[HN Gopher] The world of Dante's Divine Comedy
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The world of Dante's Divine Comedy
Author : lermontov
Score : 41 points
Date : 2024-12-02 18:44 UTC (4 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (lithub.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (lithub.com)
| liontwist wrote:
| > Dante is clearly writing in the expectation that his intended
| audience of learned men will know these references and understand
| their relevance,
|
| We just replaced the Bible and Homeric texts with Star Wars and
| marvel. Everybody at the time would know the biblical allusions
| even if they were illiterate.
|
| > many conditions that nowadays are routinely cured or prevented
| would have been inevitably fatal; not all of the souls in the
| Comedy who died in their thirties and forties
|
| Are they confusing average lifespan for typical lifespan? Isn't
| this contradicted by the later paragraph in the same article?
| yCombLinks wrote:
| I don't see that error being made. What makes you think that?
| Tons of people died in their 30s and 40s from curable illnesses
| before modern medicine. Life expectancy of people that reached
| adulthood was still under 50 during that time period.
| zusammen wrote:
| It was wildly variable. Nomads actually had higher life
| expectancies, and were taller, than most agrarian people.
|
| A Neolithic person who made it to 20 had a good chance of
| making it into his 50s or 60s, but a serf's odds weren't
| great and a day laborer's were near zero.
| Almondsetat wrote:
| An often overlooked fact of the Comedy, is that it actually makes
| some novel theological arguments and sometimes puts itself in
| contrast withe Church. This goes agains the common knowledge that
| in the "Dark Ages" the Church was tyrannical and oppressive. In
| fact, the Church of the Middle Ages had an extraordinary
| tolerance and interest towards discussions, criticism, and
| contradictions. Counter-intuitively, the later Church of a more
| "enlightened" age began turning into the intolerant regime we all
| know about
| bryanrasmussen wrote:
| >Counter-intuitively,
|
| or intuitively, it is when you start to lose influence and
| power that you become more crazy and aggressive about
| maintaining what you have, like the truism that really tough
| guys don't act all macho, a truly dominant church does not mind
| the small theological disputations.
| riquito wrote:
| ... Dante was exiled from the Pope and, if captured, the order
| was to burn him at the stake Alighieri Dante
| e condannato per baratteria, frode, falsita, dolo, malizia,
| inique pratiche estortive, proventi illeciti, pederastia, e lo
| si condanna a 5000 fiorini di multa, interdizione perpetua dai
| pubblici uffici, esilio perpetuo (in contumacia), e se lo si
| prende, al rogo, cosi che muoia (Libro del
| chiodo - Archivio di Stato di Firenze - 10 marzo 1302)
| Almondsetat wrote:
| This was a political exile because his side lost and he was
| politically active. Very common everywhere and doesn't refute
| my post
| Izikiel43 wrote:
| Everything except pederasty seems political, that one seems
| iffy
| gattilorenz wrote:
| This sentence is coming from podesta Cante de' Gabrielli da
| Gubbio, i.e. the equivalent of the city's government, not
| from the Pope or a religious authority.
| rpastuszak wrote:
| If you're interested in Divine Comedy here's one I cannot
| recommend enough:
|
| Walking with Dante by Mark Scarbrough:
| https://walkingwithdante.captivate.fm
|
| It's slow and immensely comprehensive, but also very accessible
| and so much fun! His love for the subject and enthusiasm are
| contagious.
|
| Sharing this because thanks to HN I learned about some of my
| other favourite podcasts: Science & Futurism with Isaac Arthur
| and The History of Rome by Marc Duncan. I finished THoR twice and
| I listen to Isaac's podcast every week. I keep coming back to
| Dante.
| 082349872349872 wrote:
| Dante did make the 1st circle sound like a far more interesting
| destination than any unending praise-singing up above.
| gmoot wrote:
| If you are comparing Inferno to Paradiso, then this is a poor
| summary of it.
| greenie_beans wrote:
| to those of us who are still stuck in purgatorio, the circle
| with all the virtuous doesn't sound like a bad spot.
| benatkin wrote:
| Indeed, and without saying it outright. Show, don't tell.
| optimalsolver wrote:
| Well that's what happens when you exclude every interesting
| historical person from Paradise.
|
| Eternity in heaven with a bunch of joyless saints and martyrs
| just sounds like an additional circle of hell.
|
| Reminds me of this post:
|
| https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/qZJBighPrnv9bSqTZ/31-laws-of...
|
| >Beware of packing your Utopia with things you think people
| should do that aren't actually fun. Again, consider Christian
| Heaven: singing hymns doesn't sound like loads of endless fun,
| but you're supposed to enjoy praying, so no one can point this
| out.
| graemep wrote:
| That is a straw man heaven. Its supposed to be indescribable
| and the hymn singing a metaphor for an aspect of it.
| Izikiel43 wrote:
| Reminds me of the good place show.
| GJim wrote:
| _Lasciate ogne speranza, voi ch 'intrate_
|
| Dante's words on the gates to hell; almost always translated as
| "Abandon all hope, ye who enter here".
|
| However, Clive James (yes, that Clive James), translated it much
| better as:
|
| "Forget your hopes. They are what brought you here."
|
| An utterly unforgettable bloke to all those who met him:
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clive_James
| qsort wrote:
| It's an interesting translation but it's adding a layer that
| most certainly wasn't there.
|
| The original almost literally translates to the most common
| English translation:
|
| Lasciate = leave behind
|
| ogne = every
|
| speranza = hope
|
| voi = you
|
| ch' = who
|
| intrate = enter
| acheron wrote:
| Le cose ti fier conte quando noi fermerem li nostri passi su la
| trista riviera d'Acheronte.
| RyJones wrote:
| I traded wicker.com for a 1544 edition of La Comedia.
| habosa wrote:
| Ok I need to hear the full version of this story.
| RyJones wrote:
| I loved the Dead Milkmen. I bought the wicker.com domain for
| reasons. The guy who does the thing wanted this to be the way
| his wife wanted it to be
| joloooo wrote:
| This introduced more questions than answers when Dead
| Milkmen entered the scene.
| samcgraw wrote:
| Have been going through The Divine Comedy this year as a part of
| https://100daysofdante.com, cannot recommend enough!
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