[HN Gopher] Fruits (2020)
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Fruits (2020)
Author : yeknoda
Score : 121 points
Date : 2024-10-26 16:22 UTC (4 days ago)
(HTM) web link (graphallthethings.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (graphallthethings.com)
| thadk wrote:
| These trees often gives good generic bearings for allergies and
| other aspects of life.
|
| See also: the garden's evolutionary history:
| https://observablehq.com/@thadk/garden
|
| and the make-your-own evolutionary history using pyodide and the
| python ETE3 library: https://observablehq.com/@thadk/life
| whyenot wrote:
| Cool! It's a really nice visual representation. I'm not totally
| convinced by the scaling of the branch lengths, but it doesn't
| really matter for this. By the way, there are some fruit that
| branch off before the divergence between monocots and eudicots
| and are in a group generally called Magnoliids. Years ago they
| were classified as dicots, but they made that group polyphyletic.
| Some examples are avocado, cherimoya, and soursop.
|
| _Are there fruits that diverged through domestication, other
| than obvious cases like apple varieties?_
|
| Citrus, which is well represented in your tree is a good example.
|
| _And are those people who call watermelons "berries" actually
| basing it on science? (No.)_
|
| Botanically, melons, cucumbers, and the fruit of many (not all!)
| species in the Cucurbitaceae are classified as a pepo, a type of
| berry.
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glossary_of_botanical_terms#pe...
| GrumpyNl wrote:
| I was learned that fruit has it seeds inside, vegetables on the
| outside, meaning that strawberry is actually a vegetable.
| Ductapemaster wrote:
| It's not quite that simple:
| https://carnegiemuseums.org/magazine-
| archive/1997/mayjun/dep...
|
| However, one misnomer remains true -- a Strawberry isn't
| actually a 'berry'.
| pvaldes wrote:
| Is an useless definition. Pickles, Pepper and Peas are
| vegetables
| thaumasiotes wrote:
| Vegetable just means "plant".
| whyenot wrote:
| Vegetables don't have seeds on the outside, and strawberries
| don't have that anyways. Each "seed" on the outside of a
| strawberry is actually a fruit that contains a single seed.
| If you look carefully with a magnifying glass or something
| similar, you can often still see the female parts of the
| flower (pistil) sticking up from each "seed." The fleshy and
| sweet part of a strawberry originates as part of the flower
| called the receptacle. It sits below the ovaries of the
| flower. In strawberries, the receptacle is cone shaped,
| probably an adaptation to increase access by pollinators.
| After pollination, this part of the flower swells up and
| becomes the strawberry that you are familiar with :) The
| little ring of green leaves at the top of of a strawberry are
| the sepals of the flower it originated from.
| thaumasiotes wrote:
| > Each "seed" on the outside of a strawberry is actually a
| fruit that contains a single seed.
|
| This depends on the perspective you want to take. From an
| anatomical perspective, the fruit part of the strawberry is
| different from the fruit part of a grape.
|
| From an economic perspective, they are the same; the sweet
| and fleshy material is the payment from the plant to the
| animal for doing the plant a service. The seed is something
| that the animal doesn't want but consumes anyway as part of
| the deal.
| graemep wrote:
| Grapefruit is a hybrid of pomelo and and orange so the say is is
| shown as a sibling of pomelo does not seem right.
| jamessb wrote:
| Yes, this gives a misleading view of the relationship between
| citrus fruits.
|
| This diagram (on the Wikipedia article for Citrus) gives more
| information:
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Hybrid_origins_of_Citrus....
| mjamesaustin wrote:
| In general this view doesn't do a good job of explaining citrus
| fruits. There are a huge variety of hybrids mostly deriving
| from combinations of the mandarin, pomelo, citron, and
| micrantha (lime).
| pvaldes wrote:
| Is not so simple, there are TWO grapefruits. One is an hybrid,
| the other is one of the four fantastic ancient Citrus species,
| that are the grand-grand-grand-parents of (almost) every known
| fruit from that family. "Everything", from Uglyfruits to Blood
| Oranges to Key limes is an hybrid except a very few wild
| species
| pvaldes wrote:
| Um, I see what are you saying, this part of the diagram with
| orange being older than pomelo is clearly wrong. Good point.
| Is good to remind that genetic analysis must be interpreted
| wisely together with other facts, or can easily mislead.
| rainingmonkey wrote:
| > You'd think all kiwis would be related, sharing brown fuzz and
| being associated with New Zealand, but actually the kiwi fruit
| and kiwi bird diverged 1.4 billion years ago.
|
| This got a real chuckle from me! I've hear the key to comedy is
| surprise, and I didn't expect that in the middle of a bunch of
| interesting but serious facts.
| Jun8 wrote:
| The rose branch brought to mind again this poem by Robert Frost
| which is one of my favorites: The rose is a rose,
| And was always a rose. But the theory now goes That
| the apple's a rose, And the pear is, and so's The
| plum, I suppose. The dear only knows What will next
| prove a rose. You, of course, are a rose - But were
| always a rose.
|
| In one of her letters Jane Austen mentions that they had a game
| of coming up with powers that rhyme with rose, you may see
| Jane's, her sister's and others' efforts (rather mundane) efforts
| here: https://pemberley.com/janeinfo/brablt18.html#letter97
| patrickhogan1 wrote:
| Please explain - curious
|
| "You'd think all kiwis would be related, sharing brown fuzz and
| being associated with New Zealand, but actually the kiwi fruit
| and kiwi bird diverged 1.4 billion years ago."
| DrSAR wrote:
| a decent stab at humour. I chuckled.
| patrickhogan1 wrote:
| Haha, same here! I ended up diving into a kiwi fruit rabbit
| hole. Apparently, the kiwi fruit was originally called the
| Chinese gooseberry but was rebranded by New Zealand fruit
| breeders as part of a marketing strategy. It's funny looking
| at this picture:
|
| https://i.etsystatic.com/9032484/r/il/79babb/1458733776/il_f.
| ..
| klipt wrote:
| Now that's cultural appropriation! Thousands of years of
| domestication and breeding by Chinese fruit growers, and
| then New Zealand takes all the credit!
| thaumasiotes wrote:
| > Thousands of years of domestication and breeding by
| Chinese fruit growers, and then New Zealand takes all the
| credit!
|
| The kiwi does seem to have been domesticated by the
| Chinese, but you wouldn't want to infer that from the
| name "Chinese gooseberry". They could be like the
| Norwegian rat (also from China) or the "Persian" peach,
| _prunus persica_ (which is from China too).
|
| Maybe you should just assume that everything comes from
| China.
| tuatoru wrote:
| Ya go' us bang to righ's, guv. Ih's a fair cop.
| Scarblac wrote:
| Where do grapes go? Surprised one of the fruits I eat most
| commonly isn't in the chart.
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