[HN Gopher] Howdy - Windows Hello style facial authentication fo...
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       Howdy - Windows Hello style facial authentication for Linux
        
       Author : LorenDB
       Score  : 68 points
       Date   : 2025-06-23 18:34 UTC (3 days ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (github.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (github.com)
        
       | deafpolygon wrote:
       | Why does it depend on python2...?
        
         | Arnavion wrote:
         | Ask the Fedora maintainer? The README instructions only say
         | Python 3. The OpenSUSE package's specfile only says Python 3,
         | and to be sure I tried installing it and it did not pull in
         | Python 2 packages.
         | 
         | Actually even the Fedora package's specfile only says Python 3,
         | so I'm not sure why the README says that it still needs Python
         | 2.
         | 
         | Edit: Okay, the explanation is in this commit message:
         | https://github.com/boltgolt/howdy/commit/305e42fc79ef38f66c5...
         | . The dep on Python 2 is from Fedora's PAM module package, not
         | from howdy itself. On OpenSUSE the corresponding PAM module
         | package depends on Python 3 already.
        
       | aitchnyu wrote:
       | Last time I tried it, I wished the DM indicated its processing my
       | face and also if it failed, and a button to retry. Also will the
       | model be fooled by an IR photo of my face?
       | 
       | I did have fun opening the IR camera feed and seeing objects of
       | various opacity in visible spectrum behaving differently in IR.
        
         | Boltgolt wrote:
         | Main dev here: If you're on the 3.0 version you'll be able to
         | install howdy-gtk, which will show a popup at the top of your
         | screen when authenticating.
         | 
         | You can also enable "rubberstamps" which require an action from
         | you like nodding yes to confirm authentication and making it
         | harder to fool. As noted in the readme though, Howdy is never
         | going to be 100% secure
        
       | charcircuit wrote:
       | This isn't "Windows Hello style." This program extracts features
       | from a 2d image instead of doing depth reconstruction first. This
       | makes it easy to fool with a piece of paper.
       | 
       | Also this only handles user authentication unlike on Windows
       | where it can be usedpasskey. disk encryption and for passkeys.
       | 
       | Edit: This program also saves the landmarks of your face into a
       | file in plain text when it gets added.
        
         | senectus1 wrote:
         | yeah its more of a taster demo. I wish them luck in developing
         | it properly though... I'm doing an ubuntu MOE for a corp atm
         | and man, I really miss the windows hello logins.
        
           | _joel wrote:
           | Is 'Hello' and those kind of biometrics generally enabled at
           | $CORP? The ones I've gigged at have been the polar opposite
           | of using it, due to regulatroy requirements. Even disabling
           | macos fingerprint reader company-wide, which is prerry darn
           | good imho.
        
             | senectus1 wrote:
             | yeah hello encompass facial recognition (must be dual IR
             | cams), Fingerprint sensor and PIN.
             | 
             | none are perfect but they allow users to easily access
             | their devices without having to remember and type in huge
             | passwords.
        
             | lozenge wrote:
             | I've had the opposite experience, my CORP now pushes most
             | auth through my phone's biometric authentication, I don't
             | even use a password.
        
         | written-beyond wrote:
         | Really? When I tried on an hp spectre 5 years ago it made the
         | hell sensors make a horrible clicking sounds and the LEDs glow
         | red. I assumed it was doing something with depth analysis.
        
         | Boltgolt wrote:
         | Depth reconstruction with IR cameras in laptops today is
         | incredibly hard. While the camera itself is exposed in Linux as
         | a USB camera, the sync with the IR emitters is completely lost.
         | Because of this we cannot extract a "left" and "right" lit
         | image reliably as Windows hello does
        
         | jeroenhd wrote:
         | FWIW Microsoft's branding team fumbling everything into Windows
         | Hello isn't the project's fault. The "Windows Hello" part that
         | they're trying to find an alternative for was the only "Windows
         | Hello" for a while before Microsoft also decided that all of
         | their TPM operations were now Windows Hello things.
         | 
         | That said, without the depth reconstruction, I do agree that
         | this is nowhere close to Windows Hello's features. That's not
         | the devs' fault (that kind of mostly-secure facial recognition
         | is very hard) but I also don't think the comparison is apt. But
         | who knows, if this project gains popularity, maybe in the
         | future that kind of thing becomes possible.
         | 
         | This is more akin to Android's facial recognition, except for
         | using the IR camera. Which is still acceptable for plenty of
         | people. After all, many fingerprint readers on Linux share
         | similar risks and are often regarded as secure enough. I think
         | the availability of this project, even if it's nowhere near
         | Windows Hello's standards, is a great addition to many Linux
         | desktops, as long as their users understand the limitations.
         | 
         | As for the plaintext, Linux doesn't really have a secure
         | storage mechanism (even the standard secrets API is easy to
         | fool) so obfuscating the facial features doesn't really serve a
         | purpose. As long as your disk is encrypted, I don't think
         | that's a risk (and if it isn't, whoever is looking at your
         | laptop can just browse through your photo albums anyway).
        
       | bsimpson wrote:
       | I know there was extensive testing when face recognition
       | authentication came to smartphones. I wonder how an open source
       | project like this one compares. I suspect there are substantially
       | more false positives/negatives than on a commercially developed
       | version that needs to support everyone to be successful.
        
         | e-topy wrote:
         | Apple's Face ID uses what is essentially a 3D camera, a simple
         | 2D color camera cannot compare to that in terms of accuracy.
        
           | lozenge wrote:
           | Windows also uses infrared LEDs to light your face and
           | prevent a flat photo from being recognised as a face.
        
             | throwaway889900 wrote:
             | Windows is an operating system and does not have dependence
             | on specific hardware being present.
        
               | 98codes wrote:
               | There are definitely webcams that work with Windows
               | Hello, and those that don't.
        
               | zettabomb wrote:
               | Incorrect. Windows Hello uses special hardware.
        
               | throwaway889900 wrote:
               | Right, Windows Hello requires it for facial auth, Windows
               | itself does not. Hello still works, just you have to
               | authenticate with a different method if the hardware
               | isn't present.
        
           | aniviacat wrote:
           | AFAIK Pixel phones, including the Pixel 9, only use 2D images
           | for face unlock. So it's definitely possible to reach
           | mainstream quality with conventional cameras.
           | 
           | (Unless you'd argue that the face unlock found on Pixels is
           | not passable either)
        
             | MengerSponge wrote:
             | I don't know how Google does it, but it's possible to
             | extract 3d information from a 2d sensor. You either need a
             | variable focus or phase detection in the sensor.
        
           | crowcroft wrote:
           | Apple has clearly done a lot of work in this space and have
           | decided to retain Touch ID on Macbooks. I think this is
           | fairly instructive.
        
             | real0mar wrote:
             | That was primarily because the face id sensor stack is too
             | thick to fit in the laptop lid
        
               | crowcroft wrote:
               | The point being that they think they need those sensors
               | in order to create a secure system.
        
         | thekevan wrote:
         | "A note on security
         | 
         | This package is in no way as secure as a password and will
         | never be. Although it's harder to fool than normal face
         | recognition, a person who looks similar to you, or a well-
         | printed photo of you could be enough to do it. Howdy is a more
         | quick and convenient way of logging in, not a more secure one.
         | 
         | To minimize the chance of this program being compromised, it's
         | recommended to leave Howdy in /lib/security and to keep it
         | read-only.
         | 
         | DO NOT USE HOWDY AS THE SOLE AUTHENTICATION METHOD FOR YOUR
         | SYSTEM."
        
       | joelthelion wrote:
       | I wish we had good support for fingerprint readers instead.
        
         | cyp0633 wrote:
         | I use fprintd and it works well with GNOME + builtin Elan
         | sensor. It indeed needs more complex configuration than Touch
         | ID or Windows Hello though.
        
           | mouse_ wrote:
           | In Fedora it's (supposed to be) pretty simple. Just go into
           | settings -> users and add your fingerprint. In practice I
           | usually have to use dnf to nuke pam and reinstall it manually
           | for it to start working. But they have a good skeleton set
           | up. Still no predesktop authentication, though.
        
         | Pwntastic wrote:
         | It was relatively easy to setup a yubikey bio fingerprint
         | device in arch with pam-u2f. I just kinda followed the wiki
         | here: https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Universal_2nd_Factor
         | 
         | It wasn't strictly plug and play, but it only took like 20
         | minutes of fiddling.
        
         | amaccuish wrote:
         | That, and TPM integrated WebAuthN.
        
       | fsateler wrote:
       | The project seems active, but the last release is from 2020...
       | Why no new releases?
        
         | 1970-01-01 wrote:
         | The gift of open source strikes yet again.
         | 
         | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29736369
        
         | ycombinatrix wrote:
         | Why does it need a new release if it works?
        
       | seany wrote:
       | I wonder what it would take to get an OSS fr model to decent
       | performance on the NIST/iBeta rankings.
        
       | mouse_ wrote:
       | Predesktop authentication is a killer feature. Hope to see it
       | some day.
        
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       (page generated 2025-06-26 23:01 UTC)