[HN Gopher] Mind-Bending Soviet Era Oil Rig City on the Caspian Sea
___________________________________________________________________
Mind-Bending Soviet Era Oil Rig City on the Caspian Sea
Author : rramadass
Score : 218 points
Date : 2024-11-06 11:59 UTC (4 days ago)
(HTM) web link (www.cnn.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.cnn.com)
| rramadass wrote:
| Trailer - https://vimeo.com/ondemand/oilrocks
|
| Wikipedia - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neft_Da%C5%9Flar%C4%B1
| Symbiote wrote:
| And a satellite map:
| https://maps.yandex.com/?ll=50.858333,40.236111&spn=0.1,0.1&...
|
| (Only Yandex seems to have imagery, the other services cut it
| out as it's too far offshore.)
| spacesanjeet wrote:
| That is hands down one of the coolest maps I have come
| across. Thanks a lot for sharing.
| ant6n wrote:
| You can get walking directions, it's about 9.5km end-to-end
| along the furthest connected points. Looks like the roads
| going further out have collapsed.
| ffsoftboiled wrote:
| https://archive.ph/GCmDC
| Qem wrote:
| How long real state prices can keep climbing before people are
| forced to start colonizing seas or lakes like this?
| christophilus wrote:
| These will never be economical. Waterworld will always be sci-
| fi, unfortunately.
| zemvpferreira wrote:
| Cities ocuppy maybe 0.5% of available land, if you're generous.
| We're not wanting for solid ground.
| Cthulhu_ wrote:
| Globally no, but locally yes; the Netherlands famously turned
| a sea inlet into a lake, then reclaimed a province from that
| lake: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flevoland.
|
| The tradeoff is between urbanization (think Singapore) vs
| nature vs agriculture. The Netherands doesn't want or isn't
| ready for building tall yet, for some reason.
| bastawhiz wrote:
| The Netherlands undertook that project for flood protection
| and to increase land for agriculture. You can't exactly do
| that on oil platforms.
| justsomehnguy wrote:
| > The Netherands doesn't want or isn't ready for building
| tall yet, for some reason.
|
| >> Population * 9 November 2024 estimate Neutral increase
| 18,212,400[7] (69th) * 2011 census 16,655,799[8] * Density
| 520/km2 (1,346.8/sq mi) (33rd)
|
| Compare with Singapore:
|
| >> Density 7,804/km2 (20,212.3/sq mi) (2nd)
| p_j_w wrote:
| In a world where transportation is effectively instant you're
| correct. Here in reality, though, is another story. Living 2
| hours away from a commercial center is practically useless
| unless you have one of the increasingly difficult to find
| fully remote jobs or enough money that you never have to work
| again.
| jebarker wrote:
| Wouldn't that be more expensive than just building on
| undesirable land?
| Sakos wrote:
| Maintenance for infrastructure and buildings on solid ground
| is already expensive and difficult. I can't imagine how bad
| it would be for a sea-based town or city.
| bitcurious wrote:
| Interesting premise.
|
| Infill is pretty common in cities where real estate is
| expensive. I'm not sure what the "tipping point" is but large
| chunks of the city of Boston are built on what was water. The
| neighborhood "Back Bay" is named quite literally. NYC likewise
| has large chunks of prime real estate built on artificial land.
| Manhattan's Battery Park was once water. The motivation here
| does seem to have been economic.
|
| Singapore also is similarly growing out into the sea, though
| the motivation there is the lack of land in other directions,
| not merely price.
|
| The Aztec city of Tenochtitlan was similarly built in the
| middle of a lake on a foundation of floating grass islands
| called "chinampas." Here the motivation was martial - the lake
| served as a moat for their imperial capital.
|
| Venice was built similarly to the Tenochtitlan on mostly a
| series of man-made islands, though the motivation seems to have
| been population growth.
|
| The Chinese today are building artificial islands in the South
| China Sea, the motivation here is martial/legalistic - expand
| the land territory and power projection to expand their claim
| to the sea.
| Oarch wrote:
| Gibraltar is, to a large extent, land reclaimed on water.
| m3047 wrote:
| Wouldn't that be Alpaugh / Tulare Lake / Central Valley south
| of Fresno? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tulare_Lake and of
| course the Netherlands...
|
| People may disagree with this but IMO Tulare Lake illustrates
| that it's not just "real estate" because plenty of real estate
| is basically worthless. In this case it's land with water which
| can grow things (same in Netherlands), and they made more of it
| by continuing to suck more water out of the lake than rainfall
| replenished.
| cjaybo wrote:
| I mean, given how much undeveloped area exists inland, probably
| a very very long time?
| orbital-decay wrote:
| _> When filmmaker Marc Wolfensberger first found out about Neft
| Daslari, he thought it was a myth. He kept hearing about this
| secretive city_
|
| In what way it was secretive or a myth?? There were multiple
| books and movies about it, it was a major job source and a ton of
| people worked there.
| instig007 wrote:
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BT_Tower#Secrecy
| pimlottc wrote:
| It says he learned about it in the 90s, information about
| distant parts of the world was much harder to come by back
| then, particular regarding Soviet countries (at least for
| Westerners)
| timonoko wrote:
| What was the Soviet film about hero Komissar riding around on a
| motocycle on those bridges and fixing all kinds of problems?
| kranke155 wrote:
| Oh I'd love to know. Sounds cool
| timonoko wrote:
| Plenty of films about Oilfields of Baku.
|
| https://www.azer.com/aiweb/categories/magazine/53_folder/53_...
|
| Because it was in glorius SovColor and because the hero had
| greasy ElvisPresley-pompadour, I would say it was shot in
| between 1960-1970.
| 082349872349872 wrote:
| The 1966 "26 commissars" is b/w, so maybe later than that?
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8riDkh3hJHY
|
| There's a painting in colour, however: https://en.wikipedia.o
| rg/wiki/26_Baku_Commissars#/media/File...
|
| Lagniappe: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azerbaijan_Democrati
| c_Republic...
|
| EDIT: wrong geography, but apparently the "technical" long
| predates the Toyota Hilux:
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p9fbO9NX1no#t=3553s
| 1oooqooq wrote:
| most people ignore wwii was decided on baku.
|
| it was the reason for Barbarossa, the first Germany defeat, and
| it was the only way Germany could replenish the oil used on the
| Russian offensive, which forced them to squeeze the polish camps
| dry. they lost it one baku.
|
| it was also where most modern billionaires made their fortune.
| Arainach wrote:
| >was also where most modern billionaires made their fortune
|
| Could you explain this claim?
| palmfacehn wrote:
| The Baku oil fields were capitalized by the Rothschild
| banking dynasty, which was already immensely wealthy before
| the oil age. Perhaps others will weigh in, but as I recall
| this was in response to the fabulous wealth Rockefeller was
| realizing in the United States. Petroleum had always been
| present around Baku and elsewhere, but it hadn't been
| exploited on the same industrial scale. It was sometimes
| regarded as an inconvenience which devalued land.
| kjellsbells wrote:
| Exactly so. A really good, very readable book on this and
| oil in general is Daniel Yergin's The Prize.
| mistrial9 wrote:
| yes agree that is an enjoyable and informative read..
| Arainach wrote:
| Sure - I don't doubt that Baku made some people fabulously
| rich, I'm more curious about "most modern billionaires",
| specifically "most". I'm not even convinced that most
| modern billionaires made their billions through petroleum,
| much less Baku.
| palmfacehn wrote:
| Not sure what that poster meant by that.
|
| In this case, the Rothschilds were already a powerful
| European banking dynasty. There are many shadowy
| speculations about the different branches of this family.
| Perhaps this is where the confusion originates.
|
| The Nobel family did better relative to their previous
| station. In the end the Baku concerns were sold to
| Rockefeller before being nationalized after the Russian
| Revolution.
| 1oooqooq wrote:
| i think you're making the common meaning mistake between
| modern and current times when in a history discussion
| context.
| 1oooqooq wrote:
| thats and the Nobels are the more public ones. there's also
| billionaires from the astrian dynasties all over baku.
|
| also stalin journalism career took off there.
| kaonwarb wrote:
| I suspect the intended context is most _Russian_
| billionaires.
| Aspos wrote:
| Nobel (the Nobel prize guy) made his fortune in Baku, IMSMR
| anonymousDan wrote:
| I thought he made his fortune from TNT and then founded the
| Nobel prize out of guilt?
| Aspos wrote:
| I believe that's where he invented it
| frenchy wrote:
| > the first Germany defeat
|
| Assuming you're talking about stategic defeats, I'm pretty sure
| the Battle of Britain was earlier. Possibbly North Africa too,
| but that's more debatable.
| shawn_w wrote:
| When did CNN get a paywall?
| bcks wrote:
| A month ago. https://www.cnn.com/2024/10/01/media/cnn-launch-
| digital-subs...
| yuxt wrote:
| In the late 1980s, I went on an expedition along Kazakhstan's
| eastern shore of the Caspian Sea. One of our stops was supposed
| to be a fishing village, but when we got there, it was completely
| empty. Hundreds of mud huts sat abandoned as everyone had just
| disappeared. In one of the yards, a camel was still there. It
| felt haunting, like walking through a ghost town. The strangest
| part? There was no sea anywhere nearby! The Caspian had dried up
| so quickly that people had to leave their homes behind because
| they couldn't live there anymore.
| Self-Perfection wrote:
| I think your expedition was actually along Aral sea. That is
| dried.
|
| Caspian sea is rather stable.
| yuxt wrote:
| The Volga Hydroelectric Station, located on the Volga River,
| directly impacts the Caspian Sea. The Volga River, Europe's
| longest, flows into the Caspian Sea and contributes about 80%
| of its freshwater inflow. The construction of the Volga
| Hydroelectric Station and other dams along the river has
| altered its natural flow, reducing the volume of water
| reaching the Caspian Sea. This reduction has contributed to
| the sea's declining water levels.
| https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/images/150452/the-
| caspian-...
| Izikiel43 wrote:
| Is that the dam from metro exodus?
| abcd_f wrote:
| Doesn't appear on the satellite view in Google Maps. Just water.
|
| What's up with that?
|
| https://maps.app.goo.gl/dr71WrLZ7G97E5br9?g_st=ic
| Elfener wrote:
| Interesting. It's not just the oil rig itself, the whole lake's
| satellite view is the same blue colour, while other bodies of
| water are more detailed.
| pxeger1 wrote:
| Oceans, plus I guess the Caspian Sea, don't get much
| satellite coverage because no one (except militaries) wants
| it enough. For the ocean, Google Maps uses bathymetry data to
| synthesise shaded blue imagery. The Caspian in particular I
| guess is such a uniform colour either because it's so shallow
| that Google's shading algorithm doesn't shade it at all?
| (Compare to the northwesternmost parts of the Adriatic Sea,
| for example)
| jcrawfordor wrote:
| A big issue here too is the image stitching; aerial images
| are registered for big tile maps based in part on feature
| analysis of the edges and that just never works right for
| images of the ocean (mostly you have waves, and they're in
| different places in each image). Even if you register it
| perfectly the waves ensure that the edges will still have
| stitching artifacts. As a result the "false color" oceans
| that Google Maps shows just look better than actual
| imagery.
|
| The "imagery" source for the oceans in Google Maps is (or
| at least was) GEBCO, it's a global bathymetric dataset made
| by registering depth sounding tracks from mostly commercial
| vessels. I thought maybe GEBCO didn't cover the caspian sea
| but it looks like it does for the last decade or so, but
| admittedly it seems to be data from just one survey and
| it's tagged as limited quality (at least in older versions
| of the dataset), so maybe Google ignores it.
| alephnerd wrote:
| Products like Google Maps stitch satellite and aerial photos
| together to make a cohesive image.
|
| There's no reason to spend tens of thousands of dollars on
| getting precise images in the middle of a sea or ocean from
| Maxar so a low-res image is more than enough.
|
| Also, most of the high-res images you see of regions on
| Google Earth or Maps tends to come from aerial photography,
| not satellites.
|
| These products will also update the images every couple
| months to years. For example, you could see the aftermath of
| the Donetsk airport battle and Homs Siege in Google Maps in
| 2014-15, but not anymore.
| MichaelZuo wrote:
| It's not a low-res image... because the oil rig city would
| still be blurry but somewhat visible, it's a no-res image,
| entirely generated with no connection to reality.
| beejiu wrote:
| There's historical imaging on Google Earth
| https://earth.google.com/web/@40.24978465,50.87045099,-66.75...
| wingworks wrote:
| Weirdly time lapse mode has a clearer image of it.
| photochemsyn wrote:
| The issue of how the satellite data feed ends up censored is
| pretty interesting. Here's the probable central issue:
|
| > "While countries still reserve the right to withhold map
| data, the number of state and private companies that sell
| satellite images makes hiding the globe incredibly difficult.
| At the same time, this also means that state or non-state
| actors can beat private companies to the exclusive rights of a
| satellite image, meaning they can partially censor the image
| before others can license it."
|
| https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-02-21/why-large-parts-of-ea...
| itronitron wrote:
| They could call it "Wet Texas"
| malomalsky wrote:
| Motherbase from mgs5
| wayvey wrote:
| Came to say exactly that, similar vibe
| freefaler wrote:
| There is another very interesting field built over swamps and
| lakes in Siberia where they built the rigs on artificial islands.
|
| https://as2.ftcdn.net/v2/jpg/01/99/42/41/1000_F_199424123_E5...
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samotlor_Field?useskin=vector
|
| https://maps.app.goo.gl/nq28Ct4FLyBGx5eP8
|
| It was deemed too strategically important and was not put on
| maps.
___________________________________________________________________
(page generated 2024-11-10 23:00 UTC)