Documentation versions lazarus / 62-General ---------------------------------------------------------------------- MarkMLl · 2022-09-28 07:54 The FPC documentation master page is at https://www.freepascal.org/docs-html/current/rtl/index.html Are other versions available apart from "current"? The https://www.freepascal.org/docs-html/ directory isn't searchable remotely, so it's impossible to see. Similar question applies to Lazarus, where the master appears to be at https://lazarus-ccr.sourceforge.io/docs/ MarkMLl ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Kays · 2022-09-28 10:10 Quote from: MarkMLl on September 28, 2022, 09:54:17 am[…] Are other versions available apart from "current"? […]Yes. Replace current with a version number string, e. g. https://www.freepascal.org/docs- html/3.0.0/rtl/index.html ---------------------------------------------------------------------- MarkMLl · 2022-09-28 11:14 Quote from: Kays on September 28, 2022, 12:10:15 pmQuote from: MarkMLl on September 28, 2022, 09:54:17 am[…] Are other versions available apart from "current"? […]Yes. Replace current with a version number string, e. g. https://www.freepascal.org/docs- html/3.0.0/rtl/index.html Thanks, I suspected that was the case but does anybody have a list of what's actually in there? For example, I get a 404 on https://www.freepascal.org/docs-html/2.6.4/rtl/index.html This is in the context of trying to have a coherent response for users who say "I've got version such-and-such and the documentation doesn't match". Same question applies to Lazarus, and to manuals in PDF form. MarkMLl ---------------------------------------------------------------------- marcov · 2022-09-28 11:18 Quote from: MarkMLl on September 28, 2022, 01:14:37 pmThis is in the context of trying to have a coherent response for users who say "I've got version such-and-such and the documentation doesn't match". In the past in such cases we would refer to the zipped files on the FTP. Files on FTP go back to 2.2.2. But FTP doesn't work anymore in webbrowsers ---------------------------------------------------------------------- MarkMLl · 2022-09-28 11:32 Quote from: marcov on September 28, 2022, 01:18:14 pmIn the past in such cases we would refer to the zipped files on the FTP. Files on FTP go back to 2.2.2. But FTP doesn't work anymore in webbrowsers I know, and I've been saying that the developers need to get their arses in gear to fix the PDF links for at least a year. I find a complete list of FPC versions with embedded docs at ftp://ftp.freepascal.org/pub/fpc/dist/ and I notice that Konqueror (i.e. on Linux with KDE) can still access the content. I also note a comprehensive set of documentation at ftp://ftp.freepascal.org/pub/lazarus/releases/Lazarus Documentation/ although only in .chm format. MarkMLl ---------------------------------------------------------------------- PascalDragon · 2022-09-28 11:39 Quote from: marcov on September 28, 2022, 01:18:14 pmQuote from: MarkMLl on September 28, 2022, 01:14:37 pmThis is in the context of trying to have a coherent response for users who say "I've got version such-and-such and the documentation doesn't match". In the past in such cases we would refer to the zipped files on the FTP. Files on FTP go back to 2.2.2. But FTP doesn't work anymore in webbrowsers Wasn't the idea to make that accessible through HTTP? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- dsiders · 2022-09-28 17:09 Quote from: MarkMLl on September 28, 2022, 09:54:17 amAre other versions available apart from "current"? The https://www.freepascal.org/docs-html/ directory isn't searchable remotely, so it's impossible to see. Similar question applies to Lazarus, where the master appears to be at https://lazarus-ccr.sourceforge.io/docs/ Given that those files haven't been updated since 2018... I doubt that multiple versions would ever be a consideration.  However, you can use the build_html.sh or build_html.bat scripts to build the HTML format locally. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- MarkMLl · 2022-09-28 17:19 Quote from: dsiders on September 28, 2022, 07:09:16 pmHowever, you can use the build_html.sh or build_html.bat scripts to build the HTML format locally. Noted, but that is hardly going to be much use when somebody says "I'm still on 3.0.0 and for complicated reasons cannot at present upgrade: where can I find the matching documentation?". Saying "go away and build it yourself" really /isn't/ an option here, particularly when the files /do/ exist online if one knows which magic incantation is needed to invoke a now-deprecated protocol. MarkMLl ---------------------------------------------------------------------- dsiders · 2022-09-28 17:27 Quote from: MarkMLl on September 28, 2022, 07:19:37 pmQuote from: dsiders on September 28, 2022, 07:09:16 pmHowever, you can use the build_html.sh or build_html.bat scripts to build the HTML format locally. Noted, but that is hardly going to be much use when somebody says "I'm still on 3.0.0 and for complicated reasons cannot at present upgrade: where can I find the matching documentation?". Saying "go away and build it yourself" really /isn't/ an option here, particularly when the files /do/ exist online if one knows which magic incantation is needed to invoke a now-deprecated protocol. MarkMLl I was referring specifically to LCL and LazUtils documentation where that magic spell has no effect. And I haven't seen any resource where archives for LCL and LazUtils in HTML format can be downloaded. A preview for trunk documentation is at: https://dsiders.gitlab.io/lazdocsnext/.  But again... no download is available. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- marcov · 2022-09-28 19:08 Quote from: MarkMLl on September 28, 2022, 07:19:37 pmQuote from: dsiders on September 28, 2022, 07:09:16 pmHowever, you can use the build_html.sh or build_html.bat scripts to build the HTML format locally. Noted, but that is hardly going to be much use when somebody says "I'm still on 3.0.0 and for complicated reasons cannot at present upgrade: where can I find the matching documentation?". In general most distributions originally came with some form of documentation. So for very complicated and difficult reasons, consider exploring the place where you got that version. (e.g. the package source for that ancient *nix distro that you are using) QuoteSaying "go away and build it yourself" really /isn't/ an option here, particularly when the files /do/ exist online if one knows which magic incantation is needed to invoke a now-deprecated protocol. In general support is limited to the last released version, and sometimes, for brief periods, the previous version. I don't see why documentation would be any different from the rest of the release. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- MarkMLl · 2022-09-28 19:21 Quote from: marcov on September 28, 2022, 09:08:40 pmIn general support is limited to the last released version, and sometimes, for brief periods, the previous version. I don't see why documentation would be any different from the rest of the release. Right, so consider the situation in /this/ thread: https://forum.lazarus.freepascal.org/index.php/topic,60682.0.html Here's a respected user with code apparently working properly with (Lazarus and) FPC 3.0.0. How are any of us who don't still have 3.0 on our machines supposed to help if we can't even see the docs online? MarkMLl ---------------------------------------------------------------------- marcov · 2022-09-28 19:46 Quote from: MarkMLl on September 28, 2022, 09:21:17 pmHere's a respected user with code apparently working properly with (Lazarus and) FPC 3.0.0. How are any of us who don't still have 3.0 on our machines supposed to help if we can't even see the docs online? I assume if you want to help with outdated versions, you have them, documentation incluis. For power users that want to help anyway, they probably know to workaround "outdated protocols" ---------------------------------------------------------------------- MarkMLl · 2022-09-29 06:59 Quote from: dsiders on September 28, 2022, 07:09:16 pmGiven that those files haven't been updated since 2018... I doubt that multiple versions would ever be a consideration.  However, you can use the build_html.sh or build_html.bat scripts to build the HTML format locally. ...and the documentation link page hasn't been updated since 2019. Now can't somebody go in with vi or something and fix the PDF links issue, then make the appropriate directory on the web server listable? This seems to be another of those cases- of which I've seen several in the past of "this isn't strictly part of the mainstream project, it's not my responsibility". MarkMLl ---------------------------------------------------------------------- marcov · 2022-09-30 13:29 Quote from: MarkMLl on September 29, 2022, 08:59:18 amQuote from: dsiders on September 28, 2022, 07:09:16 pmGiven that those files haven't been updated since 2018... I doubt that multiple versions would ever be a consideration.  However, you can use the build_html.sh or build_html.bat scripts to build the HTML format locally. ...and the documentation link page hasn't been updated since 2019. Now can't somebody go in with vi or something and fix the PDF links issue, then make the appropriate directory on the web server listable? I couldn't find your bugreport, so I raised it on core. Michael said a http mirror of FTP exists at http://downloads.freepascal.org  (note that is HTTP, not -S) So something was done, just the links not updated. QuoteThis seems to be another of those cases- of which I've seen several in the past of "this isn't strictly part of the mainstream project, it's not my responsibility". Well, thanks for responsibly opening a ticket then. Which number is it btw, so that I can close it ? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- MarkMLl · 2022-09-30 15:18 Quote from: marcov on September 30, 2022, 03:29:57 pmWell, thanks for responsibly opening a ticket then. Which number is it btw, so that I can close it ?  Because whenever I've tried to raise it in discussion- and I'm not one to add to the ticket backlog until I'm confident it's justified- I've been told either that "the website isn't documentation" or "it's not our problem if users run a browser that can't handle FTP". And I'm getting to the point where I just don't give a damn anymore. MarkMLl ---------------------------------------------------------------------- PascalDragon · 2022-10-01 17:35 Quote from: MarkMLl on September 30, 2022, 05:18:16 pmI've been told either that "the website isn't documentation" The wiki isn't documentation. Anything that can't easily be changed by a non-core user is considered official and thus if an issue is found there an issue should be opened on the bug tracker. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- MarkMLl · 2022-10-01 17:51 Quote from: PascalDragon on October 01, 2022, 07:35:58 pmThe wiki isn't documentation. Anything that can't easily be changed by a non- core user is considered official and thus if an issue is found there an issue should be opened on the bug tracker. I know. But when I've raised this in the past- and I'm /not/ spending my time hunting messages down- I've had people hemming and hawing and saying that the website doesn't fall into anybody's remit in particular. MarkMLl