[HN Gopher] Matt Trout has died
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Matt Trout has died
Author : todsacerdoti
Score : 115 points
Date : 2025-07-10 07:24 UTC (15 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.shadowcat.co.uk)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.shadowcat.co.uk)
| rwmj wrote:
| Couldn't we have a one sentence description of what "shadowcat"
| is? (The main website is also down at the moment.)
| sebmellen wrote:
| > _Shadowcat Systems is an open source software developer and
| software consultancy provider based in the UK but accustomed to
| operating worldwide via electronic communications._
|
| > _We offer proven expertise in development of networked
| systems and reliably automating manual processes from business
| workflow to systems and network management. Shadowcat is
| committed to Open Source technology and specialises in working
| with Open Source Software and open standards and protocols.
| Shadowcat also contributes back to the community with patches,
| scripts and occasionally full packages._
| detaro wrote:
| Maybe more relevant, Matt was a big deal in the Perl community.
| ether_at_cpan wrote:
| In his bio he has the most succinct and accurate description
| of Perl that I've ever seen:
|
| > Perl is a wonderful language once you get over the fact
| that a slightly quirky set of syntax and embedded regular
| expressions have a tendency to make it look like line noise
| in the wrong light. Once you're used to it, it's a hell of an
| expressive dynamically typed language with a _huge_ set of
| libraries and classes available for it.
| petesergeant wrote:
| alt title: Matt Trout (mst) -- prominent Perl developer -- has
| died aged 42
|
| Matt Trout (mst) was a very big deal in the Perl 5 community,
| although he was a deeply polarizing figure. He was a big
| contributor to many Modern Perl projects. I am personally very
| sad he's dead. I enjoyed the time I spent with him in person, and
| always found him personally supportive, encouraging, and helpful,
| although it would be remiss to not mention that a good section of
| other people found him a very difficult character on many levels.
|
| He wasn't a particularly heavy HN user, but here he is:
| https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=mst
| kleiba wrote:
| For someone not up-to-date with the Perl community, could you
| elaborate why Matt was considered a deeply polarizing figure,
| please?
| petesergeant wrote:
| He would have been happy to tell you himself that he had some
| rough edges, would speak his mind unvarnished, and would hold
| strongly onto his own opinions of what he thought was right.
| ChrisMarshallNY wrote:
| That sounds like half this community. I suspect the issue
| is what those opinions were.
|
| I did not know him at all, have no opinion on him, and
| sincerely wish the best for those he left behind.
| petesergeant wrote:
| > the issue is what those opinions were
|
| Rarely, in fact.
| mjd wrote:
| In my life, I've only known one person who has called me a
| "cunt".
|
| I'm sure Matt would have been happy to admit that he was
| that person. I'm sure he would have said that he had spoken
| his mind unvarnished, and maybe even that he thought he was
| right.
|
| So what?
|
| People say that a community will fall to the level of the
| most toxic person it will tolerate. For the Perl community,
| that was Matt.
| xdfgh1112 wrote:
| He was pretty mean to people on irc. If you didn't
| immediately understand what he said he'd verbally barrage
| you. Then again the whole perl irc community was pretty
| toxic.
| windowshopping wrote:
| Yeah, I tried learning Perl back in 2017 and the community
| was the worst I'd ever encountered. The language had so
| many bizarre quirks and they just treated you like an
| absolute idiot if you didn't intuitively get it. Left it
| behind and never looked back.
| ether_at_cpan wrote:
| He "did not suffer fools gladly"
| IncreasePosts wrote:
| Every time I've heard that phrase used it's just describing
| an asshole
| daneel_w wrote:
| No reason to not say it plainly: he was regularly a total
| dickhead to people asking for help. But, also, he always gave
| people first-class expert help. They just had to "pay" by
| taking a bit of verbal abuse.
|
| I spent over a decade in #perl on freenode/libera and saw so
| many abusive events that I eventually got tired of hanging
| out there, mostly due to him but in part also due to a
| handful of others displaying similar behavior. All the same I
| was always grateful for how tirelessly he spent so much of
| his personal time providing help, and I'm sad to learn of his
| passing.
| ether_at_cpan wrote:
| Well yes, he was a total dickhead to people who asked lazy
| questions and could not answer the follow-up questions that
| they were asked. He was strict about teaching people that
| it is important to be able to explain one's problem clearly
| and follow debugging instructions, and was ruthless with
| people who didn't get that. On the "help" irc channels we
| saw a continuous flood of lazy people wanting quick
| solutions to their coding homework and after a while anyone
| would become sick of it.
|
| I didn't much enjoy it when I was at the other end of it
| though, and sometimes he went too far. "Try to understand
| why the person doesn't understand" wasn't something he did
| enough -- sometimes the person doesn't know the right
| questions to ask, they just know that their thing doesn't
| work.
|
| As a helper, it's hard to find the right balance, and I
| think the most important thing is that if you're getting
| emotional about it, step away and let someone else take the
| question. (I at least have been getting better at this over
| time.)
| layer8 wrote:
| https://trout.me.uk/
| tunnuz wrote:
| Sad news :(
| kubb wrote:
| 42 :( it's way too young - pisses me of when people spend days,
| months years of our time for their own benefit like it's nothing
| _rpf wrote:
| Super sad to see this. I worked with Matt around 2004.
|
| Super smart kid, very nice to work with. I ended up supporting
| one of the systems he built (in Perl). I used his Cataylst Perl
| framework for some projects after that because of him.
| martinclayton wrote:
| I use Catalyst quite a lot - have been working on a new thing
| this morning.
|
| Thanks, Matt, the ripples will go on for a good while.
| rurban wrote:
| You died way too young, my dear friend!
| xena wrote:
| mst is the reason I know some Perl and also managed to get me a
| Perl group cloak on Liberachat. I will miss him dearly. I've
| added him to the list of X-Clacks-Overhead responses on my blog.
| kodzoman wrote:
| I've met Matt on several occasions, and while he was a
| challenging character, he was also full of life and ideas, and an
| inspiration. He was a genius in an old-school, no-compromise way.
| I have been away from Perl for a long time, but some of my best
| memories and some of the most intelligent conversations took
| place while with MST and the rest of that amazing community. Fly
| high.
| IncandescentGas wrote:
| RIP mst and thanks for all the fish. DBIx::Class and Catalyst are
| still a core part of how I pay the bills.
| ether_at_cpan wrote:
| This is very sad news.
|
| As I said on irc:
|
| He brought many people into the community, and encouraged their
| growth (like me)
|
| I popped into the scene by sending a few Moose patches and then
| coming onto irc displaying an utter lack of understanding of
| anything
|
| Matt set me straight, and encouraged me to send more patches and
| I ended up as the manager for Moose
|
| and then inherited the ownership of literally hundreds (perhaps
| thousands by now) distributions
|
| that work helped me move from being mediocre at my job to being
| stellar, and enabled me to move on to much better jobs
| the_precipice wrote:
| Here is a far more balanced view of the recently deceased.
| https://curtispoe.org/blog/rip-mst.html
| fsckboy wrote:
| where to vouch? this links to an informed, serious, and
| thoughful post, unvarnished the way Matt like things
|
| (oh, i see, it already got vouched twixt the main page and my
| comment)
| moltar wrote:
| Eh remember him from IRC days
| ShamblingMound wrote:
| Had a handful of interactions with Matt. Probably the last was
| sometime in the mid- to late-2010s. I essentially started my
| software development career using software that he was largely
| responsible for (unknown to me at the time): *
| Catalyst (web framework) * DBIx::Class (ORM) * Moo
| (object-oriented code)
|
| These are, in my opinion, some of the best packages in Perl, and
| there are rarely counterparts that are as good in other
| languages. Have not found an ORM that is as effortless and
| featureful as DBIx::Class, for example.
|
| I've read about his tough interactions with other people, and it
| does seem that, at times, he fell into the classic trap of loving
| his own ideas too much; but in our interactions (reviewing some
| of my code on a Perl project), he was really helpful and kind.
| Also amazingly quick. He read my beginner-level Perl code,
| instantly understood it, and instantly gave clear, concise
| feedback.
|
| It's a shame he has passed.
| jasonjayr wrote:
| Last post, just 54 days ago.
|
| https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=mst
|
| Huge in the Perl world, he will be missed.
| daneel_w wrote:
| Thanks for all the invaluable teachings about Perl stuff.
| Slortibort wrote:
| I used to know him quite well, though not much in a technical
| context.
|
| He used to wind up taking home every single girl I introduced him
| to. He and I met when he pulled my FWB at a club and our
| friendship long outlasted either of ours with the FWB.
|
| He gave me career advice that I followed that set me on a path to
| the great happiness I now have.
|
| Shine on you crazy diamond.
| masfuerte wrote:
| This comment [1] has a link to this obituary [2] of Matt. The
| comment is flagged, probably because the author's other comment
| is very mean spirited, but the linked obituary is excellent.
|
| [1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44523887
|
| [2]: https://curtispoe.org/blog/rip-mst.html
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(page generated 2025-07-10 23:00 UTC)