Newsgroups: comp.sys.apple2
Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!rpi!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!maverick.ksu.ksu.edu!unlinfo.unl.edu!hoss!greg
From: greg@hoss.unl.edu (Lig Lury Jr.)
Subject: Re: ProLine vs GBBS (ACOS)
Message-ID: <1991Jun2.041414.19181@unlinfo.unl.edu>
Sender: news@unlinfo.unl.edu
Nntp-Posting-Host: hoss.unl.edu
Organization: GBBS/ACOS Sysop Support
References: <1991Jun1.173621.7616@crash.cts.com>
Date: Sun, 2 Jun 1991 04:14:14 GMT
Lines: 95

bbarba@pro-torii.cts.com (Bob Barba) writes:
>greg@hoss.unl.edu (Lig Lury, Jr.) writes:
>>bbarba@pro-torii.cts.com (Bob Barba) writes:

>>Now c'mon, you have to take into account that since they are using ACOS
>>that the majority couldn't afford ProLine, and thus fewer are willing to
>>spend money in long distance bills to connect to all these places.  Age is
>>another consideration.  Who are the lucky nodes putting the bills to send
>>these messages overseas, and have they met Ed McMahan and/or Robin Leach?

>What do you mean, "could not afford Pro-Line"??  Buying direct from any
>manufacturer will be more expensive.  Programs Plus offers Pro-Line for $95.

To get the same functionality and flexibility you get with GBBS "Pro", you
must add MD-BASIC in there, and be using an Apple IIgs, and have invested
in a hard drive.  That drives up the cost.  Stock GBBS "Pro" can run on 2
5.25" disks!  It has its language built in!  It has all this and still can
be run on a FRANKLIN!

I suggest Morgan work on an 8-bit version of MD-BASIC, and quickly.  Then
I may suggest it to the average new sysop.

>Connectivity for Pro-Line is usually local or rigional on the outside.  As
>for me,  I call San Diego nightly! and no I don't know Ed McMahon, or Robin
>Leach.  I happen to be a U.S. Marine.  If I can afford to make these calls
>surly you can too!

I _surely_ can not.  (Anger is not conducive to coherent text.  As George
Carlin would say, "Calm down, have some dip.")  I don't get paid like you
do.  Pro-Line is expensive, and even that price is over the list price for
METAL.  For accurate comparisons, one must compare list price to list
price.  Anything else is unfair, and both sides of this discussion know
it.

>your wrong in 
>saying that age is a  consideration, it should be maturity!

Age of the software and network, not age of the sysop.

>(I wonder 
>how many  PIRATE GBBS boards are still running? and complaining about 
>non-support etc??)

Then they have no cause to be complaining.  I run a registered system.
L&L Support isn't helping that much.  I run my own mailing list for a
reason.

>>>I have also had the BEST support from Morgan Davis (author) and my fellow
>>>Pro-Line Sysops from around the world.  I don't think I could have found a
>>>better home than Pro-Line!!

::[out of context text deleted]

>But can you say that about L&L and the other ACOS SysOps?

L&L?  No.  Other SysOps?  Yes.  I've gotten lots of help from others.  One
of the best things a sysop can do is to teach a cosysop how to write code.
ACOS is very attractive code, and you can edit it online, without being
stuck with line numbers online with ProLine.  You teach him, he learns
more, and then teaches you back, and the learning increases.  I have
innovations in code that I cannot even DREAM of porting to ProLine,
because it would be impossible, and I'm not talking about whiz bang
emulations or mondo downloads.  I'm talking code!  Even translated to
AppleSoft, ProLine structure prevents me from implementing the stuff I
have come to rely on in ACOS.  I don't want to run another clone system.
The form of a BBS represents the sysop's personality.  You don't set up a
system and let it run.  That was the death of the Infiniti BBS here.

>and while I'm
>thinking about it...Didn't I here something about MACOS being a rip off of
>ACOS!!  Talk about PIRATING!!

Hey, I don't support MACOS, and I definitely do NOT run it.  The author
made a fatal error in his distribution methods.  If it was sent as diffs,
I don't see how L&L would have problems with it.  As it was distributed
(as from what I've been able to ascertain) it was still a viable system
without ACOS for local mode, and included documentation, most likely
sufficient to create modem drivers from scratch.  Anyone getting new
copies of MACOS is pirating, even if they own ACOS, since MACOS was
discontinued long ago.  By running MACOS, one forfeits sysop support from
L&L.  While support isn't what it should be, it is there.  If you lose
access, you don't get upgrades.  Lance Taylor-Warren has said this
publically.

>----
>ProLine:  bbarba@pro-torii                         | Pro-Torii (Iwakuni, Japan)
>Internet: bbarba@pro-torii.cts.com                 | 011-81-611-753-4846  
>UUCP:     crash!pro-torii!bbarba                   | Hrs: 8pm - 5am Mon-Thr 
>Mail: Bob Barba, PO Box 139  FPO Seattle, Wa 98764 |      8pm Fri - 5am Mon

--
///   ____   \\\ "The major problem--one of the major problems, for there are
| |/ /    \ \| |       several--one of the many major problems with governing
 \\_|\____/|_//            people is of whom you get to do it, or more to the
greg \_\\\/ hoss.unl.edu    point, who gets people to let them do it to them."
