[HN Gopher] U.S. alcohol consumption drops to a 90-year low, new...
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U.S. alcohol consumption drops to a 90-year low, new poll finds
Author : littlexsparkee
Score : 57 points
Date : 2025-08-13 17:20 UTC (5 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.sfchronicle.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.sfchronicle.com)
| thinkmassive wrote:
| http://archive.today/ncezH
| lagniappe wrote:
| Casinos are also seeing a similar drop
| FirmwareBurner wrote:
| Why go to a casino to loose money, when you can loose money
| betting on Polymarket/Crypto online from your phone anywhere
| you are?
| Analemma_ wrote:
| That's not a positive development: it's because casinos are
| getting replaced by sports betting on your phone, which is much
| much worse.
| trollski wrote:
| dont forget the casinoization of the stock market
| wcunning wrote:
| Also they've been bought out by private equity an prices have
| shot through the roof -- Vegas is seeing massive downturns in
| tourism and from my cursory following of the problem, it's
| all price increases on food, booze, travel, hotels on the
| Strip making people uninterested in going.
| dlachausse wrote:
| I think it's also the lack of disposable income to gamble with.
| tokioyoyo wrote:
| "Why gamble in Vegas, when you can do it from your phone in
| NYC?".
|
| There's a significant devaluation of "in-person fun", and
| it's sad to see.
| bdcravens wrote:
| I can only speak to my personal experience, in Vegas, but the
| electronic machines have become pretty unfriendly to casual
| players who just want to enjoy themselves. Gone are the true
| 1-25 cent machines, replaced with games that pretty much
| require you to wager dollars at a time. Plus Vegas has gotten
| more entertainment oriented over time, so that the casinos
| really aren't that interesting anymore. The trend away from
| smoking probably plays a role, with few casino floors being
| smoke-free.
| charcircuit wrote:
| Water exists and is much healthier, cheaper, and tastier than
| many other drinks. It's just a shame so many restaurants ruin it
| by putting ice in it and chilling it.
| cpursley wrote:
| You're getting downvoted, but most of the time I prefer room
| temperature water.
| ramenmeal wrote:
| probably downvoted because it doesn't really add to the
| conversation.
| dlachausse wrote:
| You can always ask your server for room temperature water as
| long as you're okay with drinking tap.
| nerdjon wrote:
| I mean... I am not drinking alcohol because I am thirsty...
|
| Often I have both in front of me. It isnt a one or the other
| situation.
| subjectsigma wrote:
| Why even post this?
| charcircuit wrote:
| Because I have never had the desire to buy alcohol since
| there is a superior alternative. I am providing context on
| why me and many others are contributing to the fall of the
| statistic.
| Larrikin wrote:
| Then post it on your blog, nobody actually wants your
| thoughts on why you think you're superior for not enjoying
| one of the most common beverages in human history.
| charcircuit wrote:
| Posting about not drinking alcohol in a thread about not
| drinking alcohol is on topic. Don't enter such a thread
| if you don't want to see such comments.
| littlexsparkee wrote:
| Found myself cutting back, too. I drink beer and usually have 1-2
| at a time - any more and the flavors just get muddled. It's
| water, tea, coffee for me most of the time (added benefit of
| polyphenols, antioxidants for those brewed drinks). If I drank
| more, I would be too worried about handicapping my intellect.
| jauntywundrkind wrote:
| I love tea, but because of the caffeine I think of it as a
| morning/afternoon enjoyment.
|
| It'd be lovely to have more evening refreshments. I have
| various mixers for seltzer water, which helps. Also just
| drinking less liquids at night probably helps some with
| sleeping in general but I really like having something to sip
| on.
| littlexsparkee wrote:
| There's always tisanes like rooibos and herbs (mint, etc). I
| read that with regular consumption of caffeine you don't tend
| to notice it anymore (sensitivity aside) which has been my
| experience. It helps my workouts and getting up but I've
| never felt like I needed it or it keeps me up (still try to
| not have it past 3 or 4pm). Agree on tapering liquids near
| bedtime.
| dskrenta wrote:
| I love drinking Rooibos at night as a replacement for tea,
| highly recommend. Various flavored options available too.
| doublepg23 wrote:
| I've been making cold brew tea during this summer and sipping
| on that.
|
| 3-4 decaf black tea bags for a body, 2 or so random herbal
| teas for flavor all tossed in a large tea jug in the fridge
| overnight.
| coffeecoders wrote:
| Meanwhile daily or near-daily marijuana use has increased by 269%
| from 2008 to 2022.[1]
|
| [1] https://www.statista.com/statistics/611714/marijuana-use-
| dur...
| thinkingtoilet wrote:
| I wonder how much of that is honesty in reporting? No doubt the
| wave of legalization has increase usage massively, but I sure
| as shit wouldn't have told a random poll in the 2010s about my
| illegal marijuana use. I didn't even tell my doctor for fear of
| it ending up in a chart somewhere.
| taeric wrote:
| No doubt it is not a 100% accurate poll. But hard to think it
| hasn't gone up? If only from the legal sales numbers.
|
| More, you'd be surprised at how many people would have told
| pollsters, even in 2010s, that they were doing things like
| this.
| bediger4000 wrote:
| > you'd be surprised at how many people would have told
| pollsters
|
| Yeah, when my son was in middle school, they ran a poll. I
| was surprised by how many kids at his school had artificial
| limbs. Terrible carnage, just terrible.
| altairprime wrote:
| It's a more effective misery suppressant per dollar than a
| drink, and is much less likely to result in humiliating or
| violent outbursts when overconsumed. Little surprise it's
| supplanted booze, then, when fewer each year can afford the
| romanticism of a cocktail bar.
| strangescript wrote:
| shh, you are going to upset people that think drinking is evil
| and cutting it has no draw backs
| linotype wrote:
| It's not evil, it's just bad for you. A 5 mg edible a couple
| times a month is going to be a way better for someone than
| drinking multiple times a week.
| toomuchtodo wrote:
| No deaths have ever been reported from an overdose on
| Marijuana [1], and about 10k people a year die from DUI
| deaths in the US [2]. There is no safe level of alcohol
| consumption [3] [4]. There is strong evidence alcohol use
| leads to cancer [5].
|
| [1] https://www.dea.gov/factsheets/marijuana
|
| [2] https://www.nhtsa.gov/risky-driving/drunk-driving
|
| [3] https://www.who.int/europe/news/item/04-01-2023-no-level-
| of-...
|
| [4] https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.05.10.212569
| 31v...
|
| [5] https://www.cancer.gov/about-cancer/causes-
| prevention/risk/a...
| WillPostForFood wrote:
| So what's the safe level of driving on Marijuana? If people
| just switch from one drug to another that's no improvement.
| nerdjon wrote:
| I do wish that this was something talked about more, I
| know there have been studies supposedly showing there is
| not a correlation but that doesn't make any sense to me.
| I know there have been several times that I have been
| stoned enough that I would not want to drive.
|
| Doesn't mean it should not be legal or anything, but I
| also don't think we should disregard it.
| toomuchtodo wrote:
| _The Effect of Cannabis Compared With Alcohol on Driving_
| - https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1080/10550490902
| 78693... | https://doi.org/10.1080/10550490902786934
|
| _Medical cannabis and automobile accidents: Evidence
| from auto insurance_ -
| https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/hec.4553 |
| https://doi.org/10.1002/hec.4553
| leptons wrote:
| >It's impossible to overdose on Marijuana, and about 10k
| people a year die from DUI deaths in the US.
|
| It's definitely possible to overdose on edible marijuana,
| and it's not even that difficult to do.
| toomuchtodo wrote:
| Comment was edited to reflect no reports of death from
| overdose. You might have an unpleasant experience, but
| you aren't going to die.
| softwaredoug wrote:
| Well we are leaving a massive microbrewery/winery bubble where
| everyone had a cousin opening a brewery in the 2010s. At the
| same time marijuana usage is slowly becoming legal. So I might
| expect the relative change to be quite large.
| mrtksn wrote:
| Hence the virginity rates. Weed replacing alcohol is a tragedy.
| Lonelier people in healthier bodies with rotting brains.
| amanaplanacanal wrote:
| Alcohol causes more brain damage than cannabis, if that's
| what you are talking about. And I doubt lowering inhibitions
| so that people have sex they wouldn't normally have had
| seems... Bad.
|
| On the other hand, if this was supposed to be funny, carry
| on!
| mrtksn wrote:
| Who cares, the civilization came to this point with the
| damage. Young people need to stop being brain damage-free
| lonely sad antisocial virgins who hate the world and
| everything. Get the brain damage have the healthy society.
| k_g_b_ wrote:
| Sure, let's just ignore all the issues that widespread
| alcohol abuse bring to societies and call them healthy.
| Who cares, I'm living a good life with alcohol, so
| everyone suffering from or seeing the side effects and
| abstaining is just an antisocial virgin.
|
| What a ridiculous take.
| hellisothers wrote:
| I'm not sure I buy this, from anecdotal evidence of friends
| who have 1-2 drinks a day vs those who have let's say a
| similar amount of weed a day... the friends who drink are
| vastly more functional.
|
| Arguably the friends who drink are indistinguishable from
| people who don't aside from maybe some weight gain if it's
| all beer. My weed friends though, you can tell they're not
| doing as great, on or off weed.
| mensetmanusman wrote:
| Yeah weed will have another pendulum swing in 5 years.
| atsushin wrote:
| There was a pretty good Kurzgesagt video posted earlier today on
| alcohol in general: https://youtu.be/aOwmt39L2IQ
|
| The shift in perception of alcohol is certainly a good sign. Even
| outside of the health benefits, a night out at the bar is
| expensive now (at least on the East Coast) and honestly speaking
| other drugs are simply more cost-effective. I still have the
| occasional cocktail when going out with friends but now that I'm
| focused more on my overall fitness I find less of a reason to
| drink now. Still love the vibe of bars and pubs though.
|
| Anecdotally knowing that club drugs like ketamine and 2c-b are
| gaining popularity, I wonder whether young people may be turning
| onto substances like those now or if in general Gen-Z prefers to
| abstain entirely.
| chiffre01 wrote:
| Anecdotally it seems like alcohol is being replaced with weed
| or other things. But it doesn't bode well for the future of
| mental health if social drinking is being replaced with solo
| drug use or just solo everything.
| taeric wrote:
| Yeah, I have a hard time thinking this is specifically a good
| thing. A better relationship with drinking is not something
| to argue against, of course. But I find the dysfunction in so
| many people that take a strong stance against it rather hard
| to ignore, as well.
| amanaplanacanal wrote:
| _if_. Other drug use can be just as social as alcohol
| consumption.
| oldmanhorton wrote:
| And also, a decent chunk of alcohol consumption must be
| solo? I'd bet alcohol is broadly more social, but I would
| also wonder if that would change if more public gathering
| places served weed in some form.
| OkayPhysicist wrote:
| Since opium dens fell out of favor, the only psychoactive
| substances that have dedicated social spaces are booze
| (bars, nightclubs) and nicotine (hookah lounges, cigar
| clubs). This _could_ change, but it hasn 't yet. It sure
| seems like society's just swinging antisocial.
| xnx wrote:
| > the only psychoactive substances that have dedicated
| social spaces are booze (bars, nightclubs) and nicotine
| (hookah lounges, cigar clubs)
|
| caffeine (cafes)
| OkayPhysicist wrote:
| Maybe it's just where I live, but cafes and coffee shops
| no longer have the expectation of being open to
| conversation with strangers.
| epolanski wrote:
| I think you have a point. While I drink mostly in company,
| and rarely if ever alone, I do consume weed mostly alone.
|
| Also, as it makes me tired, it also makes me less incline to
| go out and meet people.
|
| Those, and other reasons generally push me against consuming
| it more than few times an year.
| calmbonsai wrote:
| I guess I'm odd in that I enjoy alcohol both ways.
|
| I love a good novel paired with a whisky for an solo
| evening in, pints with 'da boyz at the pub, and food &
| winery tours with couples and friends.
| atsushin wrote:
| The lack of IRL 'third places' for young people to meet
| locally will only exacerbate the issue -- and probably should
| bear most of the blame. The car-centric infrastructure of the
| suburbs (well, the vast majority of America) encourages
| isolation and asocial behavior. It really sucks that for
| some, their lives will never go beyond that invisible cage.
| _DeadFred_ wrote:
| When I was young we lived just as spread out. We just
| biked/skateboarded to places. We stashed our surf boards at
| the closest house to the beach. We made third spaces
| happen.
|
| Why has that stopped being an option? Is it because
| people's parents are too scared to let them do it when they
| are young (we were taking public busses to downtown Santa
| Cruz in junior high but we were latch key 80s/90s kids with
| zero oversite) and so they don't realize it's an option
| when they are older or?
| aaronbaugher wrote:
| My town still has quite a few third places (the mall,
| bowling alleys, bars, etc.) and even some new ones like a
| trampoline place. Most of them are struggling because the
| young people don't go out. Go into a corner bar on a
| Saturday night, and you'll see more people in their 50s
| than 20s. The pool league that used to run 6 divisions a
| week is now down to 2.
|
| So as far as I can tell, people (especially the young)
| stopped going out, and _then_ third places started going
| away.
| Gigachad wrote:
| I just went a looked up my closest bowling alley. 4
| people, 2 games mid day Saturday and it was $180 AUD.
|
| It's not surprisingly a large chunk of Gen Z are choosing
| to stay at home when it costs that much to go out.
| weinzierl wrote:
| Quite to the contrary. A big part of alcohol use is group
| pressure. Much better for everyone if people enjoy their
| drugs alone.
| OkayPhysicist wrote:
| The entire upside of alcohol use is social lubrication.
| Frankly, I think our society could benefit from a bit more
| peer pressure.
| littlexsparkee wrote:
| You can get the social upside with adaptogens which are
| increasingly showing up in canned drinks or drinking kava
| with friends. Alcohol doesn't have a monopoly on that.
| OkayPhysicist wrote:
| We could, but we don't. Alcohol currently has a defacto
| monopoly on lubricated social spaces. Distant second is
| nicotine. Nothing else comes anywhere close.
| thewebguyd wrote:
| > being replaced with solo drug use or just solo everything.
|
| Solo everything is definitely happening. People are getting
| priced out, and the third place
| (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_place) has pretty much
| disappeared everywhere.
|
| Gen Z is considered the loneliest generation, and its easy to
| see why. COVID messed things up too, and there's a lot of
| kids and young adults that have not been properly socialized.
|
| And since you have to spend, increasingly large amounts, of
| money just to go out with friends, people will just stay home
| instead. Maybe that looks like chatting on discord while
| playing a game together, but increasingly its looking like
| solo activities.
| zevon wrote:
| I find this dichotomy a bit strange. A lot of people consume
| alcohol alone and in many cases this ends up badly for them
| (no need to speculate about foreboding - the body (and the
| bodies) of evidence is readily available). Cannabis can be
| very common in and around social settings, depending on where
| you are in the world. Other drugs are also pretty much
| everywhere, including social spaces. They are just more
| invisible due to their illegality.
| margalabargala wrote:
| > the body (and the bodies) of evidence is readily
| available
|
| My understanding is that the evidence suggests that light
| social drinkers tend to be healthier and live longer than
| people who drink not at all.
| zevon wrote:
| Which was not at all what I was taking about, or am I
| missing a point?
| Gigachad wrote:
| That's just people who have friends and socialise are
| healthier. There are only negative health effects from
| alcohol itself.
|
| If you went out to all those same events and just drank
| non alcoholic drinks you'd be healthier.
| trashface wrote:
| When I replaced social drinking with solo drinking, I
| actually drank less (and at a slower pace). Without
| exception, every bad hangover I've had was from social
| drinking.
| staplers wrote:
| NA beers and cocktails are becoming more common at bars and
| restaurants, which helps dramatically if you are shifting
| lifestyles.
|
| You can still go out with friends and enjoy festivities while
| "blending in". People are often more caged if they're drinking
| and you're not and that subtle camouflage can help alleviate
| that social awkwardness.
| OkayPhysicist wrote:
| Substance use is dropping precipitously, because partying and
| socialization writ large are dropping. The people who party are
| still drinking, they're really not the ones driving these
| decreases.
|
| Alcohol's primary purpose in our society is as a social
| lubricant. It both lowers inhibitions, and in the expectation
| of its doing so creates spaces with freer acceptable behavior.
| Cannabis doesn't currently fill that niche, because there
| aren't really spaces dedicated to its consumption.
| littlexsparkee wrote:
| Well, with edibles, mints, drinks - does there need to be?
| There are lounges opening in some cities like Oakland, SF but
| that's an emerging thing depending on openness to changing
| zoning.
| OkayPhysicist wrote:
| Dedicated spaces to consuming social lubricants naturally
| are social spaces. Losing them would be a dramatic blow to
| the entire concept of social life.
| littlexsparkee wrote:
| Yeah, I agree with you. I'm just saying someone could
| take a 5mg THC mint and then grab a beer at a bar to be
| social. My point is that weed can be social in any third
| place, whether or not it's dedicated to it.
| dmonitor wrote:
| > and then grab a beer at a bar to be social
|
| I feel like you're missing the point. The bar a necessary
| part of the equation because alcohol has a social
| monopoly on physical locations.
| zamalek wrote:
| > night out at the bar is expensive now
|
| "They" will make it cheaper. If you look at the cost of alcohol
| in developing countries, it can be _way_ _WAY_ cheaper. The
| profit and tax margins are currently colossal, both of which
| can be changed by big booze.
| Gigachad wrote:
| It's not just alcohol tax. Rent, wages, and insurance cost
| way more than in developing countries.
| socalgal2 wrote:
| > The shift in perception of alcohol is certainly a good sign.
|
| Is it? That same video, in the last 2-3 mins, mentioned all the
| positives of alcohol and ton of possibly related fallout from
| social drinking going down. People being lonely and depressed
| instead of socializing.
|
| If I had to choose between living an extra few years but being
| lonely and depressed vs living a few less years but enjoying
| them a bunch more I'd choose the enjoyment.
|
| I get that *maybe* that can happen without the alcohol but it's
| not happening and my experience is that alcohol is a net
| positive at the moment, until some substitute appears.
|
| Also, different cultures have different associations with
| alcohol. My opinions on alcohol changed over my life:
|
| As a child my parents offered me a sip of wine/beer/etc and it
| tasted horrible so I had no interest.
|
| As a teen I happened to get interested in a religion that said
| "no alcohol" and so I saw it as a bad thing.
|
| As a 20-25 I gave up the religion but it was "designated
| driver" time and I was happy to be that and so alcohol had this
| negative "drunk drivers" association.
|
| Around 26-30 I got in a relationship with some who liked to
| drink socially. I tried it, nothing tasted good and it gave me
| a headache so after a few months I went back to not drinking as
| i got nothing positive out of it.
|
| As 30 something I moved to Japan where (1) I no longer had to
| drive so no worries about drunk driving (2) my friends/co-
| workers/classmates introduced me to izakaya culture - being
| with friends for 2-6 hours, drinking and snacking and talking.
| And sometimes going to 2nd, 3rd, or 4th outings. Now, love that
| experience and I wouldn't give it up for almost anything. I
| love being with my friends, and, as the video pointed out, the
| alcohol works. The experience is different than without
| alcohol, and in a positive way. Remove it and it's influences
| and I think the experience would die out. I certainly don't
| like the negative health effects but I'm not going to give up
| hanging out with friends and the drinking, for me, is a
| positive part of that experience.
|
| Here's a talk about how alcohol helped civilization
|
| https://longnow.org/talks/02022-slingerland/
| kruffalon wrote:
| > my friends/co-workers/classmates introduced me to izakaya
| culture - being with friends for 2-6 hours, drinking and
| snacking and talking. And sometimes going to 2nd, 3rd, or 4th
| outings.
|
| There must be something I'm not understanding about "izakaya
| culture", because that just sounds like hanging with friends
| without a specific activity planned so you just talk shit,
| have a drink and eat (whether at home or different places
| around town), maybe someone breaks out a pack of cards?
| tartoran wrote:
| THC is the new Ethanol
| Mashimo wrote:
| I really like the trend. It is getting more acceptable to not
| drink.
|
| I'm a party drinker, but whenever I see someone who does not
| drink he gets bombarded with "why not?" "You just did not have
| the right kind of beer yet" "just one?" and that is incredible
| sad.
|
| Sadly social gatherings such as "meetups with friends" and
| "attendance at parties" is also dropping :( Kurzgesagt just had a
| video about alcohol and the social aspect:
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aOwmt39L2IQ
|
| Edit: Oh, and the trend for non-alcohol wine and beer is also a
| big plus.
| andrewclunn wrote:
| Maybe on the coasts, but I can tell you that here in the mid-
| West, booze is still going strong.
| tptacek wrote:
| I don't think this is true, at least not in Chicago.
| mrtksn wrote:
| Such a sad development, Young people need to drink more and
| socialize. No wonder the virginity rates are skyrocketing. You
| don't get into situations by getting stoned at home.
|
| Sure it is bad for your body but when used in moderation the
| benefits are much much more than that risk. What a scam the weed
| culture is. Maybe we should ban it again together with the social
| media to save the birth rates and the society in general.
| throwmeaway222 wrote:
| super bad faith that this is downvoted without comments
| bdcravens wrote:
| Especially when you consider this user's profile:
|
| "Sometimes I will say things I don't actually believe so we
| can have a more lively debate."
| mrtksn wrote:
| I do actually believe that weed replacing alcohol as drug
| of choice is destroying the social fabric of the society.
|
| What's so controversial about it? What is the last time
| when a joint got someone laid or made friends?
| lagniappe wrote:
| >What is the last time when a joint got someone laid or
| made friends?
|
| Surely you jest..
| amanaplanacanal wrote:
| Lots of people are able to get laid and make friends
| without alcohol. If there is a person who can't, I think
| it says more about them than about alcohol.
| mrtksn wrote:
| Lot's of people get white collar jobs without going to
| college, this doesn't mean that college doesn't help.
| leptons wrote:
| If you need alcohol to get laid or make friends then I
| feel very sorry for you. Most people I know got laid in
| high school (sometimes actually inside the school),
| without any alcohol involved at all. We also made plenty
| of friends. YMMV, I guess. I suppose some people are only
| likable if other people are drunk? I generally avoid
| those kinds of people no matter how inebriated I am.
| mrtksn wrote:
| I'm happy that people you know got laid in high school
| but loneliness has become society destroying epidemic and
| your friends that are getting laid are not doing enough
| to save the fertility rates.
|
| The strange tone in your writing reminds me of Dinesh
| from the Silicon Valley series :) I'm sure you are one of
| the cool ones with the good hairstyle who doesn't need
| alcohol unlike the lesser people haha.
|
| Alcohol is not about being so drunk that you do
| degenerate stuff and fuck people you don't like. It's
| about easing the social anxieties and improving the mood
| together with a good company and some music.
| leptons wrote:
| Since you are assuming things about me, I'll assume that
| your social skills suck if you need to be intoxicated to
| be social or get laid. It seems like your parents failed
| you.
|
| But you don't know me and no, I don't have "a good
| hairstyle", and no, I'm not "one of the cool ones". I'm
| just as average as anyone.
|
| "fertility rates" and people getting laid are two very
| different things. People don't have sex only to produce
| offspring.
|
| And the world could use a lot less people anyway, so I
| don't see it as a bad thing if fertility rates drop, no
| matter the cause, even if the drop is significant. The
| world will be fine with a billion or two less people, in
| fact it may just improve some situations.
| bdcravens wrote:
| I've only smoked a few times in my life, so I can't speak
| to its social effects. I do know that thanks to alcohol,
| I came very close to needing to make friends in prison.
| (Sober 7 years at this point)
| alcyone wrote:
| IDK if you're kidding, but I think you're right. Bar prices are
| a problem for sure. Beers at a bar cost $5 - $10 each, but a
| joint is just $2. Drinking and driving is a huge problem for
| people in the 'burbs and simply not worth the risk.
| mrtksn wrote:
| Why people are acting like alcohol wasn't the substance that
| got people laid and socialize for thousands of years? Of
| course I'm not kidding. Not going out and getting a few beers
| a few times a week is destroying the society.
| Barrin92 wrote:
| Yup. Hitchens was pretty prophetic about this when he wrote his
| "in defense of teenage drinking" piece 30 years ago.
|
| Now you have an entire generation of permanently in therapy
| pill poppers or weed smoking loners. An entire cohort of
| Biedermeiers, bores and shut-ins. Here in Germany where the
| drinking age is 16 it was always funny to see US expats let
| loose when they realized that teenagers can legally drink and
| don't need to do it secretly
|
| These days you have people in their mid 20s watching 10 hours
| per day of right-wing influencers online because they can't
| talk to women instead of going to a party and getting drunk and
| laid. It's honestly no surprise the world's craziest autocrats
| tend to be teetotalers, it's how you breed yourself an army of
| frustrated followers
| mrtksn wrote:
| True. Trump is also a teetotaler and he definitely needs a
| drink sometimes.
| Gunax wrote:
| We will all live long, safe, and boring lives
| throwmeaway222 wrote:
| i like my mind clear 100% of the time
| gwbas1c wrote:
| One drink doesn't do that. It's a misconception pushed by
| people who don't know what they're talking about / have an axe
| to grind.
|
| That being said: If you don't want to drink, don't. Life is too
| short to spend time with people who don't accept you for who
| you are and what you want to do.
| afroboy wrote:
| One drink lead to another.
| gwbas1c wrote:
| For an alcoholic, yes.
|
| I have that problem with candy and junk food. Other people
| have it with video games.
|
| It's better not to judge.
| softwaredoug wrote:
| The NA beers out there have become quite good. Athletic brewing
| timed the market really well.
| majora2007 wrote:
| This is my go to. I hope it becomes cheaper though.
| gwbas1c wrote:
| I think instead of giving up my beer with dinner, I'm just
| going to switch to non-alcoholic beer. It's easier to work
| within the habit instead of fighting it.
| gkiely wrote:
| Lagunitas IPNA is really good but it's not always easy to find.
| suddenlybananas wrote:
| I like booze and I think social drinking is good for society.
| littlexsparkee wrote:
| It's good to have 3rd places to meet folks and bars can offer
| low/no alc. options to broaden their base in light of these
| changing habits. Locally, I'm seeing Yemeni coffee places open
| up where people go to hang out - helps that they're often open
| to midnight.
| mmsc wrote:
| I think what will happen in the future is that the people that
| drink, will be drinking way more; while the people that rarely
| drink, will more rarely drink.
| tptacek wrote:
| Nightlife customer patronage is _way_ down post-pandemic, to the
| point where some very famous bars in Chicago (Twisted Spoke,
| Violet Hour) have shut down. To the extent nightlife drinking was
| a major component of US alcohol consumption, that may explain
| much of the drop.
| keeda wrote:
| I've observed the same in NYC. I experienced the nightlife in
| NYC shortly before the pandemic, and then again a couple of
| years after, and the difference was stark. The streets used to
| be buzzing at 3am on any given weekend. Nowadays, you'll see
| some people on the streets, but the city that never sleeps is,
| if not quite asleep, doomscrolling in bed.
| tokioyoyo wrote:
| A good chunk of my "fun and memorable nights" involved going out
| for a drink with friends/meeting new people at the bar. It's very
| good if the younger generation is consuming less alcohol, but
| unless they're replacing the social-aspect of it with something
| similar, I pity them. Unfortunately, looking at the data, it
| shows that people are just lonelier and hang out in social
| circles even less.
|
| Obviously there are problems with over-consumption, and
| addiction. However, what is life, if not a large collection of
| your memories?
| gwbas1c wrote:
| Does "going out for a drink with friends/meeting new people at
| the bar" _require consuming alcohol_?
|
| Plenty of bars have non-alcoholic beer and mocktails. I've
| always switched to them after 1-2 drinks.
| k_g_b_ wrote:
| It doesn't, and people slowly realize - e.g. in beer country
| Germany: https://www.dw.com/en/germany-alcohol-free-beer-
| sales-double...
| jsbisviewtiful wrote:
| I'd be curious to see a breakdown of this data by location/market
| and with sales data instead of a poll. I have a friend who works
| in the alcohol distribution industry and he's refuted these kinds
| of claims multiple times, but he also lives in a midwest state
| where there's not much to do but eat and drink so perhaps it's
| all relative.
| gwbas1c wrote:
| I recently had a cardiologist wag her finger at me and tell me
| that recent data pretty much demonstrates that there really isn't
| any healthy amount of alcohol to consume.
|
| 20 years ago, when "1 drink a day is healthiest" was all over the
| news, I said cheers and picked up the habit. It's kind of hard to
| break, considering that I really, really enjoy the flavor of
| alcoholic beverages. Alcohol, as a solvent, allows for flavor
| profiles that just water don't allow.
| moi2388 wrote:
| Reply to her that this is only true for populations, not
| individuals.
|
| Plenty of people who drink age well and plenty of people who
| don't drink don't age well.
|
| Statistics say something about aggregates, not individual data
| points
| kashunstva wrote:
| So how should physicians counsel patients, given that they
| have neither a megaphone large enough to address entire
| populations nor the prescience to discern the degree to which
| population applies to the individual or not?
| OneMorePerson wrote:
| This is not a direct response to this article, but related to the
| topic of not drinking. I'm usually a follower of the latest data
| and such but I am highly skeptical of all the recent news about
| how drinking isn't safe in any quantity.
|
| The latest data can be wrong. No different than how there was a
| period of time where UV light was considered this evil to avoid,
| and now we know it's actually pretty critical to get sunlight in
| moderation (and completely avoiding UV causes its own issues).
| This seems to be a problem with US health science where they will
| find something bad like partially hydrogenated fats (a terrible
| man made substance), and then go on to claim "fats are bad" (this
| is back in the 90s ish). The health system just ignored the long
| history of diets that were relatively high in fats (actual good
| natural fats), and tried to use "data". Ultimately data is only
| as good as our ability to measure, which is limited with
| something like the human body. That overcorrection has since come
| back to a more reasonable middle point but still has some issues.
|
| It's undisputed that drinking a lot of alcohol is bad for you,
| but I don't see clear data for the grey area. If I fed a rat a
| whole bunch of vinegar day after day in large quantities it would
| get health problems, yet drinking a bit of apple cider vinegar,
| salt and vinegar chips, etc. are all fine, likely beneficial
| (pickled vegetables are good for you).
|
| I'm not saying that there's any proof that alcohol is beneficial
| yet, but the lack of clear data for that grey area of risk is
| interesting. In Japan for example it's believed that drinking
| sake in moderate quantities has health benefits.
|
| I guess going back to the sunlight analogy, it's hard to believe
| that a substance that has been around as long as alcohol has
| could be so toxic that occasional consumption has any meaningful
| negative effect.
| francisofascii wrote:
| I hope you are right, but honestly I think alcohol is negative
| for your health in any quantity. I think there are indirect
| benefits, like socialization, bonding, etc. But it really is a
| poison that your body has to metabolize. It majorly disrupts
| your sleep which causes all sorts of health issues. Your body
| needs sunlight, but it doesn't need alcohol. I drank two beers
| a night for years, and I wish I hadn't. I still plan on
| drinking on occasion, but never plan to go back to habitually
| drinking.
| OneMorePerson wrote:
| To be fair I've also cut way back from where I used to be in
| terms of alcohol consumption, and I could be wrong. I've just
| seeing this pattern repeat too many times where people find
| out a substance has a negative effect in some area and then
| decide it's universally bad.
|
| Back to my prior example, there was a time when US health
| science said "saturated fats are bad", I think they went even
| so far as to say trans fats are good. The reality is that
| saturated fats affect cholesterol but aren't objectively bad.
|
| We know NOW that your body needs sunlight, but there was a
| time when people were all the way to the other side, sunlight
| avoidant and using sunscreen all the time.
|
| I think I'm sensitive to this because of the bullshit science
| around salt and high blood pressure as another example. Its
| finally been recently debunked that salt doesn't permanently
| affect blood pressure, but an elderly family member of mine
| was told by a doctor that eating salt would increase their
| already high blood pressure, and it led them to being
| hospitalized in bad condition because they stopped eating any
| salts at all.
|
| As a side comment it's interesting that you used the word
| 'poison'. I have been seeing that word thrown around a lot in
| the articles too and it seems like a stretch, like a word
| used to try to scare people. Technically spicy food is a
| poison (your body is telling you to not eat that thing),
| there's even literal poisons like certain sushi (blowfish)
| that are used to create a unique taste by eating just enough
| of it. I don't have a background for the technical
| classification of substances, but the word poison for alcohol
| kinda feels like calling weed a neurotoxin.
| more_corn wrote:
| There was a study a few years ago showing that there might not be
| a safe number of drinks per day.
|
| That sort of thing makes a difference as the knowledge percolates
| through society.
| zingababba wrote:
| I haven't had anything alcoholic in nearly two decades. Even when
| I was drinking it never got me any closer to getting laid. I quit
| because only stupid shit happened when I was drunk or around
| drunk friends. If anything nicotine acts as a superior social
| lubricant. These days I just drop acid, drink espresso, and
| consume the occasional nicotine pouch. Have never missed alcohol
| one bit.
| dadrian wrote:
| It's because GenZ is addicted to nicotine and millennials are all
| using legal weed. We've just replaced one substance with some
| others, rather than started abstaining.
| klysm wrote:
| I don't agree. There is a definite shift around health
| perception
| mensetmanusman wrote:
| We have the oldest population ever.
|
| This should be the case.
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