[HN Gopher] Pebble Index 01 - External memory for your brain
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Pebble Index 01 - External memory for your brain
Author : freshrap6
Score : 335 points
Date : 2025-12-09 15:03 UTC (7 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (repebble.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (repebble.com)
| eptcyka wrote:
| Could we have the same functionality on the pebble watch instead,
| please?
| micromacrofoot wrote:
| it's just a button and a mic, which both the watch have, so
| seems like it would be trivial to implement even if they don't
| do it officially
| 4ggr0 wrote:
| already exists, here's one example:
| https://apps.repebble.com/en_US/application/56205296ece6340e...
|
| or a search for 'voice':
| https://apps.repebble.com/en_US/search/watchapps/1?query=Voi...
| neom wrote:
| "What kind of battery is inside?
|
| Index 01 uses silver-oxide batteries.
|
| Why can't it be recharged?
|
| We considered this but decided not to for several reasons:
|
| You'd probably lose the charger before the battery runs out!
| Adding charge circuitry and including a charger would make the
| product larger and more expensive. You send it back to us to
| recycle. Wait, it's single use?
|
| Yes. We know this sounds a bit odd, but in this particular
| circumstance we believe it's the best solution to the given set
| of constraints. Other smart rings like Oura cost $250+ and need
| to be charged every few days. We didn't want to build a device
| like that. Before the battery runs out, the Pebble app notifies
| and asks if you'd like to order another ring."
|
| Uhhh... Huh... Ok. Welp, that's a nope from me then.
| walthamstow wrote:
| > No charging: The battery lasts for up to years of average
| use. After the end of its life, send your ring back to us for
| recycling.
|
| I shared your concerns but I read this bit and I think it's all
| pretty reasonable if you ask me. They're open and upfront about
| it, and you can very quickly choose not to buy one.
|
| Who's recycling their Oura battery anyway? Probably nobody.
| jerlam wrote:
| They didn't when my ring died, but now Oura now has a
| recycling program:
|
| https://support.ouraring.com/hc/en-
| us/articles/4441437053313...
|
| I can't comment if it's worth the effort to send six grams
| worth of e-waste across the country and how much actual
| material can be recovered from it.
| illegalmemory wrote:
| So in a way it is similar to Subscription ?
| fetzu wrote:
| More like buying a 99$ "12 to 15 hour recording" pack. Also
| created real tangible waste, I'm failing to see how recycling
| a bunch (what are they expecting to sell, hundreds-of-
| thousands order of magnitude?) of 99$ rings after two years
| will be worth it (how much material, and for what worth, can
| they really exctract?).
| thomascountz wrote:
| The choice release a non-rechargeable/non-serviceable product
| feels like something that shouldn't be dismissed with "...lasts
| for years..." and "...you''d probably lose the charger..." This
| language feels patronizing to me. Even the "...[it] asks if
| you'd like to order another ring," begs the question: at what
| cost?? 99$, I presume.
|
| The target market might not be exclusively other engineers and
| tinkerers, but as an engineer and tinkerer, I'm eager for more
| details about the testing, verification, construction, etc., of
| such a solution.
|
| On the other hand, cool!
| have_faith wrote:
| > the Pebble app notifies and asks if you'd like to order
| another ring
|
| This comes across much more dystopian than I imagine the author
| intended.
| tw04 wrote:
| Not sure how I feel about it being a throwaway device for $100. I
| get they say you can send it back to be recycled, but this feels
| like you're just proactively creating e-waste.
|
| Not even an attempt to make a replaceable or chargeable battery?
|
| Also they point out oura rings need to be charged every few days,
| but that's because they're constantly chewing through battery
| monitoring your health stats. I'm willing to bet if they were in
| a constant state of deep sleep and only woken up to record short
| audio clips they'd also last for months at a time.
|
| I know folks around here love pebble, but this feels like a miss
| to me.
| SecretDreams wrote:
| > No charging: The battery lasts for up to years of average
| use. After the end of its life, send your ring back to us for
| recycling.
|
| That's a pretty long life, TBF. I appreciate your concerns,
| though, and do wonder if there was a better middle ground
| (maybe a micro sterling engine leveraging the heat gradient
| from my finger to ambient, ha!).
|
| People are buying Fitbit charge6 products today and those
| probably have an 18 shelf life and cost more.. so maybe it's
| not totally left field - although the charge6 isn't advertised
| to fail so soon lol.
| nebulous1 wrote:
| That lifespan is based on the user recording for 12 to 15
| hours over those two years. It's a $100 device that can
| record 12 hours of audio and then you throw it away. You
| could expend the battery on your first day by holding down
| the button.
|
| Honestly I can see a niche use but this device strikes me as
| quite weird and I'm not sure why it isn't a button on their
| new watch.
| micromacrofoot wrote:
| this is a device that would potentially last years though, not
| months -- if you're in the niche of needing something like this
| you're paying less than $10 a month (maybe as low as $5)...
| doesn't net out too terribly in exchange for not charging
| amarcheschi wrote:
| We did it guys, we made physical devices usable only if you
| treat them as a SaaS otherwise you're sol when battery runs
| out
| micromacrofoot wrote:
| that's a pretty lame take, all I did was break down the
| cost to the lifespan of the device
|
| it's useful to think of a lot of things this way, I also
| justify clothing purchases on a rough estimate of cost per
| wear
| tw04 wrote:
| Right, and an Oura would be usable for a decade because it
| has a rechargeable battery.
| micromacrofoot wrote:
| sure but the Oura does a bunch of unrelated stuff specific
| to health and also has to be charged twice a week? they're
| not even comparable products
| pants2 wrote:
| The ring weighs approximately 1/1000th what a MacBook pro does.
| If it really lasts for years it's a tiny, tiny amount of
| e-waste.
| myaccountonhn wrote:
| Every company should be responsible for the lifecycle of
| their product, big or small. You can't just point fingers at
| others.
|
| How much of it is even recyclable?
| eloisant wrote:
| I know exactly how I feel: I'll never buy a disposable
| electronic device.
| whitehexagon wrote:
| Agreed. Brave to launch disposable tech with the current
| environmental awareness. e-waste in 12-15hours, when people are
| pushing for more and more for repairable devices just feels
| very out of touch.
| walthamstow wrote:
| This looks fantastic, I've always wanted something like it
|
| Water resistant, like how water resistant? Wearing in the shower
| OK? That's where I have all my best ideas!
| swrobel wrote:
| That's the bummer for me. The primary place I'd like to use
| this is surfing. Too much time to think, and too few practical
| ways to record those thoughts.
| erohead wrote:
| Yup! Can wear in shower - great for shower thoughts
| agildehaus wrote:
| > since it's always with you
|
| Isn't my watch always with me? Why not use that instead of have
| some new device?
| tenacious_tuna wrote:
| from the article:
|
| > Initially, we experimented by building this as an app on
| Pebble, since it has a mic and I'm always wearing one. But, I
| realized quickly that this was suboptimal - it required me to
| use my other hand to press the button to start recording (lift-
| to-wake gestures and wake-words are too unreliable). This was
| tough to use while bicycling or carrying stuff.
| Daneel_ wrote:
| I've never had that issue with my Apple Watch. Granted, apple
| are a world-class developer (arguably), so their stuff might
| be more reliable, but I use raise-to-speak and hey siri with
| my watch all the time.
| koinedad wrote:
| Raise to speak is the most unreliable feature for me, I've
| tried it several times and it's like 30% success rate
| Daneel_ wrote:
| I have an ultra 2, and I typically hold it about 5-10cm
| from my mouth when I try to use raise-to-speak. Maybe
| that approach will help you?
| layer8 wrote:
| But you have to instruct Siri to record/transcribe/save
| what you want to say; this does it automatically. It
| removes friction if you just want to record short notes.
| Daneel_ wrote:
| I almost never want to take a note though, I usually want
| to perform an action.
|
| Recording a note isn't high friction in my opinion
| though: "Hey siri make a note XYZ". Admittedly I don't
| create or use notes like this, but I use reminders a lot
| and I've never felt like there was friction: "hey siri
| remind me to call Dave when I get home"
| ryanjshaw wrote:
| I do this too, the biggest issue I have is when the
| shitty voice to text doesn't get it right, and I look at
| my shopping list the next day wondering wtf an "ear pig"
| is.
| mikestew wrote:
| There are a lot of egg freckles on my shopping list, too.
|
| https://newtonglossary.com/terms/egg-freckles
| sneak wrote:
| Siri sends your contacts list to Apple with every request.
| That makes it a nonstarter for me.
| ryanjshaw wrote:
| I use it all the time too, but recording a voice memo
| doesn't seem possible without touch (you need to tap to
| actually record)?
| apparent wrote:
| This is probably also part of the reason that the AW
| battery lasts so much less time. It's always on the lookout
| for these events, and over time that ends up having a non-
| trivial impact on battery. For Pebble users, that would
| significantly compromise one of the main selling points of
| the Pebble.
| eloisant wrote:
| Pixel Watch have "raise to talk" to trigger Gemini, so you
| don't need your other hand.
|
| Other watches detect gestures like pinching fingers on the
| hand wearing the watch.
| alternatex wrote:
| Pixel watch is an order of magnitude more powerful and
| expensive than a Pebble though. Raise to wake is not as
| simple as it may seem considering most big brand smart
| watches didn't have a decently working implementation of it
| until only recently. It seems like the author wanted to
| keep it within the Pebble realm.
| eloisant wrote:
| Add $75 (the price of this ring) to the Pebble time and
| you're almost at the price of a Pixel Watch 4. And you
| can get a PW3 for cheaper.
| alternatex wrote:
| Economics don't work like that though. Google has the
| benefits of economies of scale and stable manufacturing
| partnerships, not to mention probably a lot more of the
| watch parts are designed in-house. I'd be surprised if
| Pebble could achieve anything close to the Pixel hardware
| for even twice the price.
|
| It seems like Pebble is focusing on a niche market and
| this new product seems completely in line with that.
| There are plenty of other companies targeting the common
| folk who have no desire to optimize their life like this.
| ncr100 wrote:
| Niche market seems like an exaggeration, because they're
| competing against literal monopolies.
|
| Pebble serves those people who want to watch or a ring
| that doesn't require being a slave to a wall wart, who
| want the watch to last for a long time. Take a look at
| Garmin, they do that too and they are a successful
| company. They are much older than Google and they still
| have a hard time keeping up with Google and it's billions
| of dollars of of mystery money advertising revenue.
|
| The pixel hardware is a battery draining nightmare, in my
| personal experience having pixel watches for years and
| being a long-term pixel phone user. Even today the pixel
| phone that I have, after having I think five of these
| things, drains battery probably 20 to 40% faster than ..
| the competitor that I would next buy if I weren't feeling
| like I wanted some of the features that Google has
| bundled in with their phone and home and other like mnvo
| and messaging products. So, it seems like a mis
| comparison there, in my opinion. I don't want a
| smartwatch that lasts 25 hours and then has to be
| recharged. Or a smartwatch where the screen turns into a
| UHF channel just going out of tune and there's no tech
| support on Earth literally that is willing to help me.
| Volunteers on Google's support forums are lying to
| themselves that they have any power or sway with Google.
| It's a waste of time in my experience.
| ncr100 wrote:
| The pixel watch can be a nightmare. I've had the version
| 1 and the version 2 for years and I gave up because of
| the bugs. Random crashing, randomly dialing 911, just
| weird stuff that should not happen.
|
| And then there's the support which is zero support.
| Completely frustrating to post a message and then get
| some volunteer support Tech, hahaha, saying expect
| improvements! And it's a volunteer saying that. And they
| have no authority. And There is no support, it all falls
| through. Random crashing on both versions of the watch.
| The first version screen was flickering like an old
| school television trying to tune in a distant UHF
| broadcast. Display drivers anyone?
|
| So, pixel watches are in the drawer and I've got a Garmin
| watch on right now. Garmin is clunky but at least it's
| reliably clunky.
|
| So it feels like a mis comparison, to me who's had the
| pixel watches.
|
| I used to own the pebble, a couple versions of it, when
| they were first announced for several years again. And I
| found them to be very reliable and lightweight and
| usable.
|
| I wanted a smartwatch that could talk to Google's home
| ecosystem and so I traded out of Pebble. And it's just
| been kind of mediocre misery.
|
| Plus I don't know what Google is doing but recharging the
| pixel watch every 18 hours, or 36 if you're super lucky
| and your apps on the pixel watch behave themselves
| correctly, makes me feel like a slave to Google's naive
| product manager aspirations.
|
| Like, "it can do everything, and we make money off of you
| because you are the product!" While at the same time
| making me miserable.
|
| :-P
| Mistletoe wrote:
| More importantly your phone and notes app is always with you
| and you can type your thought into it without disturbing people
| and looking like a schizophrenic Green Lantern.
| franey wrote:
| It looks to me like the big benefit is being able to use just
| one hand for this. I'd be more likely to use the watch, too,
| but this would be great for people with one arm, for example.
| skeledrew wrote:
| Do you never take your watch off to charge it? Or to sleep?
| When showering?
| matteason wrote:
| > Here's the best part: the battery lasts for years
|
| I wonder how many years?
|
| > The battery lasts for up to years of average use.
|
| ...how many?
|
| > a battery that lasts for years
|
| How many years does the battery last?
|
| > That's up to 2 years of usage.
|
| Ah.
|
| I guess "2" is the absolute minimum that you could describe as
| "years".
|
| It's a shame because it does look like an interesting
| proposition. It might be more compelling if it was "send your
| ring back to us for recycling - and we'll send you a new one". I
| doubt the economics would work at this price point though.
| marcosscriven wrote:
| I really don't want to wear a battery in that form factor.
|
| Sure a phone or watch can burst into flames, but at least
| you've got a chance of dropping it or taking it off.
|
| I also don't see the bother of talking to your wrist rather
| than your hand.
| jcims wrote:
| FTA
|
| >No charging: The battery lasts for up to years of average use.
| After the end of its life, send your ring back to us for
| recycling.
| pants2 wrote:
| Given it's doing nothing when not activated, I would imagine it
| heavily depends on how often you're using it. Still would be
| nice to be able to say "1,000 hours of recording" or something
| like that
| marcosscriven wrote:
| It says 12-15 hours of recording in the article.
| eloisant wrote:
| > After the end of its life, send your ring back to us for
| recycling.
|
| this is ridiculous...
| Bolwin wrote:
| Wow I was just looking for finding like this, but.. can't be
| recharged? It would be one thing if it had like 500 hours of
| recording, but this has 12-15.
| notachatbot123 wrote:
| Where did you read that? The article says 5 minutes. Which is
| fine because it meant to transfer directly to the phone app.
| And the battery is said to "lasts for up to years of average
| use".
| nerdsniper wrote:
| The article says the battery lasts for years. Is that a
| misleading claim?
|
| Edit FTA:
|
| > How long does the battery last?
|
| > Roughly 12 to 15 hours of recording. On average, I use it
| 10-20 times per day to record 3-6 second thoughts. That's up to
| 2 years of usage.
| Daneel_ wrote:
| It says two years of average use.
|
| "Two" is not "years" in my opinion. "Years" implies at least
| 3-5.
| koinedad wrote:
| Two is definitely on the low end for "years"... really the
| lowest.
|
| But I did have a similar thought when I read it was only
| "two"
| andrelaszlo wrote:
| "Two _year_ of average use "?
| Daneel_ wrote:
| I'm not talking grammar, I'm talking convention.
|
| Think of it more like this: If I was selling you a car
| and said it would last for years, then would you expect
| it to fall apart after two years? I certainly wouldn't.
| When talking about small quantities we tend to specify an
| exact number (two, three), however as the range becomes
| larger and less exact we use generalities (years).
| Because of this "years" would typically refer to a span
| of at least 3-5 years, and I would argue even longer.
| skeledrew wrote:
| Even given that convention, with your example, a car is a
| far steeper investment than this ring. The more you
| invest in something, the more you expect to get out of
| it, and this ring is designed for a very low investment
| point, while still being highly durable (there are other
| similar rings out there at even lower investment points,
| but they probably won't survive anything beyond a
| sprinkle).
| zucked wrote:
| Years is literally just the plural of a single year. Ergo,
| years feels like the appropriate word here. What are you
| suggesting they phase it as instead?
| Daneel_ wrote:
| I would always say "two" when talking about such a small
| quantity. "Years" is misleading, as evidenced by many
| other comments here.
|
| "The battery lasts two years"
| ModernMech wrote:
| 2 years: Couple years
|
| 3 years: Few years
|
| 4 years: Several years
|
| 5+ years: Years
| apparent wrote:
| Two is years. Some people would even say that 1.5 is
| "years". I go back and forth on this. Is it correct to say
| that something costs "thousands of dollars" if it costs
| $1,800? If it costs $2,000, IMO it's clear.
| jbstack wrote:
| Something can be technically true while still being
| misleading. In fact arguably that's what the word
| misleading means (as opposed to false).
|
| I think most people, when told that something will last
| for "years", would be quite surprised to learn that it
| will fail after 2 years.
| apparent wrote:
| If someone said a shirt will last for years I would have
| a different impression than if someone said that a
| battery-powered thing will last for years.
|
| For example, I have motion sensors in my home and I have
| to replace the batteries from time to time. If the manual
| said "the batteries last for years, depending on usage" I
| would not be surprised if it lasted for 2 years.
|
| Here, it sounds like the battery life will vary greatly
| based on usage. In fact, it sounds like the battery life
| is almost entirely a function of how much you use it. It
| would be interesting to know how much the battery will
| drain over time if you don't use it, but of course we
| can't know this for certain before this has been in the
| wild for years.
| jbstack wrote:
| > It says two years of average use.
|
| Even this is misleading. The product hasn't been released
| yet. So what is it an average of? How do you know how
| people will use it?
| Daneel_ wrote:
| This makes it a non-starter for me. It feels utterly wasteful,
| and I'm basically paying USD$100 for a ring subscription every
| two years, plus international shipping. I can't support that,
| sorry.
| layer8 wrote:
| > How long does the battery last?
|
| > Roughly 12 to 15 hours of recording. On average, I use it
| 10-20 times per day to record 3-6 second thoughts. That's up to
| 2 years of usage.
|
| Two years isn't too bad, but at $99 the price is still a bit
| high for that.
| defulmere wrote:
| ... and then they go on to say there's no subscription
| involved.
|
| At $99 every 2 years it might as well be a subscription.
| embedding-shape wrote:
| Not even just a flat-fee subscription, but technically a
| usage based one! Since every time you activate the device
| it consumes power stored in the battery, it essentially
| turns electricity into credits and now your hardware-based
| device is a usage based subscription. What a time to be
| alive!
| CGMthrowaway wrote:
| Brilliant way to look at it. We already do this with phones
| CGMthrowaway wrote:
| If it keep me from having to take out my phone, which both a)
| I don't want to do for my own sanity and b) I don't want to
| do in many social situations out of respect for my
| companions, then it may be worth it. You could say "but Apple
| watch" however a big swath of society already hates those for
| the same reasons above
| rkagerer wrote:
| I still would have preferred it to be serviceable. I know
| I'll be able to buy new batteries in 6 years, 10 years, etc.
| I'm suspect as to whether you'll still be able to buy this
| device in that time ("this device" meaning same comfortable
| fit, no new onboard bloat, compatible with my other ancient
| but beloved devices, similar focus on doing one simple thing
| well, privacy characteristics, etc). Apropros of nothing, is
| repebblering.com available?
| jbstack wrote:
| It's pretty bad when you consider that you have to limit it
| to just this use-case (3-6 second recordings 10-20 times a
| day), when it could have instead been useful for other things
| e.g. recording much longer thoughts or making notes while
| reading a book or watching a video.
|
| Even for just the narrow use-case, 2 years is still pretty
| poor. I generally expect my tech to last a lot longer than
| that.
| zem wrote:
| this seems to be optimised for the use case where you just
| want to record something quickly; if you wanted a longer
| recording session the up front overhead of pulling out a
| dictaphone or something wouldn't be too bad, and you would
| have better ergonomics than holding a button pressed and
| your hand to your face.
| lucb1e wrote:
| Original title: Meet Pebble Index 01 - External Memory For Your
| Brain
|
| It's a memo recorder in ring form. Neat idea that seems really
| obvious but somehow I haven't seen it before
|
| Edit: ah. "No charging: The battery lasts for up to years of
| average use. After the end of its life, send your ring back to us
| for recycling." Planned obsolescence
| 4ggr0 wrote:
| just got my RePebble 2 Duo yesterday, wearing it right now :) was
| looking forward to the new device, but a voice-memo ring really
| isn't something i care about. oh well!
| NoraCodes wrote:
| I mean, I'll probably ditch the LLM - after all, it's open source
| so I can just build my own app to receive the messages - but it
| seems like a neat bit of kit.
| rarisma wrote:
| No charging: The battery lasts for up to years of average use.
| After the end of its life, send your ring back to us for
| recycling.
|
| Apple hire this man.
| swrobel wrote:
| Always wonder why companies see suing people as a better course
| of action than hiring them.
| jfindper wrote:
| "Years of average use" is great until you realize that it
| actually means "Roughly 12 to 15 hours of recording".
|
| Not sure how long my iphone can record for, but it's probably
| close to that. Afterwards I get to charge my phone instead of
| recycle it, though.
|
| Apple, don't hire this man.
|
| Edit for the downvoters: can my iphone not record that long or
| something? iphones can't recharge? Just hate Apple and love
| e-waste rings? Enlighten me.
| pavel_lishin wrote:
| > _" Years of average use" is great until you realize that it
| actually means "Roughly 12 to 15 hours of recording"._
|
| Is that based on anything, or is that just a guess?
|
| Anyway, 12 hours' worth of 30 second recordings is a total of
| 1440 recordings. I guess three a day for a year does seem a
| little low?
|
| > _Just hate Apple and love e-waste rings? Enlighten me._
|
| What e-waste? You send it in for recycling; they might just
| replace the battery and send you a your existing ring back.
| jfindper wrote:
| > _Is that based on anything, or is that just a guess?_
|
| Fancy enough, it's from the article!
|
| Right under the "How long does the battery last?" heading.
| pavel_lishin wrote:
| Ah, I see, I didn't ctrl-f far down enough.
| oniony wrote:
| You have to trust it will actually get recycled though. I
| struggle to believe they'll be swapping out the batteries
| and reselling these as reconditioned. (I struggle to
| believe many people will even send them in for recycling
| tbh.)
| wkat4242 wrote:
| The environmental benefit of sending it in for recycling
| is probably negated by transporting it all the way back
| to them for starters. Better to just drop it at the local
| ewaste collection facility. They'll be less specialised
| but there isn't a lot of material in it.
|
| I guess there's a market for it and in the scale of
| things it isn't so bad: you could make 10 disposable vape
| sticks from the materials in one of these rings. And
| they're expensive enough that they'll never sell more
| than 100k or so of them. Relatively speaking it's no
| measurable impact.
|
| For me it's more a matter of principle though. As a
| society we frown on disposable gizmos these days and for
| good reason.
| wkat4242 wrote:
| That's not what recycling is. If you get it back it's
| recruitment.
| skeledrew wrote:
| At the lower 12-hour end, if you're doing ~10 seconds per
| recording (remember this device is primarily for very short
| reminders and quick commands), that's ~4.3k recordings total.
| Also keep in mind that you'd only use it when it's
| inconvenient/undesirable to reach for your phone or any other
| device, so it's possible this may only be used say 5x in a
| day at most on average (likely far less). Which means ~2.5
| years worth of usage at the lower end, and you'd only ever
| have to take it off if going for a swim.
|
| Contrast to a phone that, though it has far more capability,
| you'd have to remember where it is before even reaching for
| it wherever, and usually has to be on a charger for anywhere
| from 30 minutes (with super charging) to a few hours daily.
| Or even being at a laptop/desktop, and at least having to
| open the relevant app, type/talk into it and then close again
| to return to primary task. The ring is an instant win for
| 24/7/365 convenient presence.
| madeofpalk wrote:
| Why?
|
| It's easy to make a battery last years if it doesn't do
| anything. You can send your devices to Apple as well for
| recycling.
| dwa3592 wrote:
| they should still have made it rechargeable tbh.
| InsideOutSanta wrote:
| Yeah, this would have been a neat tool for "middle-of-the-
| night" thoughts, but I don't want a disposable electronic
| device. I get why it is that way; not having any charging
| hardware probably makes the device much smaller. But I'd
| rather it be a bit bigger and rechargeable.
| behringer wrote:
| I dont believe it would be even more circuitry. 2 exposed
| pins and maybe a diode if you really want some protection.
| They did this to sell more rings.
| _flux wrote:
| How much rechargeability really requires from hardware point
| of view?
|
| I suppose the problem is that there are no standard for tiny
| magnetic chargers/cables. Every watch comes with their own,
| and they need be custom designed. For a device this large as
| much of the charging electronics should be outside the ring.
|
| And another (small?) problem is that you'd need to
| electrically protect those external pins.
| noveltyaccount wrote:
| I'm with you, a little pogo-pin connector with all the
| charging circuitry in the external dongle would add, I
| don't know, ten dollars to the BOM. Very cool product but I
| won't buy a gadget I know I'd dispose in two years.
| dwa3592 wrote:
| They can still make another version which is slightly larger
| and is rechargeable; and let people decide what they prefer
| more.
| wrxd wrote:
| I am not sure about the use case but I was happy to see they
| advertise a long battery life. Still, as soon as I learnt that
| it is disposable I lost any interest in the product.
|
| I very likely wouldn't have bought it anyway but I am surely
| not going to buy disposable tech.
| philistine wrote:
| [flagged]
| dang wrote:
| Personal attacks are not welcome here, so please don't post
| like this.
|
| https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
| cptskippy wrote:
| Given the silicone rubber covering over the button, I wouldn't
| expect the hardware to last much longer anyways.
| SuperShibe wrote:
| Couldn't the same flow be achieved on a Pebble watch by utilizing
| something like the "double tap"-gesture Apple Watches Series 9
| and upwards have?
|
| This seems like a gadget just for the sake of having another
| gadget...
| daveguy wrote:
| The idea (fta) is to have activation require only the one free
| hand.
| SuperShibe wrote:
| yup that's what the Apple Watch double tap gesture does. On
| the hand wearing the watch you tap your thumb and index
| finger together 2 times in quick succession and the watch
| recognizes that unique motion pattern on your arm and does
| [something].
| swrobel wrote:
| The double-tap gesture is something I was very excited about
| and have completely forgotten about since getting my watch. The
| caveats around what it takes to activate it (screen activated
| and facing vertically) are just so great, you wonder if anyone
| at Apple actually tried this and found it to be a better
| alternative to interacting with the screen. Their demo video
| actually does a perfect job of capturing just how ridiculously
| theatrical you have to be to get it to work:
| https://support.apple.com/guide/watch/use-double-tap-for-com...
| jerlam wrote:
| I was also excited about it, until I tried it and discovered
| it has pretty poor usability. It's not always clear what the
| double tap will do. Maybe it will scroll, maybe it will clear
| the item you are looking at, and maybe it won't do anything.
| Daneel_ wrote:
| About the only thing I use it for is stopping a timer - it's
| great for that.
| apparent wrote:
| Interesting idea, but those gestures only work on AW when not
| in low-power mode, meaning they take a non-trivial amount of
| battery. It would probably dampen Pebble's battery life
| significantly, and might not even be possible with the chip
| that it has.
| daveguy wrote:
| Any know if there are plans to make a new pebble watch that
| includes both Barometer/Compass plus Heart Rate Monitor in one
| device? This looks like a useful UI mode, but I'm holding out for
| a Pebble that doesn't require choosing between two basic (these
| days) watch sensors.
| asimovfan wrote:
| i am also waiting for this so i can order a pebble.
| starkparker wrote:
| the "tech bro independently discovers and creates an existing
| product" cycle is so fast that we're seeing it happen to tiktok
| scrolling rings now
| joombaga wrote:
| My first concern is that this looks very difficult to remove if
| the battery begins to swell, as silver-oxide batteries are wont
| to do. Perhaps that's less likely with single use batteries.
| Daneel_ wrote:
| I thought you might find it interesting to know that it's
| "wont" instead of "want", when saying "wont to do"
|
| https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/wont
|
| Also: I agree with your concern
| joombaga wrote:
| I'm embarrassed. Thanks for the correction!
| Daneel_ wrote:
| Don't be :) learning is lifelong
| layer8 wrote:
| Should be relatively straightforward to remove with a small
| wire cutter.
| stronglikedan wrote:
| just like with the samsung rings, oh wait...
| erohead wrote:
| This is one of the reasons why we decided not to have
| rechargeable batteries! We saw what happened to the Samsung
| ring.
|
| There is no risk of swelling with Index 01
| DeathArrow wrote:
| >Hold the button, whisper your thought, and it's sent to your
| phone. It's added to your notes, set as a reminder, or saved for
| later review.
|
| Take the phone, open app, done.
| ipsum2 wrote:
| 12-15 hours of recording is maybe 2 weeks usage for heavy users.
| It would've been perfect if it could connect to computers and had
| a rechargeable battery. Oh well, hope someone else takes
| inspiration and makes the same thing but can recharge.
| Jeremy1026 wrote:
| That would be a minute of recording for every 22-28 minutes.
| That is some seriously heavy use. Especially considering that
| doesn't include sleep.
| embedding-shape wrote:
| > It would've been perfect if it could connect to computers
|
| If their goal truly is "New Pebble", then surely something that
| could connect to a phone could connect to a computer, granted
| you have the available radios connected to your computer. Seems
| to be BT in this case.
|
| > and had a rechargeable battery
|
| Yeah, seems like a weird thing to do, but I guess trying to
| solve this would make the device a lot harder. Hoping at least
| there will be a DIY route to replace the batteries, I don't
| have the will to be sending back an electrical device every
| second month because the battery died, and then waiting for a
| new device to arrive in the mail.
|
| Edit: I was just about to ask if you think they'll send the
| replacement device before you've sent in the one that had the
| expired battery, but now I realize it isn't even clear if they
| expect us to _buy_ a brand new device when the battery runs
| out, or if they provide a replacement? The former would be an
| absolutely bananas proposition.
| 65 wrote:
| Even if the battery lasts "years", it still seems wildly
| irresponsible to make this a single use device. I suspect this
| thing will get very few sales because it's single use.
| apparent wrote:
| The phrase "single use" applies better to condoms than to
| wearables that you use every day for 500-1000 days, IMO.
| micromacrofoot wrote:
| how often do you replace your phone? in terms of weight/waste
| this is probably in the area of about 1/50th of one... you
| could wear these for ~100 years and produce the maybe the
| equivalent waste of 2 phones.
| maeln wrote:
| You can buy a rechargeable e-ring with several sensors and even a
| tiny screen for like 20$ on AliExpress. 75$ for a non-
| rechargeable, e-waste ring with just a button and a mic is
| insane.
| lopis wrote:
| [flagged]
| crimsoneer wrote:
| but probably not a microphone, right.
| evan_ wrote:
| Not one that they tell you about anyway
| maeln wrote:
| Sure, but I don't think that ditching the combo O2 blood &
| heartbeat sensor, charging chip and the screen, and adding
| instead a mic is worth a 55$ upcharge.
| skeledrew wrote:
| Point is to not having to take it off at all, as next thing is
| going out without it and losing that convenience. Though I
| guess they can also invent a finger-mounted powerbank for it; I
| remember buying a case with an embedded powerbank for one of my
| earlier Android phones...
| erohead wrote:
| (Pebble founder)
|
| Happy to answer any questions you have!
| schraitle wrote:
| How often do you get accidental clicks? Does it interfere with
| day-to-day activities because you're trying to avoid the
| button?
|
| Also, I love the idea of providing 3d models for something like
| this that needs to be perfectly sized
| weldedtogether wrote:
| Love the idea as a very easily distracted individual, but the
| battery is keeping me on the fence. I understand how charging
| circuitry makes this product a non-starter, but is there any
| hope of the battery being replaceable?
| erohead wrote:
| If you look at other rechargeable smart rings they're in the
| $250 to $300 range, plus a $10/month subscription. We didn't
| want to do that for a new product like this.
| weldedtogether wrote:
| I like the price here, but my question was not about adding
| charging circuitry, but some way to open the ring and
| replace the battery once it's depleted.
| skeledrew wrote:
| Then you'd run into waterproofing issues, and there's
| greater inherent complexity in providing replacement
| ability.
| Daneel_ wrote:
| Given that the user will typically have their watch on them as
| well, why not make the ring a battery-less BLE transmitter that
| triggers voice input on the watch? It's still one-handed
| operation, but now the battery life is infinite since there's
| no battery? The disposable ring seems like a solution in search
| of a problem to me, unfortunately.
|
| Example button: https://core-electronics.com.au/self-powered-
| wireless-switch...
|
| I imagine the reason is reliability, but USD$99 plus
| international shipping every two years isn't worth that to me,
| sorry.
|
| Aside: I loved my kickstarter pebble and my steel, btw!
| piyuv wrote:
| Why didn't you make it just a button which activates the watch?
| It'd be an addon to pebble watch. It couldn't be used
| standalone, but you could make it rechargeable and it would
| solve your issue (actions with only one hand)
| erohead wrote:
| It can work exactly like that, if you have a Pebble. But it
| works standalone as well.
| jyxent wrote:
| Do you mean that this is technically possible, or that this
| is a feature that will be supported? I've preordered the
| Time 2, so having the ability to configure it that way to
| significantly extend the battery life of the ring could be
| interesting. On the other hand, using it standalone might
| be fine for me. I wouldn't really know how fast I might go
| through the battery without using it for a while.
| dzink wrote:
| 1. Will it fit on a female with a size 3 finger?
|
| 2. Can we pick our own transcription service or export audio to
| transcribe elsewhere if you transcription is not reliable or
| privacy is needed?
|
| 3. Is it waterproof? Can I wash my hands without taking it off?
| roughly wrote:
| I actually like the device and can see the purpose of it - I've
| tried to kick together similar solutions in the past, but I
| like the very "one thing only" nature of this.
|
| That said, I absolutely cannot buy a device like this without a
| replaceable battery. I don't actually care about the recharge,
| I get what you're trying to do with it, but given the state of
| the e-waste world and, bluntly, the history of hardware brands
| - a big, big part of the sales pitch for the pebble is the OSS
| nature of the device because we need to hedge against any one
| company for longevity. I'd seriously consider this if I knew
| the battery was replaceable, but I can't bet on you being
| around in 4, 6, or 8 years, and I'm not willing to buy
| intentionally disposable tech anymore.
| enragedcacti wrote:
| Are you still considering implementing the feature as a Pebble
| app as well? As someone who is very forgetful I like the low-
| friction external memory concept, but it would be nice if I
| could try it out (admittedly sub-optimally) before jumping in
| with a second device. It could also be a nice option for Index
| owners to keep a similar flow even when they don't want to wear
| the Index for whatever reason.
|
| In general I really like the idea of a local-first, privacy-
| first, one-way/low-interaction digital assistant regardless of
| the form factor. A big frustration I have with Gemini as a
| voice assistant is that I have to wait out the other half of
| super simple interactions like setting a timer or making a
| note.
| broretore wrote:
| Why aren't you doing a wild degree of miniaturized power
| electronics R&D for your low-cost beta test of a new computing
| modality?
|
| /s
| ddoeth wrote:
| I really like the thought and the format, but I do not like
| that I can't change the battery. Even if it is not easy, I
| still think there should be a way to change the battery.
| arjvik wrote:
| How hackable is the firmware, if we want to assign different
| handling to the button presses?
|
| Can we flash our own firmware to the device?
| clueless wrote:
| could this be a used a bluetooth microphone, so I could use it
| with a laptop as a quick voice dictation/input for various
| uses? I'm thinking like a simple microphone for an localy
| hosted app like Hex: https://github.com/kitlangton/Hex
| nowittyusername wrote:
| This seems like one of those devices that seems like "meh" at a
| glance but grows on you once you used it. In fact just the
| Bluetooth button feature alone is warranted a second take let
| alone a mic embedded in to the ring with a crazy battery life. If
| there's a way to hack the device and pipe the mic features to
| other apps I think i might get this thing. edit: never mind i
| just noticed 15 hours recording time with no recharging. yeah bud
| that's a no go.
| koinedad wrote:
| I imagine a partial rebate for the returned device to lessen the
| burden but this does feel like a $5 subscription just for the
| device.
|
| I generally like the idea. I use my Apple Watch for Siri and
| needing the other hand to hold Siri is not ideal. I do use "hey
| siri" a lot but it doesn't always work, though pretty reliable.
| baumschubser wrote:
| I am SO close to switch to Android to buy and properly use a
| Pebble watch. I love the hacker attitude, the retro tech, the
| quirkyness.
|
| Seeing them introducing One More Thing on the other side of the
| spectrum, deep in big-corp, locked down, consumerist throwaway
| territory makes me reevaluate that.
|
| I guess they might overestimate the fanboyness of their
| clientele. I hope enough people find this as laughable as I do
| and ignore this.
| graypegg wrote:
| Hmm... I sort of would've preferred it was JUST a button. I
| wonder if you could even make it perpetually powered by body heat
| + buffer battery if it's ONLY job was to emit a couple packets
| over BLE with some burned in ID that you save on the watch. I
| don't know how efficient peltier elements are going to be on such
| a small area, but the cold side would be attached to a big metal
| ring, which feels like an adequate heat sink. (Peltier elements
| work on heat differential right? Not an expert.)
|
| I know they mentioned that they thought of making this just a
| watch app, but didn't like the two-handed button press or raise
| to wake gesture. Why not just optimize for removing the gesture
| entirely? The microphone has to be better on a full size watch on
| your wrist vs the tiny ring further away on your finger.
|
| This hits the same nerve in me as those single-use vapes with
| screens, except you can't harvest the battery out of this one.
| erohead wrote:
| You can use it just as a button - that's one of the ways you
| can hack it. Just hook the button up to whichever action
| (webhook, Tasker, etc) you'd like.
|
| Battery would last for decades just as a button.
| user_7832 wrote:
| _Any_ chance of diy, at-home battery replacements? That would
| definitely let me consider it. I don 't mind if it's a 10
| hour process to replace the battery. Just the option to have
| a device that lasts is great.
| ramses0 wrote:
| Waterproofing, tiny batteries, yadda yadda... it's either
| "charge it weekly", or "recycle" every year or two (eg:
| $9.99/mo)
|
| Thinking through: many people in the pebble-verse (back in
| the day) were super-hot about wanting the voice-control
| stuff/microphone responses to text messages. Instead of
| thinking about this as a standalone "ring", think of this
| as a "remote button + mic" for the pebble watch.
|
| As a (former) avid biker, being able to spam: "How much
| longer until sunset (and how far away am I from home [and
| will I get home before sunset])?" and having a rough answer
| "on the wrist" is super useful.
|
| On the Home Assistant front, the Apple ecosystem is waaaay
| too universal for Siri-isms. We have 3-4 home pod's
| (upstairs, downstairs, kids bedroom, guest room), along
| with phones (car-play), and airpods. All of them can be
| used as "Hey Siri, set a timer, turn on/off the lights,
| what's the weather, etc".
|
| Looking at the HA voice controls, it's utter garbage trash
| (unfortunately) until The Hackers(tm) get around to fixing
| things up, BUUUT we're still screwed b/c HA speakers/mic's
| will be worse than Apple's, and HA will never come out with
| AirPods or CarPlay integration (and likely: Apple will
| never support a "non-Siri" voice connection via their
| microphone relationships).
|
| This ring is an incredibly interesting way to sidestep all
| of that!
|
| You have the ring (mic input, 2yr battery), you have the
| watch (text display, 1 month battery), and your phone
| (cellular + storage + compute, 1 day battery), all of which
| are nominally "every day carry" items.
|
| In the home automation world, having your star-trek
| communicator pin (quite literally!) on your finger at all
| times w/ a 2yr battery life is VERY VERY intriguing!
| ncr100 wrote:
| "Ready to beam up" ... Smartwatch plays transporter
| sounds.
| Daneel_ wrote:
| I feel like this should be promoted or made clearer on the
| product page - this is how I think many people would prefer
| to use it, provided it could trigger voice input on the
| pebble/device/other watch - for example, as a Siri trigger.
| tekacs wrote:
| This reminds me of Pebble Core. Does anyone but me remember
| that?
|
| https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/getpebble/pebble-2-time...
|
| It was one of the devices I was most excited about way back
| when, and I'd still love to see it - button, headphone jack,
| running Android. I would love a headless (and thus longer-
| charge-for-smaller-device) Android device like that again.
| jdranczewski wrote:
| Yes! The ring reminded me of the Core too. Perhaps with voice
| processing and the infrastructure around MCP (which I haven't
| used myself, but Eric brings up in the blog) a fully
| headless, voice-based device like this is more feasible now
| than in those days
| summermusic wrote:
| > I sort of would've preferred it was JUST a button
|
| Exactly. The Pebble already has all the hardware to capture
| voice notes. There are at least a few third party Pebble apps
| that do this already. The problem that Eric has is limited to
| the activation of the feature, not the feature itself, but he
| overengineered a disposable standalone gadget instead of making
| an accessory for his already capable platform.
| BoredPositron wrote:
| Like the oldschool tv clickers? Piezo should be enough.
| bronson wrote:
| As long as the receiver is always-on and always listening.
| Easy when plugged into the wall, like a TV. Not so easy when
| it's on battery.
| angiolillo wrote:
| > Why not just optimize for removing the gesture entirely? The
| microphone has to be better on a full size watch on your wrist
| vs the tiny ring further away on your finger.
|
| Agreed, let the ring just be a button that can trigger
| recording on a watch or phone (among other tasks) rather than
| squeezing in a microphone and audio transmitter.
|
| > I wonder if you could even make it perpetually powered by
| body heat + buffer battery if it's ONLY job was to emit a
| couple packets over BLE...
|
| Neat! Or maybe a tiny solar cell? Perhaps the button itself is
| piezoelectric, like a wearable version of the EnOcean Nodon
| line of battery-free wireless switches -- a BLE advertising
| event costs less than 100 microjoules which a button press
| should be able to provide, though ensuring 100% reliability
| over BLE with such a tiny energy budget would be hard.
|
| Alternately it could communicate with the watch using IR, but
| the knuckles might occlude line of sight. The button press
| could mechanically emit an ultrasonic tone, but that requires
| an always-on mic in the watch/phone and would be susceptible to
| shenanigans. Maybe pressing the button causes a specific
| vibration that a watch accelerometer can reliably recognize?
|
| Now I want someone to find a way to make this work... but long
| term I expect that the real solution will be making hand
| gestures work reliably 100% of the time with no ring at all.
| InsideOutSanta wrote:
| There are battery-free switches for Hue light systems and,
| presumably, other similar systems. They're pretty large,
| though, and pushing the button has a lot of travel, which can
| be used to generate electricity.
| smeej wrote:
| Plus, even if you wear the watch on one arm and the ring on the
| opposite hand, they're only ever a maximum of your wingspan
| apart when in use.
|
| I'd just love the "customizable button on a ring" concept, and
| that battery could last basically forever.
| maelito wrote:
| Wait what ? Why can't they add a feature to the watch that is
| already there on the wrist and especially already _bought_ that
| will start recording the thought after a hand shake (that
| triggers the mic) plus magic keyword ?
| inanutshellus wrote:
| This thing seems to stand alone though? As in - I don't have to
| have a watch, nor, it sounds like, do I have to have my phone
| within pairing range when I record something.
|
| It's unlocked though, so maybe a software toggle will let you
| turn off the mic and just have it activate your watch's mic.
| This would presumably extend the battery, which seems to be a
| focus of discussion.
| a_wild_dandan wrote:
| Someone will make a killing on a rechargeable version of this.
| The ergonomics are a good idea.
| jrm4 wrote:
| For what it's worth, I 100% perfectly solved this problem for
| myself MANY years ago and still use it just about every day.
|
| On Android, it's called "Blitzmail," I'm pretty sure there's an
| Apple equivalent.
|
| Beautifully simple app; on one touch it pops open a text box
| (which you can type, dictate to, also do "shares/attachments")
|
| And emails to one and only one pre-specified address, usually
| "yourself."
|
| From there, pick your poison. I personally have a dedicated
| address/account for these, and I have some bash scripts that pick
| them up and move them around, but I imagine for many "checking
| that email address periodically" would be sufficient.
| modeless wrote:
| I do exactly the same, except via a button in the quick
| settings panel, using Tasker, so I don't have to go to the home
| screen. It's incredibly useful. I hope this can be configured
| to make the notes emails to yourself.
| quartz wrote:
| This specific use case is awesome-- I use an integrated AI
| notetaker in my self-built notes app for my thoughts and I wonder
| if I could connect the index to it?
|
| More broadly: Invisible wearable microphones are coming for
| everyone and perfect memory will follow. I'm incredibly excited
| about this for myself and simultaneously terrified about everyone
| else having it.
|
| It's coming fast enough that I'm beginning to assume in any
| decently sized crowd of tech folks /someone/ is recording
| everything.
| lopis wrote:
| Instead of a stand-alone piece of e-waste, how about this: a
| device with the same format (a ring and an button) but the only
| thing it does is trigger the pebble watch to start recording a
| message. This way the microphone isn't needed, just the radio
| (and much weaker radio at that), and the battery will last
| exponentially longer. Then just expose the charging terminals so
| that we can at least hack the device with custom made external
| charging controllers, or buy a charger separately.
| kwanbix wrote:
| Or better yet. Use your cellphone wich most of us carry 90% of
| the time?
| mikestew wrote:
| The cellphone that's buried in my handbag? I think you missed
| the expressed use case (admittedly, a few paragraphs into
| TFA):
|
| _"Before, I would take my phone out of my pocket to jot
| these down, but I couldn't always do that (eg, while
| bicycling). I also wanted to start using my phone less,
| especially in front of my kids._ "
| wkat4242 wrote:
| I'm sure it won't be able to handle wind noise well (it
| doesn't look big enough to have multiple microphones) so
| you'd have to stop the bicycle to make a good recording.
| Might as well grab the phone then.
| cxr wrote:
| Yet another retort addressed directly in the post:
|
| > _Raw audio playback: Very helpful if STT doesn't work
| perfectly due to wind or loud background noises_
| Fnoord wrote:
| Stop using your phone less in front of your kids.
|
| Start using your ring/watch/whatever_else more in front of
| your kids.
|
| Honestly, it isn't about _what_ you use (that is just
| hype). You can read the paper all day if you want. I grew
| up with a father who was listening to radio and watching TV
| all the time (to be fair: he was disabled, including
| legally blind). It isn 't about using your phone less in
| front of your kids. It is about being there for your kids
| when they _need_ you; showing genuine interest in your
| kids; interacting with them. Right now, as I am writing
| this to you, my kids are watching Peppa Pig before bedtime.
| Instead of writing this, I could sit next to them and watch
| an episode with them.
|
| As for cycling, with a ring you'd have to move your hand
| towards you or not, but it isn't much different compared to
| a watch, except perhaps when you'd wear a sweater over your
| watch.
|
| It is also very typical that in-ear buds are expensive,
| small, yet hard to repair because the battery isn't user
| replaceable. And guess what, exactly the same for this
| device.
|
| Apart from the yet another device with microphone (24/7 on,
| I suppose) and Bluetooth (the wireless spaghetti protocol)
| and it not being user serviceable the device costs 100 USD.
| For such a price, I expect it to last longer than two
| years. I mean, I'm sick of devices lasting only a few
| years. I wouldn't need yet another one.
|
| TL;DR hard pass, do better.
| cxr wrote:
| The remarks in this comment can only come from a gross
| misunderstanding of what many people mean when they talk
| about avoiding use of their phones around their kids.
| Almost every sentence reveals a very me-focused outlook.
|
| > It isn't about using your phone less in front of your
| kids. It is about being there for your kids when they
| _need_ you
|
| That's a very narrow conception if the problem--it isn't
| solely about being "there" for them or trying to get
| control over (and maintain control over) one's own
| addictions. The main thing that people have an issue with
| when they talk about kids and phone use (and TV for that
| matter) is addiction observed _in the kids themselves_.
| It 's absolutely about using one's own phone less while
| they're around as a means of quashing overexposure.
|
| You can show as much genuine interest in them as you
| want, and it doesn't change anything, because whether the
| kids feel like the parent is "there for them" not the
| problem that a parent is is already genuinely interested
| in them is concerned about and trying to address.
|
| > As for cycling, with a ring you'd have to move your
| hand towards you or not, but it isn't much different
| compared to a watch, except perhaps when you'd wear a
| sweater over your watch.
|
| "Not much" except that the fingers that are attached to
| the hand that's attached to the wrist where you're
| wearing your watch certainly aren't capable of reaching
| back to press a button on said watch.
|
| > Apart from the yet another device with microphone (24/7
| on, I suppose)
|
| The folks in this thread are really committed to just
| plucking things out of thin air and acting on foregone
| conclusions, huh?
| 47282847 wrote:
| > Instead of writing this, I could sit next to them and
| watch an episode with them.
|
| And as any study into the effects of parental attention
| and shared experience will show that kind of behavior
| would be beneficial to their overall long-term mental
| health. Requiring them to make themselves heard and to
| actively "disturb you" is a very high barrier for
| children to break through (even if you don't consider it
| a disturbance). Children need active mirroring and
| external guidance when it comes to their needs in order
| to develop a healthy sense for them. They are "left
| alone" as soon as you leave the shared emotional space.
| spike021 wrote:
| as I wondered in another comment, the button may not always
| be facing your thumb. so then you'd need to keep fiddling
| with it anyway.
| ddoeth wrote:
| It's still easier to turn around a ring than to fiddle
| with a a phone. And more legal as well, no laws against
| rotating a ring while rinding your bike. That's fully
| haptic, no is drawn from traffic for that.
| wing-_-nuts wrote:
| "Hey google, make a note: ..."
|
| I just tried it, and it worked flawlessly. Now, obviously
| it's not great for privacy per se, but I'm not jotting down
| my plans for world domination or anything
| supern0va wrote:
| ...and face the seductive allure of all those delicious
| notifications trying to get me to task switch to a bunch of
| other things?
|
| No, sir. I'm pretty much on board with anything that reduces
| the number of times I need to light up that phone screen.
| PoisedProto wrote:
| Well, you could just turn off unnecessary notifications
| like I do, same with emails. I get like 3 notifications a
| day on average now, and most of those are just dms from
| friends.
| supern0va wrote:
| I do, aggressively. Honestly, the messages from friends
| are the hardest to ignore/defer. That's why I also have a
| highly tedious DND schedule.
|
| That aside, there's also far more friction to pull out a
| device, turn it on, unlock it, then open an app.
| eichin wrote:
| If I could press _one_ button (and not unlock the phone) I
| would; my samsung even _has_ an extra wasted button (the
| "bixby" button) but it isn't reconfigurable. (Still fails for
| the "while driving" case but I'd be using it the rest of the
| time)
| SchemaLoad wrote:
| You can do it on the iphone with the action button.
| lopis wrote:
| Why stop there? Why use your phone at all? Just go visit your
| mum instead of calling...
|
| Sorry the sarcasm, but not everything should need you to take
| your phone, unlock, get distracted, open social media on a
| reflex and forget what you were doing in the first place.
| CGMthrowaway wrote:
| UX probably not as good in that case. I am thinking about how
| buggy my voice-remote is for the TV. 1/3 of the time it works,
| 1/3 of the time there is some lag before it starts working (and
| requires waiting for feedback i.e. the listening tone before I
| can speak) and 1/3 of the time it doesn't work at all (never
| hears me due to lag or booting up or whatever else).
| lopis wrote:
| It can't be worse than a tiny ring that records notes...
| adammarples wrote:
| Then just put the button on the watch? In fact, why isn't this
| just a button on the watch?
| skeledrew wrote:
| Because you need to use your other hand to press that button,
| instead of the adjacent finger.
| smiley1437 wrote:
| > Because you need to use your other hand to press that
| button, instead of the adjacent finger.
|
| Funnily enough, I've used my nose to tap my watch when my
| hands are full
|
| Yes, I've gotten some strange looks
| kirtakat wrote:
| I do this all the time in the winter as well when I'm
| wearing gloves that aren't really "touch screen" friendly
| twsted wrote:
| I thought I was the only one on Earth to do that (but
| surely I'm the only boomer doing it).
| lopis wrote:
| If you had read the post you would know the answer.
| dingaling wrote:
| "This was tough to use while bicycling or carrying stuff."
|
| That seems an incredibly limited set of use cases for the
| complication of adding another device to one's life.
| skeledrew wrote:
| Might as well bundle the ring with the watch at that point, and
| increase the price accordingly, as it's then become an
| accessory particular to the pebble watch. And including a
| charging circuit means more complexity and bulk, also leading
| to an increase in price. And cost is a factor they're
| optimizing for.
| lopis wrote:
| That's my point exactly. This should have been a pebble
| accessory, not a standalone device that sends voice notes to
| your phone. If this device actually has a 2 year battery, if
| you'd remove the microphone and turn it into a "smart button"
| to trigger a watch action, the battery should easily last 4+
| years.
| svl7 wrote:
| That could be achievable without a battery, using a Piezo
| button like some Hue remotes... Though not sure with the small
| form factor.
| gegtik wrote:
| I'll be honest, after seeing a nightmare situation where a
| smartring battery inflated and cut off circulation to a finger, I
| will never ever buy a ring with a battery in it.
| Daneel_ wrote:
| I'd be interested to see a battery-less ring that uses the
| mechanical energy of the press to power a BLE transmitter to
| trigger voice input on a watch. I feel like it's much safer,
| plus it has no fixed lifespan.
| skeledrew wrote:
| How will a single press provide that much energy?
| BoredPositron wrote:
| Piezo
| _flux wrote:
| I suppose it would be possible to design the ring so that any
| pillowing would occur only in outwards expansion.
| herval wrote:
| Battery decision asid, I love this dude's obsession with making
| unique hardware
| ibdf wrote:
| What's unique about this ring that has less features than other
| "smart" rings?
| apparent wrote:
| The part where the battery lasts for years? Did anyone see
| that coming?
| kennyadam wrote:
| The battery lasts for 12-15 hours and how long you manage
| to stretch that out to is up to you. The site says "On
| average, I use it 10-20 times per day to record 3-6 second
| thoughts. That's up to 2 years of usage."
|
| So, you can use it for 30 seconds a day to get 2 years of
| usage. They also mention using it to control your music,
| the lights in your home and are assuming STT accuracy of
| 100% using a local model. The fallback of having to
| manually transcribe it from the audio recording if the STT
| fails is going to happen often enough that it'll get
| annoying. You're not going to be sending any messages to
| people as that will take a lot longer than 30 seconds a
| day.
|
| I suspect the battery will last about 3 months if you just
| use it how you'd think it can be used. You would need to
| really discipline yourself to keep to a limit of 30 seconds
| of use a day.
|
| I think they will need to end up adding some charging
| contacts to the surface once they start sending these
| things out into the wild or sales will be very limited.
|
| How do you know how much time you have left on the ring's
| battery? Do you have to keep checking the app? Why not just
| use your phone for notes then.
| frakkingcylons wrote:
| If you can't appreciate the value of less is more, this
| device is not for you.
| Sporktacular wrote:
| Some harsh comments here. The idea is interesting and the
| miniaturisation impressive. Successful or not, it's good to see
| these ideas realised.
| shnpln wrote:
| Gonna give this a shot. I pre-ordered.
| dotdi wrote:
| I was typing in my CC info when I went back to read about battery
| life. This is meant as positive feedback: I won't be ordering a
| non-rechargeable device with 12 hours of recording for $100.
|
| Imagine I fall asleep with it on my finger and accidentally press
| the button with my head. It's recording me snore for 3 hours, and
| 25% battery life gone.
| apparent wrote:
| Based on the description, this doesn't seem plausible. If the
| button is as clicky as it sounds, it would hurt your
| head/hand/both to do the thing you describe.
| aljaz823 wrote:
| It doesn't matter if it's plausible or not. It's the fact
| that it's non-rechargeable device with 12 hours of
| recording...
| supern0va wrote:
| I wouldn't think about the total recording time so much as
| the actual usage you'll get out of it. If based on typical
| usage, you could get even eighteen months out of it, then
| you're looking at around $5/month for a device to serve
| this purpose for you.
|
| Is that worth it to you? Perhaps not. But plenty of us pay
| similar amounts of money for software subscriptions related
| to productivity, so it's not especially outlandish compared
| to paying for Standard Notes, Todoist, etc.
| user_7832 wrote:
| I posted it as a comment as well - but even just giving the
| opportunity of a diy, at-home battery replacements would be great
| for a lot of people. I think the disposability aspect is very
| counter to the kind of people who use a Pebble Steel for half a
| decade (or more!)
| poisonborz wrote:
| Huh, I think this is a problem that almost every HN reader solved
| in their life one way or other.
|
| (Not speaking of the usability of this: if voice works for you,
| this can still be great for you, however)
| whiskey-one wrote:
| The concept is interesting but without charging it's a non-
| starter for me. Also it's a bit awkward and I'd prefer to use my
| phone or watch instead of adding a ring.
| miduil wrote:
| One aspect about e-waste is really the size, this has by volume
| less than an AA-battery, which means the e-waste is pretty much
| within this realm. For a decently size powerbank, you could have
| a lifetime of those rings and probably still create less e-waste.
|
| I think it's an interesting approach, in terms of hack-ability a
| non-rechargable device is pretty much bad - also just imagining
| that any sort of software or hardware glitch could easily just
| permanently render the device useless is not super decent either.
| frankest wrote:
| The only thing that matters here is how good the transcription
| is. You absolutely have to save the recording. You also have to
| enable the user to connect to their own transcription service and
| preserve the recording for that if yours sucks or is not trusted.
| People have accents. Third party transcription vendors can sell
| data. Do not mess this up. Enable users to add their own trusted
| transcription.
|
| If we want to give this to grandparents to save their stories, we
| can want to have the stories too. If we want it for ourselves, we
| have to trust it.
| skeledrew wrote:
| Already a part of it. Recordings are saved (on the sync device)
| in case a transcript is a bust.
| frankest wrote:
| Yes, but they mention there will be a subscription plan for
| their cloud-based transcription. If you want an open platform
| of devices - ensure users can use a range of transcription
| providers for quality and security.
| h14h wrote:
| I'm sold enough on this form factor to take a flyer on a pre-
| order. I've been hunting for ways to minimize friction when
| quickly capturing random thoughts and this is a novel idea that
| seems to go further than anything else I've tried.
|
| The lack of battery charging/replacement is a bummer, but
| slimness is far more critical for a ring than just about any
| other device so I understand the tradeoff. I've also seen stories
| of injuries from battery expansion in fitness rings, so if the
| risk of this is significantly reduced by eliminating charge
| cycles, I personally consider that a notable benefit.
|
| Even though, IMO, there are enough legitimate benefits to warrant
| this product's trade-offs, I imagine its disposable nature will
| ultimately make it unsuccessful. Off the cuff, it's easy to look
| at this as "saying the quiet part out loud" vis-a-vis planned
| obsolescence, and I understand why many would find that extremely
| off-putting.
| modeless wrote:
| I don't understand why people who are probably OK with ordering
| Doordash once in a while are up in arms about a disposable
| device that weighs a couple of grams, lasts for years, and is
| recycled. You can easily spend more on a single Doordash meal
| for two people and I guarantee a few Doordash meals have more
| impact on the environment than this minuscule device ever
| could.
| tananaev wrote:
| Is it just a Bluetooth mic in a form of a ring? Or is there
| something more to this device?
| wkat4242 wrote:
| Yes it says it can store 5 minutes of audio
| miyoji wrote:
| I'm not sure what other people's hands are like, but mine are
| pretty big and I can just barely push my thumb against the part
| of my index finger where I would wear a ring, and doing so
| renders my thumb useless for any of the opposable things that I
| usually use my hand for. It's also extremely uncomfortable for my
| hand and thumb. I've managed to press buttons on my watch with my
| hands full, but it would literally be impossible to activate this
| thing with my hands full.
|
| I've worn rings, and they can rotate in place on the hand if
| they're not perfectly sized, and there aren't any half sizes
| here, so this would definitely rotate on my finger, making no
| guarantee that I can even _reach_ the button without adjusting
| the ring with my other hand, or maybe awkwardly spinning it with
| my thumb until the button is in reach again.
|
| And it only lasts for 10-15 hours of recording time. And there
| looks to be a cloud services upsell for better STT than the open
| source offering on device.
|
| This seems like an early alpha version of something that might be
| a good idea, but as it is I can't imagine buying one.
| nemomarx wrote:
| maybe wear the button on the underside of your finger?
| miyoji wrote:
| And activate it by pressing it into the tip of my nose?
| nemomarx wrote:
| it's easier for me to touch my thumb to the bottom of my
| finger (palm side) than the other way around, and you could
| also press it into whatever you're holding potentially.
|
| might mean more accidental presses though
| zem wrote:
| I figured the button went on the side of your finger nearest
| the thumb, and you curled your hand into a loose fist to press
| it
| FlamingMoe wrote:
| I think I would use this. I am the kind of person who needs to
| write things down immediately when they come into my head or I
| will forget them. I picture wearing it on my ring finger, button
| down, and use my thumb to press the button, is that realistic or
| would it be uncomfortable that way?
| josefresco wrote:
| I.... I kinda love this. Non-rechargeable battery and all. I
| don't need something else to charge. I understand this is a
| "luxury" but seamlessly recording "thoughts" is my personal
| computing holy grail.
| smm11 wrote:
| Voice recording on pre-smart phones was my jam forever, and this
| is right up my alley.
|
| But don't say "Privacy," then "data sent to your phone."
| sigmar wrote:
| Modern smartphones are very private, featuring full disk
| encryption, sandboxed app data storage, and mandatory lock
| screens. Why do you think the data stored on your phone isn't
| private?
| numpad0 wrote:
| Why not just make the electronics removable through a topside
| opening to have battery replaced at a watch shop? I don't get why
| the "jewel" part of this has to be resin molded. Normally you do
| this because smart rings are made by affixing a flexible PCB with
| somewhat-bendable battery inside a ring and then molding the
| entire inner part of the ring using clear resin, but the ring
| part for this one appears to be just a dead ring.
| giamma wrote:
| I think the design is bad: my girlfriend would never wear it.
| Maybe they know already and that's why the webpage contains only
| picture of male hands.
|
| Given the many smartwatches on the market which can do so much
| more, are lightweight and some of them with acceptable battery
| life (Garmin, Suunto, Amazfit), a smartring is of very little
| interest to me. But I often struggle to understand why certain
| products fascinate people, so I may be totally wrong and I wish
| the makers best of luck.
| sippeangelo wrote:
| The overmoulding is seriously ugly. Gold and navy blue?! Silver
| and medical grey? Only the black is passable.
| StrLght wrote:
| E-waste is still e-waste, no matter how small it may be. Shame.
| ibdf wrote:
| "Roughly 12 to 15 hours of recording. On average, I use it 10-20
| times per day to record 3-6 second thoughts. That's up to 2 years
| of usage." They really don't seem have tested the battery life,
| so 2 years is probably the best case scenario here. He says
| there's no subscription but if you need to buy one every 2 years
| or less, then that's the subscription. The primary reason given
| for not having an option to charge is just awful: "You would
| probably lose the charger before the battery ran out". This is
| seriously a device for reviewers and youtubers to hype, make a
| video about it, and then it's gone.
| Aurornis wrote:
| > How long does the battery last?
|
| > Roughly 12 to 15 hours of recording. On average, I use it 10-20
| times per day to record 3-6 second thoughts. That's up to 2 years
| of usage.
|
| I feel like I'm usually good about being able to imagine a market
| for different devices even when I'm not the target audience, but
| I'm having a hard time with this one.
|
| Having 20 different 3-second thoughts transcribed to notes that I
| have to process every day sounds more like added complications
| than problem solving. If I stretch, I can think of a few things
| that flashed into my mind and then I forgot again for a couple
| days because I wasn't in a location to immediately pull out my
| phone and put it on my todo list (which takes about 10 seconds
| because I put a shortcut in my lock screen). However, those
| locations weren't something where I could be "whispering" to a
| ring, either.
|
| So I don't know. I hope repebble succeeds with everyone they're
| doing, but this product feels like they went too far into the
| novelty end of the spectrum and neglected some of the actual
| usability that made the original Pebble popular.
|
| EDIT: On second thought, maybe the lack of recharging is an
| acknowledgement that they don't actually expect people to use
| this product a lot or for very long. Maybe the target audience is
| people who want to have something new and unique that they can
| also use as a conversation starter. Once the novelty wears off
| maybe it doesn't get worn much. If it does become popular with a
| niche audience they can release a V2 with charging.
| PunchyHamster wrote:
| I mean on one side I can see using it for to-do lists, but on
| other, why would I want another device in addition to
| smartphone _and_ smartwatch ? Especially that talking to your
| smartwatch looks _slightly_ less crazy in public than to your
| finger
| Tempest1981 wrote:
| Au contraire, you'll look like a Secret Service agent talking
| into your wrist.
| willahmad wrote:
| if it lasts even 1 year with on avg 1 min audio, I think it's
| nice disposable device to have.
|
| Some ideas if you have an app which can be integrated to other
| services:
|
| * I feel sick today, notify my manager about it, probably I
| will stay home
|
| * schedule a task to pickup a trash
|
| * something to remember, colleague X told me he is using
| service A for data clean up
|
| ...
| cxr wrote:
| Different people have different lives. I myself can't imagine
| the type of life where at any given moment during the day I'm
| in a position to "immediately pull out my phone" when I want to
| create a record of something. I'm not a Pebble customer, past
| or present, and I have owned exactly zero smartwatches.
| Excluding portrayals of futuristic wrist-mounted computers I
| saw during childhood that seemed cool just because they seemed
| cool, this is the only worthwhile thing I've ever seen anyone
| actually propose a smartwatch could be good for. The fact that
| smartwatches could be (and are) widely embraced but that _this_
| seems like pure novelty to someone strikes me as very strange.
|
| It sounds, though, like it doesn't solve a problem you have. I
| guess the only recourse you have about its existence is to not
| buy it.
| MarkusWandel wrote:
| I'm not a watch person, and the only reason I occasionally
| wear one is because it's a Garmin and I'm recording an
| outdoor activity with it. But while cycling, when the phone
| in my backpack makes a notification noise, it is kind of
| handy to just be able to look at the watch to see what kind
| of notification it is - the kind hardly worth looking at or
| the kind worth stopping and pulling out the phone to reply
| to. This particular gadget doesn't have a microphone and any
| app interaction on it involves a multi-button dance. But if
| there was a single button audio recording app, I can totally
| see myself using it. Especially as you get older (I'm
| guessing - can't interview younger me) fleeting thoughts can
| be awfully fleeting.
| braincat31415 wrote:
| There is another way to go about it - ignoring the phone
| completely while enjoying biking or jogging. Or leaving it
| at home. Unless I am on a call duty, all my notifications
| can wait.
| MarkusWandel wrote:
| My notification volume is relatively low, but there is
| one kind of notification, involving a certain significant
| other (we have high-needs kids) that requires action. So
| if the phone rings or there is a text message, for
| example, seeing at a glance (no button presses) what
| number it is from definitely allows stop/continue
| decision. I wish I did have a life where I can leave the
| electronic leash at home, or at least on mute.
| braincat31415 wrote:
| Understood.
| Tempest1981 wrote:
| > if there was a single button audio recording app
|
| Would the watch require 1 or 2 hands to record audio?
|
| The ring seems easier to use while biking. Or driving.
| lo_zamoyski wrote:
| > Having 20 different 3-second thoughts transcribed to notes
| that I have to process every day sounds more like added
| complications than problem solving.
|
| Frankly, I'm surprised this is a selling point, because I think
| it attaches too much importance to our "ideas". If it's a good
| idea that you'll pursue in earnest, you'll come across it
| again. And if you don't, so what?
|
| I say this as someone who does quite a bit of reflection
| throughout the day. I jot down things I find interesting, which
| can be, paradoxically, a way to move past the musing and onto
| other things instead of having it nag and pull my attention
| from other things. So, in all likelihood, this product would
| likely lead to a bunch of crap being stored in memory that
| you'll never return to.
| eichin wrote:
| For me it's more observations than ideas - "check out new
| restaurant/bookstore I saw while driving in Arlington" while
| not getting distracted from the actual driving...
| arscan wrote:
| I think this could be useful for the type of person that uses
| uses todo lists to help them tackle lots of small tasks that
| they intend to do immediately but somehow get distracted mid-
| action from and never finish (and then forget about
| altogether). As described in this blog post that front-paged hn
| some time ago:
|
| > When I notice a micro-task like this, my instinct is not to
| do it, but to put it in the todo list. Then I try to do it
| immediately. And if I get distracted halfway through, it's
| still there, in the todo list.
|
| https://borretti.me/article/notes-on-managing-adhd
|
| The problem with this approach is that recording tasks become a
| good amount of relative overhead compared to the 'micro-task'
| if it involves pulling out your phone, and pulling out your
| phone also introduces a potential distraction. So, having
| something that is single purpose and as low-friction as
| possible is appealing.
|
| I'm skeptical that this is actually any better than using a
| smart watch that you can dictate to though.
| dzink wrote:
| As someone who is a female size 3, will "8 US ring sizes: 6, 7,
| 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13" fit at all?
| piyuv wrote:
| > The battery lasts for up to years of average use. After the end
| of its life, send your ring back to us for recycling.
|
| This must be a joke.
| hartator wrote:
| I don't dislike the forever battery and the value proposition,
| however voice memos never appealed to me?
|
| The obvious voice commands that work only half of the time, can't
| voice memo in bed with your parters, in the office, or in public.
| That leaves very limited opportunities for this to be useful.
| cxr wrote:
| At only ~12 hours of recording per device, this wouldn't
| replace other forms of notetaking where you can afford the
| necessary interaction cost (e.g. taking out your phone). It
| reduces the number of times that you're unable to take notes
| (due to ergonomics/physical factors or otherwise).
|
| It increases the surface area of your day where "I am able to
| take a note right now (because I don't have anything stopping
| me)" is a true statement.
| apparent wrote:
| > When your phone is in range, the recording is streamed to the
| Pebble app. It's converted to text on-device, then processed by
| an on-device large language model (LLM) which selects an action
| to take (create note, add to reminders, etc).
|
| So does this mean that my lists have to be managed within the
| Pebble app? Or can the Pebble app interact with my Notes and
| Reminders apps? If I'm limited to the Pebble app's features, that
| would be more limiting. But I can't see how it would be able to
| break out and give instructions to other apps (at least beyond a
| preset list, via programmed Shortcuts).
| kennyadam wrote:
| Actions: [...] you can also ask it to do things like 'Send a
| Beeper message to my wife - running late' or answer simple
| questions that could be answered by searching the web. You can
| configure button clicks to control your music [...] play/pause
| or skip tracks [...] where to save your notes and reminders (I
| have it set to add to Notion) [...] Add your own voice actions
| via MCP. Or route the audio recordings directly to your own app
| or server!
| apparent wrote:
| Yeah I saw that, but didn't know if it was Android-only (the
| Beeper reference made me wonder). Can anyone weigh in on what
| it can do, or how it does it?
| da_grift_shift wrote:
| Title change please: "Meet Pebble Index 01 - External Memory For
| Your Brain"
|
| Also,
|
| >Wait, it's single use?
|
| HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
| noelrock wrote:
| I very much enjoy Eric's commitment to new and novel and
| imaginative hardware.
|
| Bought and am loving my Pebble 2 Duo etc - still yet to charge it
| once in fact!
|
| This device doesn't quite hit the mark for me, but I love the
| commitment to thinking about what's novel and useful, and putting
| a prototype out into the world. To use an Irish phrase, "more
| luck to them" - and hope we see many more projects from them!
| novoreorx wrote:
| A perfect simulation of a ring that would appear in a RPG, when
| the duration goes to 0, you permanently lose it.
| aristofun wrote:
| Goooshhh, just f.. give me a watch that a) last at least a month
| b) visible in a daylight Also accurate Hr activity and sleep
| tracking wouldn't hurt.
|
| That's it.
|
| Nobody gives a single bit about your fancy ai-blockhain-voodoo
| features. How blind are you to real demands of normal people?
| ulbu wrote:
| I wanted to use it to capture my musical ideas. They usually come
| unexpectedly and in bundles. There's a problem though - one of
| them is 0:40-1:30 min in duration; the ring wouldn't last half a
| year for me.
|
| I'm sure other musicians would love it as well, but are
| disqualified completely from the userbase. That's a shame as I
| think for us it would be _really, really_ useful.
|
| (The first iteration of a musical idea usually emerges somewhat
| spontaneously from an emotional state, and repetition always
| loses some important part of it. This ring could be an always-on
| photocamera for these spontaneous, naturally arising states.)
| realo wrote:
| This is a great example of use outside the box they got
| themselves in.
|
| The solution is simple: market this as a trigger for the pebble
| voice. Only thatz. Nothing else. Make the electronics as simple
| and cheap as possible. Sell it as an option to the watch. Less
| than 30$ would be ideal.
|
| Voila.
| utopcell wrote:
| I really don't see the benefit of this over, say, pixel buds.
| ThinkBeat wrote:
| We have built a new device. The device is a ring with a button
| and a microphone. Pressing the button initiates recording of your
| voice captures voice via the built in microphone and saves it on
| your phone.
|
| I think it would take a lot of heavy software to process and
| index the voice notes for the claim "Meet Pebble Index 01 -
| External Memory For Your Brain" is honest
| MarkusWandel wrote:
| Wait.. if you need to push a button and then have to get it
| somewhat close to your mouth to record an audio clip, why not
| just have a watch app? Pressing the button is still a two-hand
| thing. Or did I miss something?
| greysonp wrote:
| You put the ring on your index finger (and likely have it
| rotated so that the button is pointing to your thumb) and then
| press the button using the thumb on your same hand. That allows
| it to be one-handed.
| proee wrote:
| I like the idea and would use it. Though I would put it in place
| of my wedding band, and still access it via thumb.
| allforJesse wrote:
| This could be such a delightful upgrade for my hybrid
| digital/analog personal task management system. Right now I use
| an apple watch to capture tasks which then hackily route through
| a series of apps/endpoints to get to a thermal label printer, but
| that's just about the only thing I use the apple watch for.
|
| Having an affordable single purpose device like this could be
| much better -- how straightforward will it be to post
| transcriptions of the recorded messages to a webhook via the
| Index 01?
| allforJesse wrote:
| Update, answer is in the video at 20:30
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ArxhS4SQaP0&t=1230
|
| Sounds like the device will natively support sending the audio
| or transcription to any service you like.
| otikik wrote:
| Honestly a button on the watch seems like the way to go for me.
| spike021 wrote:
| I'd be curious what happens if you're the kind of person who
| wears a ring a bit more loosely and/or has slippery skin.
|
| That button isn't always going to be facing your thumb. Maybe you
| rotate it back with your thumb? Or you need to use your other
| hand anyway to rotate it?
| apparent wrote:
| For me, I'd rather use my Pebble to do this.
|
| > Initially, we experimented by building this as an app on
| Pebble, since it has a mic and I'm always wearing one. But, I
| realized quickly that this was suboptimal - it required me to use
| my other hand to press the button to start recording (lift-to-
| wake gestures and wake-words are too unreliable). This was tough
| to use while bicycling or carrying stuff.
|
| I guess I don't bicycle or carry stuff enough for this to matter.
| And often when my hands are full, I have my AirPods in and can
| just ask Siri (and cross my fingers that she'll understand).
|
| This seems neat, but I try to keep my life as simple as possible,
| which means not having a ring when I can use my watch/earbuds to
| do the same thing about 99% of the time.
| hahamrfunnyguy wrote:
| Something like this isn't very practical for me. I just pull out
| my phone and dictate or type when I need to take notes. If I
| can't pull out my phone, I probably have gloves on or am in a
| loud environment.
|
| A gesture on the watch that just starts the recorder seems a lot
| more practical, this ring just adds an unnecessary complication.
| Plus, $100 is a lot for something that they don't want you to
| service.
|
| I'd rather much have a lot of big programmable buttons on the
| watch itself and have a smaller display or a separate BLE remote
| with lots of buttons.
| modeless wrote:
| Hmm does it actually set reminders? Or does it just take a note
| and you have to manually set the reminder later? I would love
| this if it actually could create reminders like "remind me when I
| get home" etc. Otherwise I'm sure I'll never go back and look at
| notes I took.
|
| Edit: "It's converted to text on-device, then processed by an on-
| device large language model (LLM) which selects an action to take
| (create note, add to reminders, etc)." This is perfect!
| amatecha wrote:
| Random note to whoever put the Pebble blog together - you don't
| need 2-4 megabyte images inline in the article! Since the images
| are limited to ~544px wide, make thumbnails of that size rather
| than using the original full-size image inline. They already link
| to the full size so you're already halfway there.
| bluerooibos wrote:
| Now this is cool. Combined with localLLMs and some nice Obsidian
| integration of some sort, all away from Google and other Big Tech
| - this is the future of tech I want to see - not some centralized
| bullshit from Google or Meta.
| braincat31415 wrote:
| An interesting idea, but I look at it as yet another thing to
| make my life more complicated than it needs to be. A pen and
| paper, plus a mechanical watch have served me well so far.
| Ringz wrote:
| There are dozens of different watch batteries in various sizes
| available everywhere. Why not make the ring slightly larger and
| allow for battery replacement?
| dramm wrote:
| Oh look it's a Humane AI Pin without the AI, or rechargeable
| battery, or ...
|
| It's an app. It's an app that will run on somebody else's
| platform. Putting that in a ring has so marginal benefits (you
| can't find a phone or computer or notepad or... to record ideas
| and do it better) and has so many limitations. It's a non-
| starter.
| agloe_dreams wrote:
| I mean, this is a textbook over-simplifaction to devalue an
| idea. Hell, with that logic, you could call all kinds of things
| a non-starter.
|
| "Why buy a watch, it just shows the time on my phone" "Why buy
| a car, I can just use uber" "Why buy headphones? My phone has
| speakers."
|
| The context of where something is changes the idea of what it
| is. Just become something tells the time, for example, doesn't
| mean it is the same thing as a watch.
| dramm wrote:
| No it's text-book pointing out the bloody obvious. It's a
| voice memo app sitting in an ring with limited
| functionality/usefulness. You can tart that idea up however
| you want but it's an obvious limited value idea itself at
| it's core and it is _exactly_ the type of thing that will do
| better as an app on somebody else ' platform.
| toisanji wrote:
| This sounds kind of cool, but I'm more worried about the e-waste.
| A device that is cheap, will get "recycled", and sounds cool,
| will get a tiny amount of use after the initial wow factor wears
| off or doesn't fit the needs, then gets thrown away or lost. And
| is this feature in the new repebble watches? I would rather have
| it there with a bigger battery.
| evrenesat wrote:
| I'd be willing to pay around $100 for a rechargeable version with
| a battery life of around 24 hours and 2-3 minutes of usage.
| However, a single-use battery would only be acceptable to me at a
| much lower price point, such as $30-$40.
| rendx wrote:
| Regulation (EU) 2023/1542 of the European Parliament and of the
| Council of 12 July 2023 concerning batteries and waste batteries
|
| Article 11
|
| Removability and replaceability of portable batteries and LMT
| batteries
|
| 1. Any natural or legal person that places on the market products
| incorporating portable batteries shall ensure that those
| batteries are readily removable and replaceable by the end-user
| at any time during the lifetime of the product. That obligation
| shall only apply to entire batteries and not to individual cells
| or other parts included in such batteries.
|
| A portable battery shall be considered readily removable by the
| end-user where it can be removed from a product with the use of
| commercially available tools, without requiring the use of
| specialised tools, unless provided free of charge with the
| product, proprietary tools, thermal energy, or solvents to
| disassemble the product.
|
| Any natural or legal person that places on the market products
| incorporating portable batteries shall ensure that those products
| are accompanied with instructions and safety information on the
| use, removal and replacement of the batteries. Those instructions
| and that safety information shall be made available permanently
| online, on a publicly available website, in an easily
| understandable way for end-users.
|
| [...]
|
| https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX%3A...
|
| (This is active law; there is however a grace period for products
| until 2027.)
| bradleybuda wrote:
| Wow, sucks to bE yoU!
| 47282847 wrote:
| As a European, I actually fully support this regulation!
| ddoeth wrote:
| Me too, i hate that I would have to throw out a fully
| functioning device if the battery dies.
| jeremyjh wrote:
| I understand that sentiment but I think its arbitrary.
| People buy lots of products that don't have a useful life
| exceeding two years. For example, every pet toy ever
| sold. Some will have higher impact for manufacturing and
| disposal than this ring.
| kstrauser wrote:
| While I sympathize with the intent of the law, this is a great
| example of why it's dumb. There's no possible way you could
| make that ring, in a reasonably ring-sized form factor, with
| today's manufacturing processes in such a way that an end user
| could replace it.
| lemming wrote:
| If this law pushes back against the idea that it's ok to make
| endless tech products which are essentially future rubbish as
| soon as you buy them, then I think that's a good thing.
| Perhaps products like this just shouldn't exist until we have
| better ways of dealing with the remains.
| GolfPopper wrote:
| Yep. There's some strong "How dare they interfere with
| Thneed production!" energy.
| kstrauser wrote:
| The problem is that it makes it impossible to have a
| version 0 to iterate on until a whole lot of other
| industries have advanced. Imagine the situation of in-ear
| hearing aids: they shouldn't be allowed to exist until
| they're perfect, unless we're happy telling deaf people
| they _have_ to wear much larger than necessary devices and
| advertise their disability.
|
| I'm glad we're reducing e-waste. I'm not thrilled about the
| idea of saying you can't make a thing until 100% of the
| bugs are worked out, meaning you can't have a beta version
| for research and fundraising, meaning, you can't conjure
| the perfect version into existence.
| wing-_-nuts wrote:
| That's hyperbole and I think you know it. I'm pretty sure
| they explicitly exclude medical devices.
| kstrauser wrote:
| It's not hyperbole at all.
|
| Fortunately, your link basically says it doesn't apply to
| something you wear on your hands or arms:
|
| > By way of derogation from paragraph 1, the following
| products incorporating portable batteries may be designed
| in such a way as to make the battery removable and
| replaceable only by independent professionals:
|
| > (a) appliances specifically designed to operate
| primarily in an environment that is regularly subject to
| splashing water, water streams or water immersion, and
| that are intended to be washable or rinseable;
|
| But the only mention of "medical" comes right after it,
| and doesn't include hearing aids, future smart glasses,
| etc.:
|
| > (b) professional medical imaging and radiotherapy
| devices, as defined in Article 2, point (1), of
| Regulation (EU) 2017/745, and in vitro diagnostic medical
| devices, as defined in Article 2, point (2), of
| Regulation (EU) 2017/746.
|
| So ironically, the law allows disposable "junk devices"
| people are complaining about here, but doesn't allow
| factory-only serviceable hearing aids. How 'bout that? We
| can buy our smart rings and throw them away, but hearing
| aids will have to remain giant hunks of heavy plastic, or
| at least the models purchasable by average people who
| can't fly out of the EU to buy the good ones.
|
| Edit: It's easy to downvote. I cited the relevant law. If
| I'm wrong, cite other law that explains why.
| i_cannot_hack wrote:
| If you want more freedom to design medical devices for
| people where there is an actual need, it would easily be
| done by expanding the exception for medical devices that
| already exists in the law.
|
| If you think people to be able to sell unsustainable and
| mostly superfluous electronics because any improvements
| there might eventually trickle down to hearing aids, your
| argument is basically "we should accept the millions of
| tonnes of unnecessary e-waste in order to get slighly
| smaller hearing aids", which think many reasonable people
| would disagree with.
| cortesoft wrote:
| Who gets to choose what products are future rubbish?
|
| Even if you think this product is a waste of resources, why
| is THIS waste of resources something we should stop, but
| not other, bigger wastes? Should we outlaw flying somewhere
| when you could take a train? The fuel spent on a short
| flight wastes way more resources and damages the
| environment much more than this smart ring does. If we are
| willing to ban this piece of tech because it is a waste,
| couldn't the same arguments be made about a short range
| flight?
| mxkopy wrote:
| Sure, thanks for bringing it up. Short-range flights
| should have a higher higher threshold for permitted use
| in service of the environment.
|
| Please, ask more questions.
| maest wrote:
| You may find this a useful read:
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nirvana_fallacy
| jeremyjh wrote:
| If the battery lasts for two years its exceeding the useful
| life of many other products already, some of which of have
| higher environment cost for manufacturing and disposal.
|
| The law has chosen poor proxies for lifespan and impact.
| jfindper wrote:
| Yes, other things cause e-waste. Sometimes worse.
|
| That's not a good justification for more e-waste.
| kentiko wrote:
| Maybe it's the ring that is dumb?
| tacker2000 wrote:
| Its going to be interesting to see what will happen with
| Airpods and the like...
| fsh wrote:
| Apple will proudly announce that they've invented the
| replaceable battery.
| dmitrygr wrote:
| Good thing that there are plenty of markets outside of EU
| pedalpete wrote:
| We regularly get contacted by people in Europe who want to buy
| our product, but we haven't been providing support due to the
| cost of certs, and other regulatory needs (medical/wellness
| device).
|
| We want to help people in the EU, but with laws like
| replaceable batteries, it's going to push us further and
| further away from being able to do that.
|
| Our product is designed to be refurbished, but not user-
| replaceable.
|
| At the same time, how many products do people give up on
| because of battery life, and is this a non-issue with future
| battery chemistries?
|
| Do people replace their phones because the battery isn't good
| anymore, or is it more likely they've broken the screen,
| cameras, etc to the point where it doesn't make sense to
| replace those anymore? Or they just want the newest thing?
| maest wrote:
| > Our product is designed to be refurbished, but not user-
| replaceable.
|
| Why?
| Tempest1981 wrote:
| Design inherently involves trade-offs. Size, weight, cost,
| water resistance, etc.
| munchler wrote:
| There's an exception for "appliances specifically designed to
| operate primarily in an environment that is regularly subject
| to splashing water, water streams or water immersion, and that
| are intended to be washable or rinseable". This ring is
| described as water-resistant, so I wonder if it would be
| allowed?
| afandian wrote:
| > at any time during the lifetime of the product
|
| Eric said that the lifetime of the product is 'up to years'.
| Presumably because that's the limitation imposed by a
| disposable battery.
|
| I wonder if the circular reasoning would fly in the EU.
| itissid wrote:
| Oh I love this. I am going to contextually switch the
| instructions from this to my home trained instruction fine tuned
| LLM for doing a multitude of things.
| itissid wrote:
| Could this record like a morse code(ish) like clicks instead of
| speaking? I can find a number of use cases for it:
|
| 1. Distress/Emergency makes you Unable to speak.
|
| 2. While doing vipassana meditation to record how strong the
| feeling attached to a thought was.
|
| 3. Repeat previous action.
| infotainment wrote:
| Wow, uh, it's kind of astounding how poorly Eric is reading the
| room there.
|
| A weird disposable(!) voice recorder ring seems to go against
| pretty much all of the "open and repairable" image that the
| Pebble brand has been cultivating.
|
| This product should probably have been "Core" branded and kept on
| a different website entirely. Its very existence seems kind of
| toxic to the Pebble brand, IMO.
| r0fl wrote:
| How are there this many different comments? What is there to say
| other than a one time use recording product in 2026 is insane!
| lawn wrote:
| I really like a lot of this but I have to agree with the other
| comments that are complaining about the non-rechargable, non-
| replaceable battery.
|
| I would actually prefer a device that's twice as expensive but
| with a battery that you can charge or replace.
| eichin wrote:
| I've wanted exactly this since I first saw spider's note-recorder
| in the first issue of Transmetropolitan ( _before_ the fancy
| glasses.) Just something with exactly one button, positive
| confirmation that it 's recording, a decent pipeline into my
| private infosphere, and safe to use while driving.
|
| But in 2025, the disposable aspect is a crime... and wouldn't you
| be able to use the body of the ring to interface with an
| inductive charger?
| luis_journey wrote:
| I think that this is different than the products we had before
| like bee. Because it's more only when you really need it and not
| the whole time.
| Ninjaneered wrote:
| I'd love to have a ring that incorporates Yubikey like NFC
| functionality, I was worried it could allow login when I didn't
| intend it, but the idea of a switch might work. Having a USD
| dongle for hardware that doesn't support NFC but can negotiate
| the handshake between my ring and the device could work.
|
| I'd buy a ring with just authentication, if it was rechargeable
| and did a few other things (pulse, sleep monitoring, etc.) even
| better, but the bare bones would be amazing so I could have
| something I wear for my authentication.
| realo wrote:
| Any Oura people reading this? That would warrant a 50$ to 75$
| up sale , at least.
|
| I would buy that oura-security ring in a heartbeat.
| pedalpete wrote:
| I wonder why they added this to the finger rather than adding
| this capability to the watches they are already making? One
| handed operation is one reason, though I'd think a UX could be
| designed to make this an app on the watch, rather than a stand-
| alone device.
|
| Seems like overkill, particularly when other rings do bio-metric
| tracking, so is this focused on a big enough problem to want to
| solve?
| plaidphantom wrote:
| They explicitly address this in the article:
|
| "Initially, we experimented by building this as an app on
| Pebble, since it has a mic and I'm always wearing one. But, I
| realized quickly that this was suboptimal - it required me to
| use my other hand to press the button to start recording (lift-
| to-wake gestures and wake-words are too unreliable). This was
| tough to use while bicycling or carrying stuff."
|
| This interacts directly with the Pebble App, so I would be
| shocked if the watches never get an equivalent app.
| websiteapi wrote:
| I wish there was a device that just recorded and transcribed all
| the time and sent it to my phone, with time stamps, and then you
| could take action on that.
| smeej wrote:
| I think I'm as interested in it from a pure "button that's always
| with me" perspective. I already have my original Amazfit Bip
| watch configured to send a "track back" signal to Snipd via
| Gadgetbridge to snip podcast notes while I'm driving or washing
| dishes or whatever. And I've configured a basic Bluetooth remote
| camera shutter to turn pages forward and backward in KOReader on
| my Onyx Boox Poke 2 Color so I can read it on a stand while
| riding a stationary bike under my desk.
|
| In other words, I am apparently exactly the kind of weirdo who
| would use the heck out of something like this!
| kristianp wrote:
| I'd be more worried that a replacement product wouldn't be
| available after 2 years of use. 2 years seems quite good for a
| small product.
|
| As a tangential question, how do people find the new pebbles? I
| prefer a smartwatch that lasts more than a couple of days.
| greenwallnorway wrote:
| I've written many variations of my own "quick, take a note!" app,
| and they all succumb to the same problem: I can't safely write a
| note when I'm in a car.
|
| Driving by myself and listening to podcasts is when I have so
| many thoughts I want to write down.
|
| I'll give this a serious consider.
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