[HN Gopher] Wit, unker, Git: The lost medieval pronouns of Engli...
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       Wit, unker, Git: The lost medieval pronouns of English intimacy
        
       Author : eigenspace
       Score  : 172 points
       Date   : 2026-04-09 10:10 UTC (12 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (www.bbc.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (www.bbc.com)
        
       | markus_zhang wrote:
       | For anyone curious as me:
       | 
       | git means You two.
        
         | stoneman24 wrote:
         | I wonder how it evolved into the modern British slang of "git".
         | To quote Wikipedia [0]
         | 
         | "modern British English slang, a git (/gIt/) is a term of
         | insult used to describe someone--usually a man--who is
         | considered stupid, incompetent, annoying, unpleasant, or
         | silly.".
         | 
         | And " Git is a popular open-source software for version control
         | created by Linus Torvalds. Torvalds jokingly named it "git"
         | after the slang term, later defining it as "the stupid content
         | tracker"."
         | 
         | [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Git_(slang)
        
           | talideon wrote:
           | There appears to be nothing linking Old English "git" with
           | Modern English "git". Also, OEng "git" would've been
           | pronounced more like "yit".
        
           | Octoth0rpe wrote:
           | > Torvalds jokingly named it "git" after the slang term,
           | later defining it as "the stupid content tracker"."
           | 
           | I think the better Torvalds quote was when he said "I name
           | all my projects after myself"
        
           | OneLeggedCat wrote:
           | I (an American) had only heard the slang version in Holy
           | Grail, and didn't know the slang meaning, and finally am now
           | seeing your comment. Now to lookup the meaning of "manky..."
        
         | vintermann wrote:
         | "Listen baby, they're playing uncer song..."
         | 
         | "Git should get a room!"
        
         | rbonvall wrote:
         | Of course. It's distributed.
        
       | frogulis wrote:
       | Boy that unc/uncer looks tantalisingly close to modern German
       | uns/unser. Wiktionary seems to have it descending from a
       | different PIE root, _ns vs_ nh -- I'm not at all familiar with
       | PIE though.
        
         | shakna wrote:
         | n is just the "not" prefix. The "ero" is the real root. The
         | prefix applies to the root first, and then the other pieces
         | have their meanings, usually. (Its a reconstructed language.
         | There are both exceptions and things we don't know.)
         | 
         | "n-s-ero-" is sort of < "not" next-is-plural "mine" >.
         | 
         | So, plural-(invert mine). Or roughly close to "we".
         | 
         | "n-h-ero-" is sort of < "not" next-is-inclusive-plural "mine"
         | >.
         | 
         | So, plural-(group (invert mine)). Or roughly close to "us".
         | 
         | But both are pretty close to the same meaning. High German
         | maintained a lot of PIE, and is very close in a lot of ways.
         | Though... Welsh is closer.
        
           | z500 wrote:
           | I've never heard of it being based on that root before. Do
           | you have a source?
        
             | shakna wrote:
             | The two big ones for discussing Germanic languages and
             | their inheritance would probably be:
             | 
             | "From Proto-Indo-European to Proto-Germanic", Ringe.
             | 
             | And the simpler "Lexikon der indogermanischen Partikeln und
             | Pronominalstamme", Dunkel.
             | 
             | Both use "n-s-ero-", though in the more traditional
             | /'un.se.raz/ form.
        
           | zahlman wrote:
           | I feel like nasal sounds being associated with negation must
           | be even older than PIE.
        
         | eigenspace wrote:
         | That was my first thought too! So many things in old-english
         | are very very close to modern German, so it's sometimes
         | surprising to see these false-friends.
        
           | stvltvs wrote:
           | Contrary to what GP said, they're not false friends. They're
           | a (lost) part of English's Germanic roots, shared with modern
           | German.
           | 
           | Edit: Check out the Proto-Germanic personal pronouns.
           | 
           | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Proto-
           | Germanic_person...
        
           | shermantanktop wrote:
           | Oh, you mean "Falsche Freunde"?
           | 
           | I have no idea how to say that idiomatically in German, but
           | it struck me that those are both "true" friends.
        
         | pantalaimon wrote:
         | Same with Ic - Ich
        
         | hn_acc1 wrote:
         | As a born German, now more native English speaker (left at 8),
         | I agree. But, unless I'm very wrong, uns/unser in modern German
         | is not restricted to 2 people either - it can mean 2 or more,
         | as in "unsere Gemeinde" (our church, referring to something
         | shared by hundreds of people)?
        
         | kmm wrote:
         | Curiously, Old English unc is actually not related to German
         | uns, at least, not after the Germanic language family had
         | already formed. Old English at some point underwent a sound
         | change[1] where the -n- sound disappeared before fricatives
         | (sounds like s, f, v, z, sh, etc...). So "us" comes from an
         | older common form "uns", which German inherited basically
         | unchanged. This sound change also explains other
         | correspondences between English and German where the n is
         | missing, like mouth-Mund, tooth-Zahn, other-ander, goose-Gans
         | or five-funf.
         | 
         | 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ingvaeonic_nasal_spirant_law
        
       | nhgiang wrote:
       | You two add
       | 
       | You two commit
       | 
       | You two push
        
         | u2git wrote:
         | u2 add u2 commit u2 push
        
           | postepowanieadm wrote:
           | Us3
        
       | huijzer wrote:
       | Also sad is the fact that "you" is now used for "thee" and "thou"
       | and such. The older variants could distinguish between "you"
       | plural and "you" singular
        
         | ksherlock wrote:
         | W'all have got y'all for plural you.
        
           | thechao wrote:
           | You, y'all (small close group), y'all all (larger, further
           | group), and "all y'all" -- Southeast Texas (coastal) dialect
           | form that showed up about 25 yrs ago. I suspect it might've
           | been there all along, but only became acceptable at that
           | point?
           | 
           | Another 100+ years, and this'll be some solid grammar.
        
             | gibspaulding wrote:
             | Don't forget you'uns or yinz!
             | 
             | I struggled with this when I was a school teacher. English
             | lacks a good way to clarify you are addressing a group vs
             | one person, which comes up a lot in a classroom. "Class,
             | you..." is clunky, "You guys..." has obvious issues, and
             | y'all or any other contraction is generally considered bad
             | grammar. I generally went with y'all. Kids would laugh
             | about it, but that seemed to help get their attention.
        
               | dfxm12 wrote:
               | Surely, you knew all of your students' names and if you
               | were addressing one person, you could've used their name.
               | Addressing the class as merely "class" seems adequate as
               | well. I'm having a hard time thinking of a situation
               | where you are forced to use "you" ambiguously.
        
               | madcaptenor wrote:
               | What if you're addressing part of the class, though? Like
               | "y'all in the back, you need to get back to your work".
        
               | dfxm12 wrote:
               | "You in the back" has the same level of specificity.
               | Other options include (again) naming names or calling out
               | a more specific location "You in the back row".
        
               | madcaptenor wrote:
               | No, because "you in the back" could refer to just one
               | person in the back, instead of several. So "y'all in the
               | back" is more specific. (Of course names are an option in
               | this context.)
        
               | dfxm12 wrote:
               | _(Of course names are an option in this context.)_
               | 
               | Yes, this is a case where you aren't forced to use "you"
               | ambiguously in that context.
               | 
               |  _No, because "you in the back" could refer to just one
               | person in the back, instead of several._
               | 
               | If you meant to address one person, you'd have said that
               | one person's name, instead of voluntarily introducing
               | ambiguity to the situation. Context & body language also
               | makes this obvious. If you meant one person, you'd be
               | making eye contact with one person instead of a group of
               | people, etc. Students also know if they're paying
               | attention or not. "The back" is not a specific area.
        
               | teddyh wrote:
               | "Now, chat, settle down."
        
             | AndrewKemendo wrote:
             | That has to be more than 25 years
             | 
             | I grew up in Houston saying all that in the 80s
        
               | pessimizer wrote:
               | It's probably closer to 250 years than 25.
        
               | thechao wrote:
               | Same here, frankly. I just didn't want to make an
               | aggressive generalization that I couldn't support. I've
               | got _video_ of the usage from 2001.
        
           | madcaptenor wrote:
           | Before I moved to the South I (a non-Southerner) did not feel
           | comfortable saying "y'all". But "you guys" seemed sexist. I
           | have since spent a decade in the South and I have not picked
           | up much of the dialect, but I definitely say "y'all" now.
           | 
           | "W'all" would be nice to have. I guess it's not a thing
           | because it sounds too much like the things that separate
           | rooms.
        
             | saltcured wrote:
             | Have you yet progressed to y'all being singular and all
             | y'all being plural?
        
               | madcaptenor wrote:
               | No. As far as I can tell, singular "y'all", when it
               | exists, is an implied plural. What you might hear as
               | singular "y'all" is, say, when you go into a restaurant
               | and say "do y'all have Coke?" to the server - that
               | doesn't refer to just the server but to the restaurant as
               | a whole. But I'm not a linguist and also I don't spend
               | much time among people with heavier Southern dialect, so
               | you shouldn't believe what I say.
        
               | pessimizer wrote:
               | No, you've got it right. A lot of people trying to be
               | cute and make southern language seem more alien than it
               | is are over-"correcting."
               | 
               | When southern people say y'all to one person, they're
               | really addressing you _and your family_ (even though you
               | might be the only one there.) If I ask  "how y'all
               | doing?" I want to know how you and yours are doing.
        
               | macintux wrote:
               | > If I ask "how y'all doing?" I want to know how you and
               | yours are doing.
               | 
               | I just want people to stop asking me how I'm doing if
               | they don't care.
               | 
               | It took me an embarrassingly long time to figure out that
               | "How's it going" is a greeting, not an interrogative, and
               | I want that change undone forever.
        
               | saltcured wrote:
               | What's interesting is you may reply, "hey, how are you?",
               | and lots of people may be satisfied with that. Neither
               | party actually answers how they are, yet the handshake is
               | complete.
        
               | macintux wrote:
               | I refuse out of principle, but agree, that works.
               | 
               | I just use "Howdy".
        
               | ptmcc wrote:
               | Which is short for "How do you do?"
        
               | macintux wrote:
               | Good point! I guess my principles only extend so far.
        
               | FarmerPotato wrote:
               | Don't forget to end the conversation with "God be with
               | ye". Or "A Dios".
        
               | saltcured wrote:
               | I've had it explained to me as a western/eastern divide
               | among southerners. As you head through Texas, more people
               | think you need "all y'all" for plurals.
               | 
               | That's something those western southerners told me. I
               | don't know if a linguist would agree, but that seems to
               | be the understanding of some actual language users...
               | 
               | All I know is that there is a second boundary somewhere
               | through TX, NM, and AZ, because I've never met a native
               | Californian who would say "y'all" non ironically.
        
             | lamasery wrote:
             | "Guys" (without a "the" in front of it) is
             | uncontroversially gender-neutral in most contexts in at
             | least some parts of the US. I'm not sure whether folks
             | worried about it are from places where it's definitely not,
             | or places where it's not used much at all so they're not
             | aware that it's a non-issue in (at least many) places where
             | it is.
             | 
             | I do prefer "y'all", though. I think it's the best one
             | we've got, of the options ("yous" being another big one,
             | and ew, gross)
             | 
             | I also love the nuance of "y'all" and "all y'all".
        
             | chadd wrote:
             | i tried to stop using y'all when i got my first job at
             | MSFT, having grown up in the South; then 10 years later I
             | realized it's perfect for Corporate America given it's
             | gender neutral
        
               | madcaptenor wrote:
               | meanwhile, my New Jersey-born boss uses "you guys"
               | despite herself being female and having lived in the
               | South longer than I have
        
               | kevin_thibedeau wrote:
               | I grew up saying it and consciously eradicated it around
               | 3rd grade. I probably shouldnt've but it would seem
               | forced to do it now.
        
         | EvsCB wrote:
         | Forms of it persists in regional dialects, its not super common
         | anymore but in Yorkshire I still here "dees" and "thas", "yous"
         | also persist as another form of the plural you.
        
       | eigenspace wrote:
       | I found this article quite interesting, and couldn't help but
       | feel there's something that's emotionally lost when we got rid of
       | the dual-forms. The example from Wulf and Eadwacer where "uncer
       | giedd" was translated to "the song of the two of us".
       | 
       | Somehow that just doesn't land the same.
        
         | heresie-dabord wrote:
         | > Somehow that just doesn't land the same.
         | 
         | I fear that a modern colloquial rendering would disappoint yet
         | further:                   our besties tune
        
           | FarmerPotato wrote:
           | Certes, challenging to translate!
           | 
           | "Our secret song"
           | 
           | "Our shared song" is looser, though context helps.
           | 
           | "They're playing our song" still captures the timeless
           | feeling. But is wrong for the poem.
        
         | zukzuk wrote:
         | If you found this interesting, you might want to check out The
         | History of the English Language podcast.
         | 
         | I'm surprised how much I'm enjoying it. And I can't believe I
         | have 195 episodes left.
        
         | LAC-Tech wrote:
         | If you are interested in Wulf and Eadwacer it is beautifully
         | sung here:
         | 
         | https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=6-QagSE7sFY
        
         | iterateoften wrote:
         | We still have in English: us-two and you-two and we-two.
         | 
         | Same number of syllables.
         | 
         | Maybe "Song of just us two"
         | 
         | Like it's common to hear "You two better stay out of trouble"
         | 
         | Or "it was us two in the apartment alone..."
         | 
         | Or "them two are pretty good together "
        
         | dghf wrote:
         | The Wannadies had to go with "You & Me Song"
         | https://youtu.be/t_e_45Szprk?si=4JVZHZzguqm3SFHN
        
       | psychoslave wrote:
       | My biggest side project is about grammatical gender in French,
       | published as a research project on wikiversity[1].
       | 
       | It did made me go through many topics, like dual,
       | exclusive/inclusive group person.
       | 
       | Still in a corner of my head, there is the idea to introduce some
       | more pronouns to handle more subtilty about which first person we
       | are expressing about[2]. The ego is not the present attention,
       | nor they are that thing intertwined with the rest of the world
       | without which nothing exists.
       | 
       | [1]
       | https://fr.wikiversity.org/wiki/Recherche:Sur_l%E2%80%99exte...
       | 
       | [2] The project does provide an homogenized extended set of
       | pronouns with 6 more than the two regular ones found in any
       | primary school book. And completing all cases for all nouns is
       | the biggest chunk that need to be completed, though it's already
       | done by now for the most frequent paradigms.
        
       | LAC-Tech wrote:
       | Another fun pronoun distinction I have seen is having two forms
       | of "we" - one including the person you are talking to, and one
       | excluding them.
       | 
       | (To clarify this was in Hokkien, not Anglo-Saxon).
        
         | postepowanieadm wrote:
         | Like "us but not you"? That's mean.
        
           | LAC-Tech wrote:
           | Yeah it iw called the exclusive form lol.
           | 
           | But if you think about it seems normal... "we went to the
           | city" is not really mean.
        
           | shermantanktop wrote:
           | Not when you're delivering an insult to everyone present.
        
           | kzrdude wrote:
           | We already use this with "we", it's just not clear from the
           | word if 'you' are included or not. Example: "We had eggs for
           | breakfast".
        
         | FarmerPotato wrote:
         | One way to say this is "present company excluded" as when
         | saying: culpability is general in the population, but not to
         | accuse those you're speaking to.
        
       | mohsen1 wrote:
       | If you're interested in history of English, I'd highly recommend
       | the History of English podcast.
       | https://historyofenglishpodcast.com
        
       | red_admiral wrote:
       | English used to have dual pronouns (what the article is a about),
       | proper accusatives and genitives (she/her/hers, who/whom and the
       | apostrophe-s genitive are survivors), formal/informal 2nd person
       | pronouns (you / thou) and quite a few other things that come up
       | when you learn French or Latin.
       | 
       | Yes/No and Yea/Nay used to mean different things too: "Is this
       | correct?" could be answered "Yea, it is correct" whereas "Is this
       | not a mistake?" could be answered "Yes, it is correct" (which you
       | can also parse by taking the 'not' literally).
       | 
       | "Courts martial" and "secretaries general" are examples where the
       | original noun-first word order remains.
        
         | triage8004 wrote:
         | This sucks because yes its a mistake or no its not a mistake
         | both fit
        
           | adammarples wrote:
           | they don't fit, because 'yes' was not supposed to be used in
           | the context of 'yes it is a mistake', yea was. Having two
           | words helped stop that ambiguity.
        
             | card_zero wrote:
             | It's confusing because it was stated wrongly.
             | 
             | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yes_and_no#The_Early_English_
             | f...
             | 
             | Yes _contradicts_ the negative question. So  "Is this not a
             | mistake?" should be contradicted with "yes, it is a
             | mistake" or affirmed with "no, it is not a mistake".
             | 
             | It's further confusing because we have the idiom of
             | suggesting things politely in a tentative manner such as
             | _isn 't this a mistake?_ which has lost its sense of
             | negativity and has come to mean "this is a mistake, I
             | think," as opposed to being parsed literally to mean "this
             | is not-a-mistake, I think".
        
               | FarmerPotato wrote:
               | I'm trying to parse the extra "not" in archaic holdovers
               | vs plain modern English. It seems to carry a subtext.
               | 
               | Modern "Are you happy now?" is said with sarcastic tone,
               | to spoil happiness. Would be archaically "Are you not
               | happy?" As if to dare contradiction. It's loaded, unlike
               | when saying sympathetically "Are you unhappy?"
               | 
               | Others:
               | 
               | "Are you not entertained?" "Are you not the very same
               | Smith that dwelt at Haversham?" "Prick me, do I not
               | bleed?"
               | 
               | But commonly: "Are you not a Christian?" most likely
               | seems direct, but said in a formal sense, "rhetorically",
               | an exhortation to act like one.
        
         | stevula wrote:
         | I thought courts martial and secretaries general (and Knights
         | Templar/Hospitaller, et al) were Anglo-Norman/French
         | borrowings. Do you have any examples of native English phrases
         | following that pattern?
        
           | doobiedowner wrote:
           | Whoppers junior
        
           | brandonhorst wrote:
           | AirPods Pro :)
        
           | FarmerPotato wrote:
           | Light fantastic
        
           | drewstiff wrote:
           | Hards on
        
           | zoky wrote:
           | Passersby
        
           | gerdesj wrote:
           | A relative presided over a couple of court martials (1) in
           | the past. Modern usage has largely disconnected it from the
           | past, grammatically (if that is even a thing, except to the
           | true minutaephile)!
           | 
           | (1) https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/court-martial-
           | res...
        
         | pdpi wrote:
         | The formal/informal second person thing is fascinating to me as
         | a Portuguese speaker.
         | 
         | European Portuguese, like many (most?) Romance languages, has
         | the informal/formal second person split. Brazilian Portuguese
         | has dropped the informal second person (tu) and uses only the
         | formal second person (voce).
         | 
         | Now, because "thou" is archaic, it sounds overly stiff, and
         | most English speakers assume it was the formal second person,
         | but it was actually the informal form. So both Brazilian
         | Portuguese and English underwent the same process and chose the
         | same way.
        
           | andrepd wrote:
           | Also, "voce" is actually not originally a proper formal
           | second person. Grammatically, "voce" is a third person
           | singular. It comes from "Vossa Merce" (something like "Your
           | Mercy" or "Your Grace"), shortened to "vossemece", to "voce".
           | The origin, and still today a common gramatical construction
           | in Portuguese in any formal or semi-formal register, is to
           | use a periphrase in the third person to increase politeness.
           | I guess in English it also exists, but only on the most fully
           | formal contexts ("Does that right honourable gentleman
           | agree...").
        
             | madcaptenor wrote:
             | Similarly, Spanish "vuestra merced" evolved to "usted".
        
               | zoky wrote:
               | And likewise the Romanian "dumneavoastra" evolved into...
               | nothing, that's still the polite form of "you" in
               | Romanian. Interestingly though, it can be used in both
               | the singular and plural, and takes verbs conjugated
               | exactly the same way for both forms (i.e. the second
               | person plural).
        
             | esquivalience wrote:
             | As in 'please', from 'if you please'?
        
           | Sharlin wrote:
           | In English particularly, people associate "thou" with the
           | King James Bible and similar Christian texts ("Our Father,
           | thou art in Heaven...") and might reasonably assume that if
           | "thou" was used to address the literal God, it must have been
           | the formal pronoun - but the familial, informal one was used
           | exactly because of the "father" association! (OTOH there
           | certainly are languages with a tu/vous distinction where
           | children were expected to "vous" their own parents - not sure
           | how much of a thing it is these days).
           | 
           | Another fun thing is that calling someone you don't know
           | "thou" used to be an intentional insult ("you're not worthy
           | of being called 'you'"), something that might be missed by a
           | modern reader of Shakespeare or other EME texts.
        
             | aardvark179 wrote:
             | It depends a lot on where you were brought up, and the
             | language you were exposed to. My first association would be
             | a very Yorkshire, "Thou knowest," rather than the king
             | james.
        
               | gerdesj wrote:
               | ... thar knows nowt!
        
             | ErroneousBosh wrote:
             | > (OTOH there certainly are languages with a tu/vous
             | distinction where children were expected to "vous" their
             | own parents - not sure how much of a thing it is these
             | days).
             | 
             | It's interesting that in Viennese German (my German is
             | terrible but I do at least try) it seems like the informal
             | form is the default, in a shop I get asked "Braucht du
             | hilfe?" rather than the formal "Kann ich Ihnen helfen?".
             | 
             | Maybe this is what they mean when they say people in Vienna
             | are rude, but coming from Scotland using informal language
             | even in fairly serious settings just seems comfortable and
             | normal.
        
         | matt-attack wrote:
         | And we've literally born witness to yet another step in the
         | trend of diluting our corpus of pronouns. The trend is very
         | clearly from more articulate to less.
         | 
         | "They" and "their" for my whole lifetime were plurals. Now
         | we've pretty much lost the mere clarity of knowing if the
         | pronoun means 1 person or more than 1 person. Was watching
         | "Adolescence" and the police mentioned "they" in regards to the
         | victim of a crime. I was mistakenly under the impression that
         | there weee multiple victims for much of the episode.
         | 
         | I'm very clearly slow to adapt to the new definitions.
        
           | w10-1 wrote:
           | The article points out that Chaucer used "they" to refer to
           | singular unknown person, so the usage is very old. It seems
           | more respectful than assuming they are male.
           | 
           | I find myself wrong all the time, and I'm glad for the
           | lesson!
        
             | card_zero wrote:
             | Leaning on Chaucer isn't sufficient, because _it_ was once
             | a pronoun used for people:
             | 
             | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/It_(pronoun)
             | 
             | So maybe we should bring back _it,_ or ignore Chaucer as an
             | authority.
        
           | etskinner wrote:
           | "They" has always (in our lifetimes) been used to refer to a
           | singular person of unknown gender. For example "someone left
           | their coat here. They must be cold"
        
             | the_biot wrote:
             | Indeed. What's new is not referring to someone of unknown
             | gender as "they", but rather people identifying as non-
             | gender-specific, and wanting to be referred to as "they".
             | That's the part that feels so awkward, IMHO, not simply
             | they as one person.
        
         | lemoncucumber wrote:
         | Early Quakers rejected using different 2nd person pronouns for
         | different people since it violated their principle of
         | egalitarianism so they called everyone thee/thou (and got into
         | trouble for it as you might expect).
         | 
         | https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/16/opinion/sunday/pronouns-q...
        
       | dataflow wrote:
       | Arabic has dual subject pronouns. I wonder if the concept
       | developed independently or if there was any influence somehow?
        
         | Two9A wrote:
         | Arabic is on the Semitic branch of the hypothesised proto-Indo-
         | European language, which has dual number:
         | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_(grammatical_number)
         | 
         | So you'd expect to see languages from western Europe to south
         | Asia that either have the dual concept, or have an attested
         | ancestor that did.
        
           | eigenspace wrote:
           | The Semitic language family is not part of the proto-indo-
           | european language family. It's from the Afroasiatic family
           | 
           | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semitic_languages
           | 
           | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afroasiatic_languages
        
             | kevin_thibedeau wrote:
             | Persian is PIE and had influence over semitic languages in
             | cultural contact. The connection could be there.
        
               | z500 wrote:
               | Egyptian had it, and although it's Afroasiatic it's not
               | Semitic, so it must have gone back further than that.
        
           | mathieuh wrote:
           | Semitic languages are Afroasiatic, not Indoeuropean.
        
           | another-dave wrote:
           | Within Indo-European languages, Irish has the concept of the
           | dual. It's used with things that come in pairs like "mo dha
           | laimh" - my two hands.
           | 
           | Interestingly, to say one-handed you'd say "leath-lamh",
           | where _leath_ means half, so half the <thing that's usually
           | one of a pair>.
        
         | malikolivier wrote:
         | It should be noted that only Modern Standard Arabic (the modern
         | common Arabic language based on the language used in the
         | Qur'an) still has dual. Most (if not all?) spoken dialects,
         | which evolved from this form of Arabic have already lost dual.
         | 
         | It's interesting that we notice a similar pattern of losing the
         | dual in many languages. And it would be very interesting to
         | find the opposite pattern: a language where the dual newly
         | develops out of nowhere. However, I do not know of such
         | language.
        
       | shrubby wrote:
       | youtwo commit -m "Refactoring translations"
        
         | pimlottc wrote:
         | Pair programming are wit?
        
       | iterateoften wrote:
       | Interesting that in English we had special pronoun for plurals of
       | exactly 2, but in Russian for instance they have special case
       | declensions for plurals less than 5.
       | 
       | Is that significant? I have no idea. Is there a language with
       | special case for exactly 2 with another case for a "few" and with
       | yet another for "a lot"? Interesting to compare different
       | cultures.
        
         | andrewshadura wrote:
         | It's not just 5, it's also 21 to 25, 31 to 35 etc. However,
         | some Slavic languages (e.g. Slovak and Czech) don't do that,
         | and only have those special numerals for under 5.
        
         | stevula wrote:
         | Whereas modern English only distinguishes grammatical number by
         | singular/plural (and Old English had dual), some languages even
         | have trial (three).
         | 
         | Russian distinguishes paucal (few) from plural (many). It's not
         | super common but there are some other languages that do it.
        
         | kmm wrote:
         | Russian used to have dual pronouns too, but they all were lost
         | somewhere in the 13th century, as in all other Slavic languages
         | other than Slovenian.
         | 
         | The system used for small numbers is probably a broad extension
         | of an earlier dual number for nouns, i.e. something like a
         | plural but just for two things. For (some) male nouns, the
         | nominative dual ending was the same as the genitive singular,
         | which was then extended to all other nouns even when this
         | correspondence didn't hold, and from just 2 things to 3 and 4
         | as well. Nowadays the dual has been completely forgotten for
         | nouns, and the only interpretation of the rule is that it's a
         | genitive singular.
        
       | trinix912 wrote:
       | Slovene still has the grammatical dual and we still have (and
       | use) pronouns that could literally be translated as "we two"
       | (midva/midve) and "you two" (vidva/vidve) and so on. I've been
       | told it used to be the same in most other Slavic languages.
        
         | nuxi wrote:
         | There are still some remnants of this in Serbian and Croatian,
         | e.g. the semi-dual "nas dvoje / nas dva".
        
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