0 16964bd94b3e15fd7a4399253a4c84ab3/mdl/m_socket_class.pas#L492) with a 0 for the timeout parameter. * WaitForData sets the timeout to select() to 0, which results in select() returning immediately (like poll()). **Herein lies the bug:** if the low-level socket buffer does not _already_ contain the '[' following the initial ESC when TSocketClass.PeekChar is called by TBBSIO.InKey, then the rest of the sequence is not parsed correctly. A Qodem user saw this behavior when using Qodem's internal telnet code but not when using an external telnet. I traced the issue to having the ANSI sequence broken up into multiple TCP packets, and eventually tracked this behavior down in Mystic. Mentioned it on FidoNet MYSTIC, but I have no idea if g00r00 ever got to see it (we have both been off-and-on FidoNet over the years). It is slightly gratifying to see confirmation that this is not a solely Qodem issue. I added buffering on the Qodem side that made it a little better for some users but not all. Ultimately whether or not these ANSI sequences are transported by one or many TCP packets is controlled by the OS and network, not the terminal or Mystic. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- bbs-user-2 · 2019-06-25 17:28 [Here is my diagnosis of the issue.](https://old.reddit.com/r/bbs/comm ents/c2sd7r/best_bbs_clients_for_msdos_and_what_about_active/es0u2dv/) Alas, since the root issue is at Mystic's handling in the socket layer, I cannot guarantee any particular DOS terminals will work OK with it. On the sysop side, you could try the GPL version of Mystic with TSocketClass.DataWaiting modified to call WaitForData with a longer timeout, but that doesn't help you on the client side. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- [deleted] · 2019-06-28 13:18 So what to do at this point? Can it be fixed? I noticed mTelnet also acting weird on certain Mystic modules. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- bbs-user-2 · 2019-06-28 17:31 There isn't much to do on the client / user side, unfortunately. On the server side, if you want to pull one of the GPL-licensed Mystic repos out there and compile it yourself, you could then modify DataWaiting to pass a longer timeout to WaitForData (say 100 milliseconds). ---------------------------------------------------------------------- [deleted] · 2019-06-28 17:39 I cannot do any of that stuff. So Mystic is not gonna be fixed? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- bbs-user-2 · 2019-06-28 18:30 You might see if you could find a more direct way to reach g00r00. mysticbbs.com does show a release earlier this year, but I haven't scrounged enough to find an email address there. Might be something in the wiki.