[HN Gopher] Visualizing environmental costs of war in Hayao Miya...
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Visualizing environmental costs of war in Hayao Miyazaki's Nausicaa
Author : zdw
Score : 244 points
Date : 2025-06-20 15:23 UTC (1 days ago)
(HTM) web link (jgeekstudies.org)
(TXT) w3m dump (jgeekstudies.org)
| tmtvl wrote:
| As the site is currently getting hugged I will say that Nausicaa
| didn't quite leave as much an impression on me as Grave of the
| Fireflies, but Miyazaki's environment design is always spot-on
| (the entirety of Farewell My Beloved Lupin, for example, improves
| on every rewatch as you notice more details).
| randomNumber7 wrote:
| Grave of the Fireflies is the most emotionally disturbing movie
| I have ever watched (including non animes). It is a masterpiece
| but I wouldn't really recommend it to anyone.
| everybodyknows wrote:
| Ever seen "Threads"?
| iamwil wrote:
| It's the only movie that I liked that I'd only want to watch
| once.
| jpecar wrote:
| And if you want an anime series that you can classify like
| this, check out "Now and then, here and there".
| Aeolun wrote:
| This starts out so innocent, and becomes so disturbing.
| pchristensen wrote:
| It was definitely not a barrel of monkeys, but I think it is
| an important expression of the costs of war on the innocent,
| and the effects of societal inequality in general. It's
| powerful in a way that statistics cannot deliver. You'd also
| be hard pressed to find a better story of unconditional love,
| duty, sacrifice, and maturity.
| BriggyDwiggs42 wrote:
| Oh I couldn't remember what this was called. I watched it for
| a film class. Utterly devastating.
| khimaros wrote:
| tell me you haven't seen Old Boy without telling me you
| haven't seen Old Boy
| tialaramex wrote:
| Oldboy is fiction.
|
| The two children in Grave of the Fireflies are fictional,
| but they're standing in for a tremendous number of real
| Japanese civilians killed by these events - in some cases
| literally starved to death. The Americans really did drop
| incendiary devices on those cities to burn homes to the
| ground, in our real world. You can certainly make an
| argument that it was somehow "justified" but it's a
| terrible thing to have done even if you're quite sure that
| it wasn't a war crime (which I am not).
| FuriouslyAdrift wrote:
| Grave of the Fireflies is "semi" auto-biographical
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grave_of_the_Fireflies_(sho
| rt_...
| randomNumber7 wrote:
| I actually have seen old boy and it is an order of
| magnitude less disturbing.
| bigyabai wrote:
| _Oldboy_ is a well-made film, but absolute pulp. It 's
| disturbing in a _Silence of the Lambs_ , manufactured drama
| sort of way. Your adult amygdala should probably not be
| disturbed by it all that much.
| h2zizzle wrote:
| If you ever do, make sure to do so as a double feature with
| My Neighbor Totoro (as it was originally released in
| theaters).
| upghost wrote:
| Do yourself a flava and read the Manga. The movie ends before
| where the first volume ends, but the story goes in a completely
| different and much more interesting direction.
| HideousKojima wrote:
| Also the secret truth about the world in Nausicaa (not going to
| spoil it here) has been copied by several other animes and
| video games since, it's been very influential. Notably the
| anime _Ergo Proxy_ and the video game _Nier_ seem to take some
| significant inspiration from it.
| kibwen wrote:
| Worth mentioning that the manga is itself drawn by Miyazaki,
| and that he originally stipulated that it should never be made
| into a film. Fully agreed that the manga is far more beautiful
| and complete than the film.
| KeepFlying wrote:
| Don't forget how horribly the first English adaptation of the
| film went too.
| upghost wrote:
| Was the plot completely butchered...? Yes.
|
| Were there gaping narrative discontinuities...? Certainly.
|
| But that 80s voice acting in the English dub... _chef 's
| kiss_. The guy who voiced Milo("Asbel" in the movie) was
| the voice of Leonardo from Ninja Turtles and Kaneda from
| original dub of Akira!! (Cam Clark)
|
| If I watch any version, I watch Warriors of the Wind. It
| really is the "Hollywood version" of Nausicaa.
|
| Yeah, the newer one is better, but it doesn't hold a candle
| to the manga so give me that 80s synth and big hair voice
| acting any day.
|
| Also I was like 5 when I saw it so nostalgia goggles.
| frollogaston wrote:
| Didn't even know about the old one. The newer one has 80s
| synth too, though.
| wk_end wrote:
| It's probably easier to list the anime characters that
| Cam Clark doesn't voice!
| InvisibleUp wrote:
| It wasn't _that_ bad. It cut a few scenes but most of the
| movie is still there perfectly intact. It even won film
| festival awards. The movie mostly flopped in the US market
| on account it being distributed on a very low budget
| limited release against Rambo and The Goonies. SpaceHunterM
| on YouTube made a good video explaining a lot of
| misconceptions, if you want to check that out.
| tomrod wrote:
| The movie completely inspired me as a child and as an
| adult. I didn't relaize the story continued.
| tuna74 wrote:
| Miyazaki was the director of the movie and probably drew a
| lot more than a traditional anime movie director.
| echelon wrote:
| There is no work from Miyazaki that should be more relevant to
| us on HN than _Shuna no Tabi (shiyunanoLu , Shuna 's Journey)_.
|
| It was published during Nausicaa's run and has similar themes
| to Nausicaa and Princess Mononoke. It's certainly more brutal.
|
| It reads like Cormac McCarthy's "The Road", and the themes are
| incredibly prescient for the world we're about to be living in
| [1]. It has direct relevance to everyone on HN.
|
| https://archive.org/details/shuna-no-tabi-complete-translate...
|
| It's a hidden gem and often overlooked.
|
| Spoiler: [1]
|
| .
|
| .
|
| .
|
| [1] rot13(Vg'f onfrq ba n Gvorgna sbyxgnyr, ohg Zvlnmnxv'f
| nqncgngvba zvtug qrcvpg yvsr nsgre NV. Nsgre gur ebobgf gnxr
| bire naq jr'er yrsg nf n sreny fcrpvrf. Gur oehgnyvgl bs
| pvivyvmngvbany pbyyncfr nf gur ebobgf pbagvahr gb uneirfg hf
| naq bhe jbeyq. Ubj jr'er yrsg gb fpencr ol naq qrny jvgu gur
| pehrygl bs bhefryirf.)
|
| https://rot13.com/
| wahnfrieden wrote:
| Thanks for sharing this
| Kapura wrote:
| Glad to know that others agree; this is the elephant in the
| room that the original link doesn't mention. The manga was
| completed several years after the film's release, and the
| expanded freedom allows the story to be expanded in every
| direction. Many of the themes present in later Miyazaki works
| (stuff like redemption for certain villains) are absent from
| the film but have time to develop in the manga.
| omnee wrote:
| Like others I want to recommend the manga. It's a masterpiece
| and in my opinion Miyazaki's Magnum Opus.
| echelon wrote:
| It's certainly his biggest world, and the themes of climate
| change and environmentalism are directly relevant.
|
| I still am not sure which between Nausicaa the manga,
| Nausicaa the film, Princess Mononoke, or Spirited Away are
| his magnum opus. They are all spectacular.
|
| I posted below about his manga, "Shuna's Journey". It's also
| exceedingly relevant.
| magic_hamster wrote:
| This is especially true for Akira. While it's an incredible
| movie, it really doesn't end clearly and the reason is that
| it's simply not the end of the story. The movie ends roughly
| half way through the Manga which is insanely well done and
| should be read by everyone.
| N_Lens wrote:
| > When analyzing Miyazaki's films, including Nausicaa of the
| Valley of the Wind, often the messages regarding warfare's
| effects on the natural world focus more on the direct impacts
| rather than the indirect ones. Additionally, many researchers
| look at the film from a spiritual lens with DeWeese-Boyd (2009)
| believing Nausicaa serves as a Christ-like figure, while both
| Morgan (2015) and Nunes (2021) believe that Nausicaa serves as an
| example of how to restore balance between humans and nature.
| Despite that, these authors see her role in restoring balance
| differently. Nunes believes that Nausicaa gave herself to nature,
| sacrificing her free will in order to heal the earth without
| personal bias. On the other hand, Morgan believes that she serves
| as an example of how the fragmentation between the mind, body,
| spirit and nature can be restored through respect and care for
| the natural world.
|
| I never thought of the parallel with Christ in the numerous times
| I watched this film but I can understand why someone would make
| that connection given the final scenes.
| frollogaston wrote:
| I thought this was intentional, cause she sacrifices herself
| then gets resurrected, also visuals like https://www.mother-
| god.com/images/nausicaa.jpg and
| https://beneaththetangles.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/507...
|
| But she's definitely not the same throughout the movie, cause
| she kills 3 guys early on.
| mmustapic wrote:
| The visuals of her sacrifice and resurrection are very
| similar to Neo's sacrifice in Matrix pt 3
| brazzy wrote:
| The messiah theme is much stronger in the manga. Not just the
| resurrection: she collects followers, at least one a converted
| enemy, by showing an all-encompassing love and helping those in
| need wherever she can.
|
| On at least one occasion someone explicitly addresses her as
| "you, who would be a messiah". And no, that's not a translation
| artifact; the word is Jiu Shi Zhu .
|
| Of course, it is also subverted in some ways, most explicitly
| in the end, where Nausicaa destroys a plan for a new, better
| world, in favor of an escape from prophecies and grand plans.
| Aeolun wrote:
| I find it really weird that there's analysis like this when the
| man is still alive. Why not just ask if there's a connection
| (my guess is not).
| randomNumber7 wrote:
| > The paper will show that the visuals in the film are not simply
| aesthetic decisions, but a crucial narrative device to convey the
| effects of war on both people and nature.
|
| I don't need science to come to this conclusion.
| lazide wrote:
| Nothing about the paper is science hah. But it is a paper!
| snickerbockers wrote:
| ARE YOU DENYING THE SCIENTIFIC JOURNAL OF GEEK STUDIES?
| Isamu wrote:
| Funny though that "paper" is not about paper anymore.
| tokai wrote:
| The rare skeuomorph synecdoche.
| ge96 wrote:
| Memories was a good one too
|
| https://blog.alltheanime.com/memories-cannon-fodder/
|
| Blue Gender also good for humanity losing to something
| FuriouslyAdrift wrote:
| The bigger short in "Memories", "Magnetic Rose", is one of my
| all time favorite stories (It's Satoshi Kon, Koji Morimoto,
| Katsuhiro Otomo, and Yoko Kanno !!!)
|
| https://animationobsessive.substack.com/p/the-secrets-of-mag...
| ge96 wrote:
| the level of detail in older anime is just crazy like Roujin
| Z
| layer8 wrote:
| Blue Gender would really deserve a remake.
| feverzsj wrote:
| Laughs in Anno Hideaki.
| GLdRH wrote:
| Laughs in Hirohiko Araki.
| tokai wrote:
| For a contemporary example of the effects of war on nature the
| area around Bilohorivka in Ukraine is quite the eye opener. At
| least it was for me.
|
| https://www.google.com/maps/place/Bilohorivka,+Luhansk+oblas...
| popol12 wrote:
| What do we see here ? Artillery impacts ?
| monetus wrote:
| Almost entirely.
|
| _On 20 September 2022, Luhansk Oblast governor Serhiy Haidai
| reported that Russian troops had "razed [Bilohorivka] to the
| ground" during their failed attempts to recapture it, stating
| that Ukrainian forces had full control of the town.[78]
|
| On 18 October, Russia attempted an assault with artillery
| support on Bilohorivka, but the attack was repulsed. Russian
| troops continued to shell liberated settlements._
|
| The armored vehicle assaults and drones destroy trenches and
| buildings, make craters too, but the sheer extent and size of
| those craters is from artillery. The tank battles weren't too
| destructive relatively IIRC
| frollogaston wrote:
| I'm not into anime, but this is in my top 3 favorite movies.
| Aside from the sheer coolness, it's environmentalist but not in
| the typical annoying way like the blue people Avatar movie. It's
| more matter-of-fact, you won't win fighting against nature or
| against each other.
|
| And the main character has the right amount of flaws. Even though
| Nausicaa is totally against war by the second half, the movie
| shows that this is easier said than done. She has to reach that
| conclusion after taking part in the fighting herself, and even
| then she has to use warning shots from a machine gun. She's not
| invincible until the last scene.
| lubujackson wrote:
| Miyazaki reportedly hated the ending and didn't want to have
| such a tidy solution, but needed material because he was
| greenlit for a movie and Nausicaa was all he had.
|
| The other 3 books from the manga go into much more depth
| politically and spiritually, with a lot more philosophy about
| ecology and even what it means to be human.
| frollogaston wrote:
| That makes sense, the ending was always my least favorite
| part too. It's too convenient.
| flakiness wrote:
| You should notice the shadow of the traumatic experience from
| atomic bombs that permeated into the Japanese society throughout
| the 20th century (vs. concerns around carbon emissions today.)
| ionwake wrote:
| Absolute masterpiece both the Anime and this blog entry.
|
| I remember as a skinny 80s kid, walking barefoot into a
| videostore near the beach in Spain where I lived. No internet, TV
| only had 4 channels, and aside from the gift of Dragon Ball on TV
| nothing else that interested or inspired me.
|
| Then out of hundreds of videos I saw this, I had no idea who
| Ghibli, anime, even was and had few friends as I was autistic.
|
| Yet I could tell from a couple of pictures on the cover it had
| themes of flying and war beautifully painted.
|
| I ended up watching that, in the late 80s on a crt , in my swim
| trunks, and although we had next to no money, and plastic
| furniture in the house ( ironically we lived in the spanish
| "malibu")... just my family were common workers... I ended up
| spending a couple of dollars to rent it out a number of times.
|
| Thank you Miyazaki and Studio Ghlibli for your work, it elevated
| souls in far reaches.
| upghost wrote:
| I know. The cover art is great and makes no sense. Some dude
| with an assault rifle (I guess supposed to be Milo/Asbel)
| riding a sandworm along with his buddy Dr. Doom I guess, a
| squid guy with a lightsaber (firewarrior probably?) and there's
| a guy flying pegasus for some reason? [1] Truly iconic.
|
| Some of that is explainable but the pegasus, dude on the
| pegasus, and Dr Doom ... makes absolutely zero sense. I guess
| this is the rock opera version we never got. Maybe Dr Doom
| somehow sorta kinda was supposed to be Princess Kushana..?? I
| think the squid guy is a firewarrior, but so is the "sandworm"
| -- some kind of fever dream Ohm/Gorgon/Firewarrior mix. But why
| is a tiny adult fire warrior riding a baby giant fire warrior?
| lololol
|
| I can only imagine the requirements gathering session that lead
| to this debacle.
|
| Legendary.
|
| [1]:
| https://i.pinimg.com/736x/00/fe/12/00fe121ffa3600cfb14bbbe1c...
|
| Edit: Dear haters, I <3 <3 <3 Warriors of the Wind and all
| things Nausicaa, incl. the quirky cover. I even love your
| downvotes, it means you read this and cared enough to click the
| button, which hopefully means you are defending the cover. So I
| love you too!
| the_af wrote:
| Thanks for taking the time to write this!
|
| I'm... appalled by that cover. I wasn't familiar with it.
| It's bizarre how all the elements of Nausicaa are
| _technically_ there, yet it looks completely different (in a
| bad way). Nothing at all like the actual artwork of the
| movie!
| ionwake wrote:
| This is brilliant thank you for sharing ! wtf is he riding
| Pegasus !!!! This is so much more barmy than I remembered -
| either the screenshots on the back were great or the cover
| was different. Great post - thanks
| Hikikomori wrote:
| The hollywood version.
| bena wrote:
| I caught this on HBO in the 80s. And over the years, I had
| forgotten the name, although it wouldn't have helped much.
|
| But I had remembered liking it. The glider, the giant bugs,
| etc.
|
| I spent several years casually trying to find it. But "big ass
| bug anime" is kind of vague. Eventually I just started looking
| through catalogs of the timeframe from various distributors and
| studios.
|
| I don't know how or when, but eventually I was doing a deep
| dive on Miyazaki and Studio Ghibli and read the description of
| Naussica. Looked up screenshots. And there it was, that one bit
| from my childhood.
| anbende wrote:
| I had a very similar experience, watching it at Japanese camp
| when I was about 8. I had recurring dreams of a ship going
| down into a poison jungle for many years and vague memories
| of this movie.
|
| I found it again when mail order Netflix first came out in my
| early 20s. It was like rediscovering my childhood and
| completing a character arc.
| mattlangston wrote:
| "... Miyazaki warns against the dangers of harmful technology and
| the moral implications of its use."
|
| Apropos for current times.
| newsclues wrote:
| We have satellite footage of war zones in real life to visualize
| the environmental impacts with cameras from outer space
| Hikikomori wrote:
| If you like nausicaa give scavengers reign a watch.
| andrei_says_ wrote:
| Or if you like anything done by Moebius. The worldbuilding is
| breathtaking, and the art is magnificent.
| boxfire wrote:
| No one is really mentioning this article in from a highschooler.
| Awesome job! I'm happy to read this today and really hope she
| will continue to see such inspiring stories and maybe some day
| make some.
| YeGoblynQueenne wrote:
| >> Giant warriors walking through a city in flames
|
| Huh. I never noticed this before but that scene is very much like
|
| ** SPOILERS ** SPOILERS ** SPOILERS ** SPOILERS ** SPOILERS **
|
| the Rumbling in Attack on Titan, when the Colossal Titans are
| sent to destroy the world by Eren.
|
| ** SPOILERS ** SPOILERS ** SPOILERS ** SPOILERS ** SPOILERS **
|
| Also see Figure 4, "Giant warrior falling apart while charging up
| to fire".
|
| Possible inspiration, maybe?
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