[HN Gopher] Young Graduates Face the Grimmest Job Market in Years
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Young Graduates Face the Grimmest Job Market in Years
Author : koolba
Score : 47 points
Date : 2026-03-24 18:47 UTC (4 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.nytimes.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.nytimes.com)
| mitchbob wrote:
| https://archive.ph/2026.03.24-100557/https://www.nytimes.com...
| john_strinlai wrote:
| context: i teach at a local college in IT. some of my classes are
| part of the cybersec curriculum.
|
| as far as i have been able track (linkedin, email, etc.) roughly
| 3/4 of the previous graduating cybersec class has been unable to
| get a job in cybersec. probably 1/2 of those are struggling to
| find even basic sysadmin or password-resetter positions.
|
| this is significantly different than when the program started
| (around 2015 or so), where roughly 4/5 of the graduating class
| had jobs (specifically in cybersec) lined up at the time of
| graduation.
|
| cybersec is a _bit_ of an outlier, but i see a similar trend with
| the networking program and game design program as well (the only
| other 2 i have first-hand knowledge of)
|
| its rough out there! (i am recommending to my kids that they
| avoid post-secondary)
| brailsafe wrote:
| Game design also seems like it'd be an outlier fwiw, since it's
| a niche that people desperately want to get into if they've
| participated in contemporary entertainment culture in the last
| 2 decades, and that schools are happy to take their money for,
| but realistically the competition's always seemed high.
| Networking is a pretty boring unglamorous pursuit though that's
| very behind the scenes as well as being difficult and niche.
| flopsamjetsam wrote:
| Game making is like film making in this regard: it's often a
| "passion job."
| gedy wrote:
| > I am recommending to my kids that they avoid post-secondary
|
| I think that's a mistake, unless you mean "and go into debt for
| college". Working with many people over the years the educated
| (in STEM) are noticably better quality than high school or
| bootcamp folks on average. Work ethic or amount of code written
| is not an issue, just the general thinking through of problems.
| john_strinlai wrote:
| > _unless you mean "and go into debt for college"_
|
| well, yes. i am not rich. they would need to take loans. and
| from what i am seeing, they would likely end up working in
| the exact same position as the 19 year old who decided to go
| directly into the workforce.
|
| i will, of course, support them no matter what they decide.
| but when we discuss options, i emphasize skilled trades, or
| working for a few years before committing themselves to tens
| of thousands of dollars of debt to very possibly end up in a
| position that doesnt require the schooling.
| gedy wrote:
| I don't mean to argue but living at home and community
| college + state school is a viable option. I was not
| wealthy but able to not borrow for school this way. Good
| luck
| john_strinlai wrote:
| it is absolutely viable!
|
| i am just not _recommending_ it as a first choice to my
| kids. i remember how it was presented to me: "go to
| post-secondary or be stuck burger-flipping forever."
|
| this is also just one random teacher's opinion, where
| 99.9% of the context (e.g. academic history of my kids,
| aptitude, my experiences as a teacher, my location, etc.)
| are missing. so, mountain of salt and all that. my
| recommendation is specifically a recommendation for _my_
| kids.
| MyHonestOpinon wrote:
| For what is worth. I am planning to save about 60k for each
| and encourage them to go to the State university that is
| 20minutes from home. Hopefully they can go to college and
| stay debt free. But it will be really up to them.
| alephnerd wrote:
| > some of my classes are part of the cybersec curriculum
|
| > as far as i have been able track (linkedin, email, etc.)
| roughly 3/4 of the previous graduating cybersec class has been
| unable to get a job in cybersec. probably 1/2 of those are
| struggling to find even basic sysadmin or password-resetter
| positions.
|
| What is the curriculum that is being taught in your program?
|
| If it's "how to be a Splunk or Crowdstrike" admin or "how to be
| an L1 SOC" I don't think that is a hireable skill at this
| point.
| john_strinlai wrote:
| > _If it 's "how to be a Splunk or Crowdstrike" admin or "how
| to be an L1 SOC" I don't think that is a hireable skill at
| this point._
|
| its not, and up until recently (~2 years or so), the majority
| of our graduates were instantly picked up.
| alephnerd wrote:
| What is the curriculum though - you don't need to send me
| the name of the institution but I've been a hiring manager
| in the space and a PM for some of the larger companies and
| I haven't been impressed by "Cybersecurity" bootcamps or
| degree holders _unless_ they also had a tangible track
| record (eg. HackerOne).
|
| I feel a lot of hiring reflects that as well now - if I
| want a SWE to build a runtime agent I'm better off hiring a
| new grad from UC Berkeley who took CS162 and CS161 versus
| someone who took a summary course but doesn't understand
| how ld_preload works. Similarly, if I was doing AppSec for
| WebApps/OWASP I'd rather hire someone with an actual bounty
| track record on HackerOne instead of a bootcamp grad and
| potentially even a degree holder.
|
| My best hiring pipeline have either been Vets who were in a
| Cyber MOS with a couple years of hands-on experience and
| then did a WGU type program (the WGU program was just a
| checkbox for HR) or successful bounty hunters with a strong
| track record on HackerOne or Cobalt.
| john_strinlai wrote:
| i have no arguments with anything you have said here. but
| none of it really explains how we went from most kids
| being hired directly into the industry a few years ago to
| only a few of them now. our curriculum has not changed
| enough in the last few years for the curriculum to be the
| culprit.
|
| we understand the importance of meeting the employers
| where they are at, so once a year we meet with ~15
| industry partners (people in your position) and ask them
| directly questions like: "of your recent hires, what are
| they missing?", "what specific skills do you think needs
| more focus?", etc. that informs any changes we make for
| the following year. we have dropped entire courses and
| spun up new ones solely from industry input.
|
| we also understand the importance of hands-on experience.
| it is probably the most common feedback we get from
| people in your position. we have a giant lab so kids get
| experience wiring up and configuring real physical
| appliances instead of doing it all in packet tracer or
| whatever. we have a bug bounty club, we attend and host
| hackathons, etc. courses are split roughly 50/50 between
| theory classes and practical classes. practical courses
| are mostly focused on "fix this shitty/vulnerable
| implementation of X" or "here is an existing environment,
| propose and then implement something that addresses X
| problem in the least-disruptive way" rather than "here is
| a fresh start, implement X in this perfect environment".
|
| i dont want to give too much detail (e.g. course names
| and progression), as i would probably end up doxxing
| myself. but as someone who started off in the industry
| and then moved to a teaching position later in life, i am
| 100% with you. people who have real experience (e.g. a
| vet with cyber experience) are almost always going to be
| a better hire than a fresh graduate (i think this is true
| in any industry, and has _always_ been true -- so it
| doesnt explain the change). but my job is to try and
| close that gap, and i think we have made good progress
| along that path. we are absolutely not a 6 month money-
| grab program.
| elevation wrote:
| None of the top cyber security talent I've worked with went to
| school for it, and I have been underwhelmed by what I see
| coming from college programs. These kinds of credentials
| themselves are not a signal of quality to me.
| john_strinlai wrote:
| > _The kinds of credentials themselves are not a signal of
| quality to me._
|
| i hear this online a lot but never from the companies and
| hiring managers that hired our cybersec students for the last
| decade.
|
| keep in mind, this is not a 6-month "intro to cybersec" or
| bootcamp-style program.
| elevation wrote:
| Goodwill with hiring managers is good. But in a down
| economy it'd be helpful to boost your reputation more
| broadly.
|
| If I were running your college's program, I would invest in
| a presence at Defcon. If just one your students could use
| their skills to uncover and present something genuinely
| interesting, it would be worth covering their airfare and
| accommodations just to get your logo on the screen. If you
| could do this every other year, your program would have an
| unparalleled brand.
| john_strinlai wrote:
| > _Goodwill with hiring managers is good. But in a down
| economy it 'd be helpful to boost your reputation more
| broadly._
|
| part of our success over the years has been due to our
| reputation building, presence at local/state/national
| conventions, etc. that is exactly why the sudden downturn
| in hiring has been eye-opening.
| steve_adams_86 wrote:
| This surprises and worries me, because it seems more important
| than ever to take cyber security seriously. Although bots are
| more sophisticated and capable than ever, people seem to feel
| much the same as they did ten years ago. It's as though
| security is eternally reactive.
| alephnerd wrote:
| A major issue I feel has been a proliferation of lower quality
| programs charging a premium price as well.
|
| It's become harder to vet undergrads in the US for specific
| subfields because of either a lack of preparation or subpar
| career services.
|
| Additonally, at least in CS/CE the number of candidates have
| skyrocketed, but the reality is most companies can limit new grad
| hiring to 10-20 target programs nationally and 2-3 local programs
| and get the talent pipeline they need.
| simianwords wrote:
| > Additonally, at least in CS/CE the number of candidates have
| skyrocketed, but the reality is most companies can limit new
| grad hiring to 10-20 target programs nationally and 2-3 local
| programs and get the talent pipeline they need.
|
| Why? In my opinion a new grads can do good work and they take
| very low salary.
| tmp10423288442 wrote:
| > can do good work
|
| Doesn't mean will, and if their work isn't good the low
| salary isn't particularly beneficial.
| fakedang wrote:
| It's ridiculously funny that if I were to graduate from HBS today
| with an MBA, I would have a lower chance of securing my first job
| as an analyst at a private equity fund, as a fresh graduate. The
| numbers for graduates are even more terrible. Yes, I did the math
| and they are abysmal today.
| guzfip wrote:
| The geezers in power have been grooming them for the peasantry.
| The signaling is explicit. You will own nothing and you will be
| happy.
|
| And you will only be happy of course because it's above you
| status to worry about the upsetting things.
| commandlinefan wrote:
| I didn't read the article (paywalled), but did the headline is
| "young graduates face the grimmest job market in years". Did
| they address how many years? I've seen now compared to 2000 &
| 2008, which were bad, but that we bounced back from. Is it the
| grimmest job market in years or the grimmest in centuries?
| randcraw wrote:
| According to the article's graph of the fresh grad
| unemployment rate, the present climate is about as bad as in
| 2003 but less than a third as bad as it was in 2010.
| Unemployment during the pandemic spiked well above 2010, but
| only briefly, before returning to pre-pandemic level.
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