[HN Gopher] We need more optimistic science fiction
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       We need more optimistic science fiction
        
       Author : craig552uk
       Score  : 59 points
       Date   : 2025-04-27 20:11 UTC (2 days ago)
        
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       | luotuoshangdui wrote:
       | Good point. Can someone recommend some good optimistic science
       | fiction?
        
         | jauntywundrkind wrote:
         | _A Half Built Garden_ was lovely, I thought.
         | 
         | Ada Palmer had a good write-up on _Hopepunk_. Many of the
         | example books come towards the latter half of the write-up.
         | https://beforewegoblog.com/purity-and-futures-of-hard-work-b...
        
           | luotuoshangdui wrote:
           | Thanks, hopepunk is a fun new concept to learn about.
        
           | igor47 wrote:
           | i tried "half built garden" and just could not continue
           | reading it. why is _everyone_ so obsessed with their genders
           | and pronouns?
        
         | stevenwoo wrote:
         | Project Hail Mary, The Martian, Contact. Somewhat in line with
         | a better future mentioned in the essay, The Ministry for the
         | Future and the Mars trilogy by Kim Stanley Robinson posit some
         | solutions to some big technological challenges with a lot of
         | time with each side in the political debate, though whether one
         | finds it optimistic lies with the reader.
        
           | sho_hn wrote:
           | I was as disappointed as everbody else by _Artemis_ , but
           | _Project Hail Mary_ was a great return to form and a great
           | Space MacGyver Procedura. Definitely left me fired up and
           | feeling positive as well. I really appreciate just the joy in
           | knowledge that Weir 's books revel in.
        
         | Mithriil wrote:
         | _The Ministry for the Future_ , by Kim Stanley Robinson.
         | Realistic and optimistic climate fiction.
         | 
         | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Ministry_for_the_Future
        
           | blacksmith_tb wrote:
           | But it begins with a nightmarish heatwave that kills hundreds
           | of thousands in India, which may be a little hard for some
           | people to handle (judging by the reactions of people I've
           | recommended it to...)
        
           | gmuslera wrote:
           | When you realize all that must work (not in the physical
           | world, but in the human one) perfectly for that problem to be
           | solved it becomes very pessimistic.
           | 
           | The human part of that book is fantasy, and not a great one.
           | At some point the suspension of disbelief crash into pieces.
        
         | porphyra wrote:
         | Star Trek is often considered the archetype of optimistic
         | science fiction.
        
           | sho_hn wrote:
           | Sadly its present-day incarnations are often anything but, so
           | it's not an easy rec anymore.
        
             | morkalork wrote:
             | The TNG Picard character was a man of _principles_ that you
             | just don't see anymore on TV.
        
         | igor47 wrote:
         | The "Delta V" books by Daniel Suarez.
         | 
         | I've been recommending "The Deluge" by Stephen Markeley, which
         | is simultaneously very dark and quite optimistic.
         | 
         | "Walkaway" by Cory Doctorow
        
           | blacksmith_tb wrote:
           | I liked the _The Deluge_ (great characterization), Doctorow
           | is generally good and _Walkaway_ was great, his _The Lost
           | Cause_[1] is also a fairly hopeful novel.
           | 
           | 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Lost_Cause_(novel)
        
         | i80and wrote:
         | The Monk & Robot books[1] are my personal favorites in the
         | whole genre.
         | 
         | [1]: https://us.macmillan.com/series/monkrobot
        
           | igor47 wrote:
           | agreed, especially the first book. the other becky chambers
           | books in the "long way to a small angry planet" series are
           | also quite good.
        
         | pkdpic wrote:
         | Literally anything written by Liu Cuxin. Not overtly positive
         | all the time but always infused with a deep historical optimism
         | about humanity and the power of science + engineering.
         | 
         | Also I second Ministry for the Future.
         | 
         | Reading the newer translation of We right now also and the
         | first 1/2 or so is weirdly positive. Not what I remembered at
         | all.
        
         | o11c wrote:
         | A Miracle of Science (webcomic, 2002-2007)
         | 
         | https://www.project-apollo.net/mos/
        
       | AIPedant wrote:
       | On Twitter, Colin Fraser pointed out that Black Mirror was
       | somewhat optimistic in that the horrible evil technology actually
       | works as described[1].
       | 
       | Truly pessimistic science fiction would have
       | 
       | - people worshipping an AI God which is demonstrably dumber than
       | a dog
       | 
       | - friendly humanoid robots which don't really understand how to
       | walk down a flight of stairs
       | 
       | - gravitational warp drives which are purely cosmetic and cannot
       | travel anywhere, though it leads to terrible cancer
       | 
       | - a Potemkin Dyson Sphere where only 5% of the panels work and
       | the government blames out-of-system immigrants for the blackouts
       | 
       | [1]
       | https://xcancel.com/colin_fraser/status/1911129344979964207#...
        
         | Legend2440 wrote:
         | Hilariously, a dyson sphere operating at 5% capacity would
         | still generate more power every second than humanity currently
         | generates in 10,000 years.
        
           | Calwestjobs wrote:
           | Sure, but 89 % of that 5% will be still used for
           | interplanetary yacht fleet of owner of Choco-Darien Inc.
        
             | philipkglass wrote:
             | [delayed]
        
           | ben_w wrote:
           | But at even just 4%, the thermal emissions from a partial
           | Dyson swarm would still be enough to heat Earth by twice what
           | anthropogenic climate change has managed so far: https://www.
           | sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S092702482...
        
           | AIPedant wrote:
           | It would also cost more power to construct than humanity is
           | currently capable of generating in 10,000 years, so I am not
           | sure what your point is.
           | 
           | Presumably a 5% functional Dyson sphere would be a corrupt
           | boondoggle in the same way as a power plant which is down for
           | maintenance 95% of the year, but the financial calculation
           | would use much larger numerators and denominators than we are
           | used to.
        
         | ben_w wrote:
         | You may be interested in The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy,
         | where, due to a terrible miscalculation of scale, an entire
         | battle fleet was accidentally swallowed by a small dog. The
         | planet on which the dog was located then exploded, but not due
         | to the battle fleet.
        
         | gcanyon wrote:
         | There is a science story, I don't remember who wrote it or the
         | title, where humanity discovers a way to modify the speed of
         | light within a region. Excited, they work incredibly hard to
         | implement the technology, only to discover they can only make
         | it slower.
         | 
         | Maybe it was jumping to a parallel universe to travel and then
         | jumping back. But the same issue: the limit was lower.
        
       | JPLeRouzic wrote:
       | I love science fiction, but as someone born in the middle of the
       | last century, I am biased toward authors from the 20th century.
       | 
       | I noticed that the novels at the end of Nature (the journal) were
       | sad and weird, but I thought it was probably an editorial choice
       | to look "modern".
       | 
       | Yet recently, I read SF novels with authors sorted
       | alphabetically, and it struck me again how weird and sad 21st-
       | century novels are.
        
       | johnea wrote:
       | How about this:
       | 
       | Little Jimmy used his space laser pistol to blast the eyeballs
       | out of the reptilian space alien invaders from Chinnastan, thus
       | saving humanity and getting the girl!
       | 
       | THE END
       | 
       | This is pretty much a summary of 90% of Japanese anime (I try to
       | watch the other 10% --> Ta Yi Ge Bu Fen woJian tehoshii)
       | 
       | How much more optimistic could it get for a white male anglo-
       | european christian sci-fi reader?
        
       | Animats wrote:
       | OK, we know what's coming.
       | 
       | - Energy is less of a problem, between cheap solar cells and
       | batteries.
       | 
       | - Materials may start to be a problem, but not yet.
       | 
       | - Population is leveling off and dropping in some countries, but
       | continues to grow in Africa and among the religious groups which
       | keep women at home.
       | 
       | - Equatorial areas are becoming uninhabitable.
       | 
       | - AI is rapidly getting better. Not clear how good it gets, but
       | if everything you do for money goes in and out over a wire,
       | you're in trouble.
       | 
       | - Robots for unstructured tasks are just beginning to work.
       | Maybe. The mechanical problems of building robots have been
       | pretty much solved. Motors, sensors, controllers, etc. work well
       | and are not too expensive. There are well over a dozen humanoid
       | robots that can walk now. (Unlike the days of Asimo, which barely
       | worked over two decades of improvement.)
       | 
       | - Automatic driving is being deployed now.
       | 
       | So how do we build a society to deal with that?
        
         | walterbell wrote:
         | Step 1: kindergarten through university simulator-based
         | training for remedial omnipotence.
        
         | socalgal2 wrote:
         | - Population is leveling off and dropping in some countries,
         | 
         | This is a problem https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ufmu1WD2TSk
         | 
         | - AI is rapidly getting better. Not clear how good it gets, but
         | if everything you do for money goes in and out over a wire,
         | you're in trouble.
         | 
         | Or, everything gets so abundant that we can actually have high
         | UBI
         | 
         | This reminds me if why I disliked to movie Elysium. They had a
         | robots that effectively gave free perfect medical care. I
         | didn't buy the premise of the movie that only that rich would
         | be able to use them. Given they were robots, governments,
         | hospitals, could and would make them readily available since
         | ultimately it would massively lower their medical costs.
        
           | WorldPeas wrote:
           | you assume their compotence and forethought. Such things
           | cannot be taken for granted.
        
         | Calwestjobs wrote:
         | actually materials may be not a problem, - 40% of all transport
         | is for transporting of fossil fuels !
         | 
         | so after we lower amount of fossil fuels mined, transported,
         | refined, we can start focusing on working with other materials
         | or start using freed workforce/manufacturing capacity for other
         | kinds of terraforming activities.
         | 
         | AI - how many connections in human brain? google says 100
         | trillion, how many transistors in one NVIDIA Blackwell GPU -
         | 200 billion. so you need just 500 GPUs to have number of
         | connections as brain does. those are transistors only for
         | connections, you need much more transistors for processing
         | which is connected thru said connections, so does one
         | datacenter holds one brain worth of biological level processing
         | already ?
        
       | bitwize wrote:
       | Right now, "humanity surviving into the future long-term" is a
       | pretty optimistic vision. Real life looks like a William Gibson
       | novel right now, except just the shitty parts.
        
       | pkdpic wrote:
       | Agreed on all counts. Any advice on how so start writing some
       | short amateur scifi from folks who have a writing practice or are
       | at the start of developing one?
       | 
       | Udemy classes, youtube tutorials / lectures, books on how to
       | start writing scifi etc?
        
         | throwanem wrote:
         | 500 words a day, dead or alive.
        
       | abeppu wrote:
       | > I believe that a lack of alternatives to our current political
       | and economic ideas is a problem for the world right now.
       | 
       | While I agree with this statement, I think imagining alternative
       | political and economic systems is not primarily about _science_
       | fiction. We could imagine these new forms of society with
       | existing technology. We could imagine a future with technological
       | regress which is political /economic retro-utopia where everyone
       | has adequate food, housing, access to healthcare, education,
       | green-space ... but no screen-based brain-rot, AI, space
       | exploration or other fancy tech.
        
         | userbinator wrote:
         | _which is political /economic retro-utopia_
         | 
         | Mid-century America?
        
           | Calwestjobs wrote:
           | i really apologize but this had to be done, in current
           | situation:
           | 
           | From 1918 to 1987 the Soviet government executed,
           | slaughtered, starved, beat or tortured to death, or otherwise
           | killed 60 500 000 OF ITS OWN PEOPLE. University of Hawaii
           | Professor Rudolph Rummel
        
             | socalgal2 wrote:
             | So did China - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fwoyko4uuvI
        
       | lif wrote:
       | Unpopular take, and note, I am not an expert:
       | 
       | There seems to be an overabundance of sci-fi that is
       | hyperoptimistic with regard to tech advances. The 2nd law of
       | thermodynamics is not understood by most, or waved away as
       | 'overcome thru future science'.
       | 
       | fwiw, here's a few works I've found to be less the above:
       | 
       | book: Kim Stanley Robinson's _Aurora_
       | 
       | short stories: Damon Knight's _Stranger Station_ Larry Nivens'
       | _Inconstant Moon
        
         | Calwestjobs wrote:
         | Exactly ! Just simple : Do we have any complex mechanism which
         | works for last 100 years nonstop without fail ? Answers
         | question of generational ships towards other solar systems. XD
        
       | alganet wrote:
       | AI, give me an optimistic sci fi plot for the world.
       | 
       | AI, now compare it to communism.
        
       | AdrianB1 wrote:
       | Is this a call for pink glasses? It sounds like that to me.
        
         | sho_hn wrote:
         | I think it's a call for being aspirational. I grew up with
         | optimistic, aspirational sci-fi in my childhood, and I feel
         | it's given me a solid grounding and the ability to notice when
         | things are not right and not going well. I, too, worry about
         | society losing that ability.
        
       | ferguess_k wrote:
       | I look forward to a world where people no longer need to
       | sacrifice their curiosity to earn bread, clothes and basic
       | housing. UBI would be a good start, but with the resources at
       | hand we should be able to do more.
       | 
       | I look forward to a world where potentials are promptly
       | discovered and put to be nurtured, instead of being wasted or
       | randomly thrown to the society. Every one willing to share what
       | they have learned or made are welcomed.
       | 
       | I look forward to a world that prevention of physical and mental
       | illness is more recognized than treating them, or worse,
       | extracting value from them.
       | 
       | I look forward to a world that citizens do not hesitate to speak
       | out when they identify anything worrying. That is, they feel that
       | they own the world, not be owned as some sort of human resources.
       | 
       | I look forward to a world that technological advance frees
       | people, not keeping them enslaved.
       | 
       | I look forward to a world where monetary profit is not the
       | dominating indicator for success and failure of an organization.
        
       | wirdnok wrote:
       | Jerry Holkins of penny-arcade recently shared a similar
       | sentiment.
       | 
       | > You can't operate a deconstruction machine indefinitely;
       | ultimately, the machine is all you have left to take apart. We
       | need to make aspirational shit again so we have something to
       | deconstruct later. It's not a mysterious process, it's just the
       | opposite of what we were doing before.
       | 
       | https://www.penny-arcade.com/news/post/2025/02/28/opfor
        
       | drivingmenuts wrote:
       | You actually have to be able to envision the possibility of a
       | bright future to predict one. Right now, not the time.
        
       | gmuslera wrote:
       | The difference between science fiction and fantasy is feeling
       | that it might become possible somewhat, or that it is consistent.
       | In present world our culture has advanced enough to rule out or
       | at least make it too complex things like FTL or time travel, and
       | our current civilization struggles don't put in a good way long
       | term perspectives.
       | 
       | Somewhat aliens are not the saviors anymore, it is complex to
       | impossible to travel, and worse, colonize, anywhere else in the
       | universe, and the bringer of doom is already here, now, and it is
       | us.
       | 
       | What is left? Going virtual and living in a digital world? Lena (
       | https://qntm.org/mmacevedo ) ended with that.
        
       | socalgal2 wrote:
       | My biggest issue with most scifi now-a-days is it ignores the
       | acceleration of tech. Of course there's "Accelerando" and
       | "Marooned in Realtime" but lots of scifi has "race/society X has
       | been doing Y for 1000s of years" and now I immediately tune out
       | because no society is going to remain static enough to do Y for
       | thousands of years unless there is some premise in the book
       | preventing anyone from inventing anything new.
       | 
       | "Tales of Alvin Maker" had that. "Dune" did too but I didn't buy
       | Dune's excuse because militaries always want new tech.
       | 
       | This is also one of the many reasons why I can't buy into Star
       | Wars anymore because a society that can make droids can make
       | droids that make droids which means they have the means make
       | everything cheap and abundant. That they don't is just bad
       | writing. The writers didn't think through the implications of
       | their world building. Of course I get that Star Wars isn't hard
       | sci-fi. It's fantasy sci-fi, hence we have droids that scream and
       | get tortured -\\_(tsu)_/-
       | 
       | On the other hand, my first ride in a Waymo reminded me of the
       | optimisim I used to feel about the future like when the Jetsons
       | promised us moving sidewalks, flying cars, robot maids, etc..
        
       | aaomidi wrote:
       | BECKY CHAMBERS
        
       | snowwrestler wrote:
       | Optimistic science fiction shows humanity applying unique
       | ingenuity to solve tough problems. Our lived reality today is
       | that we already know the technical solutions to many tough
       | problems (hunger, homelessness, many diseases, overpopulation,
       | climate change, war) but simply refuse to apply them. Of course
       | people don't believe optimistic sci-fi anymore.
       | 
       |  _Star Trek_ the original series is usually taken as an example
       | of optimistic sci-fi. It's set in a faster-than-light space ship,
       | so it's science fiction. But the optimism came primarily from the
       | back story: having solved our problems on Earth, and created a
       | peaceful society of plenty, humanity turned its thoughtful minds
       | to exploring the stars.
       | 
       | Does that seem like the track we are on?
       | 
       | Science fiction, to be optimistic today, needs to show how our
       | society gets from here to there. Social progress was taken for
       | granted in the latter 20th century. It's not anymore. Something
       | is stopping us, something beyond science and engineering. In fact
       | whatever it is, is driving us to actively attack and destroy the
       | science and engineering we have already developed.
       | 
       | A better future is going to take something else: culture, or
       | society, or kindness, or empathy. It will take choice, and
       | effort, not antimatter and phasers.
        
       | libraryofbabel wrote:
       | An essay on optimistic science fiction but no discussion of Iain
       | M. Banks' _The Culture_ series...? for that matter, it doesn't
       | mention _any_ specific sci fi writer at all.
        
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