[HN Gopher] DB48X: High Performance Scientific Calculator, Reinv...
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DB48X: High Performance Scientific Calculator, Reinvented
Author : qwezxcrty
Score : 91 points
Date : 2024-11-04 17:19 UTC (5 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (48calc.org)
(TXT) w3m dump (48calc.org)
| roflmaostc wrote:
| somehow doesn't work on my Ubuntu Firefox 131.0.3 but works on my
| Arch 132.0.
| Aardwolf wrote:
| Same, shows JavaScript error:
|
| "Uncaught ReferenceError: SharedArrayBuffer is not defined at
| db48x.js:615:40"
|
| Both in Chrome and Firefox (both are up to date to versions way
| beyond where SharedArrayBuffer should have been introduced)
|
| I think they should either use ArrayBuffer, or use https
| instead of http, apparently SharedArrayBuffer has security
| restrictions
| grantmnz wrote:
| Apparently, for security reasons, your server needs to add
| certain headers if you want to use SharedArrayBuffers.
|
| https://hacks.mozilla.org/2020/07/safely-reviving-shared-mem...
| thought_alarm wrote:
| It needs https.
|
| Use https://48calc.org/db48x/index.html
| bell-cot wrote:
| IANAL, but the logo they're using looks infringingly similar to
| HP's.
| SomeHacker44 wrote:
| Spectacular project by one gentleman. Been using it for a while
| now on my Swissmicros.
| anyfoo wrote:
| Seems great. How does this compare to Free42?
| https://thomasokken.com/free42/
| chowells wrote:
| Well, it's based on the hp48 instead of the hp42, for one.
| Though that button layout is not that close to the 48, either.
| westurner wrote:
| Could this run on a TI or a NumWorks calculator?
|
| RPN: Reverse Polish Notation:
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reverse_Polish_notation
|
| RPL: Reverse Polish LISP:
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RPL_(programming_language)
| whartung wrote:
| Seems like a really nice effort.
|
| Nice they crammed it into the DM42 machines.
|
| But for me, the learning curve is steeper than the utility. I
| have no real need for an actual calculator, I rely on my phone.
| On there I have iHP48, and I've already gone through much of that
| learning curve to make it useful (back in the day with an
| original one).
|
| If you already have the DM42, I guess its a mostly compatible
| upgrade from that, to make stepping into it easier.
| stonogo wrote:
| This is also an iphone app.
| topspin wrote:
| > Seems like a really nice effort.
|
| Does it? Another powerful calculating engine trapped behind a
| skeuomorph interface?
|
| Here[1] is a really nice effort that, sadly, hasn't been
| updated in 14 years and only runs on Windows. It's a wonderful
| 606kB math REPL that can probably do everything DB48X can do,
| except it foregoes all the 1970's portable calculator nonsense,
| making it about a thousand times more useful.
|
| I have a nascent clone of this written in Rust using egui and
| rug, that is currently stalled because -- on bleeping Windows
| -- the former has problems with MinGW the latter has problems
| with MSVC... which makes me want to tear my hair out. I wait,
| patiently, for egui to get their MinGW ducks in a row because I
| have no hope that the GMP/MPFR/MPC stack is ever going to work
| on MSVC in my lifetime.
|
| [1] https://speqmath.com/
| epse wrote:
| Is there a significant difference between that package and
| SageMath / XCas / Octave and friends? While a bit arcane,
| I've always been a great fan of xcas
| qwezxcrty wrote:
| Calculator is for quick and dirty math in the field or in a
| lab, saving me from taking out the laptop from backpack or
| abandoning my optics alignment exercise and getting to the
| workstation on the other end of the table.
|
| In other cases when I have convenient access to a computer,
| I'll use a proper math software like Matlab/Mathematica or
| whatever open source alternative. It's just a different use
| case.
| whartung wrote:
| > Does it? Another powerful calculating engine trapped behind
| a skeuomorph interface?
|
| Yes, it does. This is not a calculator app. It's calculator
| firmware that happens to also be runnable in an app.
|
| They're trying to cram a HP48ish calculator into an HP42
| clone calculator body, while retaining much of the UX of the
| calculator they're replacing.
|
| The HP42 is the direct successor of the HP41 without the
| hardware interfaces and gizmos. Its essentially software
| compatible with the 41.
|
| The HP48 (and -28) are completely different animals, from
| ground up hardware redesign to the notable RPL (Reverse
| Polish Lisp) foundations, and just in raw functionality as
| well. The 28/48 series had symbolic solvers and graphing
| (among a laundry list of other things), both novel at the
| time.
|
| If you wanted an RPL based system in stand alone hardware
| with real buttons, you were stuck with legacy calculators.
| This fits in the modern DM42 system.
| gompertz wrote:
| Thanks this is a great recommendation - runs perfect in Wine.
| There definitely seems to be a habit with developers making
| calculators that still fall into a 70s form factor. This is a
| great departure.
| jiehong wrote:
| Some newer terminal based implementation of something similar
| is Numbat [0], for example.
|
| For a GUI calculator similar to seqmath, but cross platform,
| try speedcrunch [1].
|
| [0]: https://numbat.dev/
|
| [1]: https://heldercorreia.bitbucket.io/speedcrunch/
| linguae wrote:
| I feel the same way about not needing a physical calculator. I
| have an HP-48SX and an HP-15C Collector's Edition. I enjoy
| these devices; they are high-quality and are exemplary
| products. However, as a professor I have regular access to my
| laptop, which can run circles around my handheld calculators.
| For quick calculations I open up the terminal and use the dc
| command, which is a command-line RPN calculator. For more
| involved computations, I have Python and Common Lisp REPLs, and
| I also sometimes use Microsoft Excel.
|
| These days handheld calculators seem to be used the most in
| situations where people are restricted from using laptops and
| smartphones, such as during exams or in distraction-free
| settings. I think the reason Texas Instruments still has a
| viable calculator business is because TI markets heavily in the
| education market.
| db48x wrote:
| That is really weird.
| PaulHoule wrote:
| I am a fan of the HP Prime
|
| https://hpcalcs.com/product/hp-prime-graphing-calculator/
|
| But I use it in algebraic instead of RPN mode. I've got a 49g and
| a 50-something too.
|
| People say it is pricey but I managed to get one discounted that
| was intended for the Latin American market. So is the thing that
| software is supposed to run on.
| nxobject wrote:
| I'd recommend eBay, too, if you're within the continental US.
| This might be sacrilege, but after using a TI-89 I shifted to
| an TI Nspire CAS, since it has one of the highest-resolution
| screens in the market _and_ still uses AAA batteries - I paid
| only $25 on eBay.
| PaulHoule wrote:
| Those are pretty good.
|
| I was thinking the other day about all the electromechanical
| devices such as Walkman cassette tapes and portable minidisc
| players that Sony got to work with just one AA battery as
| opposed to the usual two.
| Mister_Snuggles wrote:
| I have a Prime G2 and the RPN mode is just bad. It feels like
| it was an afterthought, and some things just don't seem to work
| properly in that mode.
|
| My 48G+ is a much, much better RPN calculator.
|
| The Prime G2 is also missing the equation library from the
| 48G+, which I found weird. Maybe they expect you to download
| what you need instead of using space in Flash for it.
| PaulHoule wrote:
| That's my take on the RPN mode but I like the algebraic mode
| and agree the 48 series is way better for RPN.
|
| (My favorite HP calc was the 28, which I bought when the 48
| was available. I discovered soon afterwards that a powerful
| spring will eventually break the battery door and it seemed
| to be a problem that no engineering student managed to
| solve.)
| downut wrote:
| I use my 32S (lives on my monitor pedestal next to my 8087
| chip) weekly. When I was doing floating point/integer bit
| twiddling the 'base' key was my deeply appreciated friend.
| But that was 36 years ago. RPN (if trained into the brain)
| really is faster and I love how the register transfers
| work.
|
| Nowadays when I'm not feeling especially tactile I tend to
| reach for the Free42 Android app, which lives in a stack
| with the 32S. If I ever get _bored_ , I'm going to relearn
| how to program them both. Next time around on the wheel,
| likely, if I have hands.
|
| I've replaced the battery on the 32S twice. Suck on that,
| modernity.
| hajile wrote:
| As a DM42 owner who loves RPL, this is an exciting project.
| opentokix wrote:
| This made me exactly the same amount as frustrated like the
| originals. So, good job I guess :D
| Ringz wrote:
| I still have a HP48GX in perfect condition and love it. One of my
| first programs was to calculate how much ,,slower" my time is
| running when I drive a car or fly in a plane compared to someone
| standing still on the sidewalk.
|
| I still find it much more comfortable having a real calculator...
| call me old fashioned.
| jwr wrote:
| The 48G was a really good calculator, but only after loading
| additional software. The HP50g that came much later is better in
| every respect, except possibly for the smaller "ENTER" key (and
| people used to 48G will have to change some habits and possibly
| redefine some keys...).
|
| Incidentally, many young people (yes, I know how that sounds) do
| not know how useful a good engineering calculator can be and do
| not want to learn how to use one. They are missing out. Yes,
| there is a steep learning curve, but the rewards are significant
| if you do any amount of calculation in your hobby or work. No,
| this is not replaced by typing "python" (or "bc", or anything
| else, really) at your command prompt.
|
| Also incidentally, the development of good engineering
| calculators pretty much died. HP Prime is largely a school-
| pleasing toy, HP would down their calculator division a long time
| ago, and nobody else produces anything good. It's kind of like
| with gyms: what you get is what the market wants, and since the
| market doesn't know much, you get gyms full of useless exercise
| machines, because that's what people think a good gym should
| have. Similarly with calculators: you get stupid "modern"
| graphing calculators which are useless for actual work (it takes
| forever to use them to calculate useful things, and graphing is
| much better done on a computer), but they look great and sell
| well.
|
| I admire the project, although I would probably have taken a
| different path (emulation) to get the biggest effect with the
| smallest possible effort :-)
|
| I wish there was a good HP50G emulator for iOS -- there used to
| be one, but it was abandoned (contact me if you want to develop
| it and would like to get the source code, it was under the GPL
| and I got it from the author).
| ninalanyon wrote:
| > No, this is not replaced by typing "python" (or "bc", or
| anything else, really) at your command prompt.
|
| Why not? At least I can easily copy the results and the code to
| a document which avoids transcription errors. Or do you mean
| that there simply isn't a program that has the functions you
| use?
| tivert wrote:
| >> Incidentally, many young people (yes, I know how that
| sounds) do not know how useful a good engineering calculator
| can be and do not want to learn how to use one. They are
| missing out. Yes, there is a steep learning curve, but the
| rewards are significant if you do any amount of calculation
| in your hobby or work. No, this is not replaced by typing
| "python" (or "bc", or anything else, really) at your command
| prompt.
|
| > Why not? At least I can easily copy the results and the
| code to a document which avoids transcription errors. Or do
| you mean that there simply isn't a program that has the
| functions you use?
|
| My guess it's the ergonomics between a specialized tool and a
| non-specialized one. Technically, python may be able to
| replace "a good engineering calculator," _but so can ASM._ No
| one would even ask "Why non ASM?," because its ergonomics
| are near-universally understood to be so poor, but the same
| issues can apply to more popular tools like python, just less
| obviously.
| 7thaccount wrote:
| I'm a calculator nut who has had many fancy TI (like the
| Voyage 200) and HP calculators (yes RPN) including the
| SwissMicro reproductions.
|
| The ONLY benefit to these tools that I can surmise is
| basically that they are a physical device for scientists or
| others in the lab or field and not in front of a computer.
|
| For any kind of data work I've seen, Excel, R, Python,
| Mathematica, or Matlab are all vastly superior. They allow
| faster entry, can show large amounts of data on screen, can
| allow for saving large amounts of data ...etc.
| exe34 wrote:
| yeah after a decade in my job, I have a ton of utility
| functions in python that I reach for when given a new
| request to think through something. I doubt a smaller
| screen where I have to type in stuff and then copy out
| results would make it any easier.
| jwr wrote:
| This thread is making my point for me rather well.
| hggigg wrote:
| Some of us (mathematics side) still actually work on
| paper with calculators. Most of the job is thinking which
| tooling doesn't necessarily improve.
| hggigg wrote:
| You just write the stuff down or translate it to LaTeX.
|
| Incidentally the 50G (and Prime) has a decent CAS built in
| which seems to get stuck less than some other commercial
| ones.
| agateau wrote:
| I loved my HP 48G when I was in school (even if it was much
| slower than the Ti 81 it replaced when it came to graphing). I
| regret throwing it away because of the nostalgia, but I don't
| feel a need for using it these days.
|
| As such I am genuinely curious about what rewards you get from
| using an engineering calculator in your work. That's an honest
| question: I would really like to have an excuse to get my hands
| on a 48G again!
| hggigg wrote:
| I never liked the 48 series or the 50G (I own both). I can
| never remember how to use them half of the time. I always end
| up back with my 38 year old HP 15c. That has done me through
| separate engineering and mathematics degrees and about 30 years
| worth of jobs.
|
| They just issued new ones as well! (HP 15CE)
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