[HN Gopher] As a developer, my most important tools are a pen an...
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As a developer, my most important tools are a pen and a notebook
Author : ingve
Score : 336 points
Date : 2025-05-28 06:27 UTC (16 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (hamatti.org)
(TXT) w3m dump (hamatti.org)
| bufferoverflow wrote:
| I don't understand the pen/physical notebook thing. It's slow to
| write, insanely slow to search what you've written, almost
| impossible to copy or share.
| abid786 wrote:
| In comparison it's much faster to draw, infinitely more
| portable and much less distracting. I use pen and paper for
| self notes that are throwaway in nature or exploring ideas. For
| artefacts that are meant to be shared with others I use a
| computer
| Brajeshwar wrote:
| I believe that is the beauty. It makes you be intentional, your
| mind slows down at a pace that does a double write to your
| brain (helping you remember better). If remembering with your
| brain is the RAM, then writing it down is the ROM.
| kubami wrote:
| In the context of this post it's not about preserving or
| sharing the thoughts. Writing, in this case, is a "thinking
| tool". Forcing yourself to materialise the thoughts as actual,
| written, text helps form clear ideas.
| jes5199 wrote:
| that's so alien to me. for me, writing by hand is frustrating
| to the point of distraction. if I want to think clearly, my
| best bet is to do it silently, in my head.
| serial_dev wrote:
| That's great if you can do it!
|
| To me, if the problem is too complex, or more likely, if I
| expect to be distracted by family and chores, "building in
| my head" is not the best option as it all falls apart and
| need to build it up from scratch (though admittedly faster
| than last time).
| karn97 wrote:
| My brain has enough memory
| raincole wrote:
| It's a road bump that forces you to slow down. Which is
| sometimes a good thing, like taking a shower or walk.
| forty wrote:
| people's brains all work differently and for some of them
| manually writing help them think better, and apparently your
| are not in this case. I don't think there is much else to
| understand.
| specproc wrote:
| Each to their own.
|
| I wholeheartedly agree with the author. I find it really hard
| to think deeply at a computer. Too many distractions.
|
| The speed of writing and search isn't a problem for me. With
| the writing, I wish I could write faster, but deep thinking
| isn't fast anyway.
|
| Search, well, 99% of what I write is never looked at again.
| It's all a process of working things out, committing stuff to
| memory.
|
| Whenever I'm stuck, stepping away from the computer is usually
| the best way forward.
| sph wrote:
| From a quick search:
|
| https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/why-writing-by-ha...
|
| https://stackoverflow.blog/2022/11/23/why-writing-by-hand-is...
|
| Writing by hand definitely is better for a squirrel brain like
| me. And searching is overrated, most note-taking is write-only
| and tends to accumulate without anyone ever reading it back. So
| optimize for memory retention so you can later form better
| mental associations with the material, rather than how
| searchable on a computer it is. Notes on a PC are inert, what
| you want is to integrate their contents into your brain so you
| can actually do something with it.
| WalterBright wrote:
| Write on!
| Edd314159 wrote:
| I also use a notebook and pen constantly as a software engineer
| - but never when I need any of the properties you just
| mentioned.
|
| It is absolutely the wrong tool for any long-term information
| store. Ephemeral think-it-through process notes only. Obsidian
| for anything that should live longer than the current problem
| I'm trying to solve.
| _thisdot wrote:
| I used to have a hybrid setup of paper as an offloading tool
| + Notion as a knowledge management system. However, since
| moving to Obsidian, I've never felt the need to use paper.
| Adding a line item in my daily note is much faster and
| efficient for me
| bananapub wrote:
| So what? It's not for any of those things. It's part of the
| thinking process, same as having a walk and letting your mind
| wander or having a shower.
| draven wrote:
| I use a notebook. It forces me to slow down. I don't like to
| cross/erase blocks of text so I actually think about what I'm
| about to write before writing it. It helps the same way rubber
| duck debugging does.
|
| Also: I just like writing.
| gofreddygo wrote:
| Funny. I was tolling the virtues of my spiral notebook which is
| always on my desk to a coworker, whom I was trying to get out
| of some trouble and i got... silence. That notebook is the
| difference between said coworker and I. She didn't get it.
|
| That notebook is the fastest most accessible tool to capture my
| thoughts. I can state concisely what was discussed in a team
| meeting last october before any notetaking tool boots up. I
| know kids names, birthdays and favorite movies of almost all my
| coworkers which I can glance without switching windows while
| sharing my screen.
|
| the impossibility of such content being legible to anyone else
| and being shared is a feature I value very highly.
|
| i take it where i want, introspect, take notes. No screen. No
| distractions. I doodle, draw lines, write jokes, whatever.
|
| Pages on the right are work things. On the left are my ideas.
| Index on the first page tells me exactly where to turn to for
| that idea and mockups i had on filling tedious forms.
|
| I know when I'm spinning my wheels. I can see the gaps in my
| thinking from months ago. I can see patterns in human behavior
| that I would otherwise have not noticed.
|
| The simplicity is a huge advantage. I stopped looking for
| anything better. I don't try to promote it either (except on
| rare occasions). Saved me hours.
| MrGilbert wrote:
| I think an analog note taking device (woah!) requires more
| discipline than a digital one. In the digital world, you can
| always re-arrange your chaos at almost no cost, whereas you
| are screwed in the analog world. I'm curious: How do you
| organize your notes? If you mind to share.
| rsclarke wrote:
| The bullet journal method is a popular way.
| gofreddygo wrote:
| First there's a work notebook and a personal one. both are
| semi structured, but work one has more structure.
|
| first page is always for index, split vertically and you
| get roughly 80 entries with about 3-4 words each. one for
| each page that i number as i go writing through the book.
| index usually has just pointers to days when i get
| interesting ideas.
|
| each right page is for 1 week that i label up top. a small
| margin is dedicated for recurring meetings. using only the
| right side allows quickly flipping through. rest of the
| page is for todos and logs.
|
| left pages are for related thoughts, ideas, etc from that
| week. sometimes overflows but not by much.
|
| For wordy stuff, i use pages from the back of the book. I
| don't use sentences much. Just few words with lines
| connecting them.
|
| Thats pretty much it - index, numbered pages and using just
| the right side per week. It works wonders for how simple it
| is. You'll find something else that works for you. Don't
| overthink this. Just start with a structure and let it
| evolve.
|
| side note - i do use a folder for plain text notes on my
| work laptop (that i keep open in sublime) for links and
| text that benefits from copy and paste. i would not care if
| it all got deleted or leaked out to the world. I also have
| another folder of interesting bookmarks and articles
| exported to pdf for reading on a flight on my phone. i have
| a dozen or so google docs with my thoughts on topics i'm
| interested in.
| MrGilbert wrote:
| > You'll find something else that works for you. Don't
| overthink this. Just start with a structure and let it
| evolve.
|
| I'm currently looking at a stack of lovely
| "Leuchtturm1917" A5 note books. The way I took notes for
| the last three years has been chaotic, that's why I was
| interested in your way of doing them. I think, finding a
| mode of work and let it grow and iterate over time is the
| way to go. I see room for improvement with regards to how
| I structure my notes, so that I can find them again -
| that's what I'm struggeling with in my analog world. So,
| thanks for your insights, they are really valuable!
| johnisgood wrote:
| What do you do when you make a mistake? Do you use an
| eraser instead of backspace? That is my major problem
| with notebooks.
|
| I type much faster on a keyboard, I can read it even a
| month from now while I can't do that with my own
| handwriting, and when I make a mistake, I can quickly and
| easily correct it.
| MrGilbert wrote:
| > What do you do when you make a mistake? Do you use an
| eraser instead of backspace?
|
| I my books, I use Tipp-Ex for that. I usually write with
| a ballpoint pen.
| Hamatti wrote:
| I do almost no organising of my paper notes. The only thing
| I do is that I add a date to the corner of the first page
| of when I start making a specific note and I keep index
| pages where I list page/note titles (or topics, themes, not
| everything have a title) and a page number.
|
| I often browse my notes even when I'm not looking for
| anything. I read what I've been thinking previously because
| that often sparks new ideas and thoughts.
|
| One thing where I find pen and paper superior to digital is
| that it's easy to write in the margins, draw arrows and
| annotate. When I got my first iPad and tested out digital
| notebook tools (with stylus), I was excited about the idea
| that I can resize and move my existing drawings around.
|
| Then it took me a few days to notice that I don't really
| ever need that. I don't need my "finished" notes to look
| tidy or good. I got over the need to have organised and
| structured notebooks and embraced the chaos.
|
| I guess it's different things for different people. For me,
| the flexibility of paper is superior to any digital
| solution because it has the shortest "input lag" or
| "feedback loop" to my brain. I'm happy to sacrifice other
| potential benefits for that.
| tony-allan wrote:
| All true but I find that a pen and paper and a couple of
| diagrams help me think and solidify an idea.
| serial_dev wrote:
| I took the pen+notebook idea a bit further, I use pen+paper (a
| sheet of paper).
|
| To me, none of the qualities you listed matter when it comes to
| sketching ideas, thinking about problems, staying on track
| while problem solving. When I'm done with the task, I read
| through my notes once and throw it out.
| WalterBright wrote:
| I date the handwritten pages and keep them. I've been
| attacked more than once for copying, the notebook offers
| acceptable proof of provenance.
|
| It serves the same purpose as the lab notebook does for a
| researcher.
|
| The notebook doesn't take up significant room. If you still
| have a space problem, run it through a scanner.
| WalterBright wrote:
| If you want to get the most out of a physics lecture, leave the
| laptop at home. Instead, bring a spiral notebook and some
| colored pens. Write everything down the prof writes on the
| blackboard.
|
| It's remarkable how much of the lecture you'll remember. And
| when you read your handwritten notes, you'll remember the
| lecture that went with it.
| guappa wrote:
| Yeah good luck writing with coloured pens at the speed
| teachers speak.
| aragilar wrote:
| Why are you focusing on what they are saying, rather than
| what they are writing (there's an important distinction)?
| WalterBright wrote:
| I would copy what they were writing. The professors had 9
| blackboards available, and they'd use them all during a
| 55 minute lecture, and then some. Some would write with
| their left hand while erasing with the right (!). It was
| a heluva time for me. Never before or since have I
| learned so much so fast. Blink and I fell behind.
|
| In retrospect, I sorely wished I had set up a cassette
| recorder and recorded all the audio. It would be a gold
| mine today, as all those lectures are lost to time.
|
| On the other hand, I had no money to buy cassette tapes
| at the time.
| WalterBright wrote:
| I managed it for 4 years in college, with usually 3 hours
| of lecture per day. Was it work? Sure. One was busy the
| whole lecture. But the results were clear.
|
| My favorite pens at the time were the Pilot pens. Today I
| love the Tul pens.
|
| I have long since scanned them all in. I should post them
| on my website, just for fun.
| 2b3a51 wrote:
| Suggestion: Write on the right hand page and leave the left
| page blank (that's the back of the page if you fold the pages
| over).
|
| Then go over the notes later and summarise or add details on
| those left hand pages. I used to do the colour
| pen/highlighting then.
|
| Worked for me half a century ago. No data format problems or
| need for legacy hardware either.
| johnisgood wrote:
| But I am left-handed!
|
| Jokes aside, I often used to take notes only on the left
| side because of it, and sometimes the right side, except
| upside down.
| pif wrote:
| If you only need to write sentences, what you say makes sense.
|
| If you need to draw approximate diagrams, or formulae, or
| flows, or trees, or whatever else, instead...
| Veen wrote:
| They aren't optimising for speed, sharing, or searchability.
| Notes of this type aren't an inadequate database, but a tool
| for thinking. Note-takers visualize and symbolise their
| thinking while they work through a problem. Writing and drawing
| reduce cognitive load and externalise information so it doesn't
| have to be held in memory. Notes also create a useful record of
| that process so you can see how you got to your solution.
| Notebooks are just a convenient UI for that process.
| cladopa wrote:
| I use A4 sheets of paper, pens with different colours and
| fluorescent markers. Nothing beats that for me (and I have a
| iPad Pro with stylus) and I use emacs with org mode too.
|
| I use an automatic scanner to store the important papers as
| documentation. Now you can even send those to gemini or google
| cloud to digitalise it for cheap.
|
| At any given time I have four sheets of paper over my desk that
| I can see in parallel, but I could have 8 or 10 for complex
| problems with areas equivalent to engineering or architectural
| blueprints.
|
| Having said that, I can draw and paint very well as I was
| interested since childhood and had formal training. Probably is
| not for everyone, but it is for me.
| _Algernon_ wrote:
| I mean the obvious example is that you can sketch graphs or
| figures easily without any additional friction. Very few
| digital notes allow that.
| wrp wrote:
| Division on this topic reminds me of the division between those
| who prefer light vs heavy development tools. Some enjoy
| mastering and wielding powerful tools, but others see them as a
| distraction.
| Eavolution wrote:
| I like it when trying to work things out/design things as I can
| easily scribble down quick drawings to keep myself right. This
| is much easier with a pencil and paper than trying to do it on
| a computer to me.
| jbs789 wrote:
| Many studies showing it aids recall more effectively than
| typing or event writing on a tablet.
| Hamatti wrote:
| OP here.
|
| > It's slow to write
|
| Only to an extent. I write fast enough with pen and paper that
| my thinking is the bottleneck -- which isn't really that fast.
| I don't need to write down everything I think so it also acts
| as a filter and processor of those thoughts.
|
| > insanely slow to search what you've written
|
| Compared to digital notes system, sure. But the way I use my
| notes, I don't usually need a full-text search to find stuff. I
| remember what I've been working on, I often browse through my
| notebooks to revisit ideas and most often these notebook notes
| are kind of a "working copy" where the search relevance is
| often just for the feature so it only needs to be fast to
| search for a few days or weeks.
|
| I also do copy many of my notes down in digital format too when
| there's something worth capturing for long term storage for the
| sake of searching for example.
|
| > almost impossible to copy or share
|
| 100%. Sharing is not a consideration for me, these are my raw
| pure thoughts and explorations, they don't often make much
| sense to other people as-is. Sometimes I may take a photo of a
| UI sketch or something to share if needed but otherwise when I
| have something to share, I write it based on my notes rather
| than sharing my notes as they are.
| roryirvine wrote:
| Searching through a physical notebook does take a few
| moments, but the upside is all of that context you get to
| drink in during the search.
|
| I typically get through a couple of B5 pages a day, so homing
| in on the thing I want to look at is a matter of opening the
| notebook to roughly the right fortnight and then flicking
| through up to a dozen pages in either direction. A tenth of a
| second per page is enough to scan for major events - what
| projects was I working on at the time? Were there any major
| interruptions to my flow, or changes in direction?
|
| And then, once I've found the right day, seeing the detail of
| everything I was doing at the time triggers a flood of
| memories - I remember all of the conversations, decisions,
| problems, and ideas that were current at the time of the
| entry in question.
|
| I've tried a number of digital notetaking systems, but none
| has been able to give me so much context so quickly as a
| paper notebook.
| hk1337 wrote:
| > slow to write
|
| that's probably the most important thing. it forces you to slow
| down and think it through and actually absorb it.
|
| Searching what I have written in the past would be useless for
| me because it wouldn't necessarily make sense. It's more about
| the physically writing it out.
| js4ever wrote:
| Calling a notebook the "most important tool" for a dev is pure
| romanticism. Useful for some, sure, but let's not pretend it
| outweighs a debugger, version control, or CI. This isn't
| craftsmanship cosplay, it's software engineering.
| zwnow wrote:
| In a few years of my career now I never had to use a debugger
| or CI. Console debugging is good enough usually. On version
| control I agree.
| 01HNNWZ0MV43FF wrote:
| CI is really nice with multiple platforms or multiple people.
| Solo projects for Linux, I never bother
| polishdude20 wrote:
| I was the same until I started working on a Go server. It
| helps immensely when I want to know the value of objects say
| when a request is handled and how that flows.
| aerhardt wrote:
| I do not know what you work on, but debugging is
| indispensable for certain workloads. Print debugging doesn't
| come close to setting up a breakpoint and inspecting every
| single variable in the stack with a good interface. You don't
| even have to select what to print and where, _anything_ can
| be printed _anywhere_ in two clicks. A UI like the debuggers
| in Jetbrains IDEs provides smart rendering for all types so
| that for example map or list elements can be collapsed. The
| entire call stack is neatly organized and searchable too. It
| saves hours, creates less friction and also greatly enhances
| exploratory debugging, where you don't even know where in the
| call stack your problem might be. I'd feel very hindered and
| unhappy if I didn't have access to a good debugger.
| zwnow wrote:
| I dont know, sounds more like a design issue to me, if your
| app requires this amount of information to get debugged
| properly.
| trueismywork wrote:
| Really? Just try debugging a Dijkstra like algorithm and
| then talk about design issues.
| karn97 wrote:
| You seem to have worked on small simple projects thus far
| then.
| guappa wrote:
| Or on embedded systems
| planb wrote:
| I don't know you or your work. But I know (senior) developers
| that don't use a debugger and I've often noticed that when
| fixing a bug, they don't build a full mental model of what
| really goes wrong and often just fix the symptoms. Think
| "that shouldn't be null, we need a null check here" instead
| of "why is this value null? we should check here, but also
| make sure the caller works correctly."
| johnisgood wrote:
| You can have that kind of thinking or mental model with and
| without debuggers though. I do not see how it is relevant
| to debuggers.
| vacuity wrote:
| On the other hand, though this is n = 1 and from 2000 (and
| it is classic Linus):
|
| Linus Torvalds:
|
| > I don't like debuggers. Never have, probably never will.
| I use gdb all the time, but I tend to use it not as a
| debugger, but as a disassembler on steroids that you can
| program.
|
| > I don't think kernel development should be "easy". I do
| not condone single-stepping through code to find the bug. I
| do not think that extra visibility into the system is
| necessarily a good thing.
|
| > Oh. And sure, when things crash and you fsck and you
| didn't even get a clue about what went wrong, you get
| frustrated. Tough. There are two kinds of reactions to
| that: you start being careful, or you start whining about a
| kernel debugger.
|
| > I happen to believe that not having a kernel debugger
| forces people to think about their problem on a different
| level than with a debugger. I think that without a
| debugger, you don't get into that mindset where you know
| how it behaves, and then you fix it from there. Without a
| debugger, you tend to think about problems another way. You
| want to understand things on a different _level_.
|
| https://lkml.org/lkml/2000/9/6/65
|
| And I agree. At least for me, print debugging goes a long
| way, and I'm already invested in building mental models
| about code. I think using a proper debugger has to be the
| last resort, because nothing else works and it's time to
| get into the ugly details. Two valuable avenues for
| producing good code are formal verification (and its ilk,
| such as specification) and horse sense/common sense, which
| combine to say that we should have rigorous mental models
| that impose on our code. That's the primary objective, to
| me. The use of tools such as debuggers is secondary, and in
| my experience, largely neutral or harmful. There's the
| classic caveat of "if your goal is to ship code fast, then
| this isn't practical", which is fair, but I have some
| things to say about shucking off that culture.
| skydhash wrote:
| Debugger for me is more about inspection than actual
| debugging, especially when dealing with a complex
| systems. It's possible to just use a printf, but the
| debugger gives more information. It's rare that I need to
| do stepping. I mostly just want to see the stack trace
| and the state of the program. One of the nice thing about
| Common Lisp and Smalltalk is to be able to do this any
| single point.
| xnorswap wrote:
| The conclusion I draw from this is that some debuggers are so
| bad it's not delivering value over "print debugging".
|
| But perhaps it's a lack of knowing what a debugger can
| deliver.
|
| A debugger gives you the ability to immediately dive in and
| instantly inspect the complete stack trace, all the values on
| the stack, all the values of local variables, etc. Without
| restarting the program or calling out specifically what
| you're going to want to inspect ahead of time.
|
| A debugger will "pause the world" and let you see all the
| parallel stacks.
|
| A debugger will let you set conditional breakpoints. If you
| need to debug the conditions for when a variable gets set to
| a particular value, a conditional breakpoint on the variable
| set to break when it's set to that particular value makes
| that a doddle.
|
| A debugger will let you enumerate collections and re-write
| values on the fly.
|
| A debugger will let you break on exceptions, even ones
| normally caught and handled.
|
| A debugger can launch and attach itself.
|
| All of that is a massive force-multiplier and time-saver,
| which print debugging doesn't deliver.
| wiz21c wrote:
| A debugger doesn't show you the evolution of your program
| over time. A few well placed prints give you that.
|
| I use my debugger often, but sometimes you need to track
| the value of something over time (say, over 1000
| iterations) and a debugger can't show you that.
|
| So prints are still relevant. Debugger are more for
| "needle-in-haystack" stuff I think.
|
| A debugger that could record the execution over time (and
| query that execution), that would be great. I know there
| are some, but are there for python for example ?
| lcnPylGDnU4H9OF wrote:
| > I know there are some
|
| Do you mind providing examples? I'm not sure what I would
| search to find that and I'm interested in the idea.
| danadam wrote:
| I've never used it but sounds like https://rr-
| project.org/
| Tainnor wrote:
| A debugger will also allow you to step through library and
| framework code where you can't usually go and place print
| statements.
| yetihehe wrote:
| Debuggers are important tool, but not all debugger are good
| and not all problems require debugger. That's why I wrote a
| simple tool, which given a list of methods and classes will
| printf to log every invocation and exit of selected functions
| (via java reflection and function rewriting). It was much
| better than a normal debugger at finding actual flow of data
| in very complex multi-program system, so essentially
| machinegun-printf saved the day.
| HelloNurse wrote:
| There are different categories of tools.
|
| You can design a house on paper, but you need e.g. mallets
| and wheelbarrows to build it; you can design software with
| "tools for thought", more or less computerized, but you need
| the automation offered by CI, version control etc. to handle
| the more concrete aspects properly.
| stackedinserter wrote:
| It means that you don't write anything complex.
| paganel wrote:
| Which is most probably the majority of us, computer
| programmers.
| mosselman wrote:
| Thanks for pointing this out. In the same vein there are so
| many posts about productivity systems where people put endless
| amount of time into crafting their gtd notebooks with tabs and
| lists, etc. All that time spent to be productive instead of
| actually being productive. Or people describing their ideal
| Obsidian work flows instead of actually noting anything useful
| down in it. People writing about how they built their own
| blogging engine because their particular way of blogging is so
| unique that they had to hand-roll something. All that time
| spent on building a blog rather than blogging. (I've been there
| too).
|
| I love "This isn't craftsmanship cosplay, it's software
| engineering.". I will definitely steal this, let me put it in
| my notebook.
| blippage wrote:
| As some wag on Reddit put it, "Digital Note Taking Systems:
| Cutting and pasting your life away, one note at a time."
| martindbp wrote:
| You see this everywhere. In sports its the people who spend
| most of their time worrying about their equipment instead of
| just playing the game. I was there with learning Chinese as
| well, spent way more time thinking about tools than actually
| learning the language.
| verzali wrote:
| The people wearing the shiny new running shoes at the start
| of the race rarely finish anywhere close to the front.
| onion2k wrote:
| The literal argument here is fine - using a notebook is
| antiquated and we have better tools.
|
| But the _sentiment_ holds true. When you 're building software
| designing good code is the most fundamentally important aspect
| of your job. All the tools you mention are things that enable
| you to delivery that code, but if the design of the code itself
| is wrong then they mean very little. The process of designing
| code feels like a lost art these days; developers are far too
| happy to throw crap at a wall until enough of it sticks to pass
| the acceptance criteria. Going back to actually working out the
| logic and flow of the code (on paper, in a diagramming app,
| whatever) is missing for a vast amount of the dev community.
|
| If people were happy to work through the logic of a feature
| before hitting their IDE and debugging the first thing they
| code up, maybe apps would be a bit less buggy.
| MonkeyClub wrote:
| > using a notebook is antiquated and we have better tools
|
| Although I would agree that we have more _modern_ tools, I 'm
| not sure they're better along every dimension: pen and paper
| is better for memory retention than typing. Also, while YMMV,
| oen and paper works wonders for brainstorming for me.
|
| Though admittedly search is easier with digital tools.
| directevolve wrote:
| For fast, physically intuitive, flow-of-thought expression,
| there's nothing like pen and paper, for me.
|
| I throw away almost all my handwritten notes, because of
| the downsides: illegibility, unsearchability, physical
| bulk.
|
| But the qualitative difference of thinking or reading +/-
| handwriting is huge. I don't get caught up in editing. I
| can draw diagrams easily. It slows me down, makes me dwell
| on an idea while I'm writing it, and thereby physically
| calibrates my thought process.
| coldblues wrote:
| Finally someone had the guts to say it. I see the same
| arguments again and again that writing in a notebook makes you
| remember things better and think more thoroughly, but who
| exactly was tested here? Were people with an extensive and
| deeply personal Zettelkasten note taking system added as
| participants in the studies? What was their note taking
| process? Most people severely underutilize or even misuse their
| digital tools. Just take a look at people who use Notion ;)
|
| I iterate faster, have more freedom and information is
| displayed and manipulated in a more ergonomic way to me on a
| computer, in such a way that it creates a symbiotic
| relationship. I severely doubt physical notetaking and
| brainstorming could ever compare
| anonzzzies wrote:
| > Finally someone had the guts to say it.
|
| ? It's the (mostly anonymous) internet and not linkedin.
| People call these things out all the time?
| ptero wrote:
| Different people learn and work in different ways. To become
| comfortable with a new complex topic I personally have to
| work things out, with a pencil and an eraser, on a piece of
| paper.
|
| And even writing software I often make toss-away paper
| sketches; they help me see things in a way that make sense to
| me. Not replacing a computer, but complementing it. I would
| not push my method on everyone but it works for me. I also
| think similar techniques are fairly common. People discuss
| ideas verbally. They take walks to let brain take a different
| view, etc. My 2c.
| reaperducer wrote:
| _I see the same arguments again and again that writing in a
| notebook makes you remember things better and think more
| thoroughly, but who exactly was tested here?_
|
| Plenty of the research is online for you to answer your own
| question.
| epolanski wrote:
| I would say that planning, analyzing and tracking is by far the
| most important part of engineering process, software or not.
|
| I'm personally not a fan of pen and paper, I find it to not
| scale, I often change devices or I'm on the move, so I rely
| mostly on note apps (mostly Notion).
| austin-cheney wrote:
| If you need a framework to do the job you were hired to perform
| then, clearly, that framework is the most important tool. You
| likely don't exist professionally without it.
|
| For people with higher confidence, those of us who have been
| around the block a few times, the article is correct. The
| supporting tools you mention are beneficial, but they aren't
| _the most important tool_. The most important tool is soft
| skills and taking notes.
| wrp wrote:
| "Most important tool" depends on what you mean by "important".
| For TFA, it means the environment where most of the thinking is
| done. So it's a legitimate claim. If you want to restrict
| "important" to the most critical link in the development chain,
| I suppose you would have to choose the compiler.
| crq-yml wrote:
| Over generations, we'll get to where the software tools are
| relatively more important, but as of right now, it is almost a
| certainty that the quality of the software you write benefits
| from writing less code and relatively more of it with a paper
| draft that is based on carefully reading sources and
| documentation, and not from any other kind of tools investment.
|
| The new stuff is often fast and many jobs need it by way of
| keeping up with the standard practices and creating a hiring
| filter, but it's a supplement, not a foundational tool for
| thought. It can't be all that important because it's constantly
| shifting.
| xtiansimon wrote:
| > "craftsmanship cosplay"
|
| Nice slap down.
|
| Aaaa. I'd like to see stats over the comments--if management
| role, job history, age, income, education--and I'd expect
| opinions would be revealed as archetypical. In other words, it
| says more about the speaker than it says about successful
| software development.
|
| Clearly the OP is talking about what works for them mentally--
| focus, creativity.
|
| It's a mistake for anyone to read a post like this and think of
| it (and the criticism) as prescriptive. Emulating any of the
| patterns would have the same result of cargo cult behavior.
| AnimalMuppet wrote:
| All right, let me put it this way: As a developer, my most
| important tool is my _brain_. The time I spend figuring out
| _what_ to build and _how_ to build it is more important than
| just banging out some code.
|
| For at least some people, stepping away from the keyboard may
| be the best way to do that thinking.
|
| To put it in your own style: This isn't typing class, it's
| software engineering.
| Hamatti wrote:
| OP here. Last time my blog caught attention in HN, I was told
| I'm "living in a fantasy" and this time it's "pure
| romanticism".
|
| The tools you shared are of course important and I enjoy having
| them a lot. Wouldn't want to work as a developer without
| version control or debuggers, for sure. Those are tools that if
| I lost them, it surely would slow me down and be annoying.
|
| I do truly consider notebook more important to me than those.
| Writing and running code is the tool to get things done but
| software development to me is more importantly building
| something valuable that solves problems or makes life easier.
| And to that, code is often somewhat trivial implementation
| detail -- it's much more important to figure out what to build
| and how.
|
| Some people are good at thinking when they are in a code editor
| or other digital tools. My brain goes into detail
| implementation mode and it's hard for me to see the big picture
| when I'm writing in code editor and building functionality.
|
| For me, it's crucial part of my job to take my notebook and use
| it as a tool for thinking before (and during!) coding. While
| losing access to the other tools would definitely slow me down,
| not being able to think through writing with pen and paper
| would cripple my thinking, my problem solving ability, my
| creativity and thus cause me writing bad software.
| brettgriffin wrote:
| > Those are tools that if I lost them, it surely would slow
| me down and be annoying.
|
| Yes, but the post above is pointing out that you would be
| significantly slower without an IDE, compiler or debugger
| than you would be without a pen/paper. In fact, I don't think
| you would be a professional programmer if you didn't have
| them.
|
| Saying you like a notebook and pen while designing and
| writing software is very different than saying a notebook and
| pen are more important than an IDE, compiler, or debugger.
| DoingIsLearning wrote:
| > you would be significantly slower without an IDE,
| compiler or debugger than you would be without a pen/paper.
|
| Slower at creating what? With just great tooling there is
| still a real risk of creating the wrong thing just very
| fast.
|
| OP's point is that it is a thinking tool more so than a
| creating tool.
| tomjakubowski wrote:
| > significantly slower without an IDE, compiler or debugger
| ... In fact, I don't think you would be a professional
| programmer if you didn't have them.
|
| This is a strange take. Programmers were around before any
| of those tools were. And today, even many professional
| programmers do their work without using any of them: they
| use text editors, they write interpreted languages, and
| they use printf()-debugging or other techniques.
| brettgriffin wrote:
| They are examples, the exactness is not what is important
| here. Choosing something that is not connected to
| electricity, an OS, or the internet to be a software
| developer's _most important_ tool is, in fact, the
| strange position here.
| reaperducer wrote:
| _Choosing something that is not connected to electricity,
| an OS, or the internet to be a software developer 's
| _most important_ tool is, in fact, the strange position
| here._
|
| Like a human brain? I'd say that is the programmer's most
| important tool, and it is not connected to electricity,
| an OS, or the internet.
| brettgriffin wrote:
| As much as I hate that answer I think it is better than a
| pen and and a notebook.
| testing22321 wrote:
| > _Last time my blog caught attention in HN, I was told I 'm
| "living in a fantasy" and this time it's "pure romanticism"._
|
| When people criticize like that, you know you're doing
| something right. "Only people doing less than you will
| criticize "
|
| Keep it up!
| aragilar wrote:
| What about an issue tracker? Or requirements? Design and
| planning? A debugger doesn't help you design, version control
| doesn't tell you what you still need to do, and CI doesn't tell
| you you've implemented the requirements (or even that the
| requirements you think you have are the actual requirements).
| ioslipstream wrote:
| As a developer my most important tools are a computer with
| working keyboard, monitor, and mouse. Everything else is
| secondary. A notebook and pen falls somewhere below cpu, gpu,
| hard drive, ram, reliable internet, etc.
|
| I agree with parent comment of notebook and pen being pure
| romanticism. I mean, heck, I'd rate Obsidian or some other back
| linking note software as more important than a notebook and
| pen. A sticky note and pen would be even more important than a
| notebook and pen.
| Apocryphon wrote:
| And yet, you'll be hard-pressed to be given access to those
| during computer science exams, unlike a pen and notebook.
|
| (Maybe it's different in modern college classes now but wasn't
| for decades.)
| reaperducer wrote:
| _And yet, you'll be hard-pressed to be given access to those
| during computer science exams, unlike a pen and notebook.
|
| (Maybe it's different in modern college classes now but
| wasn't for decades.)_
|
| /Old enough to have heard, "OK, now put away your slide
| rules..."
| r053bud wrote:
| I've definitely fixed more bugs with pen/paper than a debugger.
| paganel wrote:
| That and taking a shower, doing dishes or taking a walk
| around the block, in fact I'd say that the ratio of
| bugs/issues I've solved while _away_ from the computer
| compared to being in front of the computer is quite high (in
| favour of the "away from the computer"-fixes, that is).
| DawsonBruce wrote:
| The balance of rest is an important factor that I've
| understood the value of only later in my career. Pausing on
| a difficult engineering task at the end of the workday in
| favor of exercise or cooking dinner (or both) gives my mind
| and body time to reset it needs. Often answers or alternate
| approaches will materialize mid curl, crunch, or vegetable
| chop.
| dwringer wrote:
| This feels like saying "when building a house, obviously a
| hammer is more important than the blueprints. This isn't art
| class, it's construction"
| growthwtf wrote:
| And funny enough, saying that to a group of tradespeople and
| GCs would elicit essentially the same discussion as this is!
| angrysaki wrote:
| Wouldn't it be:
|
| "when building a house, obviously a hammer is more important
| than the _paper_ blueprints. This isn't art class, it's
| construction".
|
| (when digital notes/digital blueprints are an available
| option)
| yokoprime wrote:
| yes! my thoughts exacly. its the arrogance of a junior
| engineer
| rubicon33 wrote:
| This 100%. I was going to write something similar. In my entire
| 15 years in software engineering, the amount of times I've
| reached for a notebook pales in comparison to the amount of
| times I've relied on version control or a debugger.
|
| Has a notebook or a whiteboard been handy at times? Of course.
| But the rubber meets the road behind the IDE, and the tooling
| there is the story of the day.
| acuozzo wrote:
| > the amount of times I've reached for a notebook pales in
| comparison
|
| What kind of code do you work on?
|
| I find notebooks useful all the time, but I write in C for
| embedded systems, so a lot of what I do involves setting up
| data structures, memory layout, etc.
| rubicon33 wrote:
| I do/done a little bit of everything. Backend Java, mobile
| ObjC (iOS) and Java (Android). Spent 2 years as a firmware
| dev on NRF platform so very familiar with spending time on
| data structures and byte alignment. I've also spend 4 years
| doing TS/JS back in the early Angular days.
|
| Everyone's different I guess, but for me I've never really
| reached much for a notebook. I just start writing code,
| refactor as needed, and rely on tooling from
| debugger/IDE/devtools when and where applicable.
| Jtsummers wrote:
| > the amount of times I've reached for a notebook pales in
| comparison to the amount of times I've relied on version
| control or a debugger.
|
| In my now ~35 years of programming, I've found reaching for
| the notebook often saves me from needing to rely on a
| debugger unless it's code I inherited and didn't write
| myself. Even then, though, mapping it out on paper and using
| my pseudocode-shorthand to describe what the program does and
| what it intends to do is often faster than dealing with a
| debugger for anything but trivial bugs.
| hooverd wrote:
| I thought engineers frequently used notebooks? I guess if an
| electrical engineer ever sketched anything in a notebook,
| they're just pretending.
| noosphr wrote:
| What you're talking about is software machining, not software
| engineering.
|
| The difference between the blue collar machinist and the white
| collar engineer is exactly this view of the machines they use.
|
| For an engineer a machine - be in a slide rule, calculator or
| super computer - is just a tool. You're not doing engineering
| because you're using the tool. You're doing engineering because
| you're thinking and the tool helps you think a bit faster.
|
| For a machinist the machine is the job. You can't make widgets
| if you don't have a machine to make them on. Thinking about
| widgets is pointless because they don't get made by thinking.
| mediaman wrote:
| That's funny, because if you go into any machine shop you'll
| find machinists writing things down in notebooks (and
| probably cursing engineers who never set foot in the shop).
| butterlettuce wrote:
| Apollo 13 crew was saved by duct tape, yet it's still rocket
| science.
| runjake wrote:
| Think of it this way: The brain outweighs those tools (for
| now). The notebook is an extension of thought and the brain.
|
| Some of us who grew up in the 1970s and 1980s even used to
| "program" by handwriting code on paper as kind of a rough
| draft.
|
| I did this particularly for systems I didn't have at home, like
| the Apple ][. I'd handwrite programs at home, then take it to
| school and type it into an Apple ][. This was somewhat common.
| ironman1478 wrote:
| It's not romanticism and it's very important for me too. I
| spend a lot of my time drawing out what I'm trying to do before
| I actually try to do it. I tend to work on greenfield embedded
| projects though for context. Coding and debugging is hard to
| get good at and are obviously important, but you still need to
| figure what to actually build and those tools won't get you
| there. For me, I use a pen and paper to actually figure out
| what I need to do.
| godshatter wrote:
| When trying to figure out what to code or how to solve a
| problem, pen and paper is too "concrete" for me for some
| reason. If I'm waiting for inspiration I would rather just go
| for a walk or pace back and forth or just stare at something
| (monitor, wall, whatever) and think it through. When I write
| something down (or especially when I type it into a document)
| it becomes too set in stone for me, and if I do it too much I
| get way too "close" to it to see the solution.
|
| Pen and paper is more helpful when I'm trying to see how the
| solution I came up with fits into the code, at least for me.
| I can't visualize at all, so even basic things about how data
| flows will be helpful if I write them down. The more concrete
| I'm getting, the more I use pen and paper or text documents.
| Otherwise it's just give myself time to work through the code
| as I know it, thinking of things and discarding them quickly,
| and waiting for inspiration to strike.
| yokoprime wrote:
| CI or VCS is worth diddely squat if you dont organise your
| thoughts
| Brajeshwar wrote:
| I like writing much better,[1] and after a fair share of
| Moleskin, Field Notes, and a long streak with Muji, I'm now blown
| away by Midori. I have already gotten a few, and I'm going to get
| a lot more. The tactile 'scratch' of the fountain pen on the
| Midori Paper is so soothing, it makes me feel like I'm a poet
| even when I'm writing down the most mundane idea that I just had.
| :-)
|
| https://brajeshwar.com/2025/notes/
| n2h4 wrote:
| wow, what a website. got totally immersed in your backstory.
| last time i had such fun was with https://meyerweb.com/
| zuzuleinen wrote:
| I like to have an Obsidian vault for every company I work for.
|
| But when I really need to think I upgrade to pen and paper.
| Aziell wrote:
| It actually works. Every time I get stuck, writing things down
| helps me slow down, think more clearly, and move forward more
| steadily. Pen and notebook really are an underrated but essential
| part of being a developer.
| tony-allan wrote:
| There is another interesting linked post...
|
| https://hamatti.org/posts/how-i-take-work-notes-as-a-develop...
| irjustin wrote:
| Hard disagree. My most important tool is google sheets.
|
| Multiplayer mind mapping; idea organization; clear understanding
| for all; fast reorg; sequential and/or parallel flows or
| concepts; etc etc.
|
| The worst part is having large calls watch me misspell things and
| fumble to correct it on a shared screen.
| sky2224 wrote:
| Some of the most intelligent people I've ever met in math,
| physics, and computer science don't even use a notebook. They use
| printer paper and pen. When they're done, they throw the paper
| away.
|
| I have seldom found personal notes from far in the past to be
| useful. If there's something worth noting down, then it goes into
| documentation, so others can stumble upon whatever quirk I've
| come across in the future. If there's something I really want to
| remember, I create flashcards and do spaced repetition until I've
| learned the thing. But that's just me, and I imagine my way
| doesn't work for a lot of people.
|
| I think people are taking this post a little too personally and
| literally. This is a writer's piece. The title is meant to share
| a philosophy that _this_ developer subscribes to. Nothing about
| it is declaring that others must subscribe to it as well.
|
| If a pen and notebook don't work for you, then don't use it.
| cheema33 wrote:
| This is how my brain works. I do have a notebook. My stream of
| thoughts for one day go one one page for that day. I turn the
| page the next day and I almost never look back. There may be
| some value in looking back. But, I have not been able to make
| myself do it.
| sixtyj wrote:
| I'm sure it's very personal :) Because everyone has their own
| reality, workflow and reading a piece either resonates or
| dissonates with you (personally).
|
| I personally find paper&pen both comforting and unsettling at
| the same time. Soothing because writing really helps sort out
| thoughts etc. Mindflow is different from flow "on the
| computer/phone/tablet".
|
| On the other hand, it's distracting because without an index
| system (I start each notebook with two blank pages trying to
| index the contents; every other page has a number) it's easy to
| get lost.
|
| But today's kids, being digital natives, may take a different
| approach. Paper&pen may present anxiety for them. So it very
| much depends on the family we grew up in.
| sph wrote:
| Don't try to transform a paper notebook into a database. All
| those organizational tools are elaborate forms of
| procrastination.
|
| What I do is write notes in the best format for paper: an
| append-only log with a date on top. Whether digitally or on
| paper, I rarely if at all need to consult notes from a long
| time ago, so the log is good enough for most use cases. In
| fact, as I mentioned elsewhere, writing by hand is not to
| store data, it's a way to effectively digest information and
| incorporate it into your brain. You'll get a lot of benefit
| of writing something and immediately throwing it away, so who
| cares about indexing it for later.
| reaperducer wrote:
| _On the other hand, it 's distracting because without an
| index system (I start each notebook with two blank pages
| trying to index the contents; every other page has a number)
| it's easy to get lost._
|
| I use a smart pen that writes in a notebook, but also stores
| everything I write in memory. Every month or so I export the
| content of the pen to my computer via Bluetooth as OCRed
| PDFs. This is because my boss often asks me to account for
| time I spend doing different things, and I can quickly search
| the PDFs.
| safety1st wrote:
| The sciencey side of this is that writing stuff down boosts
| memory, retention and learning, even if you immediately throw
| away what you wrote.
|
| Here's one of the hundreds of articles about this, it's a very
| well documented phenomenon
| https://www.newscientist.com/article/2414241-writing-things-...
|
| Writing by hand also has a greater effect than typing because
| it engages more of the senses and more of the brain, in
| particular the motor cortex.
|
| I keep telling myself that this would all make a great excuse
| to get a Moleskine, but handwriting just isn't a part of my
| workflow. Typing copious amounts of stuff into text buffers and
| then transforming it is, especially now that we have LLMs. If
| my brain is totally non-functional I simply start typing barely
| intelligible phrases into a text editor until it wakes up, then
| I go back and edit/refactor/clean up, and frequently something
| comes out of this that looks like a vague outline of an email
| or piece of code I need to write that day. Or at least a todo
| list. Then we're off to the races doing actual work. Most of
| the initial doodling is destroyed.
|
| Handwriting does aid retention though.
| bee_rider wrote:
| Unscientifically I always assumed that the pencil-and-paper
| was not really the important part, just the ritual of
| memorization that modern people have from however many years
| of schooling. I assumed the important part was the ritual.
|
| I guess we have a large enough population of people who've
| always taken notes on their computers that a natural
| experiment could have occurred. But I wonder about the
| crosstabs--computers can be very distracting so I wonder if
| people who prefer them to notebooks will also just tend to be
| more distracted.
| freetonik wrote:
| >I have seldom found personal notes from far in the past to be
| useful
|
| Same, but I still keep them (both notebooks and random pieces
| of paper). I find it extremely satisfying to just look into
| them after many years. It's like looking at random old photos,
| photos of my thinking process from the past.
| hk1337 wrote:
| > They use printer paper and pen. When they're done, they throw
| the paper away.
|
| That's the most important takeaway from using pen(cil) and
| paper. If you can make it reusable for you great but the most
| important thing is physically writing it down.
|
| I rarely, if ever, keep anything I have written down in the
| notebook. Eventually, I rip it out and shred it.
| atrettel wrote:
| I've used printer paper myself in different jobs in science. I
| personally don't like it but I have done it when it was the
| only paper available. Budgets in scientific organizations are
| often very tight, so often nothing else is provided, and many
| times you do not have the direct authority to order anything
| yourself.
|
| My point is that I'd view this behavior more as a consequence
| of the circumstances many scientists find themselves in rather
| than a conscious choice, though I do admit that some people may
| like it more than I do.
| exe34 wrote:
| What kind of paper do you prefer?
| atrettel wrote:
| I don't have an exact preference on the kind and weight of
| the paper, but I do prefer notebooks with firmly bound and
| numbered pages like old-school laboratory notebooks [1]. My
| problem is that I often do long derivations or work that
| can span dozens of pages with diagrams, etc. If I use loose
| leaf paper like printer paper, I often lose track of pages
| or their order. I tend to label my pages extensively when I
| have to use printer paper. I also use binder clips instead
| of paper clips since they are much more secure. That system
| works for me but other people might not like it.
|
| [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38772707
| MSFT_Edging wrote:
| Most of the contents of my notebook are never looked at again,
| just lists of thoughts, order of events, etc.
|
| Occasionally i'll write something down that I know I'll forget
| for later reference and put a small post-it sticking out for
| easy access.
| foobarian wrote:
| I used to use fancy watermarked paper just because it was fun,
| but then I got a job at a place with supply closets stocked
| with infinite printer paper, and, best of all - 11x17 printer
| paper! I got a 11x17 clipboard to go with it and been using
| that ever since.
| perrygeo wrote:
| For me it's critical that the note capture mechanism be
| unstructured and entirely free form. Typing notes on a keyboard
| just doesn't work when much of the things I need to keep note
| of are non-linear, non-verbal, relational, or spatial. Or just
| facts that I need to keep in temp memory.
|
| I periodically review the notes and summarize anything worth
| keeping into the appropriate system of record (calendar,
| tickets, wiki, spaced repetition, doesn't matter). Like you, I
| find that very little is actually worth keeping. And that's
| fine; the paper notes are not a system of record but more of an
| extension of working memory.
| tmaly wrote:
| I use to just lose my notes. But I have been using tech to
| transcribe them and put the text into my Obsidian vault.
|
| I am thinking about trying to do something with this like
| scanning for connections between notes or adding some tags to
| make ideas easier to find.
| XorNot wrote:
| Reminds me of the sheer optimism which taking a picture of a
| whiteboard represents...I have not once, ever, needed or wanted
| to look back at one.
| unsungNovelty wrote:
| I have tried both. Going fully digital and fully notebook
| oriented. The best I have come up with is to have long term notes
| in a note app but your on going current thought process in a
| book. Like what you are currently doing or it's process.
|
| This helps with the search and copy issue of going physical. But
| writing things for your ongoing process / tasks makes you
| remember things so much better. Sometimes, all I have to do is
| write. I don't have refer them. But if I have to, I usually have
| a better sense of how I got to the end result cos I have the
| journey written down in my notebook. Also being a fountain pen
| lover helps.
| quectophoton wrote:
| Sorry, that's not allowed.
|
| You must choose one side or the other, and fully commit to it
| (like everyone else in this comment section). But it's too late
| now, since you've already tried both sides (fully digital and
| fully notebook) with an open mind, that means your opinion is
| automatically invalid and wrong.
|
| Them's the rules.
| amelius wrote:
| And your secretary types in the code and it runs in the first
| attempt?
| indrex wrote:
| I thought so too. But I would rather use docstrings and comments
| because: - Readable by LLMs/others in the context of the code -
| Searchable - Version controlled
| WalterBright wrote:
| The D programming language was designed on a spiral notebook.
| adampwells wrote:
| I have been writing software for about 20 years (following on
| from OChem PhD and research for a few years). I am 'senior' and
| get paid plenty in Oz...
|
| I have aphantasia - I can't visualise/picture things in my mind,
| so I use pen and paper or whiteboards A LOT!
|
| I create various ERDs, mind maps, sequence diagrams etc. I use a
| ReMarkable which makes it a bit easier to move stuff around and
| makes it more effective.
|
| I get that some people might think it is 'pure romanticism', but
| pen and paper has been crucial for my success.
| cheema33 wrote:
| Most humans cannot visualize too many things in their minds at
| one time. I think the limit is low on average. We all therefore
| benefit from pen and paper. But I recognize that some more than
| others.
| ho_schi wrote:
| I'm also into team note taking.
|
| _Work In Progress_
|
| Endless printer paper or doted A4 paper (I love it). It is is the
| planing area of my brain. Some specific notes are kept for long
| term and re-used, which is seldom - this can (should) moved into
| a moleskin. Probably I should use the moleskin more? I need a pen
| or pencil, on paper to plan.
|
| _Long Term Storage_
|
| I don't use it to think. Mostly digital, Markdown. Stored on my
| filesystem, Git or IMAP. Avoiding all weird and soon defunct
| commercial things.
| avinassh wrote:
| I want to ask developers here who keep and maintain notebooks:
| How exactly do you take notes? What things do you write down? And
| how does it help you, or how has it made you a better developer?
|
| OP's post also references a similar post [0], but I am curious to
| hear from the people here.
|
| [0] - https://hamatti.org/posts/how-i-take-work-notes-as-a-
| develop...
| voidUpdate wrote:
| I don't tend to use it extensively, but I find it much easier to
| work out things, especially graphical things, when I can doodle
| it on some paper rather than having to type it into notepad. For
| example, yesterday I was working out how to generate a mesh of
| triangles and needed to work out the vertex indices. It was
| quicker to doodle a net of triangles and note number them than to
| try and do it on the computer. It's probably because I'm a very
| visual thinker. It's also easier to work out an equation on paper
| than on a computer when I've got fractions and powers and stuff
| that are annoying at best to represent in plain text
| gherkinnn wrote:
| As in "the most important accessory beyond a computer and a text
| editor", I absolutely agree for _how I work and think_.
|
| Nothing I have tried comes close. No iPad, writing code directly,
| talking it through, thinking it through, sketching it out on
| whatever drawing tool you might like. Pencil and paper are all I
| want.
|
| Now, let's argue about our favourite colours and why teal is
| objectively the best.
| kennu wrote:
| I understand the sentiment, but I don't get how you could draw
| more complex software plans by hand. I usually use
| Draw.io/Diagrams.net, and the drawings get pretty large and need
| reorganizing dozens of boxes several times while planning the
| architecture.
|
| OTOH if the plan is very simple and obvious, and can be drawn out
| in one go, it doesn't really need a diagram in the first place,
| so I skip spending time drawing the obvious stuff.
| Hamatti wrote:
| OP here.
|
| I don't often do very complex software plans like that. My
| working notes are often on a smaller scale like individual
| features or so. If we need to document the full architecture
| for the project, I'm happy to do that with digital tools.
|
| But while I'm planning parts of it or designing it, I do better
| with pen and paper. My main issue with many of the digital
| tools I've tried comes down to the added friction if I need to
| switch to a different tool in the app when I switch between
| circles and rectangles and text and the fact that I find free-
| hand drawing with mouse really difficult.
|
| > OTOH if the plan is very simple and obvious, and can be drawn
| out in one go, it doesn't really need a diagram in the first
| place, so I skip spending time drawing the obvious stuff.
|
| I think there's a middle ground where it might be easy to draw
| on one go but deciding what to draw and how things work
| together and what's needed requires iterations and for that,
| thinking through drawing and writing helps me a ton.
| kennu wrote:
| I guess there's many cases where you don't really know how
| complicated or simple the solution will end up to be, and
| start drawing it while thinking about it.. I must admit that
| those are usually the most interesting parts of the work.
| kayodelycaon wrote:
| I actually do all this stuff in my head and use hierarchies of
| bullet points in a text file to externalize some stuff. Some of
| these may end in arrows that point to a different process.
|
| I never use paper because I'm always moving these bullet points
| around and inserting stuff between them. Apps are too slow.
|
| I never write down all the information because these notes are
| enough for me to reload everything. It's pretty easy to see
| that I didn't write something when there's a gap in my notes. I
| never wrote it down because I'm going to come up with the same
| or better solution quickly.
|
| This isn't really helpful for anyone else and doesn't work well
| with pair programming.
| sa-tre wrote:
| For me, pen/pencil and paper is for throwaway notes when I need
| to distil an idea down or slow my thinking to focus on something
| I can't quite reason about in my head fully. It's more of an
| unloading mechanism that gives me more space to think than my
| head allows alone. It's not actually something I use for note
| taking at all, for this I tend to just use
| OneNote/Obsidian/Confluence (whatever I need to at the time).
|
| I would like to explore using stuff like Zettlekastan note
| systems with emacs a bit more for actually holding onto a web of
| knowledge that I refer to. Though this is a different ends, and
| so requires a different means.
| wrp wrote:
| > I learned very early on in my career that I'm not very good at
| thinking when I'm at a computer.
|
| Before personal computers, I had the same experience at the
| typewriter. I find it very inhibiting to have a machine staring
| me in the face, waiting, while I try to be creative.
| kstenerud wrote:
| Most comments are focusing on the physical pen and paper aspect
| of this post, but are missing the underlying principle:
|
| The author uses pen and paper because when they sit down at a
| computer they end up shifting to "function mode" where they're
| implementing rather than designing.
|
| That's it.
|
| The important takeaway is to make sure you don't fall into the
| trap of implementing when you should be designing. How you
| maintain that balance is up to you.
| Hamatti wrote:
| OP here.
|
| Exactly! So happy to read you managed to pick up the core gist
| of the story.
|
| It's important to find the tools that work best for YOU.
|
| I partially wanted to write this because I've often felt as an
| outsider in tech teams where everyone sits at a computer 7.5
| hours every day and I'm the one thinking better when I'm away
| from the screen and keyboard. So I wanted to offer an example
| to those who are like me and also feel like they might not
| belong.
| noosphr wrote:
| I used computers for a lot longer than 7.5 hours a day.
| Doubly so since I got a home desktop with a tablet display
| and 3 other screens. I find that the reason why productivity
| in offices is so low is that:
|
| 1). The available screen real estate for doing work is tiny.
|
| 2). The tools people use have happy paths that force you to
| work a specific way.
|
| 3). Deep thinking is impossible with interruptions.
|
| As an example of a tool which works best on computers, I've
| finally recreated the literate environment I used at a
| previous job on my own time and from scratch: https://olive-
| alayne-28.tiiny.site/
|
| I can now work happily with Emacs in an environment that
| supports deep thinking about code instead of fighting with it
| every step of the way.
|
| If you're interested [1] and [3] from that paper are great
| introductions to literate programming and noweb + emacs +
| synctex is by far the most pleasant IDE I've ever used.
|
| I also can't rave enough about how well pen tablets work with
| xournalpp these days. I can take notes on top of multi-
| thousand page printouts of code bases and rearrange, doodle,
| remix, and add new pages wherever I feel like. Even five
| years ago there was no tool that would let you do that
| without the threat of a major crash is you wrote too fast.
| bellBivDinesh wrote:
| Can't grep a notebook.
|
| There's a good insight in there about preserving your process of
| arriving at a conclusion, but it's better done in obsidian or
| notion or something like that.
| atum47 wrote:
| I still have my notebook with the notes and drooling from my
| machine learning class back in college. I remember drawing nodes
| and connections to wrap my head around hidden layers, weights and
| all that. It is definitely super helpful to take notes and draw
| stuff when you're a dealing with a complex subject.
| jimlawruk wrote:
| I have a notebook that I bring on vacations or weekend trips to
| jot down occasional bouts of inspiration. A few of those pages
| contain designs of pet projects that may or may not get
| implemented later. It can be fun to sit on the beach and map out
| a potential design even if you never end up implementing it.
| ednite wrote:
| Great discussion. In my opinion, the real takeaway isn't about
| notebooks vs. digital tools, it's about what shifts your mental
| gears. Every time we switch modes, it forces our brain to pay
| attention differently. That fresh context can boost focus,
| creativity, even recall.
|
| For example, I recently stopped coding all the time and picked up
| a new hobby at night, writing. That simple change gave my brain a
| reset and actually improved the performance during the day. Same
| goes for planning: switching from digital to pen and paper breaks
| the routine and makes your brain engage differently. It's less
| about the tool and more about how the change wakes you up.
| cleak wrote:
| The book Smarter Faster Better introduced me to the concept of
| disfluency - the idea that extra friction such as awkward
| fonts, new environments, different tools, etc will pull you out
| of autopilot mode and force you to think in new ways. I haven't
| seen references to it elsewhere, but it's changed how I
| approach problems and learning the last 9 years. Switching to a
| notebook is one great way I use to trigger this as well.
| ednite wrote:
| Thanks for sharing. I just added Smarter Faster Better to my
| reading list, along with Annie Murphy Paul's The Extended
| Mind.
|
| Both seem to explore how breaking out of autopilot can unlock
| better thinking, which is exactly what I've been noticing in
| my own routines.
| bookofjoe wrote:
| Great book: https://www.amazon.com/Five-Day-Course-
| Thinking-Edward-Bono/...
| gjadi wrote:
| Interesting. I noticed the same and sometimes I change my
| emacs theme just to get a fresh perspective. Sometimes I also
| disable syntax highlighting when typing so I won't get
| distracted.
| diggan wrote:
| > Sometimes I also disable syntax highlighting when typing
|
| Was waiting for someone to comment this. It's a somewhat
| known strategy if you have to read through a bunch of
| boring code you don't want to work with, and find hard to
| focus with, to turn off the syntax highlight and somehow
| the brain stops glossing over/skimming the code and starts
| to pay more attention.
|
| I found it led to marginal difference at best, as with most
| strategies. It does work well initially though, as I guess
| the brain stops being able to use colors it's used to for
| grouping stuff together and similar.
| WCSTombs wrote:
| Along similar lines, sometimes I print out code on paper
| and make notes with a pen, sitting far away from my
| computer. Of course there's no, or very minimal, syntax
| highlighting then.
| thewebguyd wrote:
| A bit extreme on my end, but I've got the spare hardware
| for it - when I get into a rut I change operating systems,
| so I'm bouncing back and forth between macOS and Windows or
| Linux.
|
| I'm adept at using both but the change adds just enough
| friction and visual differences to spark creativity, or a
| little productivity boost.
| dalmo3 wrote:
| Interesting. For me it's the opposite, e.g. just changing
| keyboard layouts between pc and mac breaks my brain hard, and
| I feel useless.
| jahsome wrote:
| I experience similar and I think of discomfort tolerance
| like a muscle. The more I (am forced to) use it, the less
| strain I experience when using it.
|
| I am naturally prone to optimizing friction away--autistic
| engineer--but have come to realize regularly putting myself
| in uncomfortable positions professionally and personally
| works for me as a form of exposure therapy.
|
| Nowadays, in the event I'm thrust into such an unfamiliar
| situation against my will, I'm still functional.
|
| An enormously valuable knock on effect was coming to the
| realization the things I enjoy most in life are those which
| have been a surprise, and I would have simply avoided
| weren't I being intentional in pushing my own boundaries.
| atrettel wrote:
| This is one of the reasons that I actually take notes in three
| different media: paper notebooks, an old-school digital voice
| recorder, and in text files. Different media have different
| advantages and disadvantages and represent different ideas for
| more readily.
|
| I have used the voice recorder less over the years but I find
| it optimal when time is limited and I have to move onto
| something else. Part of using a voice recorder as a medium is
| listening closely afterwards and writing down what I said in a
| different manner (either in a more permanent paper notebook or
| digitally in a text file). And yes, each iteration transforms
| the idea at least somewhat. It gives you the chance to see the
| idea in a different way.
| bandoti wrote:
| Something I noticed for myself--doing a live webinar series
| over a couple days and taking notes with pen/paper in realtime
| --I really struggled to keep up at first, but over a few days I
| started to notice my ability to do a listen-and-write context
| shift improved and it felt like I was able to retain auditory
| information better.
| agarren wrote:
| Out of curiosity, what kind of writing? Journaling and getting
| your thoughts out, or fiction, something else?
| ednite wrote:
| Honestly, I'm kind of all over the place with my writing
| right now, but I can't stop. It's one of the reasons I
| finally joined HN. I've been a long-time reader here but
| recently decided to start sharing my 2-cents here and there.
|
| I started a blog to get my thoughts out and explore whatever
| sparked my curiosity. It's been a creative blast, and I'm
| still figuring it out as I go.
|
| I do journal, though it's more of a quick log, tracking time
| and daily developments. My deeper writing is more immersed.
| Lately, I've been spending a few hours most nights working on
| a self-improvement book, which I've been enjoying writing.
|
| One unexpected benefit I can't emphasize enough is how much
| writing has helped me stay sharp and more focused in my day
| job. It's like a reset button for the brain. If you're
| feeling stuck or low on motivation, I really recommend trying
| something completely different in your routine, especially
| something outside your comfort zone, like switching from
| digital to analog. Thanks for asking!
| hinkley wrote:
| I wonder how many developers today were forced to take an
| introductory drafting class. I know a lot of us played with
| Lego. The problem of describing a 3 dimensional object in two
| dimensions requires extra projections to describe the thing. A
| 3d object in 2 dimensions takes three drawings to mostly
| describe. If the object is more complex than three dimensions,
| you need to look at it from a lot more angles.
| ednite wrote:
| Wow, decades in this field and it finally took your comment
| to connect my childhood LEGO obsession with coding. Simple
| enough, but it never actually crossed my mind. The funny
| thing is, I've always linked my love for storytelling to LEGO
| building, but not coding. Thanks for the insight, that just
| snapped into place.
| hinkley wrote:
| Did I love Lego because I was like this, or am I like this
| because I loved Lego?
|
| That'll bake your noodle for a good long while :)
| ednite wrote:
| Whoa...
| stronglikedan wrote:
| I read a study a while back that said context switching costs
| ~15 minutes on average. I don't know how true it is, but my
| bosses have always believed it and tried to respect it.
| nemofoo wrote:
| This is a great insight. I have no data to back it up by my
| experience is very similar
| uludag wrote:
| I must say, without hesitation and doubt, that Claud 4 is my most
| important tool. I literally feel like I have the intelligence of
| the entire human race at my fingertips, giddily awaiting a caress
| from the tips of my fingertips. I honestly could not imagine my
| developer life without the twain of Opus and Sonnet.
|
| Not my opinion of course, I just thought I'd include it as I
| found it surprisingly missing from the comments.
| justinrubek wrote:
| That model has been out for something like a week, and it's
| already the most important tool? That's a very interesting take
| to me. I tried it, and it found Claude 4 particularly unusable
| personally, 3.7 seems better.
| directevolve wrote:
| You definitely don't have the intelligence of the entire human
| race on Claude. You have a generative model of most of the
| published, digitized text the human race has produced. I'm
| happy to call it intelligent, and, as a daily user of the most
| recent pro LLM models, extremely useful for tasks like coding
| and, to some extent, search.
|
| But as soon as I turn from implementing and debugging code to
| conceptual thinking or building a mental mode of a problem
| domain, LLMs currently function for me mainly as Grammarly on
| steroids. There's no one tool in this space that's supreme -
| Zotero, DuckDuckGo, Google Scholar, pen and paper, draw.io, and
| Google Docs all play a role. I'm a PhD student, YMMV, the LLMs
| do improve over time, etc.
| FigurativeVoid wrote:
| One of the few things that I miss about working in an office is a
| large whiteboard and standing in front of it with a colleague.
|
| Working on an architecture with a peer and marker really led to
| some elegant class designs.
| barrenko wrote:
| Whiteboard (blackboard etc.) is life.
| noosphr wrote:
| I have a 24 inch pen display.
|
| The last time I worked as a CTO I bought them for the whole
| team. Being able to redraw things on a shared digital white
| board beats having to redraw the same 4 boxes a dozen times
| because you keep running out of space.
|
| Also saves people taking photos of the white board before
| erasing.
| abletonlive wrote:
| I use excalidraw for this and think it's better than whiteboard
| because
|
| 1) it's prettier and less messy 2) the digital markers are
| never dry 3) it encourages more edits and changes
|
| I basically start all my technical designs in excalidraw now
| FigurativeVoid wrote:
| Digital whiteboarding tools are close, but I think they miss
| some of the magic of working in a shared space with an analog
| too.
|
| I can make more complex drawings in excalidraw than I could
| on a really drawing surface. I suspect that leads to simpler
| drawings and thus simpler designs.
| submeta wrote:
| Why a superlative? For me it's lots of things: My notebook, my
| editor, my terminal, my ide, my ipad, and so much more. So why
| ,,the" most important? :)
| infermore wrote:
| read the article?
| hk1337 wrote:
| One more person confirming pen(cil) to paper helps make the
| connection.
|
| I go through several different notebooks, none of which I keep
| what is in it because it wouldn't make sense to me now but
| writing it out helped for it to make sense to me then.
|
| It's like those tv episodes with the kid making a cheat sheet on
| his shoe then never needs it because he remembered everything.
| namblooc wrote:
| That got me curious how the author debugs his code using a
| notebook!
| regus wrote:
| I have tried multiple times to make notebooks work for me for
| note taking or tracking tasks but it always falls apart
| eventually. First it was bullet journals, then I tried something
| a little less structured but in the end I couldn't get it to
| stick. Now I use Apple Notes which is good enough.
| ge96 wrote:
| Most jobs I've had I use a macbook and I take daily notes in the
| Apple Notes app
|
| Ex:
|
| W22 D111 Wed May 28, 2025 (7)
|
| The (7) means hours since I'm a contractor and I do
| walks/subtracts time that I fill in with PTO
|
| I will probably get a remarkable 2 again at some point, it seems
| redundant if you have a tablet like device (I have a Surface Book
| 3) but that is rarely used funny. I used to use an RM2 a lot but
| had to sell it when I needed cash. It's cool that it's
| programmable.
| digitalsushi wrote:
| we have given new life to the vim-emacs religious war, this time
| pens-vs-keyboards. fascinating
| staplung wrote:
| As per Hot Fuzz:
|
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-ZzGNQnuo8
| jokoon wrote:
| many times, I solved problem I was stuck with, by hanging outside
| at the park, with pen and paper
| sawaali wrote:
| I have thought through tough problems using pen and paper. Have
| tried a lot of iterations of digital notebooks, but lost the
| fluidity and malleability of paper.
|
| These days I have found the iPad + Pencil with an infinite canvas
| to be the best fit. I use Ahmni (https://www.ahmni.app/) which is
| a delight.
| culebron21 wrote:
| I had to work on a coding project with a serious geometric
| problem in the core, and no amount of thinking over code itself
| could help, whereas on paper, I could find the solution easily.
| And implementing it in code didn't progress, until I wrote down
| all the formulae, in sequence, on paper too.
| agentultra wrote:
| As I like to say, _I do most of my programming before I touch a
| keyboard_.
|
| The single most powerful thing I do is _ask questions_ and _write
| down the answers_. When I want to understand a system this is the
| fundamental step that cannot be skipped. How crucial it is that I
| understand the system will tell me how formal I need to be in my
| thinking. If it 's a basic web application or a report I need to
| generate it's a simple, informal note. If we're talking about a
| critical system that's distributed and requires high-availability
| with hard limits on processing time and the consequence of
| getting things wrong is that businesses and people lose
| money/property? Then I'll bust out the mathematics and model
| things formally.
|
| I've experimented as well with writing code on paper first. This
| doesn't work so well with procedural languages without some form
| of shorthand/formalism. It works much better with statically-
| typed functional programming languages. When using such languages
| I mostly need to reason about the types: the implementation is a
| matter of filling in the holes which can be done when I'm at the
| keyboard. The more I learn to "think in types," the better this
| works but I'm not super great at it yet.
|
| Notebooks are where it all begins.
|
| I also use notebooks to journal my work. I use the _bullet
| journal_ system to keep track of my work. Keeping it on paper
| forces me to sit in front of it and physically remind myself of
| my tasks. It helps me stay focused on the day to day activities
| and not lose track of my longer-term goals. After using one long
| enough this way it becomes a chronicle of my work. Handy for
| performance review season. A great deal of programming work comes
| out of these journals.
|
| Some folks prefer digital tools and that's fine and dandy. I'm
| just old school and prefer physicality. Paper and pen work on the
| level my brain works on and gives me a break from screen,
| keyboard, and constant stream of notifications. Room and freedom
| to think without interruptions is important and useful.
| sylens wrote:
| After trying all sorts of note taking tools and apps over the
| years to try to get myself organized, part of my New Year's
| Resolution this year was to just buy a stack of To-Do list
| notepads that had a spot for the date and just let me write stuff
| down ad-hoc while in meetings or working on stuff. It's amazing
| how much more productive I've been since doing this.
|
| The item in question for anyone curious:
| https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0BS1WJZNW
| hnthrowaway0315 wrote:
| A notebook and a pen clear one's mind before touching the
| keyboard. I agree it is essential to clear one's mind before
| committing code to the computer. Sometimes I even write full
| pages of pseudo code before writing code in real programming
| languages.
|
| However this is only for things that I care about. I'm OK to
| throw shits on the wall and see if it sticks for anything I don't
| care about.
| calebm wrote:
| I'm pretty sure a developer can get more done with a computer
| than a notebook...
| idlip wrote:
| Tbh for me both seems the same. I can ignore both digital
| notifications and open book/paper lying there to reminder me of a
| task. Its the mental state of person to commit for getting things
| done. Digital method gives lot of space for organizing tho.
| thecrumb wrote:
| After scribbling down notes in paper notebooks for years I
| finally decided I didn't want to kill any more trees to take
| notes I seldom referenced.
|
| Now I have a digital tablet (Supernote) on which I scribble down
| all the meaningless stuff throughout the day. Then I review that
| and anything useful or important goes into Obsidian where I can
| tag/search it later.
| ujkhsjkdhf234 wrote:
| On the scale of the amount of harm you personally do to the
| planet on a daily basis, I have to imagine wasting paper is one
| of the least consequential things.
| magistr4te wrote:
| I've never done the math on this, but my immediate thought on
| that reasoning was always that you'd have to burn through a LOT
| of paper to actually have such an electronic product be more
| environmentally friendly. Does anyone have concrete data on
| this?
| __natty__ wrote:
| I found some data on slate - between 7000-14000 sheets to
| balance an iPad over 3 years of usage. [0]
|
| [0] https://slate.com/technology/2011/09/paper-versus-the-
| ipad-i...
| xutopia wrote:
| For me it's taking a walk.
| codyb wrote:
| Basically any... autopilot behavior for me is going to turn
| into some insight at some point or another (although it's good
| to be in the present too! Now I try to think in Spanish which
| forces me to be present cause it's such a slow process for me
| still lol, but actually super useful I've found for continuing
| to flesh out those neural pathways is to just sit and talk to
| myself outloud in Spanish about whatever I'm doing all day)
|
| Also love writing things on paper. I love using different pens,
| and write in different styles sometimes (cursive, block,
| normal, whatever). I just take quick throwaway notes on paper
| or I'll sometimes sit down and outline things for an hour over
| a few sheets just to put organization to some large task which
| I'll translate into something for consumption by others later.
| Almost always throw these away. Sometimes I work through a
| notepad, sometimes it's a little notebook, sometimes it's
| printer paper... getting away from the screen for a bit is
| lovely.
|
| And I set up a notes section on my computer which I can pop
| open with a quick <space>X in ViM which has a directory
| structure giving me spaces for recurring meetings, architecture
| work, or notes on whatever initiatives I'm trying to push
| through. I index file names with 01-, 02- etc and if I have a
| section that branches out I'll just add another index so 01A-,
| 01B-, etc...
|
| Having everything in ViM with a tmux conf setup that scaffolds
| out a ton of different spaces I've set up mnemonic keyboard
| shortcuts to navigate to is really helpful in reducing the
| overload of having Slack, IDEs, browsers, notepads, music, etc
| etc etc all open at once (since on a good day I just have
| Slack, Outlook, iTerm, Firefox and maybe Figma or Music open at
| most points). I'm also quick to wipe away tabs in the
| browser...
|
| Next up I'm diving into Figma so I can turn these ideas into
| beautiful diagrams and even mock interfaces my partners can
| ingest visually for easier understanding of complex spaces
|
| Finally, and I'm thankful I can afford to do this, but I turn
| all notification sounds off, Slack'll bounce once from the
| hidden dock...
|
| It's great, distraction free, tailored to my needs, a fair
| amount of variety, and some really nice productive times.
| ggdhdj wrote:
| I think my brain works the exact opposite of what he describes. I
| can only think about code, while I write it. Interpreted
| languages are a blessing for me. I was taught the approach
| described in the post in school (it's the Pascal way after all)
| and I never understood, how people can actually work like this.
| There really seem to be (at least) two types of programmer
| brains.
| jandrewrogers wrote:
| I use engineering paper and a mechanical pencil extensively for
| software development work, a habit I picked up in my chemical
| engineering days.
|
| None of it is saved. I use it to extend my working memory for
| complex design problems, and for this purpose I find it very
| effective. The advantage of paper and pencil is that it is
| naturally and efficiently amenable to non-linear and somewhat
| arbitrary patterns of access and representation.
|
| Software really struggles at this because computer UIs force
| everything into coarse linear workflows no matter the
| presentation, which makes navigating and rewiring a large number
| of orthogonal dimensions awkward and inefficient on the best
| days.
| neilv wrote:
| > _None of it is saved._
|
| As we're absorbing this idea... I've seen employment contracts
| for technical people that arguably might consider these
| handwritten notes to be IP artifacts, which must be preserved
| and made accessible to the company.
|
| If that's your situation, you could scribble the date, your
| name, project, etc. in some margin of the piece of paper, and
| stick it in a pile/folder. To eventually be scanned, and the
| file put somewhere accessible, and/or the paper technically
| preserved.
|
| In a startup, you might also want to preserve things like these
| for nostalgia, even if they have no IP value. One seed startup,
| I kept a folder of "nostalgia" photos, video clips,
| screenshots, etc., of early prototypes, people working late,
| incremental successes, etc., and it was quickly a good thing.
| It's amazing how well you can progress, and what positive
| feelings you have some of these things that quickly become
| nostalgic. Anyone can see the current state of the code in the
| repo, but here's the pencil sketch on quadrille paper (or a
| napkin) one evening that became our architecture.
| jandrewrogers wrote:
| At least in my case, it is difficult to overstate how unlike
| linear "notes" those scribblings actually are. They aren't
| remotely consumable outside the context in which they were
| created. It really is treated like swap space for working
| memory.
|
| I do go through all the old papers when I discard them but
| 99% of the time there is no discernible value. The thought
| process that created them is strongly non-linear, which does
| not lend itself to naive linear consumption at all later
| date.
| visviva wrote:
| I was kind of hoping for a deep-dive on notebook types and
| features, not gonna lie.
| cja wrote:
| Hammock-driven Development https://github.com/matthiasn/talk-
| transcripts/blob/master/Hi...
|
| Default mode network
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Default_mode_network
| voilavilla wrote:
| The bell-curve meme popular on reddit showing both extremes using
| the same solution, while the "average" cries, is dead on.
|
| OP is on the right path: think before you code.
|
| One of the neat things about being in the last few years of my
| career (started in 1988) is how the tools change. I'm a senior
| principal software architect at a large-ish company. And I don't
| write a single line of code. I write everything in Visio, Word,
| and PowerPoint (and sometimes PlantUML). As you move up the
| abstraction ladder the tools become simpler. I define
| architectures that will deploy into 10-year lifespan applications
| (think military, medical, and automotive tier-1), and the code
| that implements it--or even the language used--has absolutely
| zero impact on the architecture. Mostly C and C++ (went through
| an Ada period, too), and some of it might even be implemented in
| Rust over the next few years as it matures into the automotive
| world, but when you're high enough up, the implementation is
| irrelevant.
|
| What matters are the building blocks, the apis, and most
| importantly, the encapsulation because that has an impact on the
| silicon, security, manufacturing, and test. Stuff that can be
| drawn and explained in a few slides, and not the code itself. (Of
| course, my lovely boxes have to be able to withstand upstream
| discoveries of flaws in the architecture, but that's the fun
| part!)
| dustbunny wrote:
| Taking detailed notes in meetings, and keeping a record of what
| I'm doing/thinking about has allowed me to drastically shorten
| the "context switching time" between meetings and days. And
| having those notes is vital every once in a while, ie: X person
| said Y thing on Z date. Or It took me X days to do this thing,
| etc... doing this is a great way to be "management material" if
| that's what you wanna do. Because you are visibly very organized.
|
| I literally just write down everything important in meetings
| because it keeps me focused and I enjoy the act of hand writing.
|
| And then I keep notes in a giant endless .md file of what my
| goals are for the day. It's like 10 lines per day max.
| agcat wrote:
| I agree. Documenting your thoughts, ideas on a notebook is one of
| the best ways that helps you think clearly.
| jwpapi wrote:
| I see that point but now discussing approaches with AI replaces
| that most of the time, not because the AI is genius but because
| me formulating it helps me to think and me getting challenged
| helps as well (I ask for it)
|
| The input speed on keyboard is just way faster than with pen:/
|
| Sometimes I still use notebook but it becomes less unfortunately.
|
| But my my challenges are just not challenging
| spidersouris wrote:
| > me getting challenged helps as well (I ask for it)
|
| Can you elaborate? Do you have any examples of such
| interactions with LLMs?
| exiguus wrote:
| For me too. And i love this notebooks https://nuuna.com/notebooks
| and this pens https://www.kaweco-pen.com/ Around 2 notebooks and
| 1-2 pens and refills a year.
| WCSTombs wrote:
| I used to be able to walk down to a local store and buy a
| Leuchtturm1917. Sadly, I believe they've all closed in the last
| few years. At least I can still order them online...
| roskelld wrote:
| I find that using ways to step away from code help think things
| through in ways to overcome roadblocks. One recent trick I've
| found is rubber duck my issue into ChatGPT, which I used to do in
| a notepad (either digital or physical), the added advantage of
| ChatGPT is I can hit Enter once I'm done with my thoughts and get
| a response, which might have a solution in it.
| t1234s wrote:
| What does one do when their handwriting gets worse and worse as
| the years go on due to constant keyboard use? Is there any way to
| get it back?
| chipsrafferty wrote:
| Are you writing often?
| cameron_b wrote:
| Summarizing some discussion here before: practice, and with a
| goal or example.
|
| Most notably - https://joshldavis.com/2013/05/20/the-path-to-
| dijkstras-hand...
|
| Discussed - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20791049
| croisillon wrote:
| The wayback is called practicing, i think i told that story
| before but at 14 i basically started writing pages and pages of
| alphabets and numbers, working on individual signs and
| ligatures
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