[HN Gopher] The cleaner: One woman's mission to help Britain's h...
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The cleaner: One woman's mission to help Britain's hoarders
Author : Qem
Score : 41 points
Date : 2026-01-18 14:55 UTC (5 days ago)
(HTM) web link (www.aljazeera.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.aljazeera.com)
| thisislife2 wrote:
| I've moved houses 3 times in the last 3 years. The pain of moving
| all my personal belongings made me realise how much unnecessary
| stuff I had accumulated. So I made it a point to throw or give
| away many things that was no longer really needed. It was a
| revelation and now I am more mindful to storing anything for
| long-term without thought. I still have more than 2+ decades of
| stuff in a storage - books, sentimental stuffs, things I thought
| may be useful or needed in the future etc. Still figuring out how
| to go through all that.
| Bluecobra wrote:
| I'm in a similar situation, after dealing with the deaths of
| multiple parents I don't want my descendants to have a huge
| burden of stuff and I've been on a mission to purge as much as
| possible. Facebook Marketplace has been great to get rid of a
| lot of the more bulky stuff. It's great, you post a picture and
| someone comes to your house to pick it up cash in hand. Low
| value stuff gets donated to goodwill or my local Buy
| Nothing/Free Stuff group on Facebook. Also been doing a tidy
| amount of sales on eBay for smaller/more valuable items.
|
| Still have a lot of progress to make. At least my game
| collection on Steam will be easy to clean up.
| arethuza wrote:
| A few years back we "decluttered" our house in order to make it
| more appealing for sale and put all the stuff in storage. After
| the property eventually sold we went back and looked at the
| stuff we had stored and probably threw out 80% of it.
| laborcontract wrote:
| This applies to both physical and digital goods. I've tried to
| think hard about how to keep my digital life in order in a way
| that my kids will be understand to make some sense of. I'm not
| there yet but I am mindful of it.
|
| Trying to explain the sentimental value of your belongings to
| others is like trying to explain a dream.
| rationalist wrote:
| I'm not a hoarder, but my dad is.
|
| I have a couple of items from my dead grandparents, and it's
| a connection.
|
| It's a tangible connection that feels more real than
| something intangible like memories.
|
| As for my dad though, I have no idea. He recognizes that it's
| a problem, but can't stop. It's stuff like plastic ship
| models, or stuff he wants to buy on eBay - postcards from
| defunct airlines that he used to fly on.
| laborcontract wrote:
| That makes sense, but don't you think hoarding muddies the
| signal? Do you know what of your father's you'd want to
| keep of his hoarded goods?
| rationalist wrote:
| There is nothing that he has hoarded that I want to keep.
| I have told him that.
|
| I have told him that he has so much stuff, that it would
| be impossible for me to recognize the $1,000 model boxes
| from the worthless model boxes, and that when he dies,
| I'm just going to have to wholesale the lot for probably
| a penny on the dollar.
|
| I told him him that the people who will pay money for
| plastic model kits are the same age as him, and if they
| all die around the same time or before him, there will be
| no one to buy the model kits.
| criddell wrote:
| I've had the same discussion with my parents. They wanted
| me to go through their home and mark down everything I
| want. I don't want any of it and frankly dealing with a
| full house of stuff after they die is something I dread.
| I wouldn't even know where to start. Are there companies
| you can hire that will take care of everything?
| a2tech wrote:
| Yes, they're called clean out companies. They'll swoop in
| and put everything in a dumpster. You can engage an
| auction house-+cleanout company if you think they have
| anything worth selling.
| technion wrote:
| Australian here. I paid a garbage removal company to
| basically empty a house. Their qebsite called it "estate
| cleanup". It took a whole day for a team with crowbars to
| smash up every piece of furniture and load it in a truck
| and take it.
|
| People take this offensively and insist someone must have
| wanted an old chest of drawers or something if only put
| it on facebook marketplace and work with interested
| parties and assist with them obtaining it - but those
| people dont realise how much they are asking of someone
| who is dealing with loss.
| rationalist wrote:
| > don't you think hoarding muddies the signal?
|
| Yes, which I am thankful now that I only have a couple of
| items and haven't had to make the choice of what to keep
| or not.
| laborcontract wrote:
| Thank you for sharing.
| astura wrote:
| The only people who want to pick through a hoard to find
| the "good stuff" is other hoarders and flippers.
|
| Also, 90% of the time that the act of hoarding ruins the
| objects hoarded so everything becomes trash anyways.
| rationalist wrote:
| > 90% of the time that the act of hording ruins the
| objects horded.
|
| I can also attest to this.
| mythical_39 wrote:
| Put it into a storage locker. Pre-pay 5 years of fees on the
| locker. Wait 5 years.
|
| This is what we call a 'self-sovling-problem'
| thisislife2 wrote:
| To be clear, it is in storage for the past 2+ decade. It was
| moving houses every year, the last few years, with only the
| essentials, that made me realise how much of a hoarder I was.
| Nevertheless, dumping it somewhere and "forgetting" about it
| is not much of a solution - as someone else said here, you
| are just passing on the problem to the next generation.
| tonyedgecombe wrote:
| I think the implication is once the fees stop being paid it
| ceases to be your problem. The storage company will sell
| the contents of your locker.
| ToucanLoucan wrote:
| One of my most guilty indulgences is the various TV programs
| about hoarders and hoarding. They are of course sensationalized
| all to shit and they basically provoke mental breakdowns out of
| their subjects to make good TV. The guilt isn't just that it's
| bad like all reality TV- you can tell these people, a lot of them
| anyway, have serious mental difficulties that a TV show showing
| up with 4 1-800-GOT-JUNK trucks and parking them out front of
| their homes before pulling all their shit out for neighbors to
| see and then yelling at them for being distressed about it isn't
| addressing. They offer "therapy" as part of it, after they've
| traumatized the fuck out of someone already struggling. Woo.
|
| But I watch. I have a mother who's started down the path. Maybe
| I'm like... training myself for what's probably due in about 15
| years. Or maybe I'm just making excuses for indulging in trash
| TV.
|
| The article is definitely correct: these people need help. They
| also usually need money. They usually need a lot of both. A lot
| of those shows take place in dilapidated parts of the world where
| you can tell, obviously, that the hoarding is certainly an issue
| but an even more pressing one is poverty. People keep everything
| when they're broke, far long past the point of reason, because
| they've found themselves needing... who knows, a tooth brush, a
| can of food, and had it kept from them by money so many times
| that they psychologically can't bear to throw one out, ever. Even
| if it's rotted away.
|
| And what's worse: because throughout any attempt at helping them,
| anyone, is then a threat. They become animated, angry, and any
| action that can actually help them is like playing Russian
| roulette with 5 bullets in a 6-shooter. They'll tell you with a
| straight, red face that yes they fucking need the mayo that's
| been in the diner packets for 10 years because it's still fine
| and usable. It's hard to feel sympathy for people so
| insufferable, and it's not even just you, the helper. They're
| often estranged from family and have no friends because their
| behaviors strain every relationship beyond repair.
|
| It's... tragic, in every sense of the word.
|
| FWIW, I also watch a lot of YouTubers who do this in a way that
| isn't evil. But also the content is less engaging because, well,
| reality TV wouldn't poke people the way it does into acting the
| way they do if it didn't make fucking good content. But yeah, I
| feel notably less disgusting consuming that at least.
| InitialLastName wrote:
| My mother went down this road (she, fortunately, had enough
| resources that it wasn't a catastrophe), but last year was
| forced to downsize due to a medical condition. I filled 2
| 20-yard dumpsters with the trash, donated another truckload,
| and put the rest (anything she might actually value) in
| storage. Since then, I've been going through that remainder
| with her and I think she's finally coming around to the
| absurdity of her situation. It turns out she isn't actually
| attached to her parents' monogrammed (but moth-eaten) linens,
| or the contents of her grandmother's sewing box.
| gedy wrote:
| It's not for everyone, but I found I was keeping a lot of
| things "for the memories". I started taking pictures of the
| thing then getting rid of it. Serves similar purpose and
| easier to let it go.
| ToucanLoucan wrote:
| Also scrapbooking. I've really gotten into that lately as I
| struggle to get rid of like, strange things. Parking passes
| and tickets for concerts, receipts from dinners on trips,
| that sort of thing.
|
| Scrap booking is wonderful for such things. And when I need
| a boost, I pop it open and get a rush of memories from all
| the lovely things I've gotten to do.
| ToucanLoucan wrote:
| In my strictly non-professional opinion, as a watcher of this
| stuff: the hoarders stuff almost always replaces _something._
| Maybe it 's a person who is gone, or was driven away. Maybe
| it's a purpose they only had before they retired. Maybe it's
| an event that drove them to crazy places to get by, and even
| though it's past, it's scars remain. Maybe it's merely the
| abstract concept of control, and agency; this one crops up a
| lot with the older female subjects of the shows, who's
| abusive husbands controlled them their entire lives, almost
| with regularity exhibiting all the classic signs of Battered
| Woman Syndrome.
|
| It's hard for me to disentangle this with the inhumane way
| modern life lets people live.
| pipeline_peak wrote:
| If there's one thing I learned watching those Hoarder reality tv
| shows it's that you can clean up after them all you want but
| that's just a bandaid.
| randycupertino wrote:
| I once had a patient in a nursing home who was a hoarder and
| she would hoard pinecones from outside the facility in her
| room. Garbage bags upon garbage bags of pinecones. When she
| would go to dialysis the staff would clean out her room and
| toss the pinecones. So she started begging the EMTs to bring
| the garbage bags of pinecones with her to dialysis so they
| wouldn't get thrown out.
|
| The recovery rate for hoarding is under 5%, it's generally
| treated by SSRIs and CBT. Recently there is potential that
| GLP1s may have benefits for hoarding and other addictions.
| bell-cot wrote:
| For people like your patient, is it useful to try to give
| them any sort of physical agency, control, or tasks?
| 0cf8612b2e1e wrote:
| Is the <5% response rate with treatment or in general?
| 6stringmerc wrote:
| I'm on standby as my generation, the Millennial cohort, becomes
| the true "sandwich generation" in the US. Elder care is such a
| disaster and farce here. There's a high profile senior citizen
| who has no business in leadership but apparently the system likes
| it this way. There's going to be a mass passing of Boomers and
| how it looks - probably a lot like this but without public
| healthcare so even more traumatic - in the US does not seem
| manageable.
|
| In the US we don't even test drivers over age 70 for competence
| because taking away their licenses means we'd have to look out
| for them or provide alternatives and that's not happening so here
| we are.
| PopAlongKid wrote:
| >In the US we don't even test drivers over age 70 for
| competence
|
| We don't test non-commercial drivers at _any_ age after initial
| issuance of the license, which is apparent after a few minutes
| of observation while walking around.
| bluGill wrote:
| That isn't true. If you move states they will test you again
| if you don't come from a state they like the testing for.
| This is just a written test though, there is nothing about do
| you apply the book knowledge to your real world driving.
|
| Most people never make such a move, but it still happens.
| (this is an exception that proves the rule)
| Bender wrote:
| I moved states a few years ago _CA to WY_ and was not
| required to take written test. _computer in this state._
| The only thing they tested was my eye-sight.
| bluGill wrote:
| If you were to move WY to CA you probably would need the
| test. Though I don't know.
|
| I do know if you move from CA to IL you wouldn't need to
| take the test, but I'm not sure about WY to IL. I moved
| from MN->IA->IL, and I had to take a test but I remember
| at the time moving directly from MN would have meant no
| test required.
| zabzonk wrote:
| I had a couple of thousand books in my flat in london, including
| about 500 technical computing ones (design, languages, other
| stuff). I got my nephew to fix up the flat, for sale. He asked me
| "Which of these books do you want to keep?", my response after a
| few seconds "None".
|
| It's so easy to hang on to things you really don't need.
| criddell wrote:
| You're not afraid you're going to need that UCSD Pascal book
| from 1986?
| bluGill wrote:
| My physics textbooks look impressive sitting on a bookself
| even if I never open them again. I only need a few books like
| that to prove I'm smart though. "I swear someday I will open
| my calculus textbook again and do all the exercises..."
| criddell wrote:
| It's fun to find a colleague's collection of Knuth's _Art
| of Computer Programming Books_ books and open them to hear
| the crack of a book that 's never been opened before.
| throwway120385 wrote:
| We buy them to pay homage to Knuth more than to work
| through the exercises.
| ghaff wrote:
| I've gotten rid of a bunch of books. Don't care a lot so
| long as they now fit my bookshelves. But will probably dump
| another bag or two to my library's next book sale next
| fall.
| davidwritesbugs wrote:
| That's particularly true of tech books. I want to hang on to my
| copy of "Tinker Tailor" but "Adobe Air in Action" 2008?
| zabzonk wrote:
| Yeah, well, I do kind of miss "The Design & Evolution of
| C++", but I can't convince myself I actually need it.
| biofox wrote:
| That's a sad indictment of tech.
|
| Most underlying technology is timeless (see TAOCP, SICP,
| CLRS, K&R, GoF, Dragon Book, Beej's Guide, Sipser,...); but
| we seem set on producing an endless, pointless, churn of
| frameworks and minor language differences in the name of
| progress.
| zabzonk wrote:
| > Most underlying technology is timeless (see TAOCP, SICP,
| CLRS, K&R, GoF, Dragon Book,
|
| True enuf, but how often do you actually refer to the books
| underlying ideas? I've had (now gone, presumably) TAOCP on
| my bookshelves for years, but how often did I use it? Stuff
| on RNG a bit, I guess...
| julesallen wrote:
| There's need and there's want I suppose.
|
| My oldest computer book I won't part with is Alan Simpson's
| dBase III+ Programmer's reference guide, circa 1987. This book
| was transformative and allowed me to get a gig as a coder, so
| much self driven practice on a crappy underpowered generic
| clone PC. That crappy hardware was an advantage I didn't see at
| the time, having to think about routines that were fast enough
| based not because of faster disks and tons of RAM.
|
| Do I need this book? Not so much. But it brings me joy
| carefully flipping through it on occasion.
| esafak wrote:
| That does not mean they were all useless, of course; maybe you
| have absorbed some of them.
| rossdavidh wrote:
| I have a wise, witty, charming and personable friend who is a
| complete hoarder. It was a big deal to be allowed into the house.
| But, after several years of attempting to help, I eventually had
| to realize that it wasn't the effort required to clean that was
| the issue. The issue is that she doesn't like the space that's
| left behind. If I could snap my fingers and make it all clean and
| tidy, it would not really help anything because it would be back
| to the old way in a month or so.
|
| I once suggested bins and shelves to help keep it better
| organized and manageable, and her response (quite negative) was
| one of the clues that it wasn't the effort of cleaning up that
| was the issue, and therefore all the help in the world wouldn't
| make much of an impact. She doesn't like the space left behind
| after you clean, and feels the need to fill it up with whatever
| she can find.
|
| Eventually, I had to just accept that this is how she was, and if
| I wanted to keep her as a friend I had to stop trying to change
| how she kept her house; if forced to choose between empty space
| in her house and keeping me as a friend, there was no way she was
| going to tolerate empty space in her house. Every bit must be
| filled. (sigh)
|
| And yet, outside of her house, she's great. For example, she
| loves helping us clean our house.
| pjc50 wrote:
| > I wanted to keep her as a friend I had to stop trying to
| change how she kept her house
|
| This is a hard lesson for those of us who like to fix things:
| you basically can't change the behavior of adults, without a
| huge amount of work and/or their active cooperation.
| IAmBroom wrote:
| > you basically can't change the behavior of adults, without
| a huge amount of work and/or their active cooperation.
|
| Odd statement, with the "/or" part. Changing the behavior of
| adults without their active cooperation is compulsion, not
| behavioral modification. I mean, we do it in prisons and boot
| camps, but that's not a solution here.
| doublerabbit wrote:
| If folk would stop hoarding browser tabs too; the internet would
| be a tidier place.
| shermantanktop wrote:
| I'm attempting to do a weekly bite-sized version of decluttering
| - one problem area, 1-2 hours, once a week.
|
| I am calling it Swedish Death Cleaning
| (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swedish_death_cleaning) to sell it
| to my spouse. Not sure the marketing is working but we are making
| progress.
| mrweasel wrote:
| My wife and I have been helping a friend of the family move and
| part of it was dealing with the hoarding. The part in the article
| about "just buying a new umbrella" is so relatable. We where
| moving our friend and she needed an extension cord, rather than
| looking through her boxes, her first instinct was to just order a
| new one (she already have 15, but she didn't want to look for
| them, in her 40sqm apartment).
|
| Deciding on what to keep and what to get rid of it also mental
| struggle for those helping. In our case we just watched as
| kitchen equipment, complete, and expensive, dinner set,
| furniture, art, family heirlooms and new unworn clothes got de-
| prioritized in favour of unread magazines, hundreds of VHS tapes,
| and thousands of DVDs and BluRays with endless recording of
| talkshows and random TV programs. She has been following a second
| rate pop duo band since the 1970s and the idea of missing an
| article or a TV appearance is unthinkable, so tossing valuable
| belongings is preferable to throwing out 5 years of unopened
| magazine on the off chance that there might be a nugget of
| information she didn't have. It's mentally taxing seeing someone
| basically throwing away their life that way. We know that she'll
| never look through those magazine or even hook up the VHS player
| to figure out which tapes to keep. When she dies, all that's left
| is a ton of junk which her family do not care about and it will
| all go to the dump.
|
| I have such huge respect for anyone spending their time helping
| hoarders every day, the mental load is just massive.
| NoSalt wrote:
| Ok, I really want to know the name of the "second rate pop duo
| band".
| IAmBroom wrote:
| I have a hoarder friend, who is very cognizant that she suffers
| from a mental illness.
|
| Her motif is a bit different: she has childhood trauma from her
| mother secretly throwing away her things, and assigns emotional
| value to anything that _might_ be usable in the future
| (essentially safeguarding it against secret destruction by the
| mental image of her mother).
|
| But likewise, her sense of value is all skewed.
| mrweasel wrote:
| While I don't think this is trauma in the traditional sense,
| it might be something similar. My father-in-law, who known
| her for decades, told me that it's a crush on one of the band
| members. Basically a teenage crush that never got resolve or
| replaced by actual relationships.
| throwway120385 wrote:
| I've known someone like that too, and in her case it's
| because she never had anything when she was a kid. So she can
| take agonizingly long to let go of anything even if it's
| obviously ruined or worthless because it might be useful in
| some undefined way in the future.
| tim-fan wrote:
| I'm storing small items in numbered bags. I take a photo and have
| a web UI for easy searching. It also tracks which items are used
| frequently vs not used at all in years.
|
| Bags are stored in numerical order for quick storage and
| retrieval.
|
| With this you do your decluttering from the web interface: search
| for items that haven't moved in years, flag for removal.
|
| For frequently used items the system doesn't make sense - the
| storage and retrieval overheads are too high. But it pays off for
| any item you might forget the location of, or forget if you have
| it at all.
|
| I feel we're overdue to have these types of digital front ends
| over our household item storage.
| julesallen wrote:
| Absolutely agree, have been looking for something like this for
| a while now.
|
| Did you build this yourself? Would love to know more if you'd
| be so kind to share.
|
| Used to do similar things with Trello before the focus went all
| in on enterprise (getting acquired by Atlassian will do that).
| tim-fan wrote:
| Here's the repo, I've just added a demo video to the readme:
|
| https://github.com/tim-fan/hordor
|
| I was learning Django when I wrote it, today you'd probably
| get further quicker vibe coding from scratch.
|
| I have about 100 items in storage today, I intend to add
| more, would like to optimize the workflow as I scale up.
|
| Going forward I'd like to add: * more
| optimized storage/retrieval flow. The overall goal for the
| project is to minimize this friction, as far as possible
| * AI enrichment - generate descriptions, aid with search etc.
| I'd love to be able to query my storage "how can I connect
| this thing to this old speaker?" and the storage responds eg
| "you have this cable, this adaptor, plug that into this
| cable, etc"
|
| I've seen a few related projects but can't find the links
| just now. There's some cool projects that store items in
| little trays each with an LED, when you request the item the
| LED blinks for rapid retrieval. The numbered bags I used are
| slower for retrieval but cheaper and easier to set up.
|
| I do enjoy thinking about the different options and tradeoffs
| for cost and storage/retrieval time. Also tradeoffs between
| time and (physical) space.
|
| edit: formatting
| IAmBroom wrote:
| Confession of a Quasi-Hoarder:
|
| I have a tendency to keep unfinished projects, many of which are
| at the "collection of supplies needed" stage. During Covid
| isolation and depression, combined with a mentally ill roommate
| who added to all of it, it just overwhelmed my life.
|
| I had to evict the roommate, sadly, for my own self-preservation.
| I am happy to say that, AFAIK, he's in a better place today, and
| receiving treatment. MOST of his stuff left with him; a small
| remnant is stashed in corners of my basement and attic, and I
| throw out a sackful whenever I remember to do so.
|
| The rest... I extended an invite over Thanksgiving to a friend
| iby a temp job, far from her family. In return, we agreed she
| would help me clean up. She had learned from her daughter doing
| the same for her after her husband died, and very thoughtfully
| did just as I asked. She'd hold up something and say, "Are you
| going to finish this project?", and I'd say "Yes, someday...
| No... Throw it." She'd call me over after assembling a pile, and
| I'd give approval to throwing it.
|
| I had agency, and am certain I agreed to everything that went
| curbside. IIRC we filled 5 construction trash bags.
|
| For weeks afterwards, I would continue the trend with another
| half bag or so a week.
|
| It's given me a new trajectory. Someone ITT described a hoarder
| disliking empty spaces in their house; I have a romantic image in
| my head of a magician-type of person with a cluttered but ever-
| useful house. I am now replacing that with a romantic image of a
| clean, ordered house, with select places for _ordered_ piles of
| stuff.
|
| I'm typing from my "office", where hundreds of tools sit within
| well-labeled bins, one bin deep, all readable from the center of
| the room. Order. Piles. And for the first time in my life,
| looking for a _thing_ is something I can do in my head: "Go to
| my office. On the left wall, just below eye level, on the center
| of the shelf is a bin labeled 'SHARP THINGS'. You can find an
| exacto blade there." I can tell you where to find envelopes, DVI
| cables, electrical tape, and magnifying glasses, from memory. The
| room is the opposite of a heap... even if I have over a dozen
| screwdrivers in the bin labeled 'SCREWDRIVERS'.
|
| I say I'm a quasi-hoarder, because I've known people at the
| actual extreme. A friend who owns three houses, all filled to the
| brim, with only walkways through the stuff.
|
| Anyway... That's my confession. I have a lot of sympathy for
| those at the extreme end, because the dysfunction agues me as
| well. But a friend devoting a couple days to helping me really
| did a lot to empower me on a new direction in life.
| tristor wrote:
| I'm not a hoarder like most people imagine, but I have hoarder
| tendencies as my two storage units can attest. My main challenge
| has always been that when I have invested the (significant)
| effort in organizing things in a reasonable way, some life event
| soon comes along that causes everything to go back into disarray.
| My "stuff" is almost entirely various types of tools for doing
| various types of things that I have gained skills in over the
| years as personal education or hobbies.
|
| My dream, which I'm hoping to soon realize, is to build myself an
| expansive workshop that has defined spaces for everything so that
| I can actually do things and make things when I want to, with all
| the necessary tools present, and without requiring external
| storage or cluttering my home. Right now most everything I don't
| use daily is stored neatly in labeled totes which are tracked in
| a spreadsheet and on shelving units in a storage unit off-site.
| Certainly not the cluttered mess that most people think of, but
| at the same time I have many things which are not used every
| single day that took years to acquire along with the companion
| skills and I have no intention of getting rid of.
|
| In times gone past, I wouldn't appear as a hoarder because land,
| housing, workshop space was all massively more affordable and so
| I would have achieved my dream many many years ago. It's pretty
| incredible in how disappointing our current timeline is that
| someone who earns a massively outsized income compared to the
| average cannot afford to have a designated place to exercise
| their hobbies, because property pricing is so out of whack with
| what is reasonable that you need to be a multi-
| millionaire/billionaire to afford the space to do and have things
| without it appearing as a mess.
|
| This is a preface to the fact I see these same problems with my
| older relatives, many of whom are now incapable of ever again
| participating in some of those hobbies due to physical infirmity.
| They spent a lifetime learning and collecting the tools to go
| along with that learning, and in many ways those tools now
| represent physically the manifestation of their entire life's
| work, and they cannot give them up, even as they can neither
| afford the space to keep them organized nor have the physical
| capability to continue working those skills even as a hobby, so
| it all just lingers around them as so much clutter and unopened
| boxes in the attic. This isn't quite the trash bags of magazines
| level of hoarding that most people think of, but I already know I
| will be responsible with the mental and physical effort to deal
| with this situation after my relatives pass, and yet I already
| find myself in the same situation. Wouldn't it have been so much
| nicer if they would have been able to pass along the property,
| the tools, and the skills to the next generation instead of being
| priced out and it all ending up in a dump eventually?
| trashface wrote:
| Having seem some relative's houses, IMO hoarding is basically
| undiagnosed or undertreated ADHD.
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