[HN Gopher] Cataphract: Medieval-fantasy roleplaying wargame, in...
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Cataphract: Medieval-fantasy roleplaying wargame, in the Black-Sea
C. 1300
Author : vidro3
Score : 151 points
Date : 2025-06-19 17:40 UTC (4 days ago)
(HTM) web link (samsorensen.blot.im)
(TXT) w3m dump (samsorensen.blot.im)
| reactordev wrote:
| Was totally interested until I read its play-by-post and he keeps
| track of all the troop movements and results. Not exactly what I
| had pictured in my head before I clicked the link. I don't
| understand how people have the time to play things by mail in
| realtime. I want an evening escape, not a lifetime achievement.
| Xelbair wrote:
| you're unable to comprehend why people have a long-term
| hobbies?
| thih9 wrote:
| > I don't understand how people have the time to play things by
| mail in realtime
|
| It's not via mail, it's via discord; there are more details in
| the submission:
|
| "I set up a channel on a reasonably-popular RPG discord server
| I'm on, then each commander gets their own thread, using
| discord's thread feature. Each commander then gets a little doc
| with their character writeup and a sheet with their army
| numbers. They write messages to me, I reply and notify them as
| events occur, and I keep track of everything on a big
| spreadsheet and a running Photoshop map file. (...)"
|
| ---
|
| Also note that in early wargames writing down orders was part
| of the game, e.g.:
|
| "Players do not speak to each other. Instead, they communicate
| with their teammates and the umpire through written messages.
| This is so that the enemy team cannot hear their plans. This is
| also so that the umpire can delay or block messages if he feels
| the circumstances on the battlefield warrant it. In the early
| 19th century, officers in the field communicated over long
| distances through messengers. There was no radio in those days.
| Messengers needed time to reach the recipient, and could be
| delayed or intercepted by the enemy. The umpire can simulate
| this problem by holding on to a player's message for a round or
| two before giving it to the recipient, never giving it, or even
| give it to the enemy."
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kriegsspiel
| nottorp wrote:
| > I want an evening escape
|
| That would be giving orders for one turn. Why the rush?
|
| > not a lifetime achievement.
|
| That would be those free to play clickers.
| IncreasePosts wrote:
| Just get 20 hobbies like that to fill up each evening.
| lupusreal wrote:
| Back in the day my buddies and I used to play Civilization 2 by
| swapping a floppy with the save file back and forth every day
| we met in school.
| deadbabe wrote:
| I actually got excited thinking it was play by mail but it was
| not. I was picturing weathered wax sealed letters arriving to
| your mailbox, written in an old school font, detailing outcomes
| of your decisions and how you wanted to proceed.
| GolfPopper wrote:
| The A Collection of Unusual Pedantry blog which the author
| references is an amazing introduction to this work of thinking
| (the challenges of military operations, and the forces that shape
| warfare and civilization). [1] If you're already familiar with
| ACoUP, or find Cataphracts fascinating, you might also enjoy
| Edward N. Luttwak's _The Grand Strategy of the Byzantine Empire_
| of which one review says (and which I find a quality summary):
| "The Grand Strategy of the Byzantine Empire is written with a
| profound knowledge of the field, a thorough mastery of the
| sources and secondary literature, and a lively and engaging style
| that both specialists and general readers will appreciate."
| --Peter B. Golden, Rutgers University
|
| 1. https://acoup.blog/
| bee_rider wrote:
| He writes about games from time to time. You can sense the
| friendly frustration. I wish he'd take a sabbatical from
| Professor-ing and, like, Creative Assembly could hire him to
| consult on a total war game.
| Maken wrote:
| He himself seems more interested in Paradox games. I wonder
| what he will think about EUV.
| GolfPopper wrote:
| He also has a great collection of his posts that are
| particularly useful for aspiring authors and rpg game
| masters:
|
| https://acoup.blog/resources-for-world-builders/
| 0cf8612b2e1e wrote:
| There is only so much realism you can inject before it
| detracts from the fun. The author occasionally even
| references this during his analysis on how some mechanic
| would be required for simplicity or balancing a rock-paper-
| scissors troop counters.
| lovegrenoble wrote:
| It will go well with fantasy ambience for RPGs:
| https://tabletopy.com
| stoneman24 wrote:
| Sounds like a really interesting and delightfully frustrating
| game. Bit busy to join at the moment but it's going on my list
| for the future.
|
| The comments about the loyalty of the sub-commanders being very
| strong due to the extremely restrictive information environment
| reminded me of opposite within the history book Nemesis by Max
| Hastings.
|
| He covers the end of the Second World War in the pacific. One
| veteran commented that it seemed that the different commanders
| and services within the US armed forces were more at conflict
| with each other than with the Japanese, all trying to get the
| resources and credit for the successes. (Especially MacArthur in
| the Philippines).
|
| The radio and news reels of the days could both provide fast
| information about what is/was happening and also ensure fame and
| fortune in the domestic environment if your narrative could
| prevail
| lubujackson wrote:
| I loved this theme in Patton! I wonder if the gov't fostered
| this or simply allowed it to manifest because, for the most
| part, it gave extra motivation to the generals to succeed and
| succeed well.
| stoneman24 wrote:
| Every war needs Heroes. Gotta sell those war bonds! Boost
| favourable public opinion and control the positive narrative.
|
| I believe that Stalin set 2 field marshals (Georgy Zhukov and
| Ivan Konev) on a race to Berlin in the last weeks of WW2 in
| Europe. Don't think Stalin cared who won.
| hermitcrab wrote:
| >One veteran commented that it seemed that the different
| commanders and services within the US armed forces were more at
| conflict with each other than with the Japanese
|
| MacArthur and Patton were both massive egomaniacs, weren't
| they? I guess well-adjusted people don't end up as wartime
| generals.
|
| But the Japanese army and navy hated each other so much that
| some Admirals and Generals were walking around with bullets in
| them from unsuccessful assassination attempts from the other
| service. Not a great way to run a war.
| largbae wrote:
| As a recovered EVE Online addict, there is at least one game out
| there that requires significant time on logistics and operations
| to win wars.
| Cthulhu_ wrote:
| And while that one doesn't shy away from the material and
| financial cost of war, it greatly simplified traveling,
| allowing for shortcuts like jump drives allowing for instant
| teleportation of armies.
| nottorp wrote:
| > there are a lot of games about strategy [..] and innumerable
| games about tactics [..], but very few about operations. Almost
| no games, as far as I'm aware, are interested in, say, the
| logistics of feeding an army, or communication structures between
| commanders in the field.
|
| Allow me to whine about Ubisoft buying out Settlers, which was
| initially about (peace time) logistics, and somehow thinking they
| bought a RTS.
| Cthulhu_ wrote:
| Same with Knights & Merchants, which was a city builder but you
| had to feed your peasants and army every day (I forgot how time
| worked in that game though), which involved a peasant going to
| the inn to eat for X amount of time, then going to the
| storehouse to pick up a bread or sausage and bringing it to a
| soldier. Times every peasant, times every soldier. I don't know
| if I remember that accurately though.
| nottorp wrote:
| At a quick check the lead developer and artist on Knights &
| Merchants had previously worked on Settlers II at BlueByte.
| Looks like they liked their job a lot and quit before the
| series drifted more towards being a RTS.
| yomismoaqui wrote:
| > there are a lot of games about strategy [..] and innumerable
| games about tactics [..], but very few about operations
|
| Operational wargames are a thing (at least on boardgames)
|
| https://boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/181039/favorite-operation...
| Kinrany wrote:
| Are there games in this genre that aren't historical?
| yomismoaqui wrote:
| Don't know... maybe you can pick one of them in BGG and
| drill-down by mechanics?
| mr_toad wrote:
| Arguably games like StarCraft include operational elements -
| managing and defending the peon line is as important as the
| front line.
| bee_rider wrote:
| Lots of games that are billed as "strategy" are really more
| operations (or even tactics!) than strategy, right? I mean it
| is often the case in a strategy game that you just start out at
| war with everybody else, taking away the most important
| strategic decision.
|
| Or, there are games like Civilization or Total war where,
| really, c'mon, you know it is just a matter of when, not if,
| you go to war.
| stoneman24 wrote:
| Not sure how to do it, but a history of the campaign from the
| different viewpoints would be an interesting read.
|
| Perhaps a journalist piecing together the information, 6 months
| to a year after the events. Once the ripples have settled, more
| or less.
|
| I might be biased as I have been reading 3 part history of the
| American Civil War, which also suffered from the fog of war and
| very slow information propagation.
|
| Of course, history is always written by the victors after their
| glorious triumph has been consolidated and the losers
| comprehensively defeated.
| lupusreal wrote:
| Sounds very cool. I wish I had the patience for this kind of
| real-time game. I did a real time Kerbal mission to Mun once and
| that was about at my limit. It sounds like this wargame requires
| much more.
| oezi wrote:
| Directly reminds me of Subterfuge which is a fog of war and
| realtime submarine war game of conquering outposts. It has
| absolutely 0% loyalty though which makes it hard to play.
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