[HN Gopher] Ask HN: What are the best programmable holiday lights?
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       Ask HN: What are the best programmable holiday lights?
        
       I am replacing some old outdoor lights and I want to get LED lights
       that I can program? Any suggestions on the best ones? Ideally
       replaceable/extendable light strings with some kind of programmable
       controller that has usb/wifi. If it has an app my family can use
       that's a plus.
        
       Author : sh1mmer
       Score  : 110 points
       Date   : 2024-12-06 17:20 UTC (2 days ago)
        
       | pwg wrote:
       | https://kno.wled.ge/
       | 
       | Many 'effects' already prepackaged. Plus the ability to schedule
       | time based changes (on/off/change pattern/etc.). Includes a web
       | server to provide "app like" control over a phone or PC. Also
       | includes integrations for several "home control" systems and a
       | http API for programmatic control from another system. Can even
       | synchronize plural controllers into a whole 'net' (note, I've not
       | used this feature yet).
       | 
       | Small ESP32 boards (with wifi capability) such as this example
       | (no affiliation, just an example that works):
       | 
       | https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09Y8X1GK7
       | 
       | WS2811 LED strings [1] (of which there are an infinite variety)
       | suitable for outdoor use. One example (no affiliation):
       | 
       | https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CYZF1WCR
       | 
       | Suitable power supplies, outdoor weather sealed boxes, and wiring
       | (all left to you to locate).
       | 
       | Willingness to assemble the pieces and some time to do so. Having
       | a soldering iron is helpful here, although one could possibly get
       | by with screw terminal blocks inside weatherproof boxes if need
       | be for many of the 'connections'.
       | 
       | [1] Or other 'programmable LED' strings for which WLED is
       | compatible (it works with numerous different programmable LED
       | standards, browse the WLED website for details).
        
         | neotek wrote:
         | Seconding WLED, it's fantastic. Super easy to install and
         | operate, compatible with HomeAssistant, the built in effects
         | are great, the web app / native mobile apps are powerful but
         | straightforward, and the community offers plenty of help and
         | other resources.
        
         | Firerouge wrote:
         | It also supports DMX input (sACN or Art-Net) for designing and
         | controlling complex effects from external software.
        
         | jhardy54 wrote:
         | Warning: don't buy an ESP32-C6 for this. It's not compatible
         | with WLED/ESPHome/etc and it isn't clear whether/when this will
         | be resolved.
        
         | quickthrowman wrote:
         | I strongly suggest not buying _any_ electronic components from
         | Amazon, but 5VDC LED light strings should be OK.
         | 
         |  _Do not_ roll the dice on the power supply, buy a UL listed
         | one. If you buy some shitty Chinese PSU and it lights your
         | house on fire, your homeowners insurance will deny the claim.
         | 
         | This one puts out 30w @ 5VDC and is also UL listed:
         | https://poliledsigns.com/shop/poli-5vdc-30w-waterproof-led-p...
         | 
         | Even though it says 'waterproof', it needs to be installed in
         | an enclosure, NEMA 3R rated enclosure if it's installed
         | outdoors.
        
           | harrall wrote:
           | This is some major myth. Crack open your insurance policy --
           | it's not going to say "UL listed appliances only" or anything
           | like that. Insurance also covers mistakes.
           | 
           | But you should get a good power supply anyway because the
           | hassle is not worth it.
        
             | quickthrowman wrote:
             | My bad on perpetuating the myth regarding homeowner's
             | insurance and UL listing, I appreciate the correction.
             | 
             | You'd need to read what the policy has to say about
             | uninspected electrical work performed by or at the
             | direction of the homeowner. If you use a hardwired power
             | supply, non-UL/cUL equipment won't pass an inspection [0].
             | You can bypass the inspection by using a cord and plug 120V
             | rectifier which wouldn't need to be UL listed since it
             | wouldn't need an inspection.
             | 
             | [0] NEC Section 110.3(c): https://up.codes/s/examination-
             | identification-installation-u...
             | 
             | > 110.3 (C) Listing Product testing, evaluation, and
             | listing (product certification) shall be performed by
             | recognized qualified electrical testing laboratories and
             | shall be in accordance with applicable product standards
             | recognized as achieving equivalent and effective safety for
             | _equipment installed_ [1] to comply with this Code.
             | 
             | [1] 'Equipment installed' means hardwired.
        
             | thereticent wrote:
             | Ah, good point. I was picturing this setup as hardwired.
        
           | lukevp wrote:
           | Do you have proof that claims are denied due to power
           | supplies not rated correctly? That seems like fear mongering
           | otherwise. Your insurance still covers your house even if you
           | make mistakes on construction or repair yourself, I can't
           | imagine them denying a claim over a purchased part that you
           | have a good faith reason to believe it will function
           | correctly.
           | 
           | Also why do you specifically call out Chinese parts as being
           | shitty? Where do you think the majority of electronics come
           | from? This feels like xenophobia. The power supply can be
           | cheap and crappy and come from anywhere. Or it can be great
           | and come from anywhere. That one you linked, by the way -
           | Made in China.
        
             | thereticent wrote:
             | My understanding is that insurance will not cover issues
             | caused by DIY work if you did not have it permitted and
             | inspected properly afterward. I sincerely doubt that an
             | insurance company would be required to cover losses due to
             | DIY electronics using parts that have not been properly
             | safety rated. I'm surprised you think the opposite is
             | obvious. Could just be my US perspective.
        
               | sokoloff wrote:
               | I fully expect that if I built (or bought) a power
               | supply, plugged it into the wall, and it caught fire due
               | to my own negligence (unintentional), that the resulting
               | losses to the structure would be covered. (I'm in the
               | US.) It would seem no different than if I built a fire in
               | the fireplace that caused the issue, had a 3D printer
               | catch fire, or had a grease fire cause the issue.
        
             | quickthrowman wrote:
             | I clarified in a sibling comment, I was incorrect about UL
             | listing being required for homeowner's insurance but UL
             | listing (or testing by another nationally recognized test
             | lab) is required to pass an inspection if you're hardwiring
             | a piece of equipment, and fires caused by unpermitted DIY
             | electrical work are not covered by insurance.
             | 
             | Amazon does not have audited supply chains. The power
             | supply I linked is sold by Sylvania, it has a warranty, and
             | it's UL listed, not sold on Amazon by Xfrtteg or Psygwist.
             | You can have quality goods manufactured in China, it's
             | Amazon that I don't trust.
        
         | joshstrange wrote:
         | WLED is the clear answer here. I got a simple USB controller
         | (usb just for power) so it can't run a a massive strand of
         | lights (at least at full brightness) but it was perfect to dip
         | my toes in and try out.
         | 
         | The Home Assistant integration works great as well.
        
           | sircastor wrote:
           | The fact that you can install the WLED firmware _from the
           | website_ is the cherry on top. It's a fantastic piece of
           | software.
        
             | tiagod wrote:
             | Agreed. There's people on HN complaining about APIs like
             | Web USB, but I never got why. You can ship a firmware
             | flasher as a single .html file now! No sketchy native tools
             | or messing around with the command line, and runs on pretty
             | much any machine.
        
         | sowbug wrote:
         | The most plug-and-play WLED-compatible controller I've found is
         | made by athom.tech and available on AliExpress
         | <https://www.aliexpress.com/store/1101393719>. There are two
         | versions based on the ESP32C3. One is powered by USB-C @ 5V,
         | and the other has a barrel jack and passes through 5-24V to the
         | lights, which is useful if you're using a higher-voltage strip
         | like WS2813.
         | 
         | I used to build my own controllers from ESP development boards,
         | but it's just not worth it when an enclosed controller with
         | convenient connectors is priced between $10-20.
        
           | asteroidburger wrote:
           | I'm a fan of these guys:
           | 
           | https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CHHZTGJR
           | 
           | Power is passed through from either connector, so it'll work
           | on 5v or 12v strings. And it's got two output channels. It's
           | only an ESP8266 inside, but that works fine for my needs.
           | 
           | For a slightly more DIY approach, try this one:
           | 
           | https://wiki.vdbx.io/product/flip_c3
           | 
           | Has everything you need to give it some sort of power and get
           | the requisite data signal out.
        
             | daredoes wrote:
             | The ESP8266 is no longer recommended for WLED due to its
             | lack of resources
        
               | asteroidburger wrote:
               | If you need the upgraded performance, you can pay a bit
               | more and get the ESP32 equivalent:
               | https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0D4Z4YG4H/
               | 
               | Personally, I've found the ESP8266 version adequate in
               | the year I've owned it.
        
           | blutack wrote:
           | The athom stuff is a bit annoying because they never bothered
           | to upstream anything to support their fairly minor changes -
           | they just forked instead. You can still install upstream
           | WLED, but the remote control support is faffy.
           | 
           | The mottramlabs or QuinLED boards don't have this problem.
        
           | notedwin wrote:
           | another plug-and-play pre-flashed with wled:
           | https://magwled.com/
           | 
           | you can find the controller on amazon comes with usb-c for
           | 12v and 5v and currrently using it with some BTF-LIGHTING
           | WS2812B fairy lights
        
         | leptons wrote:
         | WLED is nice for 1-dimensional LED strips, or if you don't
         | really care how the animations project on your LEDs, but
         | anything in 2 dimension is painful, the grid mapping in 2D is
         | just overly complicated and obscure. I barely got my simple LED
         | matrix working and I've been doing LED grids with my own
         | software for over 10 years (so I know how easy it can be). WLED
         | was just an awful experience for 2D led arrays or anything more
         | complex than a single LED strip.
        
         | codetrotter wrote:
         | > kno.wled.ge
         | 
         | I want to take a moment to ackno.wled.ge how absolute awesome
         | of a domain hack "kno.wled.ge" is for the website of a WLED
         | project!
        
       | tannedNerd wrote:
       | I've been super impressed so far with the Govee lights I've
       | gotten. The app is pretty easy to use has tons of cool effects,
       | and they have a LAN API (https://app-h5.govee.com/user-
       | manual/wlan-guide) for most of their lights that have WiFi. Don't
       | have enough time this year to program a custom show but was going
       | to start earlier next year now that I have a couple of these. The
       | new scene stage thing they just released where you can map your
       | lights and have them all work together is pretty slick too.
        
         | havnagiggle wrote:
         | Is Govee the down-cone style? Or are there also others doing
         | that? There's been a couple of houses that have this and I
         | wasn't sure what they are using, but it's the only one that I
         | would consider doing whole house exterior. Many others look too
         | sharp.
        
           | jason_pomerleau wrote:
           | Yes, though they have other types too. We've been thrilled
           | with ours. I've never done Christmas lights because I don't
           | do ladders, so having a permanent fixture is attractive. Plus
           | we can use them on big holidays too.
           | 
           | I have big reservations about 'smart home' stuff, and it's
           | only the second such device in our house. But I'm clearly
           | losing that battle, and will be looking into some ways to
           | mitigate the privacy concerns. But gosh, it sure is nice to
           | pick from a gazillion light patterns.
        
         | linsomniac wrote:
         | That's very good to hear, because last year on Black Friday I
         | got a couple of dual 36' Govee light strips and am just
         | planning on putting them up today, as a permanent install. It's
         | been a long-time dream of mine to have permanent holiday
         | lights. These are the ones that are the strips with an LED
         | every few inches, individually controllable. Looking over at
         | Amazon it looks like they have the 65ft kit I got for $70 right
         | now ($40 off coupon).
         | 
         | Last year we put up this Govee LED grid "curtain" and my son
         | had some fun programming it.
        
       | netsharc wrote:
       | Maybe relevant: https://youtu.be/TvlpIojusBE
        
       | luxuryballs wrote:
       | I want a mesh grid of LEDs that I can lay across the house maybe
       | with 6" between each one so I get a low res screen of dots and
       | then play Die Hard on it to see if people figure it out. It would
       | kind of be like a TV but with 9 out of 10 pixels missing, more or
       | less.
        
         | blutack wrote:
         | You could use ws28xx/skxx based addressible strips laid out in
         | rows. Usually WLED would be recommended to drive it, but for
         | playing a video, the teensy fastled library comes with a demo
         | specifically doing what you discuss with a film.
         | 
         | https://quinled.info/2019/06/03/what-digital-5v-12v-rgbw-led...
         | good intro to the subject.
        
       | ryukoposting wrote:
       | Not quite what you're looking for perhaps, but I'm very happy
       | with my "dumb" lights controlled with a couple smart plugs
       | flashed with Tasmota.
        
         | criddell wrote:
         | We have the Twinkly lights and they are pretty neat. You put
         | them on your tree and you don't have to be careful about where
         | or how you lay them out because step 2 is point your phone
         | camera at the tree and it turns the lights on and off to map
         | where each bulb is. You move around the tree until they are all
         | mapped (lights go from orange to green when mapped).
         | 
         | The app has a bunch of canned patterns and there's an online
         | site for user designs and of course you can design your own.
         | It's a lot of fun and they aren't terribly expensive (there was
         | a good black friday sale).
        
       | ramones13 wrote:
       | If you ever want to go all out with a musical light show, I have
       | some recommendations here: https://aluhrs.com/blog/holiday-
       | lights-electronics/
       | 
       | For your specific question, Wally's Lights is great, and like
       | others have mentioned, something running WLED to control them is
       | a great choice.
        
         | copperx wrote:
         | Is this the best choice if I wanted to wire the outside of
         | entire house?
        
       | sircastor wrote:
       | This is a huge space to get into. I'm on my fourth year doing an
       | outdoor light show.
       | 
       | My personal preference is 12v ws2811 bullet-style voltage-
       | regulated nodes. They're extendable, individual nodes on a strand
       | are replaceable if you're willing to do some cutting and
       | crimping.
       | 
       | I like the 12v because you can go for longer strands without
       | losing colors from voltage drop. Regulated over a resistive
       | voltage divider = less heat.
       | 
       | As has been mentioned, you can install WLED onto a
       | microcontroller and have a web-page for a remote control.
        
         | INTPenis wrote:
         | I know programming but only very rudimentary hardware, how
         | difficult is this to do? Are there guides?
        
           | sircastor wrote:
           | Installing WLED is about as easy as one could hope for - so
           | easy, it's kind of unbelievable. Provided that your device
           | has USB, you plug it in, go to the WLED installer page
           | (https://install.wled.me/) and press the install button.
           | 
           | In terms of making custom sequences for lights, my go to is
           | Xlights - an Open source project that allows you to create
           | layouts, and build sequences.
        
         | averageRoyalty wrote:
         | I'm sure you know but for others reading, 12v ws2811 are
         | grouped in threes, so not individually addressable. 5v is, and
         | when you're working at scale power injection isn't a huge deal
         | as you'll be doing it anyway.
         | 
         | Always standardise your connectors. I'm a fan of the Ray Wu
         | ones.
         | 
         | ESP/WLED driven is my preference, but the Falcon controllers
         | are popular amongst people who are more DIY/woodworking
         | oriented as they're much simpler to set up and not _heaps_ more
         | expensive. Falcon Player/xlights is the standard software for
         | designing/playback of your show regardless of hardware.
         | 
         | Coro props (corrugated plastic, corflute) are a cheap and
         | effective way to stand out from the crowd. Animatronics, smoke
         | etc are also an option when going more advanced.
         | 
         | It's a lot of work. You rarely want to start after October or
         | order your goods after July. You are running a live production
         | and things will go wrong. Good luck to anyone entering the
         | space, it's very fun and expensive!
        
       | silverlight wrote:
       | Somewhat related topic: anyone used something like the Luxedo to
       | do a projection mapping? It seems like it's more complicated and
       | expensive but I love the idea of doing something cool to the
       | house for Halloween and Christmas without having to lug out a ton
       | of lights and decorations.
        
         | moepstar wrote:
         | I'm fascinated by these projection setups ever since I learned
         | they're a thing! But Jesus is the Luxedo stuff pricey?! I'd
         | love to learn about something similar but in a kinda OSS/DIY
         | kind of style...
        
         | rapjr9 wrote:
         | There are several open source projection mapper projects that
         | run on a RaspPi, or other platforms, here are a few of them:
         | 
         | https://github.com/arisona/mpm
         | 
         | https://ofxpimapper.com/
         | 
         | https://mapmapteam.github.io/
         | 
         | There are media players and graphics generators that will run
         | on a RaspPi also. Finding a bright enough projector and
         | sheltering it for outdoor use might be the main challenge.
         | 
         | Another approach might be a galvo scanned laser with DMX
         | software to control it, though there may be safety/liability
         | issues with that.
        
       | Tepix wrote:
       | Maybe i can piggyback onto this question: Are there timer
       | switches that can change the times depending on the calendar? I
       | want to turn on some lights shortly after sunset but they don't
       | have a brightness sensor. So i'd like to do it by time of day.
        
         | sowbug wrote:
         | If you're already using Home Assistant and WLED, this is a
         | cinch. You could even write an automation that plays your home
         | team's colors each night they win a game.
        
           | Tepix wrote:
           | no, i want as little tech as possible, i imagine entering the
           | date and the latitude and perhaps the number of minutes
           | before/after sunset/sunrise.
        
       | riedel wrote:
       | For Twinkly: https://github.com/scrool/xled
        
       | entangledqubit wrote:
       | I ended up buying a couple strings of Twinkly lights a while back
       | - after considering a diy solution. The mobile app has been solid
       | and (assuming they didn't muck it up) there's are libraries out
       | there for interfacing to them as well (over WiFi). The cost is
       | not cheap but seems fair to me and seems to be well built. (The
       | light mapping is pretty fun. You can zigzag a bunch of lights
       | across a wall and basically create a low res display.)
        
         | TheJoeMan wrote:
         | Second Twinkly for the question of "will this company still be
         | around in a few years". They seem to have branched out into
         | non-holiday lights too which improves their business stability.
        
       | tedchs wrote:
       | I've used strings of Twinkly lights for a couple seasons now.
       | They can sometimes be found on eBay for cheap. They're easy to
       | set up, whether standalone or by clustering multiple units into
       | one larger virtual canvas. The app has a lot of good looking
       | animated patterns included.
        
       | anfractuosity wrote:
       | Has anyone come across many distributors for HD108 LED strips per
       | chance? I've found only the bare LEDs on Aliexpress currently.
        
       | charleslmunger wrote:
       | If you're interested in DIY:
       | 
       | LED lights as a string or strip - sk8612 are RGBW, which you need
       | if you want a nice looking white. Lots of strips of varying
       | density and waterproofing are available everywhere; strings
       | ("pixels") can be harder to find but are available on AliExpress.
       | 
       | Controller is https://quinled.info/
       | 
       | Runs wled which has a simple web interface, mobile apps, and
       | works with home assistant.
        
       | SoftTalker wrote:
       | White, non-blinking lights are the only acceptable holiday
       | lights. All others are exceedingly tacky and should be banned.
        
         | riiii wrote:
         | I didn't know you had Internet access up in the mountain, Mr
         | Grinch.
        
       | daredoes wrote:
       | Check out Twinkly. Little pricey, but if you can grab them on
       | sale they're super cool.
        
       | hgomersall wrote:
       | I had fun with this little board:
       | https://shop.pimoroni.com/products/plasma-2350?variant=42092...
       | 
       | There're a couple of other variants of that board too, one with
       | wifi. Basically you can animate Neopixels with about 6 lines of
       | pretty simple python.
        
       | chris_overseas wrote:
       | A lot of people here are recommending WLED for the controller,
       | but I would suggest you look at the Pixelblaze [1] instead. I've
       | used both in a bunch of different projects and strongly prefer
       | Pixelblaze over WLED.
       | 
       | Some reasons why: - It has a much more intuitive user interface -
       | It's far easier to program new patterns. Programming is done in-
       | browser with a language that's a subset of Javascript, with code
       | changes being applied in realtime. - Due to the way its rendering
       | engine works, the patterns it produces are generally far more
       | 'organic' looking and smoother than most of the WLED ones. - It's
       | possible to map LEDs in arbitrary 2D or 3D configurations (think
       | lights strewn all over a Christmas tree), which WLED can't really
       | do at all. - If you have multiple Pixelblazes you can get them to
       | sync with each other over Wifi. - A really helpful community
       | forum.
       | 
       | Downside: - The firmware isn't open source, though some of its
       | tooling is, and the firmware is stable and gets fairly regular
       | updates, so it's not a huge issue to me. YMMV.
       | 
       | For the LEDs, you probably want wired bullet-style strings of
       | LEDs rather than the thin copper LED strips since they're
       | generally more suited to outside use. By far the most common (and
       | generally cheapest) type of LEDs are WS-2812B or similar. They're
       | OK, though you might notice they don't have good definition at
       | low brightness levels. APA-102 or equivalent are a bit more
       | expensive, but have MUCH better dynamic range, so I'd suggest
       | going for these if you can. There are other better (and more
       | expensive) LEDs still, but it starts to become diminishing
       | returns, plus they can be hard to come by or find suitable
       | controllers for. If you're running lengths of more than a 150 or
       | so LEDs then power starts to matter, and you'll either need to
       | inject power regularly into the strips, and/or use LEDs designed
       | to take 12V or 24V. These can come with caveats such as worse
       | power consumption and/or fewer addressable LEDs per meter, so
       | research what you're buying carefully.
       | 
       | [1] https://electromage.com/pixelblaze
        
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