[HN Gopher] Keep the Robots Out of the Gym
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Keep the Robots Out of the Gym
Author : Group_B
Score : 21 points
Date : 2025-12-28 21:58 UTC (1 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (danielmiessler.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (danielmiessler.com)
| turtleyacht wrote:
| If gym is a mindset, hard to separate from the other.
| danielrm26 wrote:
| I think that comes down to documenting the mindset as a goal
| and then using all the AI, scaffolding, and tools available to
| that system to help you nurture that mindset.
| PaulDavisThe1st wrote:
| > [AI/LLM writes] why I made the decisions I did
|
| When one thinks about human decision making, there are at least
| two classes of decisions:
|
| 1. decisions made with our "fast" minds: ducking out of the way
| of an incoming object, turning around when someone calls our name
| ... a whole host of decisions made without much if any conscious
| attention, and that _if you asked the human who made those
| decisions_ you wouldn 't get much useful information about.
|
| 2. decisions made with our "slow" minds: deciding which of 3
| gifts to get for Aunt Mary, choosing to give a hug to our cousin,
| deciding to double the chile in the recipe we're cooking ... a
| whole host of decisions that require conscious reasoning, and if
| you asked the human who made those decisions _you would get a
| reasonably coherent, explanatory logic chain_.
|
| When considering why an LLM "made the decisions that it did", it
| seems important to understand whether those decisions are closer
| to type 1 or type 2. If the LLM arrived at them the way we arrive
| at a type 1 decision, it is not clear that an explanation of why
| is of much value. If an LLM arrived at them the way we arrive at
| a type 2 decision, the explanation might be fairly interesting
| and valuable.
| arm32 wrote:
| You're really rizzing up the whole "AI can do almost everything
| better than humans" point. Is there a chance that your
| investments are causing you to sensationalize things a bit?
| Because I can promise you, AI can only do better the things that
| I have absolutely no skill in.
| davnicwil wrote:
| It's an interesting one. We'll have to discover where to draw
| that line in education and training.
|
| It is an incredible accelerant in top-down 'theory driven'
| learning, which is objectively good, I think we can all agree.
| Like, it's a better world having that than not having it. But at
| the same time there's a tension between that and the sort of
| bottom-up practice-driven learning that's pretty inarguably
| required for mastery.
|
| Perhaps the answer is as mundane as one must simply do both, and
| failing to do both will just result in... failure to learn
| properly. Kind of as it is today except today there's often no
| truly accessible / convenient top-down option _at all_ therefore
| it 's not a question anyone thinks about.
| danielrm26 wrote:
| OP here, yeah, I think that's a really good point.
|
| I feel like the way I'm building this in is a violent
| maintenance of two extremes.
|
| On one hand, fully merged with AI and acting like we are one
| being, having it do tons of work for me.
|
| And then on the other hand is like this analog gym where I'm
| stripped of all my augmentations and tools and connectivity,
| and I am being quizzed on how good I could do just by myself.
|
| And based on how well I can do in the NAUG scenario, that's
| what determines what tweaks need to be made to regular AUG
| workflows to improve my NAUG performance.
|
| Especially for those core identity things that I really care
| about. Like critical thinking, creating and countering
| arguments, identifying my own bias, etc.
|
| I think as the tech gets better and better, we'll eventually
| have an assistant whose job is to make sure that our un-
| augmented performance is improving, vs. deteriorating. But
| until then, we have to find a way to work this into the system
| ourselves.
| davnicwil wrote:
| there could also be an almost chaos-monkey-like approach of
| cutting off the assistance at indeterminate intervals, so
| you've got to maintain a baseline of skill / muscle memory to
| be able to deal with this.
|
| I'm not sure if people would subject themselves to this, but
| perhaps the market will just serve it to us as it currently
| does with internet and services sometimes going down :-)
|
| I know for me when this happens, and also when I sometimes do
| a bit of offline coding in various situations, it feels good
| to exercise that skill of just writing code from scratch
| (erm, well, with intellisense) and kind of re-assert that I
| can do it now we're in tab-autocomplete land most of the
| time.
|
| But I guess opting into such a scheme would be one-to-one
| with the type of self determined discipline required to learn
| anything in the first place anyway, so I could see it
| happening for those with at least equal motivation to learn X
| as exist today.
| xboxnolifes wrote:
| How I see it, LLMs aren't really not much different than
| existing information sources. I can watch video tutorials and
| lectures all day, but if I don't sit down and practice applying
| what I see, very little of it will stick long term.
|
| The biggest difference I see is, pre-LLM search, I spent a lot
| more time looking for a good source for what I was looking for,
| and I probably picked up some information along the way.
| llmslave2 wrote:
| We want machines to do the laundry and clean our house so we have
| more time to create art and write code. Seems like in our current
| trajectory, the machines will produce the art and code so we have
| more time to clean our house and do laundry....
| danielrm26 wrote:
| Ah man...that's good.
|
| But maybe both of those are in the category of undesirable
| things.
|
| And the things we end up with are like art and baking and
| walking and talking and drinking coffee and such.
|
| Professional Chess is a nice pattern here. A calculator can
| beat Magnus Carlsen at this point, but Chess is more popular
| than ever. So it should be ok if AI/Robots are better than us
| at all the stuff we still decide to do.
| ares623 wrote:
| Maybe cleaning house and doing laundry needs to start being
| marketed as an art form /s
| ab227 wrote:
| This is a great framework for self-development, but I wonder if
| the Job vs. Gym analogy is a bit premature. There seems to be a
| level of Silicon Valley optimism here that assumes AI already
| surpasses human capability in these creative areas. From my
| perspective, AI only outperforms in areas where the human hasn't
| developed a real craft. Is it possible that the current hype is
| causing us to undervalue the unique quality of human-only output?
| dnautics wrote:
| - using ai effectively is itself a skill that needs training,
| especially if you're already good at the critical thinking stuff.
|
| - using AI actually most of everything i do anyways, _is_
| critical thinking. I 'm constantly reviewing the AI's code and
| finding little places where the AI tried to get away with a
| shortcut, or started to overarchitect a solution, or both.
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