[HN Gopher] Play the Virtual Organ from Arp Schnitger
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Play the Virtual Organ from Arp Schnitger
Author : ohjeez
Score : 118 points
Date : 2025-03-23 18:31 UTC (1 days ago)
(HTM) web link (www.orgelstadt-hamburg.de)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.orgelstadt-hamburg.de)
| p0w3n3d wrote:
| That's such a great project! But I'd love to see a proper VST
| with it, that allows voice mixing. The power of organs lays in
| the analog voice mixing (not simple on off, and not one voice
| exclusively)
| satiric wrote:
| https://www.hauptwerk.com/ is paid software but has a few
| Schnitger organs, although not the one shown off here.
| tgv wrote:
| There's also Sweelinq (https://sweelinq.com; subscription
| model), and Grand Orgue (free, but cumbersome; only a few
| worthwhile sample-sets), and there are some instruments for
| Kontakt.
| satiric wrote:
| Sounds great, even from so limited a platform. One octave is
| enough to have some fun with, if you're creative. Would have been
| nice to be able to combine the stops, but the plenum at least
| gives you a solid sound. You can really hear the character of the
| organ.
| tgv wrote:
| You can play it with your ASCII keyboard as well, as if it were a
| piano keyboard. It shows the German layout, but my Intl English
| keyboard works just as well.
|
| Should you be so inclined: (short) k u (long) k (short) u y g f
| (long) d f.
| DrSAR wrote:
| very clever, thank you
| josephernest wrote:
| Oh something in my niche ! I produce French pipe organ sample
| sets for a living : https://www.jeuxdorgues.com
|
| It's an extroardinary journey to record an organ, process the
| thousands of WAV files and design a virtual organ model.
| tptacek wrote:
| What! For a living? Say more!
| HPsquared wrote:
| People do that with pianos and other instruments too. Some of
| these sample packs are very expensive. It is a small market
| though, I suppose.
| vunderba wrote:
| Very cool! I'd be curious what you think of Modartt's recent
| attempts at physical models of organs and how they compare to
| more traditional sampler approaches.
|
| https://www.modartt.com/organteq_physical_modeling
| smj-edison wrote:
| Not OP, but I've worked on programming my own organ software
| before. I'd say physical modelling really cool tech, but the
| question is whether it makes a significant auditory
| difference.
|
| The thing is organs are a lot easier to sample compared to
| something like a violin. I'm oversimplifying, but it's mainly
| just note on, note off, vs lots of articulations where
| physical modelling is more beneficial. (Yes, there's wind
| sag, and wind delay, and regulators, but most organs
| specifically have things to avoid those artifacts so they'd
| only show up on more niche organs imo.) I've had great
| success simulating tremulants by just using FM demodulation
| to reconstruct the pitch and volume effects from tremmed
| samples[1]. Release samples are also difficult to match with
| the current phase, but I was also able to mitigate that with
| a single bin DFT + crossfaded.
|
| Another issue with physical modelling is it's decently CPU
| intensive, which is tricky when you have 700 simultaneous
| notes on bigger organs. So, it's definitely cool, but the
| question is whether it's significantly better than current
| sample-based technology. It could potentially reproduce some
| of the more strange interactions, but those interactions
| aren't necessarily wanted in the first place.
|
| EDIT: one thing that is nice about physical modelling is it's
| a lot easier to voice (modify) a pipe to the sound one wants.
| I think with some special filtering (comb filter for even
| harmonic attenuation, shelf for augmenting the harmonic
| series trajectory) voicing could also be satisfactory with
| traditional sampling (hauptwerk does some of this, but I
| think I could make it even more flexible).
|
| [1] https://github.com/smj-edison/sample-analysis
| HPsquared wrote:
| From my experience with the piano one, the "tweaking the
| sound" aspect is where I've got the most out of it. Even
| just for awareness. But yeah, the physical modelling
| approach is probably better suited to something like piano
| with all its interacting resonances (and the way a tuner
| can change things around on a real piano).
| mattgreenrocks wrote:
| Physical modeling seems to work really well for guitar/bass
| amplifiers. The Fractal Audio products are all based around
| simulating the various components of an amp and the ways
| they interact with each other, often with very unexpected
| results. They've been pushing in this direction for quite
| awhile, but I think it is more promising than capture-based
| tech ultimately.
|
| The modeling is so accurate that it ends up replicating
| even the unintended side effects of amps, such as ghost
| notes (false notes being produced due to the power supply).
| The tech note explains it better than I can:
| https://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/ghost-notes.126903/
| tgv wrote:
| Not the one you asked, but I have both Hauptwerk and
| Organteq, and the former beats the latter on everything
| expect cost, memory usage, start-up time. Organteq sounds
| artificial, and its reverb doesn't make it any better. Ok,
| you can tweak a lot, but the ensemble sound is unconvincing,
| and the registration choices are too limited.
| mock-possum wrote:
| What?? That's such a specific thing to do!
| wglb wrote:
| Let's hear more!
| josephernest wrote:
| You can hear many MP3 examples here:
| https://www.jeuxdorgues.com/jeux-d-orgues-4-lachaisedieu/
|
| All are played with the virtual organ, what do you think?
|
| I'll do a post soon with more stories about this project
| itself (that I started long ago)!
| isoprophlex wrote:
| I know what a WAV file is, and I've even made some electronic
| music myself.
|
| Yet my brain errored out and for a while I thought you made
| samples of pipe organs: little mini-organs to take home with
| you, to try out before you buy the big one.
|
| "Hello! Can I interest you in trying one of our sample organs?"
| wlonkly wrote:
| You've reinvented the portative!
| pontusrehula wrote:
| I'm interested in your choice to focus on French organs. Do you
| specifically aim to focus on French organs and not those of
| German type? Or is it more like a matter of convenience due to
| geography?
| smj-edison wrote:
| This is super cool! I've advocated for spreading the organ to a
| modern audience through websites before, so it's great to see
| someone doing this.
|
| In fact, I've been working off and on on my own virtual pipe
| organ software[1], except based around modular synthesis. I've
| found most modular synthesis engines don't have great support for
| blended midi and audio nodes, and often don't have good resources
| management, so I started from scratch.
|
| [1] https://github.com/wwtos/mjuo
| coldcode wrote:
| Long ago I sometimes played the organ. There is nothing more
| amazing than being alone in a large dark church, playing a pipe
| organ at full volume, feeling the vibrations. It's the original
| heavy metal. No other instrument can duplicate that feeling.
| smj-edison wrote:
| This is true--but that's something that's not very
| discoverable. I think getting to mess around with an organ
| online would pique someone's interest enough to seek out at
| in-person concert when they find that inevitably their
| speakers aren't good enough.
| Metacelsus wrote:
| At first I thought it was about the biologist Arp Schnittger:
| https://scholar.google.ch/citations?user=tvLQFnwAAAAJ&hl=en
| jll29 wrote:
| Beautiful sound - could anyone here point me to a method to
| upload such sounds onto standard keyboards (e.g. Yamaha PSR or
| Casio CT series), please? Thanks i.a.
| snickmy wrote:
| Went to the demo, played some basic counterpoint, probably some
| poorly recalled lines from Bach, and I always get surprised how
| well the music of that time fits the instrument capabilities.
| Eduard wrote:
| my keyboard apparently only allows to press three keys
| simultaneously. But when I switch browser tabs/windows while
| pressing a key, the keyup event apparently is not send to the
| previously focused window. For this virtual organ, this means it
| keeps playing the tone and therefore allowing to play more than
| three tones.
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