[HN Gopher] Germany's 'Deutschlandticket' helps environment - study
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Germany's 'Deutschlandticket' helps environment - study
Author : rustoo
Score : 69 points
Date : 2025-04-04 18:36 UTC (4 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.dw.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.dw.com)
| quakeguy wrote:
| Nothing new under the sun.
| Aldipower wrote:
| "A study funded by the German government ..." bla bla bla
|
| I mean, the Deutschlandticket is finance by taxes, so it is no
| surprise, that a study financed by the government, that is
| responsible for the taxes, reveals only good things.
| niemandhier wrote:
| Parts of the government would like to get rid of it, we are a
| nation of car companies after all.
| Aldipower wrote:
| Not true, when this study was financed.
|
| I have nothing against the Deutschlandticket, like it too.
| But I do not like bad studies.
| ziddoap wrote:
| > _But I do not like bad studies._
|
| Can you share your link to the study & data? I'd like to
| determine if it is a "bad study" myself. I looked at the
| links in the article and it doesn't seem to have the study.
| Aldipower wrote:
| Sure. As there is only one "study" Deutschewelle relates
| to. https://mcc-berlin-ariadne.shinyapps.io/dticket-
| tracker/ Highly biased. Telling you this is actually the
| job of DW, not me.
| ziddoap wrote:
| Thanks! Curious to dig into it over the weekend.
| barbazoo wrote:
| How is it "highly biased"?
| oytis wrote:
| The government decided to introduce Deutschlandticket to, among
| other things, reduce CO2 emissions. The government financed a
| study to quantify the effect. I don't really see a conflict of
| interests here, or how it compromises the integrity of the
| study.
| Aldipower wrote:
| The conflict is the potential waste of tax money, if it does
| not work as advertised.
| Krasnol wrote:
| I don't know what conspiracy you try to construct here, but
| it doesn't make sense. The new government would love to
| have a study which says that it didn't help, so they can
| cut it. They'd still want to cut it and it already got more
| expensive.
|
| Also, this is a Meta-analysis. Here it is:
| https://ariadneprojekt.de/media/2025/04/Ariadne-
| Report_Deuts...
|
| Try reading that before you start spreading such
| constructs.
| riedel wrote:
| The study was published by the Ariadne Project[0]. They also
| publish studies that actually criticize other subsidiaries by
| the government [1]
|
| Our research system in Germany is mostly publically funded,
| btw. Not sure who else would fund an independent study. It is
| actually a meta study, that states it's methodology and also
| mentiones contradictory results.
|
| [0] https://ariadneprojekt.de/news-de/deutschlandticket-
| verkehrs...
|
| [1] https://ariadneprojekt.de/en/press-releases/a-reward-of-
| seve...
| pixelpoet wrote:
| Mine's even paid for by the company, and on top of that we get a
| great discounted bike program: https://www.jobrad.org/
|
| Over 40 years old, lived in basically all the countries, never
| had a driver's licence!
| Etheryte wrote:
| Somewhat curious, how long is the list of "basically all the
| countries" really?
| jeofken wrote:
| Maybe GP means country as in "Bundesland", like how British
| people call their regions "countries"
| chaoskanzlerin wrote:
| Might not be what you meant, but German uses the same word
| for "state (federal subdivision)" and "country", known as
| "Land". In contrast, "Staat" refers chiefly to the
| administrative apparatus (implicitly of some country).
| pixelpoet wrote:
| Ehh yeah actually the list of countries isn't that long, and
| I mean living as in at least a few months (but most are at
| least a few years) in own apartment etc. Includes Indonesia
| (used to speak Bahasa as a kid), South Africa, Poland,
| Czechia, USA, England, Germany, Switzerland, and probably
| some others along the way. I suppose the actually-long list
| is cities; in Germany I've lived in 6 cities, and it's quite
| a few cities for some of the other countries.
|
| My main point though is that, while I get there are places
| where you absolutely need a car, a lot of people
| (particularly in car-cultured countries) are surprised to
| hear you can get by just fine without one in many cases.
| ChrisArchitect wrote:
| Some previous discussion:
|
| _Germany 's 49-euro ticket resulted in significant shift from
| road to rail_
|
| https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41819481
| dfxm12 wrote:
| It probably helps tourism too. Foreigners in Japan can get a rail
| pass at a huge discount. I might not have left Tokyo if not for
| it. It would be fun to pop around the country, from Munich to
| Stuttgart (for Oktoberfest and Volksfest?), then onto Frankfurt
| and Nuremburg. It looks like it pays for itself after 2 trips.
| zeeZ wrote:
| The Japan Rail Pass has gotten a price hike recently and now it
| feels like you have to keep chasing trains a lot to make it
| worthwhile. The regional passes are a bit better, but still
| require more moving around than I'm comfortable with for a
| vacation.
|
| The Deutschlandticket is only valid for up to Reginald lines
| and not on faster trains like IC and ICE. It's already worth it
| money wise for the first trip already, but only using local
| connections adds at least an hour per trip between those
| cities, plus a bunch of layovers.
| elpocko wrote:
| It doesn't. The ticket is available as a monthly subscription
| only, you can't just go and buy one.
| dietr1ch wrote:
| Which would help tourism if tourists could buy it, but the
| app asked for some Id and double-checking the web asks for an
| European address (UK is also listed)
| elpocko wrote:
| Yeah, as in "you can just go and buy one." It looks like
| they made it intentionally hard to acquire the ticket:
| government issued identification required, no way to
| purchase it ad hoc, subscription only; it's German
| bureaucratic hell. It's as if they want it to fail.
| usr1106 wrote:
| The political reasoning was that it's for commuters only.
| Tourism is not a big thing on federal level, so they
| don't want to subsidize tickets for tourists. Tourist
| areas sometimes have special tourist tickets for their
| guests.
| dietr1ch wrote:
| As a tourist though you want the least burden without
| getting ripped off. Just ask for my payment details and
| charge me whatever is fair for my trips.
|
| I don't want to become an expert on buying the optimal
| set of tickets from multiple regions.
| usr1106 wrote:
| That's your perspective. The federal government is not
| interested. Tourist regions are interested, but of course
| they usually do not cooperate with others, so every one
| invents their own thing. So you end up what Germans call
| a ticket jungle.
| dietr1ch wrote:
| They made me spend more money, which I wouldn't mind
| since I don't contribute to any of the subsidies public
| transport may have, but you can simply charge more, or
| consider it an investment since tourists bring new money
| in daily.
|
| Having the ticket would help a lot navigating around
| without fear of having the wrong ticket or making dealing
| with delays or cancellation even more frustrating.
| filmor wrote:
| You only need some official document (ID card, passport,
| whatever) that matches the name and birthday. If you are
| a tourist, you must have a passport or ID card close by
| anyhow.
| usr1106 wrote:
| There is no "the app". There are 100s of sellers, and each
| of them has different processes. Some sell smart cards at
| the ticket windows, most have apps, and some have both.
| Only the price and the basic rules of validity are
| nationwide. Some offer extra regional perks.
| zeta_ wrote:
| You can just cancel the subscription at any moment. I had
| American friends doing that.
| elpocko wrote:
| Americans can't buy the ticket. EU citizens only.
| usr1106 wrote:
| Source? I seriosly doubt that. Yes, it's difficult to
| find a suitable seller, but it's neither forbidden nor
| impossible.
| elpocko wrote:
| I only have anecdata and I don't feel like googling until
| I find something that confirms the real life experience.
|
| It's probably not impossible, but it's also not as simple
| a transaction as it could be. It is a difficult affair,
| at least _bordering on impossible_ unless you 're a EU
| citizen with a SEPA bank account.
| usr1106 wrote:
| It's a subscription requiring a German bank account in most
| cases. In theory any SEPA account should work, but it's a
| well-known problem that sellers break the law and accept only
| domestic accounts.
|
| However, reportedly a small number of apps allow paying by
| credit card. And some are more flexible regarding cancelling
| the subscription than others.
| filmor wrote:
| I just stayed with the app that I used for my old monthly
| ticket (mobil.nrw) and it allows paying with Paypal.
| comrade1234 wrote:
| Pre-pandemic some cities/kantons here in Switzerland wanted to
| make public transportation free (we're still recovering from
| running trains and transport essentially empty for a couple of
| years).
|
| However the Swiss constitution says that people have to be
| charged a "reasonable" fee for public transportation. It was
| probably meant to make it so they can't be overcharged. But it's
| been also interpreted that there has to be a minimum charge -
| thus no free transport.
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