[HN Gopher] New treatment eliminates bladder cancer in 82% of pa...
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New treatment eliminates bladder cancer in 82% of patients
Author : geox
Score : 258 points
Date : 2025-08-13 15:16 UTC (7 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (news.keckmedicine.org)
(TXT) w3m dump (news.keckmedicine.org)
| newfocogi wrote:
| My (non-AI) Summary:
|
| - "TAR-200 is a miniature, pretzel-shaped drug-device duo
| containing a chemotherapy drug, gemcitabine, which is inserted
| into the bladder through a catheter. Once inside the bladder, the
| TAR-200 slowly and consistently releases the gemcitabine into the
| organ for three weeks per treatment cycle."
|
| - Phase 2 Clinical Trial
|
| - 85 patients with high-risk non-muscle-invasive bladder cancer
|
| - "treated patients with TAR-200 every three weeks for six
| months, and then four times a year for the next two years"
|
| - 70/85 patients--the cancer disappeared and still gone 1yr later
| in almost 50% patients
|
| - FDA granted TAR-200 a New Drug Application Priority Review
|
| - Johnson & Johnson manufactures TAR-200
| woeirua wrote:
| Unfortunately the recurrence rate after 1 year here is still
| quite high. Good progress, but not a cure yet.
| tptacek wrote:
| Only a small percentage had a recurrence that progressed to
| later-stage muscle-invasive illness, though.
| lordofgibbons wrote:
| Do cancers have a tendency to come back with better drug
| resistance if it's not fully eliminated? at least a
| resistance to the drug that got rid of it the previous time?
| tomsto wrote:
| Emphatically so, yes
| codr7 wrote:
| Return customers generate more profit.
| AnimalMuppet wrote:
| Not if the same thing can't be used to treat them again.
| GoatInGrey wrote:
| Cynical take, but not wrong.
|
| Though this reads as though the implied message is
| preaching the suppressed cure conspiracy theory so I'll
| respond to that interpretation.
|
| What you're missing the competitive factor of this. If
| your drug strings your patients along while your
| competitor releases an effective cure, guess who's
| getting all the business? Look to Sovaldi and Keytruda
| for recent examples.
| tptacek wrote:
| The competitor with the effective cancer cure will take
| all the business.
| octaane wrote:
| For some cancers yes, for other cancers, no. Sometimes
| resistance to therapy is a matter of time, not prior lines
| of therapy.
| ac2u wrote:
| I wish I could find the article, but there is a clinic
| somewhere that ran trials where they deliberately
| wouldn't treat the cancer too aggressively. Instead they
| experimented with treatment frequency but with control
| being the aim instead of elimination.
|
| The theory being that they could keep it at bay
| indefinitely and lower the chance of selection pressure
| kicking in. The thought behind their approach is that
| they wanted their patients to die of something different
| than their cancer.
| apwell23 wrote:
| yes they are resistant to that line of therapy once it
| stops working.
|
| Sometimes that resistance carries over to other lines too.
| For example, Enzalutamide doesn't work for prostate cancer
| if you were already treated by abiraterone.
| amacbride wrote:
| Bladder cancer has a notoriously high recurrence rate,
| unfortunately. (I worked for years in NMIBC molecular
| diagnostics.)
| tptacek wrote:
| Say more? You've got some domain expertise on this story
| and I assume an interesting story to tell!
| chrisgd wrote:
| My dad had his bladder removed. Cancer came back 18 months
| later and he was gone 4 months after that. It sucks.
|
| Plus, I regret that he had to live with a colostomy bag for
| that time. His quality of life probably higher if they do
| the other option (name escapes me).
| 0xWTF wrote:
| FFS, I'm a physician and I had to look up that the acronym.
| Have mercy on people: NMIBC = non-muscle invasive bladder
| cancer.
| Teever wrote:
| > The standard treatment for this type of bladder cancer is an
| immunotherapy drug, Bacillus Calmette-Guerin,
|
| Can anyone explain why the vaccine for TB works to treat bladder
| cancer?
| QuercusMax wrote:
| This "drug" is a weakened form of the bacterium, which
| apparently stimulates immune response. So I guess it works for
| both TB and bladder cancer just by getting your immune system
| to notice something is amiss?
| imranq wrote:
| Turning it off and then on again works in a lot of surprising
| places
| octaane wrote:
| I can explain. BCG infects the actual epithelial cancer cells
| inside the bladder, triggering Th-1 response (production and
| release of cytokines by activated CD4 T cells).
|
| The cytokines induce an inflammatory response, which I turn
| activates other immune system cells such as CD4 and CD8, NK
| cells and macrophages.
|
| The immune cells then attack the bladder cancer cells,
| hopefully destroying them, thus "fighting cancer".
|
| Source: Li J et al, NPJ Vaccines. 2021;6:14.
| tiahura wrote:
| "almost half the patients were cancer-free a year later."
| onlyrealcuzzo wrote:
| That's one way of looking at the glass half empty.
|
| If half of people get rid of cancer for 1 year that is still
| outstanding - ESPECIALLY if the majority of those remain cancer
| free for quite some time after.
| codr7 wrote:
| If we wanted patients to survive long term, then maybe we
| could try a treatment that doesn't destroy their immune
| system in the process.
| tptacek wrote:
| Invent it and your grandchildren will retire rich.
| burnt-resistor wrote:
| The most obvious, naive approach is banking blood & marrow
| prior to treatment. However, there's a need to clear
| metastatic cells (CTCs) or train the immune system to find
| and kill them so that it doesn't reintroduce CTCs upon
| retransfusion.
| apwell23 wrote:
| > remain cancer free for quite some time after.
|
| OS is more relevant than PFS
| chiph wrote:
| One of the things I learned going through my own treatment
| (prostate) was that everyone's cancer is different. Which makes
| sense if you think about the variability in malignant cell
| growth.
|
| So something that cures half the patients and only requires an
| office or outpatient visit every few weeks (no surgery, no
| radiation) is astounding. This result will likely lead to
| further research using this approach.
| apwell23 wrote:
| Yes my father died in 3 months after getting lutetium 177.
| mcswell wrote:
| More than half would be nice, but: these tests were run on
| "individuals with high-risk non-muscle-invasive bladder cancer
| whose cancer had previously resisted treatment." One could
| expect that it would be even more effective on patients whose
| cancers were not resistant to treatment.
| blackhaz wrote:
| My father currently suffers from bladder cancer, he's currently
| in palliative care, he's in Ukraine. If there are any medical
| professionals here, could someone provide an advice - is there
| any chance to get him access to TAR-200?
| gautamcgoel wrote:
| So sorry to hear this, I wish him the best.
| octaane wrote:
| No, the trial is closed to new participants. Check the
| company website to see if they are having international
| trials or are open to compassionate use.
| blackhaz wrote:
| Thank you.
| blackhaz wrote:
| Thank you.
| apwell23 wrote:
| 1.look for clinicaltrial on https://clinicaltrials.gov/ .
|
| 2.See if your father qualifies for any
|
| 3. Enroll
|
| 4. Get B2 visa. All medical treatment is usually covered once
| you are accepted into the program.
|
| good luck!
| moi2388 wrote:
| There are EU trials as well. Perhaps contact your physician,
| insurance or Johnson & Johnson directly.
|
| https://euclinicaltrials.eu/ctis-public/view/2023-507685-10-...
|
| To be honest, chances are slim to none. But worth a try.
| pkaye wrote:
| You may want to look at this study. Its preapproval expanded
| access. There is an email and phone numbers for the company
| which is running the study. Usually the further along the drug
| trial is they more the loosen the criteria. Wouldn't hurt the
| ask if its suitable for your father.
|
| https://clinicaltrials.gov/study/NCT06877676?intr=TAR-200&ra...
| teyc wrote:
| Pat Shoon Shiong had a cancer drug approved for targetting
| bladder cancer, don't know whether Ukrainians can have access
| though.
| TheAmazingRace wrote:
| I really wish this was available earlier, because I just lost a
| family member to bladder cancer yesterday morning. :(
| ecoffey wrote:
| That is tough, I'm sorry for your loss.
| TheAmazingRace wrote:
| Thank you for the condolences.
| javiramos wrote:
| Sorry for your loss.
| xxr wrote:
| Very sorry for your loss. An uncle had bladder cancer about 15
| years ago, and while he survived, it began a very steep decline
| that led to his passing in 2022.
| bdcravens wrote:
| So sorry to hear. My father passed from bladder cancer that
| metastasized 20 years ago.
| selectodude wrote:
| Always kind of bittersweet to read these breakthroughs in
| cancer treatment.
| A_D_E_P_T wrote:
| There's an open access paper on the development of the drug here:
|
| > https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S107814392...
| pugworthy wrote:
| To be clear, here is the rest of what the article title should
| be...
|
| > ...for individuals with high-risk non-muscle-invasive bladder
| cancer whose cancer had previously resisted treatment
| tptacek wrote:
| Only those patients were admitted to the trial, so the
| effectiveness of the treatment on later-stage muscle-invasive
| disease is unknown. That it's scoped to patients who are BCG-
| unresponsive ("previously resisted treatment") makes the
| breakthrough more significant, not less.
| GoatInGrey wrote:
| This is relatively common with experimental therapies in
| trials, and thus shouldn't be interpreted as the final say on
| its usage.
|
| Part of the reason why is that it's difficult to convince
| patients or providers to reach for the experimental treatment
| in trial before the current standard of care. Many first-line
| treatments began as second/third-line or salvage treatments
| before experiencing _line promotion_ or (if surgery is
| involved) _neoadjuvant promotion_. Keytruda is a good example
| of this progression in action.
| ltbarcly3 wrote:
| "New treatment eliminates bladder cancer in 82% of patients" -
| current HN title (matches article)
|
| I don't like headlines like this because they lack any necessary
| context. Knowing that a treatment eliminates cancer in 82% of
| patients isn't data unless we know more or already experts in
| this field. For all I know the previous treatment was 99%
| effective but just cost more or something. PR-style headlines
| very often use misleading statistics to get attention, so this
| wouldn't even be surprising.
|
| - What was the previous treatment's success rate? Was it 22% or
| 81%?
|
| - What are the other tradeoffs? If the previous treatment was
| also 82% maybe this one doesn't cause incontinence, or maybe it's
| non-invasive?
|
| How you should make a title:
|
| "New treatment eliminates cancer in 82% of patients, a major
| improvement"
|
| "New treatment is first non-invasive way to eliminates cancer in
| 82% of patients"
|
| "New treatment way to eliminates cancer in 82% of patients -
| without causing incontinence"
|
| "New treatment eliminates cancer in 82% of patients without
| radiation"
| tptacek wrote:
| This is 81% CR in patients who had already had recurrence and
| progression after front-line treatment, so neither of your
| concerns about the headline are relevant to the actual story.
| GoatInGrey wrote:
| Dumb question: why not rely on the article contents to provide
| context?
| virtualwhys wrote:
| My father had bladder cancer, which was caught relatively early
| as the cancer had not yet spread beyond the bladder wall.
|
| The doctor performed a rather uncomfortable surgery (the pathway
| for a man is not pleasant) and then injected the TB virus into
| his bladder, which is apparently an effective treatment for this
| type of cancer.
|
| It's been 20 years now, no recurrence. Think he was treated at
| Dana Farber in Boston.
|
| Having gone through what was likely a life saving treatment he
| has become, ironically, anti-western medicine -- don't blame him,
| having a surgical implement shoved up main street doesn't sound
| like a walk in the park :)
| hereme888 wrote:
| That's not 82% of bladder cancers.
|
| It's 82% of those whose bladder cancer is fortunately not
| invading the muscle, and after failing current standard
| treatments.
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