[HN Gopher] Chainalysis Successful Deanonymization Attack on Monero
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Chainalysis Successful Deanonymization Attack on Monero
Author : Anon84
Score : 55 points
Date : 2025-11-29 12:26 UTC (10 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (darkwebinformer.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (darkwebinformer.com)
| embedding-shape wrote:
| It always seemed weird from Day 1 when I reviewed Monero vs Zcash
| to rely on anonymization that depends on other nodes and number
| of honest peers, instead of relying on technical anonymization
| that Zcash does, seems much more reliable and long-term workable,
| even though it was much harder and took them longer to arrive at
| good solutions.
| pclmulqdq wrote:
| If Zcash had privacy by default, they would have won against
| Monero for being the private cryptocurrency. As it stands, any
| private transaction on the Zcash chain stands out like a sore
| thumb and the use of de-anonymized transactions around it make
| it easy to figure out how much money was moved. It was a missed
| layer 8 opportunity on the part of Zcash.
|
| This attack doesn't seem to work if you run a monero node,
| though.
| embedding-shape wrote:
| You'd have a bit more credibility if your complaint was more
| up to date :) Zcash wallets have defaulted to shielded
| accounts and transactions for some time already.
| pclmulqdq wrote:
| It took at least half a decade if not a full decade to get
| to the obvious place and I (and everyone else) wrote Zcash
| off in that time.
| vosper wrote:
| You said
|
| > As it stands, any private transaction on the Zcash
| chain stands out like a sore thumb
|
| Is that actually still the case or has the change to
| defaults made anonymity more common?
| pclmulqdq wrote:
| If you look at recent mined blocks, a majority of
| transactions are still public. So yes, even if the
| default is shielded wallets and private transactions for
| a specific wallet, most of the chain is not using them.
| DennisP wrote:
| True, but as of this month 30% of zcash transactions are
| shielded, and 20-25% of addresses are private. That's a
| fairly large anonymity set. The percentage of shielded
| transactions is also increasing, at a rate that will make
| them a majority within a year if the trend continues.
|
| https://www.coindesk.com/research/inside-zcash-encrypted-
| mon...
| embedding-shape wrote:
| > and I (and everyone else) wrote Zcash off in that time
|
| Seemingly in the ecosystem you exists in yeah, but in the
| world at large Zcash seems to have at least 6x the
| volume. I guess "everyone else" didn't get your memo.
| Regardless, I don't really care personally which one is
| better or which one you specifically use, as long as what
| we say is being truthful :)
| pclmulqdq wrote:
| Are you referring to on-exchange volume of a coin that
| has pumped 10x in a few months? And it's only 6x the on-
| exchange volume of monero? It sounds like people still
| don't use it. If you look at the blockchain, you will see
| very few transactions per block (literally less than one
| per minute), so it seems the volume is almost entirely on
| the exchanges. It's probably people speculating on
| privacy for some reason, combined with some dumping of
| the pre-mine.
|
| The majority of the on-chain use is also public
| transactions, so it seems the "privacy by default"
| setting doesn't really matter.
| monero-xmr wrote:
| I know (and many others do as well, it's not that hidden)
| of the group that pumped Zcash. Very well executed pump
| pjdkoch wrote:
| September 17, 2024
| kobieps wrote:
| surprising how often this happens...
| RandomBacon wrote:
| Monero's main "competitor" seems to be Zcash which is run by
| a VC-backed company. The company gets 20% of all mined Zcash.
| The incentive is very strong to FUD Monero.
|
| As of this comment, Monero is #26 on CoinGecko's list of
| crypto by marketcap with Zcash at #27. I'm guessing that's
| why there's a few of these posts on HN all of a sudden.
| kobieps wrote:
| Sure, but I more meant people recycling year old news for
| clicks, and smart people falling for it. That's a very
| broad phenomenon and not tied to crypto.
| nunobrito wrote:
| This isn't deanonymization, it is modifying and infiltrating
| nodes to then listen what is happening from naive users
| connecting to them.
|
| There was never an expectation of privacy when you connect to
| servers outside your control with non-encrypted data. That is the
| reason why the article itself mentions that this isn't working
| when running your own node, as most people do.
|
| This is the same thing as complaining that Monero is no longer
| anonymous because Windows is capturing screenshots and keyboard
| presses when you open the desktop app.
|
| Monero remains anonymous by default.
| dodomodo wrote:
| In practice they (allegedly) took anonymouse transaction and
| linked it to real world identity. Call it what you want.
| fruitworks wrote:
| The transaction wasn't really anonymouse in the first place,
| but I agree that the UI should warn users more when working
| in "light wallet" mode.
| abecedarius wrote:
| > running your own node, as most people do.
|
| Huh, surprising -- it's _very_ different from most people using
| most software. (Of course HN is not most people.)
|
| I tried to fill myself in by asking Claude Opus neutrally "do
| most users of Monero run their own node?" and was told it
| couldn't find good data, it's community-promoted behavior, but
| there were multiple reasons for skepticism.
|
| I have no idea, I'm just noting my surprise.
| krior wrote:
| I don't know what asking AI adds to the discussion.
| ianbutler wrote:
| Well reading comprehension tells us they were surprised
| that most monero folks run their own nodes and that they
| were unable to find supporting information.
|
| Your comment however does actually add nothing.
| wizzwizz4 wrote:
| No, reading comprehension tells us that Claude Opus
| output the "unable to find supporting information" claim,
| which abecedarius faithfully relayed to us. There's no
| evidence in the text that suggests abecedarius attempted
| to find supporting information.
| ianbutler wrote:
| Okay and if they had said Google we wouldn't be doing
| this dance, people just hate AI and its obnoxious to see
| comments about it on HN all the time. On a crypto post no
| less.
|
| We get it you guys don't like AI, next!
|
| It is equally obnoxious to people who talk about AI for
| everything as if it is a savior, it's a tool use it or
| don't.
| shmel wrote:
| It's literally in their FAQ: https://www.getmonero.org/get-
| started/faq/
|
| Anyone curious about how Monero is implemented would
| immediately understand why it's a bad idea to use remote
| nodes.
|
| >What is the difference between a lightweight and a normal
| wallet?
|
| >For a lightweight wallet, you give your view key to a node,
| who scans the blockchain and looks for incoming transactions
| to your account on your behalf. This node will know when you
| receive money, but it will not know how much you receive, who
| you received it from, or who you are sending money to.
| Depending on your wallet software, you may be able to use a
| node you control to avoid privacy leaks. For more privacy,
| use a normal wallet, which can be used with your own node.
| nunobrito wrote:
| Most people don't know nor use Monero at all.
|
| Most monero users are on the desktop where the common
| practice is to download and run their own nodes and/or use
| monero from Android on apps like CakeWallet, where their node
| is used and assumed as trustworthy.
|
| To give background info: most users are on desktops because
| monero mining happens using CPU and instead of GPU, so they
| install the wallet which comes with a miner included and
| installs the node as well. They basically make some little
| income every single day and accumulate that profit.
|
| The other miners like GuPax also install a node on the local
| computer as well, so a large majority of users simply runs
| nodes locally because they don't want to send their hashes to
| remote nodes which might fool them.
| bhouston wrote:
| So chainalysis is working for governments now? I guess it makes
| sense.
| MadsRC wrote:
| Now? Chainalysis has always worked for governments...
|
| It was basically spawned out of the government needing help
| with investigating crypto - I think it was Mt. Gox...
| Anon84 wrote:
| Exactly. "Tracers in the Dark" (https://a.co/d/aos3Nka) does
| a good job of telling that story and a couple of others from
| the early days of blockchain analytics
| walletdrainer wrote:
| Chainanalysis is certainly not running the Tor attack as
| described here.
|
| It's technically possible, but not really practical. We'd have
| seen darknet markets as they currently exist eradicated a long
| ago.
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(page generated 2025-11-29 23:01 UTC)