[HN Gopher] Getting Past Procrastination
___________________________________________________________________
Getting Past Procrastination
Author : WaitWaitWha
Score : 276 points
Date : 2025-06-07 03:06 UTC (19 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (spectrum.ieee.org)
(TXT) w3m dump (spectrum.ieee.org)
| litoE wrote:
| Of course the correct term is procrastination, and not
| procastination. But we'll fix it tomorrow.
| djmips wrote:
| That's quite amusing. SMH.
| tomhow wrote:
| We've bent the guidelines by changing the title from the
| article's original title to one with correct spelling.
| kernelsanderz wrote:
| I'll read this tomorrow
| rented_mule wrote:
| > Action leads to motivation, not the other way around.
|
| I've found this to be very true. A trick I found that made this
| easier for me is to leave a trivial task to start tomorrow with,
| often with notes to remind myself what to do. Ideally the trivial
| task is on the way to something bigger, not finishing something.
| That gets me into my editor, gets me running the code / tests /
| etc., and gives me a trivially easy way to get moving. Then the
| motivation kicks in and I can start moving for real.
|
| The same approach helps me with tasks outside of software
| development, and even outside of work.
| jraph wrote:
| Yep.
|
| When there are no clear tasks, I sometime leave a syntax error
| at the place work should continue tomorrow. This is quite
| effective. It can make the answer to the "Where was I?"
| question immediate instead of taking a few seconds and this is
| one fewer barrier.
| euroderf wrote:
| Yes. It's funny how this kind of trick can instantly snap the
| entire working context back into your mind. Essentially
| leaving you free to forget about the context during your free
| time and overnight. Truly a useful "hack".
|
| It's also useful to jot down a quick list of (say) three
| items that are at the top of your mind when you leave work
| for the day, and they too will help with a context restore.
| bravesoul2 wrote:
| Also just chuck Todo comments in the code
|
| The magic of Git means you can immediately find them in the
| working index and get back on to it. Just remember to
| remove them before the commit.
| diggan wrote:
| > The magic of Git means you can immediately find them in
| the working index
|
| How does git help you find certain texts in files? `grep`
| should do the trick just fine, unless I misunderstand
| what "chuck Todo comments in the code" mean, the code
| lives on your disk no?
| cjbillington wrote:
| They'll show up in the diff.
|
| Grep will find them too, but any in the diff you'll know
| for sure were added by you.
| diggan wrote:
| Parent mentioned specifically finding them from the
| index, so they've been added but not committed, so
| they're not even remote nor have an author associated
| with it, yet.
|
| And why it matters to get them from the diff if they're
| on disk already? Literally one command to find all of
| them, rather than going through git?
| bravesoul2 wrote:
| One advantage of git is it shows you any uncommitted
| changes. Great way to get context the next day of where
| you were up to anyway even if you didn't use TODO to make
| it searchable.
| bravesoul2 wrote:
| Grep works too. I just spend a lot of time in git or
| tools that wrap it. It's an unconscious habit to check
| the status and diffs when I open my editor.
| diggan wrote:
| Yeah I mean I use the git cli exclusively too, and use it
| switch contexts, but I'm not sure why'd I use it to find
| stuff that is already on disk. But, you do you, was just
| trying to understand if there was any benefits I didn't
| knew about :)
| rmwaite wrote:
| If you do this often enough you can create a simple
| commit hook that searches for these markers and will fail
| to commit if it finds them.
| Henchman21 wrote:
| "focus division multiplexing"
| apwell23 wrote:
| I always leave work( for lunch, for home) at failing test .
| Try to anyways.
| dogman1050 wrote:
| I've always used "$$". It's probably a subliminal thing.
| jenny91 wrote:
| Another similar thing is to leave an easy sentence half-
| finished so when you come back to it, there's an obvious
| first thing to do and hop back in.
| getlawgdon wrote:
| I like this. Good trick.
| tmoertel wrote:
| That's Hemingway's trick: "You write until you come to a place
| where you still have your juice and know what will happen next
| and you stop and try to live through until the next day when
| you hit it again."
|
| https://www.theparisreview.org/interviews/4825/the-art-of-fi...
| roudaki wrote:
| there are so many different names for this. and time
| blocking. but it really works. small reminder. it works even
| when, like me, someone has serious case of ADHD. but its
| slightly different and there are extremes on both end. where
| it does not work or it works to well. but it always work.
| what I am trying to say if you feel its not efficient you
| still have to feel it out until you find how it works for you
| in whatever form it works.
| veunes wrote:
| It's way easier to ride the momentum of "just one quick thing"
| than to start cold and stare into the void of a blank screen or
| a big to-do list
| parpfish wrote:
| I've heard this called "park facing downhill"
| agumonkey wrote:
| Same, it's so much easier to quit just when you hit your limit
| and keep a 2 min window to bookmark your solution search and
| leave some potential follow ups. Makes restarting your job a
| lot easier.
| nasretdinov wrote:
| I've personally found LLMs to be particularly helpful to get
| started with something I have trouble with: surely, they'll most
| certainly get it wrong (unless it's something trivial), but it
| gives you enough momentum to keep going even if you end up
| discarding its original output completely
| g3z wrote:
| I'll read this later
| baxtr wrote:
| _> Action leads to motivation, not the other way around._
|
| For me, this sounds a bit tautological. Of course the opposite of
| procrastination is action.
|
| It's similar to saying, "If you want to lose weight, just eat
| less." It's certainly true on a meta level, but very difficult
| for some people to implement.
| lazyasciiart wrote:
| No - it's aimed at people who say they can't do x because they
| aren't in the right headspace/feeling creative/they're too
| tired, they will do it when inspiration strikes. People who are
| waiting for some uncontrollable muse before they finally write
| their novel, and waiting until they feel like a creative person
| to start taking drawing lessons, or waiting til the essay idea
| jumps fully formed into their head before they start drafting.
| That isn't a description of _all_ procrastination.
| maerch wrote:
| It's about taking small steps to get the flywheel turning, not
| about "just doing it." You need small wins to build up
| motivation for the bigger, more complicated tasks.
|
| If you want to lose weight but don't feel motivated, it might
| be because you associate getting started with a strict workout
| routine and highly restrictive dieting. But taking smaller
| steps in the right direction can spark motivation. From my own
| experience, I know I naturally start eating healthier as soon
| as I get back into running.
| roncesvalles wrote:
| "If you want to lose weight, just eat less" is not as
| tautological as you may think. Many people don't actually know
| that if you just eat the same calories as someone 20 lbs
| lighter than you, you will eventually weigh 20 lbs lighter,
| that you don't need to "do" anything else to shed those 20 lbs.
| JustinCS wrote:
| This isn't really true, everyone has a different basal
| metabolic rate, and effectiveness with absorbing calories
| from food can vary as well. Even small differences can add up
| to large effects, the difference between being at net-zero,
| or having caloric surplus or deficit every day.
|
| That said, in practice it may be reasonable advice on
| average, but there's also a problem where it's not very
| practical to eat the "same" calories as someone else, unless
| they are together with you all the time.
| Arisaka1 wrote:
| As someone with fast metabolism who struggled to gain
| weight: I get that, but at the same time, understanding
| that there's trial and error with your own body but is
| ultimately all about input and output does more good than
| saying "haha I just have fast/slow rate looool" as
| justification for not taking care of yourself.
| veunes wrote:
| But in a way that can still be useful. Like, "just do
| something" isn't deep wisdom, but when you're stuck, even a
| cliche can break the mental loop.
| baxtr wrote:
| Yes, fair enough.
| madduci wrote:
| The article focuses more on procrastination at work, what about
| those who procrastinate outside of work instead?
| rkachowski wrote:
| I mean, its the same concept. what are you procrastinating on?
| madduci wrote:
| Sometimes on house chores or small repairs to do.
| cjfd wrote:
| I do not know much or anything about your situation, but
| here is one thing that might work.
|
| I would suggest picking a fixed point in time every week.
| At this point in time you will finish (if they are small
| enough, otherwise split in multiple steps) on of these
| chores/repairs. E.g., every Saturday afternoon from 1 am
| you will finish one of these. The rest of the time you then
| do not need to think about these which is your reward for
| doing one chore/repair.
| jventura wrote:
| Everyday I have to prepare dinner and put the plates,
| glasses, forks and knifes in the table, and, I don't know
| why, get that feeling that I'd rather do anything else (or,
| most times, nothing at all). So I always start everything
| by putting the towel in the table (don't know if it's
| called like that in EN, not a native speaker). It seems to
| click something and the rest follows.
|
| Maybe the idea can help you starting things?
|
| It also helps that, sometimes, when the tasks are big, I
| convince myself that I can finish it later. Many times I do
| not have to finish it later..
| slumberlust wrote:
| Is the towel for wiping your mouth? If so I'd call that a
| napkin. If the plate goes on top of it it's more a
| placemats. If serving dishes get set out on it and it
| runs the length the table, a runner.
| JustinCS wrote:
| Related to taking tiny steps, I've set up a daily habit checklist
| with the lowest bar possible, even lower than the author's
| suggested log statement. When it comes to software dev, it's just
| "open my IDE and look at my notes for what to do next". This
| usually just takes 10 seconds, but it's the first step in
| starting and usually leads to me doing at least a bit more, so
| it's helpful when I'm at my lowest in terms of energy. And even
| if I do nothing else, I get some satisfaction that I at least
| completed my to-do and did a tiny bit more than nothing for the
| day.
| unkulunkulu wrote:
| ++ for the "lowest bar" and constantly negotiate with oneself
| on if every line is still valuable and brings profit and not
| despair.
|
| Like "brush teeth", "do nothing at all for half an hour after
| work" "remove trash photos for the day in the phone", "finish
| working" (here I have a detailed sublist ending with "close
| computer lid") "move todos I did not have time for today to
| tomorrow"
|
| another cool habit is "I did list": add items that you did that
| were not planned, because we sometimes forget why we did not do
| something "planned", because we actually did something else
| important that we are just blind to when "planning". for
| example, "meal", "took some rest that I actually need", "took
| out trash", "told someone irritating to fuck off" etc etc
| verisimi wrote:
| In defence of procrastination, perhaps there are good reasons for
| failing to have enthusiasm for whatever-it-is. Perhaps trying to
| do something but being unable to muster the energy is an
| indication that this is not the thing you really ought to be
| doing. That the thing you believe to be a worthy goal is itself a
| false goal, and not where your heart is at, and that you need to
| take a second, deeper look.
|
| Or maybe that is just another excuse :)
| unkulunkulu wrote:
| There is a lot of truth in what you're saying I believe. At
| least, in the "cadence of work". They say in the article about
| consistent productivity for example. But lets think about
| consistency and quantitative productivity (ie amount of work
| per day).
|
| of course we are pressured to be "consistently highly
| productive". But is it healthy and sustainable for everyone?
| Probably not. So I would start with "consistently bare minimum
| productive" and not demand more from myself. If I demand more,
| the "procrastination" kicks in, because my body knows that it
| needs rest and relaxation.
|
| we are not robots: work for us and not we for work.
| verisimi wrote:
| I agree. I even see support of this in the seasons. If you
| think about the difference in light between summer and
| winter, it is far more natural to be up and about when there
| is more light, and far more likely to be 'lazy' in the
| winter. The workweek however is constant, even though the
| quality of time is entirely different. So, in this example
| 'time' throughout the year is not the same - feeling less
| energetic in winter is perfectly acceptable, and not a
| problem.
|
| You can characterise this real factor (quality of time over
| the year) as 'procrastination' but I think this is unfair.
| Other factors such as joy/depression, meaning in work,
| personal circumstances, etc also come in to play. But yeah,
| if 'work' is the highest principle one has, these are just
| excuses for procrastination.
| unkulunkulu wrote:
| Wow! You probably just opened my eyes to the "spring
| productivity boost" pattern clearly observed in my life :)
|
| > But yeah, if 'work' is the highest principle one has,
| these are just excuses for procrastination.
|
| exactly! And even rhyming some other thread here, this
| might happen if "work" is procrastination for the life
| itself. I honestly feel myself here now: work figured out
| as process, but life... oh my I better go write some code.
|
| It's like you're cornered: you're like deer in the
| headlights concerned with "work", if you're not
| "productive", you devalue yourself completely. It could
| happen if you chose work as your primary value long before
| you realized that the same patterns will lead you into the
| corner inside work itself.
|
| It's like running away from one world to another to another
| until there is no further escape. Then hopefully, you start
| to find the way back, because you have the Ariadne's thread
| in your hands.
|
| Good luck to us all :)
| bravesoul2 wrote:
| Oh yeah! There are things that you "have" to do to fit a
| monoculture that are not fun.
| em-bee wrote:
| sure, but it was the only thing paying at the time. so what
| choice did i have? my heart is on building my own project, but
| to do that i'd have to be independently wealthy, or save up at
| least 50k so that i can afford to be without an income for a
| year. at least i learned something so if i managed to focus on
| that i could get some motivation going.
| anal_reactor wrote:
| The older I get, the more I realize there's no point. I'll never
| be rich. I'll never have a family. I'll never go to space. I'll
| never take part in Olympics. Best I can do is beating a video
| game on medium. So I try to focus on that, instead of spending
| 80% of my life trying to make myself 20% more productive.
| nasretdinov wrote:
| This vibe matches perfectly with your nick name :)
| hi41 wrote:
| Regarding the family part. Don't feel terribly bas about not
| having a family. There is the possibility of a divorce and the
| resulting court ordered payments that can be far more
| devastating. It's simply too hard to keep someone else happy
| all the time. Frustrations add up, more fights, more insults,
| more angry words. As humans I don't think we can ever be happy.
| anal_reactor wrote:
| I know, but it still sucks to be alone. It's instinct to seek
| partnership
| 331c8c71 wrote:
| > It's simply too hard to keep someone else happy all the
| time
|
| It's definitely going to be too hard as it is imo simply not
| possible and is a non-goal for a marriage.
| nasretdinov wrote:
| On a serious note, you never actually _know_ that e.g. you'll
| never be rich. E.g. KFC founder was ~62 years old when they
| founded the company. The median age of (successful) founders is
| also roughly 40, if not more.
| em-bee wrote:
| see my comment above. i know that i'll never be rich, nor do
| i want to, because trying to get rich it would interfere with
| how i want to live my life...
| em-bee wrote:
| i'll never be rich either, and contrary to the KFC founder who
| got rich very late it is not lack of opportunity but lack of
| motivation to be rich. as soon as i earn some money i'll spend
| it on hiring others to help me build what i want, or if it is
| enough, even stop earning money to focus on my interests.
|
| family is trickier. finding the right partner is very hard. it
| takes a lot of introspection and being able to recognize flaws
| in yourself and in your partner. it took me decades to
| understand what i need in a partner. and now i feel like i'd
| rather stay alone than have a partner that doesn't fill my
| needs. that sounds very selfish, but it goes of course both
| ways, i also look at the needs of my partner and evaluate
| whether i can fulfill those needs. (in short it's about
| compatible goals. many chinese women for example just want
| their husband to be successful and enable a comfortable life.
| fortunately the woman i found didn't because as i said above,
| that's just not a life goal for me)
|
| when you mention space, the olympics and video games i get the
| impression that those are not even your real goals, and you are
| more likely lamenting that you feel like you don't have
| anything to strive for.
|
| as i wrote above, it took me decades, not just to understand
| what i need in a partner, but simply what i need in life. the
| interesting thing is that now that i think i understand that,
| actually fulfilling that need became less important.
| understanding myself helped me detach.
|
| as for beating procrastination, for me it's not about
| increasing productivity but being productive at all. it's not
| just 20%, it's 200% or more. it's about keeping that job and
| doing enough to get leads for the next one.
| imjonse wrote:
| "Across a decade working at hypergrowth tech companies like Meta
| and Pinterest, I constantly struggled with procrastination [...]
| I was not making progress on the things that mattered."
|
| Maybe unless one can really convince themselves that their daily
| work matters (really matters and not just for their team/company
| metrics) one is bound to procrastinate as a symptom of some
| subconscious sense of pointlessness.
| veunes wrote:
| Yep, it's hard to summon genuine motivation when, deep down,
| something feels meaningless. You can build all the productivity
| systems in the world, but if the work itself feels hollow...
| xorcist wrote:
| Relentlessly trying to lock up as much of the world's
| information as possible behind your login wall, I'd be
| struggling with procrastination as well.
|
| Maybe the answer isn't so much finding new tricks to play on
| your mind, but finding something to do that doesn't involve
| codifying more power in the strong leader, to increase his
| masculinity in the worklace or whatever the political issue du
| jour is.
| ndr42 wrote:
| I observe the opposite: the more important something is the
| more afraid I am to approach it. I procrastinate because it is
| important.
| layer8 wrote:
| I suspect it's because of fear of failure, as failure is more
| consequential the more important the task is.
| annie_muss wrote:
| When I see stories like this I always wonder "How did you get
| and keep jobs at meta and Pinterest if you have a
| procrastination problem?"
|
| I procrastinated so badly I could never apply for jobs. And the
| jobs I did get I lost quickly due to the same procrastination.
| jampekka wrote:
| I think almost everybody has procrastination problems of some
| degree from time to time. Especially in occupations that need
| concentration on complicated things.
|
| But procrastination problems don't mean infinite
| procrastination. It's just that work keeps piling up and then
| it has to be done in a burst when it has to really be done. I
| find this doesn't necessarily mean my output is less (in the
| short term), it's just that it's exhausting.
|
| Also productivity requirements at work, no matter how fancy
| workolace, are typically way less than you may think. Just
| showing up and not actively cause grief goes a long way.
|
| What you tend to see publicly is people in their productive
| phases, or quite exceptional outliers, or just messaging.
| kuboble wrote:
| I was thinking about it a lot.
|
| I think the programmers in most environments aren't judged
| based on some hard metrics that could say someone
| procrastinated half of the time and could have done twice as
| much.
|
| Most judgement comes from remembering whether anything has
| been done at all, and if yes then whether it was sunbathing
| of quality. People (I at least) will rate higher someone who
| worked less but contributed higher quality code. Also good
| contributions to discussion, mentoring juniors is something a
| procrastinator might not even think is work but is valued
| highly.
|
| And even while procrastinating some part of your brain often
| thinks about problem so the time isn't completely lost.
|
| All in all procrastinators aren't as bad as it sounds unless
| we get into some deep pathology.
| polishdude20 wrote:
| My boss met with me this week to have me finish something
| important to get done by Friday. That really kicked me into
| gear this week and I was very motivated and productive. Come
| Friday, no message, no more push from him, no mention of how he
| needs my work or asking how it's going. That instantly tanked
| my motivation to continue
| em-bee wrote:
| in situations like this i forgive them if the only effect is
| that i get work done faster without downsides to my other
| activities/responsibilities. priorities change. if less
| procrastination is the only sideeffect i am not complaining.
| caminante wrote:
| _> Come Friday, no message [...] tanked my motivation to
| continue_
|
| I see the bookends, but notice the root cause
|
| _> That really kicked me into gear [...] I was very
| motivated and productive_
|
| You don't have intrinsic motivation for these tasks and the
| job. This is the thread to pull on. Keep asking "why?"
|
| In the least, I recommend a pro-active note, letting him know
| you're done and ready for his feedback on the assignment or
| new priorities. Figure out why he didn't (or persistently
| doesn't) follow-up.
| kubb wrote:
| My goodness, a FAANG coaster is founding a tech startup -_-
| nilirl wrote:
| The warrant for this claim: The smaller the action you ask from
| yourself, the easier it is to choose it over inaction.
|
| But sometimes it's not inaction we're choosing against; it's
| discomfort.
|
| In that case, this becomes simplistic.
| veunes wrote:
| Breaking things down can still help, but it doesn't magically
| erase the discomfort. It's more like easing into cold water
| melodyogonna wrote:
| I've found that sometimes the first action doesn't even have to
| involve directly working on the problem, just trying to write
| down a series of actions you need to take in a todo list can
| unblock you mentally.
| parpfish wrote:
| Sometimes I can trick myself into getting started that way.
|
| The trick is to come up with a tiny goal and give yourself
| permission to quit once you reach it so it's not like your
| overwhelmed by the full task.
|
| The smallness of the task is important, but it's even more
| important that you genuinely give yourself permission to stop
| when it's done. If you don't do that, it's not "one small
| task", it's "step one in a big task" and you'll keep
| procrastinating
|
| For coding it's a sequence of: "Ill just get all the software
| and documentation open and organized"
|
| "I'll create a few empty files on a new branch"
|
| "I'll just stub out a few things I KNOW I'll need"
|
| ...
|
| For other non-code writing, I've occasionally been able to hack
| it in a similar way by writing progressively more detailed
| outlines.
|
| For physical projects, sometimes it's just about gathering
| supplies and organizing tools.
| raincole wrote:
| I don't know why prestigious institutions like IEEE and Nature
| all have blogs to post fluff and opinion pieces today. Why do
| they need page views?
| veunes wrote:
| The "action precedes motivation" idea is underrated. I've
| definitely found that once I take that first tiny step (open the
| file, write the first test, whatever), things start to flow. It's
| weirdly easy to forget that when you're stuck in that doom-
| scroll-procrastinate spiral.
| hliyan wrote:
| To me, procrastination is the brain overestimating (or perhaps
| just estimating) the unpleasantness of a task in the future. The
| unpleasantness could come from general lack of pleasure in
| performing the task, anticipation of frustration or irritation
| due to a gap in the skills or resources required, anxiety about
| not being able to successfully complete the task, or the output
| of the task not meeting one's personal expectations.
|
| One example for me is getting out of the house: I loathe the idea
| of getting dressed, getting into the car and driving, whenever I
| contemplate it, but once I'm behind the wheel, the thought always
| is "this isn't so bad". If I think about the getting dressed bit,
| that too, thought of in isolation, isn't so bad. It seems it is
| the anticipation of a seemingly complex sequence of tasks that
| tend to put the brain off.
| cardanome wrote:
| It is normal to struggle with procrastination from time to time
| but if is a regular occurrence you need to check the actual
| causes.
|
| You might have ADHD.
|
| And is is very important to know whether you have it or not
| because all that advice for neurotypical people will not work for
| you then. In fact it will harm you. It will make you feel as a
| failure.
|
| You need to figure out how your brain works and only then you
| will finally manage to make lasting changes.
| parpfish wrote:
| What's an example of the kind of advice that _doesn't_ work?
|
| (I'm always curious to learn other potential diagnostic markers
| for adhd)
| jasode wrote:
| _> What's an example of the kind of advice that doesn't
| work?_
|
| For some people struggling with chronic lifelong
| procrastination, the oft-repeated advice from the author such
| as _" Action leads to motivation, not the other way around."_
| ... and similar variants such as, _" Screw motivation, what
| you need is discipline!"_ ... and other related big picture
| ideas such as Dilbert cartoonist Scott Adams' _" Systems
| instead of Goals"_ -- all do not work.
|
| And adding extra rhetorical embellishments to the advice such
| as using the phrase _" it's simple [...]"_, and using the
| word _" [...] just [...]"_ as in:
|
| - _" Stopping procrastination isn't that hard to solve. It's
| simple. Just chop up the task into much smaller subtasks and
| just start on that tiny subtask. That will give you momentum
| to finish it."_
|
| ... also doesn't work. Some procrastinators just
| procrastinate the initiation of starting that tiny subtask!
| For the few that actually do try to start with that first
| step, they'll quickly lose steam because of
| boredom/distraction/whatever and the overall task remains
| unfinished.
|
| A lot of books and blogs about time management repeat the
| same advice that many procrastinators have all heard before
| _and it doesn 't work_. The procrastinators _understand the
| logic of the advice_ but it doesn 't matter because there are
| psychological roadblocks that prevent them from following it.
|
| EDIT reply to: _> That doesn't mean the advice is bad, _
|
| I'm not saying the advice is wrong. Instead, I'm saying that
| some well-meaning people who give that repeated advice seem
| surprised _that it doesn 't work on some people_. Because the
| advice givers believed _" Action Precedes Motivation"_ worked
| on themselves, they automatically assume that _imparting
| those same words to other procrastinators_ will also work. It
| often doesn 't. The meta-analysis of that advice and why it
| sometimes doesn't work is not done because the people giving
| that advice are the ones who used that technique
| successfully. This creates a self-confirmation bias.
| em-bee wrote:
| so what does work then?
|
| isn't the problem here that the answer is very individual.
| for me for example some of the above things do work, and
| some don't. some of the time. it's like it depends and
| there is no clear answer even just for myself. knowing
| whether i had ADHD would not make any difference. i'd still
| not know what works.
|
| for example i have seen tasks lists recommended as one way
| to deal with ADHD. because the lists help focus. isn't
| breaking things down into small steps the same thing?
| others here with ADHD also claim that specific suggestions
| work for them. so this isn't clear cut, and it doesn't make
| sense to just dismiss the suggestions.
|
| you are right, there is more than just getting started.
| boredom and distractions are a problem too. but they are
| also a problem for "normal" people.
|
| seems to me that the only thing we can do is to list a
| number of possible approaches, and let everyone pick what
| works best for them.
|
| so back to the original question: what does work for people
| with ADHD?
| spelunker wrote:
| Honestly, medication.
| cardanome wrote:
| > what does work for people with ADHD
|
| Medication.
|
| Not for everyone with ADHD. Only for 70% but that is
| still pretty good.
|
| Besides that, again understanding how their brains work.
|
| Neurotypical people don't have executive dysfunction. If
| they have a task that they know how to do, have the means
| to do, know they need to do, have the time to do and want
| to do, they can... just do it.
|
| In fact neurotypical people can't even imagine it being
| any other way. For me with ADHD this sounds like a super
| power that I can't even comprehend having.
|
| To simplify it very much, the ADHD brain is chronically
| understimultated. It lacks dopamine.
|
| So easy boring tasks can be insanely painful. That is why
| stimulants work so well. It is not to get us "high", it
| so so we get the same level of stimulation as a
| neurotypical person watching paint dry.
|
| But, we can still get over-stimulated as well so it is a
| balance act.
|
| Neurotypical people mostly manage time and exhaustion, I
| guess but managing ADHD is managing your level of
| stimulation and focus and time tertiary.
|
| You need to build activities into your routine that
| stimulate you, both mentally and physically. Washing your
| clothing can be much more taxing for you that fixing that
| complex bug no one else can figure out. ADHD can make the
| hard things easy and the easy things hard.
|
| So yeah, ultimately every human is different and what
| works for one might not work for another. Yes some advice
| or trick for neurotypical people might also work for
| someone with ADHD but if you don't understand yourself
| you will not know what to user and what to dismiss and
| only hurt yourself.
| parpfish wrote:
| If somebody had "lifelong procrastination" and was
| routinely overwhelmed by simple tasks, my first thought
| would be to see if they are actually dealing with
| depression because it sounds like something bigger.
| cardanome wrote:
| How is depression "bigger" that ADHD? That sounds super
| invalidating.
|
| Being overwhelmed with simple task is typical ADHD
| behavior.
|
| Lots of people with untreated ADHD develop depression as
| well. It is not either/or. Not to mention that there is a
| overlap in symptoms as well.
|
| A diagnosis for ADHD will make sure that there no other
| physical or mental things present that could explain the
| symptoms instead. The will try to exclude anything else
| that could explain your struggles. They check for stuff
| like depression.
|
| On the other hand, a depression diagnosis is just given
| out like candy. I never understood that.
|
| Why wouldn't you ask WHY someone is depressed in the
| first place? I don't mean to invalidate people that are
| depressed. Sometimes that is just what is going on but it
| still vexes me because so many neurodivergent people will
| get diagnosis like "depression" because health care
| providers refuse to look further into it.
|
| It is such an uphill battle get diagnosed with ADHD.
| parpfish wrote:
| I didn't say depression was bigger than adhd. Depression
| is bigger than "I just need a little productivity hack to
| get started"
| bluefirebrand wrote:
| Yes, when I struggled with motivation, procrastination,
| whatever you want to call it, I was diagnosed as
| depressed for years
|
| Turns out, unmedicated ADHD, procrastination, and
| depression are all comorbid
| owebmaster wrote:
| This looks like an answer from a procrastinator that
| actually developed a system to ensure they continue
| procrastinating long-term. Sure, suggestions of systems
| that could help with that won't help without a sometimes
| descomunal effort. That doesn't mean the advice is bad,
| just that it's hard and most people won't be able to
| overcome lifelong procrastination.
| cardanome wrote:
| Your brain does not work the same way as my brain works.
| I am sorry, I know this is hard to believe but you will
| develop some actual emphathy once you accept the fact.
|
| General advice for running a marathon will not for for
| someone who has no legs. I can't will my brain to work
| differently than it does. I can just learn to cope with
| my ADHD brain. And you being judgemental about it will
| not change that.
| owebmaster wrote:
| > Your brain does not work the same way as my brain
| works. I am sorry, I know this is hard to believe but you
| will develop some actual emphathy once you accept the
| fact.
|
| I am also sorry but I do have ADHD and I'm no different
| than any other human being, and so aren't you. Many
| people just deal with it much better than you, but at
| least it means it is possible. Nobody said it is easy but
| people with ADHD have a tendency to think that people
| doing what they need to do have it easy, "they just do
| it". Well, no. That is not how it works. It is hard for
| everybody.
| mtlmtlmtlmtl wrote:
| Your points are well taken, though I want to nuance them a
| bit. My experience(with severe ADHD-C) is that this type of
| advice _can_ work. It 's just that it's not something you
| can just decide to start doing and immediately find success
| at. It's just a lot more complicated to get this off the
| ground, but it's possible. For some complex organisational
| system, you need to compile that system into "ADHD byte
| code" and for that, you need to bootstrap a compiler.
| Create an incredibly simple, extensible system which can do
| things your ADHD brain can't on its own. Then you need to
| find ways to force yourself to follow that system using
| various hacks like alarms tied to QR codes, body doubling,
| regular therapy or home visits, etc. then you can start
| implementing more complex structure in that system. And
| even the simple system is not gonna be _easy_. It 's gonna
| take months of trying, failing, starting over. The ADHD
| brain is absolutely capable of developing habits(just look
| at the comorbidity rates between ADHD and various types of
| addiction), it's just a lot of work.
|
| I'm in the process of doing this myself, and after 8
| months, with many setbacks, I kinda have a base system I'm
| following that's significantly improving my quality of life
| and ability to keep up with everyday tasks. And it's still
| a struggle, but it's getting easier.
|
| I'm writing a blog post about it currently, which will be
| more structured. It's about how I used my software dev
| skills to think about and tackle my ADHD(and other issues).
| Not about writing actual software(although software is
| involved), but imagining the brain exhibiting ADHD is a
| software system , identifying the "bugs", and combining
| concepts from software dev and behavioral/cognitive
| psychology to fix, or at least mitigate them.
|
| This blog post could be finished two days from now, two
| years from now, or never. ADHD is still hard to live with,
| and I'm still quite dysfunctional. I guess if I do finish
| it, it'll be worth reading since I'll be on to something...
| jdenning wrote:
| Please post the link when it's ready - I'm very
| interested
| em-bee wrote:
| better yet, share the link to your blog if you don't mind
| making it public so we can follow it and find the post
| when it's ready. (in my case you can also email me (see
| my profile) and i'll keep it to myself)
| yodsanklai wrote:
| > Across a decade working at hypergrowth tech companies like Meta
| and Pinterest, I constantly struggled with procrastination
|
| I used to procrastinate a lot when I was a PhD student and later
| in academia. Sometimes, it was literally weeks of doing nothing
| and stressing out.
|
| I eventually migrated to big tech and I now rarely procrastinate.
| We have pretty tangible goals, good results are rewarded and lack
| of results would raise concerns pretty quickly.
|
| In my case, working in the right environment helped a lot with
| procrastination.
| jrrrp wrote:
| It's good to read this while being in one of those nothing-
| months myself. I have extended the deadlines and my goals are
| not clear.
|
| Incidentally, I have a supervisor who felt the exact same way
| when he was doing his PhD and fled to industry. Evidently he
| found that there was something to be enjoyed in the freedoms of
| research and returned.
| shreddit wrote:
| > lack of results would raise concerns pretty quickly. In my
| case, working in the right environment helped a lot with
| procrastination.
|
| Sounds more like fear than "not" procrastinating.
|
| But on the other hand fear is a good motivator
| haunter wrote:
| I need something like that not for work... but for hobbies.
| wseqyrku wrote:
| There was one quote that helped me get past this, "self-
| discipline is a form of self-respect" and there's no way around
| that if you don't have any.
| predkambrij wrote:
| I like to have phone with 30min countdown, this helps me keep
| sense of time. Sort of like pomodoro, but for a different
| purpose.
| ednite wrote:
| Some great comments in this thread and I agree, a lot of it comes
| down to understanding yourself.
|
| In my case, not always, but often, procrastination shows up when
| fear is involved. Fear of failure, of not doing something
| perfectly, of the task being too big. What's helped me is turning
| the task into a challenge, because I know that personally, I
| thrive on challenges. It re-frames the fear into something
| exciting, and once I get started, I follow all of the other
| advice such like breaking it down into small steps. Thanks for
| sharing.
| athenot wrote:
| I've had a similar experience. If it's a "I must do" with high
| stakes, I get a fear of failure, fear of disappointing and if
| left unchecked it unfortunately becomes a self-fulfilling
| prophecy.
|
| However, challenges that start with "I wonder if"--like
| wondering if some bold idea just might actually be possible--
| give me a huge reservoir of energy to work well beyond my
| normal limits and find new solution that truly make a
| difference.
|
| Of course in most projects, actual innovation is only a
| fraction of the work so some reframing of "run the business"
| tasks is necessary. That's when I tap into gratitude: for being
| able to work on a project, for being entrusted with a
| particular task, etc.
| ednite wrote:
| I like your approach of reframing with gratitude, may borrow
| that. Thanks!
| subhro wrote:
| Make your own bed (?)
|
| Ref: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=pxBQLFLei70
| throwpoaster wrote:
| Sometimes what one self-describes as procrastination is actually
| ADHD or values misalignment -- sometimes one cannot work for
| reasons that are not personal failings.
|
| I have found that "procrastination" is not a particularly helpful
| word because, for me, its meaning includes a shame component that
| can obfuscate causes.
| yde_java wrote:
| Before coding on the actual problem I usually start with a tiny
| refactoring of something that's related. That's my warming up
| sports before tackling the actual exercise. Works 100% for me.
| kriro wrote:
| I disagree with the idea that getting past procrastination should
| (always) be the target.
|
| Mostly because I don't think procrastination is inherently bad.
| There's a lot of stigma attached to procrastination as it's seen
| as being "unproductive". But I think procrastination can lead to
| great insights.
|
| Your brain is telling you that it is not interested in the
| current task. The question is: Why? Overworked and needs a break?
| Much more interested in exploring something else? Protecting
| against the pain of failure?
|
| Investigating the why instead of forcing "overcoming" is quite
| fruitful in my personal experience.
|
| My guess is "action leads to motivation" might be helpful for
| solving one of the root causes (likely fear of failure/imposter
| syndrom) but not all of them.
| CharlieDigital wrote:
| I procrastinate a lot on hard tasks and usually it's because I
| don't yet fully understand the risks with each decision that
| goes into the design.
|
| I think for younger engineers "fail fast" makes a lot of sense;
| there's not enough of a foundation of experience to tell right
| from wrong so the only way to learn is to fail.
|
| For more experienced engineers, there's a greater sense of "I
| have a sense where this can fail; how do I design around that?"
|
| It's not that a more experienced engineer will know _exactly_
| how it fails, but that there are modalities of failure that
| have been encountered so the goal is to design with some
| flexibility or optionality in mind. And sometimes, this just
| requires a bit of "gestation" or "percolation" before carving
| the path.
|
| I think of it like an experienced sculptor sizing up a block of
| marble before making the first strike with a chisel. It's a
| kind of procrastination, but really, its a process of
| visualizing the path.
| mnemonk wrote:
| Wow, that's a really insightful perspective. I often feel a
| bit ashamed for reading hacker news or some other IT related
| post on the net when I know I should be doing some
| development task. Your description pretty accurately
| describes the reasons for my procrastination. Thank you.
| nine_k wrote:
| This is a solid observation.
|
| I'd say that procrastination is bad when it drives you into
| some unproductive but addictive behavior, like watching silly
| tiktok videos, etc. It can be actually good if you do
| "structured procrastination": can't force myself to do task
| X, but find solace in solving problem Y really neatly.
| Another approach is to take a walk, do push-ups, etc,
| anything that changes your focus away from mental tasks, and
| preferably brings more oxygen to your brain.
|
| Yet another approach is analytical: "I can't stomach doing
| that thing! But what thoughts or feelings make me loathe it
| so much? Where do they come from?" Interesting insights can
| follow.
| mromanuk wrote:
| I procrastinate all the time, listen to much to your mind or
| chase the fun stuff only, would not get you traction, probably
| it's a distraction, because the mind is lazy. Most of our
| systems wants to conserve energy or expend at little as
| possible. Going to the gym in a cold morning is not something
| that the mind or body is seeking, so listen to the idea of not
| going would be bad for you. Muscles are lazy too, they just
| want to chill. But if you make them do a little work, they like
| it and ask for more. We are weird and we need to force us to do
| stuff. That's your job, you command your body
| satisfice wrote:
| Well said!
|
| The productivity fetishists want us to hate ourselves for
| resisting the orders issued by the executive mind. Fuck that.
| tejohnso wrote:
| > Your brain is telling you that it is not interested in the
| current task. The question is: Why?
|
| I think for a lot of us it's something like: Because it's
| nonsense busywork that I don't care about. Procrastinating
| isn't going to help, and it is absolutely bad because it leads
| to uncompleted tasks and that leads to financial distress. I
| need to get it done regardless of whether it's going to provide
| a dopamine hit or not. Best thing to do is to stop thinking
| about it and get it out of the way so that I can focus on the
| things I want to do. I'm not overworked, I just don't want to
| do this task. I am interested in exploring something else but
| that's not a choice that I have right now. I don't have the
| privilege of doing whatever I feel like doing. Pain of failure?
| No, it's not at all something that I'll fail at. It's drudgery
| avoidance. Unfortunately there's plenty of drudgery that has to
| be completed.
| Kiro wrote:
| That's nice and all but when your procrastination prevents you
| from doing anything at all for months it doesn't really feel
| like it's a good thing.
| ponector wrote:
| Why? The answer is easy: the work is pointless corporate
| bullshit. Not sure if it ever going to hit the prod at all. But
| they pay huge salary and I need money. Turns out nice things
| are expensive.
| thenoblesunfish wrote:
| This post and similar advice is aimed at people who feel pain
| from procrastination. You are not one of them, probably. It's
| not an inherently bad thing, just like any number of things
| some, not all, people struggle greatly with (drugs, food,
| etc.).
| devenson wrote:
| When stuck I do what I call "prepping". Don't try to do the task,
| just prep for it -- clean the room, the desk, close distracting
| websites, gather the materials.
|
| It's lowering the activation energy so the reaction can happen
| more easily.
| polishdude20 wrote:
| I notice cleaning had a huge effect on greasing the wheels for
| me. It's the decluttering for me which I think prevents me from
| thinking about all the stuff on the counter in some far off
| place in my mind.
| em-bee wrote:
| cleaning for me is just another form of procrastination. the
| reason i think that is because once i am done cleaning i feel
| no better or more motivated to do the work. on the contrary i
| feel frustrated by how much time i spent cleaning up.
| satisfice wrote:
| Procrastination is not a problem. The problem is being unhappy
| with procrastination.
|
| I accept it as part of my life, because I believe it is an
| intuitive process that protects me from doing bad work.
|
| There are times when I really have to get something done, and
| then I need to put pressure on myself. But mostly I have learned
| to listen to and respect my procrastination.
| fHr wrote:
| I read this to Procrastinate of course...
| adamnemecek wrote:
| Procrastination is a sign that you don't give a shit.
| Ericson2314 wrote:
| It is correct on self-esteem and procrastination being
| bidirectionally linked
| 4ndrewl wrote:
| Don't forget folks, Always Be Productive!
| chistev wrote:
| They say we procrastinate when we feel anxious about the task we
| are supposed to be doing.
| kazinator wrote:
| I'm not addicted to procrastination. I can start any time I want
| to!
| uptownfunk wrote:
| Maybe fighting it itself is a form of exercise. Maybe fighting it
| is an end in itself regardless if you got anything done. But not
| trying is the failure.
| agumonkey wrote:
| Some people describe that as momentum preserving workflow.
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