[HN Gopher] AMD 'Strix Halo' Ryzen AI Max+ Debuts with RDNA 3.5 ...
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AMD 'Strix Halo' Ryzen AI Max+ Debuts with RDNA 3.5 Graphics and
Zen 5 CPU Cores
Author : kcb
Score : 70 points
Date : 2025-01-06 19:27 UTC (3 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.tomshardware.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.tomshardware.com)
| jsheard wrote:
| This is the first x86 SoC to follow the lead set by Apple
| Silicons huge unified memory bus.
|
| Bandwidth is more or less on par with the M4 Pro, and it supports
| up to 128GB.
| unusualmonkey wrote:
| Remember that AMD has been making x86 SoC's with unified memory
| for quite some time.
| jsheard wrote:
| Yeah but they had pretty meagre memory bandwidth until now,
| aside from the parts they made exclusively for Xbox and
| Playstation. AMD didn't seem to be interested in bringing
| _fast_ unified memory to real computers until Apple did it.
| Now they need to double up the bus again to make an M4 Max-
| alike...
| BeefWellington wrote:
| It's possible they were restricted by agreements with
| Microsoft or Sony not to release anything before this year.
| hedgehog wrote:
| Historically PC OEMs cared about price more than graphics
| performance so that's what they got. If you look at
| mobile SoCs or the eDRAM-equipped SKUs Intel made for
| Apple you see more emphasis on memory & graphics
| performance similar to consoles.
| kmeisthax wrote:
| Those agreements would be >15 years old at this point, I
| doubt AMD would agree to sandbag their entire APU lineup
| going forward just to make the base model PS4 and Xbone
| look good, and I _especially_ doubt that they would do
| that _again_ with the PS5 and Xbox Series when they
| actually had money and room to negotiate. Likewise, it
| doesn 't make sense as a restriction Microsoft or Sony
| would impose: the console business is one of convenience,
| not power. They aren't trying to beat PCs and they don't
| care if PCs are a better deal. They care if they can get
| you to buy a box that locks you into their DRM scheme.
|
| Furthermore, during the chip shortages of the last few
| years, AMD was actually selling broken PS5 silicon for
| use as a normal Windows PC[0]. If there were restrictions
| on selling APUs above a certain performance level, then
| this PC wouldn't exist.
|
| [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9h08cMFwqRc
| babypuncher wrote:
| It isn't what the market wanted, and by market I mean OEMs,
| because I'm sure consumers would have loved it.
|
| The OEMs buying APUs to use in laptops and SFF desktops
| were more interested in cutting costs than boosting
| graphics performance. Users who want better 3D performance
| can buy a higher end laptop with a discrete GPU and juicier
| profit margin.
| sliken wrote:
| Right, but none wider than 128 bits, unless you count PS5 and
| XboxX.
| crest wrote:
| It "just" doubled the memory bus width from 128 to 256 bit and
| cranked up the interface clock speed. I wonder what it means
| for the infinity fabric. Is it going to run at ~4GHz to keep
| up?
| okasaki wrote:
| > AMD says this delivers groundbreaking capabilities for thin-
| and-light laptops
|
| Laptops with 120W cpus aren't thin or light.
| getcrunk wrote:
| Amd in general has allowed their mobile cpus to power scale. I
| don't see why this would be any different. 15w on the go. 120
| with plug
|
| Edit: per article these are positioned from 45w up
| eigenspace wrote:
| AMDs slides say 45-120W.
| enragedcacti wrote:
| The quoted tdps seem to be for CPU+GPU combined and these SKUs
| have huge increases in GPU size (40 CUs up from a max of 16
| last gen). The M4 Pro and M4 Max fall into the same tdp range.
| crest wrote:
| That's for both CPU, supposedly no-longer puny iGPU and the
| NPU. You'll get >=80% real-world throughput for about half the
| power budget which is can easily be cooled in a 14" laptop
| that's thin for a gaming laptop without shattering your
| eardrums. I'll grant that you'll have to pick between
| acceptable acoustics, thermal throttling, or form factor when
| you go beyond 60W continuous heat output.
| okasaki wrote:
| > That's for both CPU, supposedly no-longer puny iGPU and the
| NPU.
|
| Right, the CPU.
| runjake wrote:
| FTA (emphasis mine):
|
| "All of the AI Max chips have a 55W base TDP, but also a
| configurable TDP that ranges from 45 to 120W to unleash more
| horsepower _in designs that can handle the thermal output_. "
| ncann wrote:
| > AMD 'Strix Halo' Ryzen AI Max+ 395 PRO
|
| Gosh that name is a mouthful
| leptons wrote:
| I hate it. Whatever does "strix" even mean?? The rest of it is
| stupid too.
| nerdix wrote:
| Isn't Strix Halo just a code name?
| mindcrime wrote:
| That was my understanding.
| Havoc wrote:
| >Whatever does "strix" even mean?
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strix_(mythology)#Greek_origin.
| ..
| hnuser123456 wrote:
| Strix Halo is the codename, not marketing name, so you can
| remove that part.
|
| "AI" seems to have replaced the segment number.
|
| The + is because it's the top-end model of the lineup.
|
| Not sure what's Max or Pro about it though.
| ncann wrote:
| They managed to put Max, plus, and Pro into the name, which
| is kinda impressive in a way. Now we just need Ultra to
| complete the set.
| toast0 wrote:
| AMD Better watch out, Altera, a subsidiary of Intel, claims
| a trademark on MAX+PLUS.
| shoo wrote:
| there's still room for MAX(+, +) or MAX(+, PRO)
| enragedcacti wrote:
| I think the AI appears on any SKU with enough TOPS for
| copilot+ (they released some 200 SKUs that are just Ryzen
| 5/7, no AI)
|
| Max is the segment number i.e. it's "Ryzen 11" (the other 300
| series SKUs they announced are Ryzen AI [5|7] 3xx). Weirdly
| though there are no Ryzen 9s so maybe it's really just a
| rebrand of 9.
|
| The Pro just means it has management and security features
| for enterprise customers.
| hnuser123456 wrote:
| Thank you. It's nice to be able to decode that.
| Uehreka wrote:
| Isn't Strix a brand of RAM or something?
| runjake wrote:
| Strix is a brand name for the ASUS ROG line of PC
| components, but AMD is using it as a code name.
|
| BTW, here's the meaning of "Strix":
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strix_(mythology)
| timewizard wrote:
| > Not sure what's Max or Pro about it though.
|
| Secure processor, shadow stacks, secure boot, hardware asset
| trackability. Enterprise stuff.
| solarkraft wrote:
| > Strix Halo is the codename, not marketing name, so you can
| remove that part.
|
| That was the good part, lol.
| gazchop wrote:
| Sounds like ChatGPT had a breakdown when asked to name it.
| jmward01 wrote:
| If they can deliver the drives and support for pytorch out of the
| box then I know what my next laptop will have in it.
| UncleOxidant wrote:
| Yep. Though I'd prefer just to have a small form factor box on
| my desk. Something the size of a Mac Mini.
| ksec wrote:
| I cant find any information on memory it uses for its 256GB/s. It
| said New Memory interface. Seems high even for 256Bit LPDDR5X.
|
| Zen 5 CPU, RDNA 3.5 GPU, and XDNA 2 NPU. No word on process
| nodes.
| adrian_b wrote:
| It uses LPDDR5X-8000, with a 256-bit memory interface (double
| in comparison with standard desktops).
|
| 8 GHz x 32 bytes = 256 GB/s
|
| This has been known for a long time.
|
| What annoys me is that AMD does not say whether the Zen 5 cores
| of Strix Halo have full vector processing pipelines, like
| Granite Ridge and Fire Range, or they have the narrow pipelines
| of Strix Point and Krackan Point.
| sliken wrote:
| Various leaks have claimed that some products would ship with
| DDR5-8533 which is 266GB/sec. I wouldn't be surprised if a
| range of frequencies ship with the 1st gen devices.
|
| Maybe even a SFF sized motherboard that allows CUDIMMs, which
| is a nice fit since each CUDIMM is 128 bits wide.
| kcb wrote:
| AMDs comparison with the M4 Pro.
|
| https://www.digitaltrends.com/wp-content/uploads/2025/01/3d-...
| diggan wrote:
| What is the graph supposed to measure, actually? Renders are
| usually measured in seconds, so high=worse, but then clearly
| they highlight it as they're better, so it's the second-
| difference as a percentage or something?
|
| Why can't companies just include absolute numbers in their
| comparisons...
| zamadatix wrote:
| It's first party marketing so always orienting the scale
| towards "higher=better=ours" and measuring via "whatever
| measurement gave the best numbers to present". They could
| give all the information in the world and I'd still wait and
| see what 3rd party reviews say the performance actually is
| rather than look into the 1st party number.
| tedunangst wrote:
| They're benchmark scores.
| danudey wrote:
| Betterness.
| zamadatix wrote:
| Source article of that (though it's actually linked in TFA as
| well) https://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/amd-mobile-
| processor...
|
| Non-thumbnail version of the chart:
| https://www.digitaltrends.com/wp-content/uploads/2025/01/3d-...
| bearjaws wrote:
| Not shown: Wattage
|
| 100% chance its chewing through at least 50% more power to
| achieve the result.
|
| Infact based on their TDP guidance, it goes up to 120w, which
| is more than double M4. But we don't know what the
| configuration was for this benchmark. We also don't have great
| numbers for M4's power consumption either.
|
| Then you throw in the fact 120w TDP from AMD is not actually a
| power consumption figure... and it's all made up.
| danudey wrote:
| Not to mention what's the performance like on battery vs.
| plugged in. If I have to stay tethered to the wall in order
| to achieve the rated performance then it's not really an
| apples-to-apples comparison unless you only ever use your
| laptop at a desk (which is probably most people, honestly).
| ac29 wrote:
| M4 Max is the most comparable to Strix Halo and while Apple
| does not appear to give an official power consumption, there
| are plenty of anecdotal reports of it using over 100W under
| load. For example:
|
| https://www.reddit.com/r/macbookpro/comments/1hj3m0p/m4_max_.
| ..
|
| https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/m4-max-eats-
| battery.244...
| Archit3ch wrote:
| Shouldn't they compare Max+ to M4 Max?
| dagmx wrote:
| They should but it's not favourable. In their presentation
| they specifically said it outperforms the binned M4 Pro and
| is on par with the unbinned M4 Pro.
|
| It would be behind the M4 Max. It's also over double the
| wattage of the M4 Pro to achieve these numbers.
| sliken wrote:
| Even M4 Pro is a big step up. M4 max is pretty expensive and
| I suspect AMD is targetting a lower price point, not that any
| prices were mentioned today.
|
| 256 bits * DDR5-8533 is a pretty big step up from any other
| x86-64 laptop or SFF and should be a pretty huge help for
| anything graphics or bandwidth intensive, like LLMs.
| Lerc wrote:
| If it runs pytorch at speed without hand holding I would probably
| get one.
|
| If it runs tinygrad at speed(a lower bar developmentally) I might
| get one.
|
| Is there a model benchmarking site where you can select varying
| degrees of models by source code and see how they perform on
| different hardware. It would assist people to evaluate whether or
| not a specific piece of hardware is good for the jobs that they
| want it to do.
| diggan wrote:
| > Is there a model benchmarking site where you can select
| varying degrees of models by source code and see how they
| perform on different hardware. It would assist people to
| evaluate whether or not a specific piece of hardware is good
| for the jobs that they want it to do.
|
| Not that I'm aware of (at least based on real benchmarks), but
| it's something I've been noodling about building, together with
| with some other associated data that can be helpful when
| wanting to select a model. Glad to hear I'm not the only one
| wanting it :)
| UncleOxidant wrote:
| > If AMD keeps with tradition, which we fully expect, we will see
| these monstrous APU chips come to desktop PCs in the future.
|
| How far in the future? I don't need another laptop, but would be
| nice to have a box to run local llms on. If these things can run
| LLMs at a decent clip then this would be sort of a "shut up and
| take my money" situation.
| wmf wrote:
| HP already announced a mini workstation with this chip.
| UncleOxidant wrote:
| I'm seeing a laptop [1] do you have a link to the
| workstation?
|
| EDIT: Oh, I see they're calling the laptop a workstation.
|
| [1] https://liliputing.com/hp-zbook-ultra-14-g1a-mobile-
| workstat...
| sylware wrote:
| mmmmh.... I wonder how much the CPU ram usage will slow down the
| GPU with real life loads.
| sliken wrote:
| The strix halo announce was pretty much exactly what was leaked.
|
| However one big surprise was that the Halo 395 chip runs Llama
| 3.1 70B-Q4 2.2x times faster than a RTX 4090 24GB. Anyone have
| any details? The slide mentions seeing AMD endnote SHO-14 for
| details.
|
| Maybe 70B-Q4 doesn't fit in 24GB?
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