[HN Gopher] Tesla's "Mad Max" mode is now under federal scrutiny
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Tesla's "Mad Max" mode is now under federal scrutiny
Author : asplake
Score : 62 points
Date : 2025-10-26 16:48 UTC (6 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (arstechnica.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (arstechnica.com)
| Centigonal wrote:
| Either it's overhyped marketing, or Tesla has automated
| aggressive A-hole driving. I don't like either option.
| vichle wrote:
| In Sweden, Tesla is the new BMW. It attracts aggressive A-hole
| drivers, so no need to automate it.
| paradox460 wrote:
| Soon enough Tesla will be omitting turn signals to save on
| manufacturing costs
| potato3732842 wrote:
| Can you ship some over here? Seems like if I want to get
| through a light before it turns red I find myself betting on
| the lane with the work van or heavy truck in stack rather
| than the one with the Tesla somewhere in the mix. In any sane
| world it'd be the opposite.
| pavel_lishin wrote:
| > _Mad Max_
|
| Fellas, the "Torment Nexus" tweet was supposed to be a joke.
| ocdtrekkie wrote:
| This is one of those things where if we had a normal functioning
| regulatory environment, Elon Musk would be in jail long before he
| got this obvious. Having an "Autopilot" mode people get killed by
| because it doesn't actually drive the car should've been plenty.
| noir_lord wrote:
| Agreed but we are through the looking glass at this point.
| monerozcash wrote:
| There has to be some acceptable maximum rate at which your
| products can kill people, and Tesla's autopilot is probably
| below that rate.
| barnabee wrote:
| Thinks aren't magically legal just as long they don't kill
| "too many" people.
| gambiting wrote:
| I keep using this as an example - the Therac mechines for
| radiotherapy undoubtedly saved lives. They also undoubtedly
| administered radiation treatment better, faster and more
| accurately than any manual operator could have done.
|
| And yet, they all got recalled when we realized they
| "sometimes" administer a lethal dose of radiation by mistake.
| Or do you think they should have continued operating? What
| was the "acceptable maximum rate at which your products can
| kill people" for them? Because I'd argue it's zero. And it
| should be zero for Teslas or any cars that have something
| called "autopilot".
| appreciatorBus wrote:
| You would need more than one rate: - percentage of product
| owner operators who are killed by the product they
| own/operate per year - number of other people killed by the
| median product owner per year - inflation adjusted property
| damage (belonging to other people, or to the public/govt)
| caused by the median product owner per year
|
| Regulating products based on the potential to kill, maim, or
| injure, is not a terrible idea.
|
| It's why we require more training of people who fly 747, then
| people who operate cars.
|
| But if it was going to work, we'd have to do it without carve
| outs - if it only applies to some products, then it's really
| just politics.
|
| If Tesla's auto pilot is really so safe that it needs little
| or no regulation, then by definition, regular cars are so
| dangerous that they should be banned or require much more
| regulation. But I only ever hear the first half of this
| argument, which makes me worry this is not really an argument
| about safety.
| lotsofpulp wrote:
| Autopilot in planes also doesn't actually pilot the plane gate
| to gate. That name actually seems consistent with the plane use
| of autopilot, as Autopilot in a Tesla merely follows the lane
| markings and keeps distance from the car in front.
| cosmicgadget wrote:
| Care to list the major functions of autopilot in airplanes
| and the Tesla equivalent?
| lotsofpulp wrote:
| I have no expertise in piloting or the details of autopilot
| in a plane, except that it does not fly the plane gate to
| gate, however it does assist the pilot in mundane tasks,
| such as cruising at altitude and following a path. Maybe
| modern ones land/take off, I don't know, but a pilot is
| still required for many crucial tasks as far as I know.
|
| Which is what the Autopilot function does in a Tesla, so I
| find it to not be a misleading name.
| gambiting wrote:
| Except that obviously the difference is that plane pilots are
| rigourously tested, certified, and they have their every
| action including their voice recorded while they operate the
| plane, and they are held accountable with legally required
| self reporting for any mistakes no matter how innocent. There
| is no such scrutiny with car drivers, in fact in some places
| in the world you can operate a car with zero formal training
| and a short form test that tests bare fundamentals and
| nothing else - to expect such a driver to take the same level
| of care and attention as a commercial pilot when operating a
| Tesla in autopilot mode is....wishful thinking at best.
|
| But sure, Tesla's autopilot is the same as a plane autopilot
| in all the other respects.
| lotsofpulp wrote:
| >to expect such a driver to take the same level of care and
| attention as a commercial pilot when operating a Tesla in
| autopilot mode is....wishful thinking at best.
|
| This is irrelevant to the branding. Just as autopilot in a
| plane assists pilots in ideal conditions, Autopilot mode in
| a Tesla assists drivers in ideal conditions.
|
| As an aside, Autopilot mode in Tesla monitors the driver's
| eyes to ensure they are looking at the road, and quite a
| few steps are taken to ensure drivers know that it is not a
| self driving feature, but merely assisted driving. Again,
| the broader point being that autopilot is not known to fly
| planes end to end, so there should be no confusion due to
| the name that Autopilot in a Tesla will drive end to end.
| trehalose wrote:
| > Again, the broader point being that autopilot is not
| known to fly planes end to end
|
| Is the public broadly aware of that?
|
| There's a colloquial phrase in American English, "to be
| on autopilot", meaning when a person acts without
| awareness of what they're doing, often used when somebody
| makes a stupid mistake during a lapse of attention.
| gambiting wrote:
| >>As an aside, Autopilot mode in Tesla monitors the
| driver's eyes to ensure they are looking at the road, and
| quite a few steps are taken to ensure drivers know that
| it is not a self driving feature
|
| And as many, many, many videos of pornhub attest, you can
| do plenty of other activities for a long time without
| autopilot giving a crap. Maybe that's the drivers messing
| with the sensors somehow, but it's obviously possible.
|
| >>Autopilot mode in a Tesla assists drivers in ideal
| conditions.
|
| That sounds like an absolute cop out if you don't mind me
| saying so. It's not how the feature is perceived, and
| again it goes back to what I said earlier - drivers
| should have to receive actual, real sit-down-with-a-book
| training to use this feature.
| beefnugs wrote:
| Isn't it kind of dumb that only after something like this hits
| world wide distributed news does anyone investigate anything?
| lux-lux-lux wrote:
| The feature was only available this month
| rsynnott wrote:
| As far as I can see they rolled it out without any warning,
| and, well, presumably without asking the regulators.
| hydrogen7800 wrote:
| I find myself asking "how is this legal" several times a day
| lately. Why does "tech" get to stress-test long standing rules
| and norms? It's an attitude of "I dare you to regulate us". I'm
| remembering a comment on HN a week or so ago . To paraphrase:
| "thing, but from the internet".
| ricardobeat wrote:
| The article says it "speeds" but provides no sources or
| evidence, you might want to take that with a grain of salt.
|
| Here's a video of the new mode, it seems pretty normal, you
| wouldn't bat an eye to a friend driving in the exact same way:
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C8uIPsaF-yY
|
| Not that I would trust it with my life at this point in time,
| but the claims do seem exaggerated.
| tacitusarc wrote:
| There is effectively 0 traffic to contend with in that video.
| I do not see how you could reasonably claim that video should
| alleviate fears about unsafe behavior.
| johnisgood wrote:
| How could they think that this is a good idea? Baffling.
| cosmicgadget wrote:
| Influencers will post about it and that will resuscitate their
| brand. Somehow.
| dimal wrote:
| "Move fast and break things" is taking on a very literal meaning.
| cosmicgadget wrote:
| Does this mode comply with state traffic regulations like follow
| distance and lane change protocol?
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