[HN Gopher] OpenAI whistleblower found dead in San Francisco apa...
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       OpenAI whistleblower found dead in San Francisco apartment
        
       Author : mmorearty
       Score  : 127 points
       Date   : 2024-12-13 21:56 UTC (1 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (www.mercurynews.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (www.mercurynews.com)
        
       | alsetmusic wrote:
       | https://archive.is/xBuPg
        
       | cryptozeus wrote:
       | may he rip!
        
       | bpodgursky wrote:
       | I'm confused by the term "whistleblower" here. Was anything
       | actual released that wasn't publicly known?
       | 
       | It seems like he just disagreed with whether it was "fair use" or
       | not, and it was notable because he was at the company. But the
       | facts were always known, OpenAI was training on public
       | copyrighted text data. You could call him an objector, or
       | internal critic or something.
        
         | stonogo wrote:
         | The article holds clues: "Information he held was expected to
         | play a key part in lawsuits against the San Francisco-based
         | company."
        
           | abeppu wrote:
           | and later:
           | 
           | >In a Nov. 18 letter filed in federal court, attorneys for
           | The New York Times named Balaji as someone who had "unique
           | and relevant documents" that would support their case against
           | OpenAI. He was among at least 12 people -- many of them past
           | or present OpenAI employees -- the newspaper had named in
           | court filings as having material helpful to their case, ahead
           | of depositions.
           | 
           | Yes it's true it's been public knowledge _that_ OpenAI has
           | trained on copyrighted data, but details about what was
           | included in training data (albeit dated ...), as well as
           | internal metrics (e.g. do they know how often their models
           | regurgitate paragraphs from a training document?) would be
           | important.
        
       | neilv wrote:
       | Condolences to the family. It sounds like he was a very
       | thoughtful and principled person.
        
         | OutOfHere wrote:
         | > he was a very thoughtful
         | 
         | Not that thoughtful. Copyright law is mostly harmful.
         | Apparently he couldn't realize this simple conclusion.
        
           | henry700 wrote:
           | Found the hitman
        
       | sharkjacobs wrote:
       | http://suchir.net/fair_use.html
       | 
       | When does generative AI qualify for fair use? by Suchir Balaji
        
         | minimaxir wrote:
         | It's also worth reading his initial tweet:
         | https://x.com/suchirbalaji/status/1849192575758139733
         | 
         | > I recently participated in a NYT story about fair use and
         | generative AI, and why I'm skeptical "fair use" would be a
         | plausible defense for a lot of generative AI products. I also
         | wrote a blog post (https://suchir.net/fair_use.html) about the
         | nitty-gritty details of fair use and why I believe this.
         | 
         | > To give some context: I was at OpenAI for nearly 4 years and
         | worked on ChatGPT for the last 1.5 of them. I initially didn't
         | know much about copyright, fair use, etc. but became curious
         | after seeing all the lawsuits filed against GenAI companies.
         | When I tried to understand the issue better, I eventually came
         | to the conclusion that fair use seems like a pretty implausible
         | defense for a lot of generative AI products, for the basic
         | reason that they can create substitutes that compete with the
         | data they're trained on. I've written up the more detailed
         | reasons for why I believe this in my post. Obviously, I'm not a
         | lawyer, but I still feel like it's important for even non-
         | lawyers to understand the law -- both the letter of it, and
         | also why it's actually there in the first place.
         | 
         | > That being said, I don't want this to read as a critique of
         | ChatGPT or OpenAI per se, because fair use and generative AI is
         | a much broader issue than any one product or company. I highly
         | encourage ML researchers to learn more about copyright -- it's
         | a really important topic, and precedent that's often cited like
         | Google Books isn't actually as supportive as it might seem.
         | 
         | > Feel free to get in touch if you'd like to chat about fair
         | use, ML, or copyright -- I think it's a very interesting
         | intersection. My email's on my personal website.
        
       | vouaobrasil wrote:
       | > It was then he became a believer in the potential benefits that
       | artificial intelligence could offer society, including its
       | ability to cure diseases and stop aging, the Times reported. "I
       | thought we could invent some kind of scientist that could help
       | solve them," he told the newspaper.
       | 
       | It's hard to say anything because we don't know why he died, but
       | I wonder if his death could have been prevented if he had not
       | been exposed to this sort of propaganda that AI will help
       | society. Then he wouldn't have worked at OpenAI and would have
       | gone to do something more worthwhile with his life.
        
       | abeppu wrote:
       | So, not at all the point of the article, but ... who does Mercury
       | News think is benefited the embedded map at the bottom of the
       | article with a point just labeled "San Francisco, CA", centered
       | at Market & Van Ness? It's not where the guy lived. If you're a
       | non-local reader confused about where SF is, the map is far too
       | zoomed in to show you.
        
       | lolinder wrote:
       | Normally the word "whistleblower" means someone who revealed
       | previously-unknown facts about an organization. In this case he's
       | a former employee who had an interview where he criticized
       | OpenAI, but the facts that he was in possession of were not only
       | widely known at the time but were the subject of an ongoing
       | lawsuit that had launched months prior.
       | 
       | As much as I want to give this a charitable reading, the only
       | explanation I can think of for using the word whistleblower here
       | is to imply that there's something shady about the death.
        
         | lyu07282 wrote:
         | You assume he revealed everything he knew, he was most likely
         | under NDA, the ongoing lawsuit cited him as a source. Which
         | presumably he didn't yet testify for and now he never will be
         | able to. His (most likely ruled suicide inb4) death should also
         | give pause to the other 11 on that list:
         | 
         | > He was among at least 12 people -- many of them past or
         | present OpenAI employees -- the newspaper had named in court
         | filings as having material helpful to their case, ahead of
         | depositions.
        
           | lolinder wrote:
           | Being one of 12+ witnesses in a lawsuit where the facts are
           | hardly in dispute is not the same as being a whistleblower.
           | The key questions in this lawsuit are not and never were
           | going to come down to insider information--OpenAI does not
           | dispute that they trained on copyrighted material, they
           | dispute that it was illegal for them to do so.
        
       | DevX101 wrote:
       | Anyone who's a whistleblower should compile key docs and put it
       | in a "dead man's switch" service that releases your
       | testimony/docs to multiple news agencies in the event of your
       | untimely demise. The company you're whistle blowing against and
       | their major shareholders should know this exists. Also, regularly
       | post public video attesting to you current mental state.
        
         | eastbound wrote:
         | But then what do you have to whistleblow?
        
         | cced wrote:
         | Weren't theres couple of dead Boeing whistleblowers in recent
         | times relating to poor AA/design?
        
       | dgfitz wrote:
       | I wonder who called to ask about his well-being.
       | 
       | The Boeing guy killed himself, this guy apparently killed
       | himself. The pattern of David vs Goliath, where David kills
       | himself, is almost becoming a pattern.
        
       | dtquad wrote:
       | Interesting that the NYT article about him states that OpenAI
       | started developing GPT-4 before the ChatGPT release. They sure
       | were convinced by the early GPT-2/3 results.
       | 
       | >In early 2022, Mr. Balaji began gathering digital data for a new
       | project called GPT-4
       | 
       | https://www.nytimes.com/2024/10/23/technology/openai-copyrig...
        
         | minimaxir wrote:
         | ChatGPT was a research project that went megaviral, it wasn't
         | intended to be as big as it was.
         | 
         | Training a massive LLM on the scale of GPT-4 requires a lot of
         | lead time, so the timeframe makes sense.
        
       | pkkkzip wrote:
       | odd...OpenAI partnered with the military only a week ago
       | 
       | now a whistleblower is found dead ? not sure what to make of it,
       | he had no signs of depression, was seen quite happy and through
       | his private circles and according to friends he was not suicidal
       | but 'worried'
       | 
       | https://www.technologyreview.com/2024/12/04/1107897/openais-...
        
       | leobg wrote:
       | I wonder if he received threats from Altman after the NYT piece
       | came out.
        
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       (page generated 2024-12-13 23:00 UTC)