Remove the textmode IDE lazarus / 8-Other ---------------------------------------------------------------------- JiaXing · 2020-05-07 14:48 It's not updated, not work on systems other than Windows and Linux. And the last time I tried it had problem to compile program. It said it can't find unit System used by test.pas. My test.pas is just a simple program to print 'test' in the screen. Compiling with fpc on the terminal worked fine. I think if we can't treat it well (it's not updated and in maintenance mode for a long time) we should just remove it. People passionate will have their own folks to keep up the classic Turbo Pascal like IDE. I think it's the best. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Thaddy · 2020-05-07 15:01 Many people, like me, do not program much GUI stuff (webservers and the like) For such cases the textmode IDE is perfectly capable. Keep it! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- JiaXing · 2020-05-07 15:01 I think it's the time to de-bloating fpc. Removing all of the unmaintained units as well as the textmode IDE. We don't just throw them away but we moved them to a separate git repository and no longer ship them by default with our distribution of fpc. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- lucamar · 2020-05-07 15:03 So it should be removed just because it doesn't work for you? I strongly disagree. I do use it a lot in DOS, (old) Windows and Linux, and I find it quite handy to write/maintain programs in low- ressources machines, of which I maintain quite some, and I'd be quite lost without it (or obligued to BMO, quite a long and tedious process). I'll agree, though, that it could do with a little more love. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Thaddy · 2020-05-07 15:04 Again, the standard distribution IS maintained and any bugs can be reported. If a package has not been touched for some years it does not mean it is not maintained. It can also be the case that the code is very stable. That is also the most likely explanation. And unlike Lazarus, FreePascal is in no way graphical GUI centric. Keep as is. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- JiaXing · 2020-05-07 15:05 Quote from: Thaddy on May 07, 2020, 05:01:02 pmMany people, like me, do not program much GUI stuff (webservers and the like) For such cases the textmode IDE is perfectly capable. Keep it! If you work before the terminal the textmode IDE is the worst thing I could think of. A terminal based text editor supports basic code completion + syntax highlighting for Pascal and a shell window to compile with fpc, all possible with the help of tmux, it's the best I could think of. p/s: I don't want to just throw it away. I only suggest to no longer ship it by default with our distribution of fpc. People want to install it could download a separate package or clone the git repository of it and compile it themselves. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Thaddy · 2020-05-07 15:13 Quote from: JiaXing on May 07, 2020, 05:05:51 pmIf you work before the terminal the textmode IDE is the worst thing I could think of. A terminal based text editor supports basic code completion + syntax highlighting for Pascal and a shell window to compile with fpc, all possible with the help of tmux, it's the best I could think of. This is not true: the textmode ide contains a full statically linked compiler. It does not open an extra shell to run the compiler. It IS the compiler. It contains even the exact same compiler code as the one you run in a terminal. (ppcXXX) I run fp in a 132x50 terminal window over SSH or even on headless systems. Only the executable you wrote yourself is run from a terminal, same goes for Lazarus, and then you have to know how, because Lazarus does not like such things. If you have a GUI free system all is run from the same. On many of my systems I type startx to switch to GUI mode. Does not happen a lot ---------------------------------------------------------------------- PascalDragon · 2020-05-07 18:12 Quote from: JiaXing on May 07, 2020, 04:48:36 pmIt's not updated, not work on systems other than Windows and Linux. And the last time I tried it had problem to compile program. It said it can't find unit System used by test.pas. My test.pas is just a simple program to print 'test' in the screen. Compiling with fpc on the terminal worked fine. I think if we can't treat it well (it's not updated and in maintenance mode for a long time) we should just remove it. People passionate will have their own folks to keep up the classic Turbo Pascal like IDE. I think it's the best. The textmode IDE is maintained. We've only with 3.2.0 added support for GDBMI, thus improving debugger support on modern platforms. Also shipping the IDE does not cost anything except space. If you're miss something, file a bug or better yet: provide patches. So in short: we'll not remove the textmode IDE from FPC's distributions. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- lucamar · 2020-05-07 18:48 Besides, the fp IDE adds around six MiB (with source); it's just a drop in the sea of 400+ MiB of a normal install. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- dbannon · 2020-05-07 23:22 Yes, I'd vote to keep it it there too. Its not perfect but neither was the original. I too had problems getting it compiling initially, the process is not intuitive but thats probably just a documentation issue, I'll write what I did down next time.  And the colours are poor, based on when we all used screens with a black background.  But thats (apparently) fashionable again ! Keep it there so its ready to use on install please ! Davo ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Zoran · 2020-05-08 05:31 Keep it, please! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- eljo · 2020-05-08 05:32 I do not have it in my installation (Lazarus 2.0.4 r61665 FPC 3.0.4 i386-win32-win32/win64) but yeah keep it please. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Awkward · 2020-05-08 06:01 When i tried to use Text IDE, got many problems with initial settings, that true, but keep it anyway! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- PascalDragon · 2020-05-08 07:03 Quote from: dbannon on May 08, 2020, 01:22:09 amYes, I'd vote to keep it it there too. Its not perfect but neither was the original. There is nothing to vote, cause we're not even remotely considering to remove it. Quote from: eljo on May 08, 2020, 07:32:45 amI do not have it in my installation (Lazarus 2.0.4 r61665 FPC 3.0.4 i386-win32-win32/win64) but yeah keep it please. The FPC distribution shipped with Lazarus does not contain the textmode IDE, because after all Lazarus is the IDE of choice here. Standalone packages of FPC however ship with the IDE (with the exception of macOS), cause there the textmode IDE is the IDE. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- lucamar · 2020-05-08 08:07 Quote from: PascalDragon on May 08, 2020, 09:03:12 amThe FPC distribution shipped with Lazarus does not contain the textmode IDE, [...] More precisely: the Lazarus distributions for Windows don't contain the textmode IDE; the *nix ones do. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- marcov · 2020-05-08 09:35 There was some discussion about starting to package a full FPC with lazarus. The savings gotten smaller and smaller over the years. (mostly because the left out bits are near constant in time, and the rest keeps growing). The google api alone is 93MB or so. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- PascalDragon · 2020-05-08 12:58 Quote from: lucamar on May 08, 2020, 10:07:45 amQuote from: PascalDragon on May 08, 2020, 09:03:12 amThe FPC distribution shipped with Lazarus does not contain the textmode IDE, [...] More precisely: the Lazarus distributions for Windows don't contain the textmode IDE; the *nix ones do. That is because on *nix Lazarus simply has a dependency on the FPC package. And that might not necessarily be used with Lazarus. Also on Debian this is not true as there the textmode IDE is a separate package. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- lucamar · 2020-05-08 14:43 Quote from: PascalDragon on May 08, 2020, 02:58:47 pmThat is because on *nix Lazarus simply has a dependency on the FPC package. And that might not necessarily be used with Lazarus. Also on Debian this is not true as there the textmode IDE is a separate package. I was talking about the "official" releases from lazarus-ide.org (i.e. the debs and rpms you download from, say, sourceforge), but yeah, once you dive into the "underworld" of Linux distro specifics anything goes ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Martin_fr · 2020-05-08 15:02 Quote from: lucamar on May 08, 2020, 10:07:45 amMore precisely: the Lazarus distributions for Windows don't contain the textmode IDE; the *nix ones do. They Windows ones probably will in future. It was/is just a very old quirk in the build script that prevented it (no idea if by accident or intend). And it seems (looking at the snapshot builds with 3.2beta) that quirk no longer acts on the textmode ide. Besides, given the size of the installer, really makes no difference. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- trev · 2020-05-08 23:38 Quote from: lucamar on May 08, 2020, 10:07:45 amMore precisely: the Lazarus distributions for Windows don't contain the textmode IDE; the *nix ones do. Not that precise because the Lazarus distributions for macOS, a fully certified UNIX, do not include the text mode IDE.