[HN Gopher] Show HN: I built an app to use a QR code as my doorbell
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Show HN: I built an app to use a QR code as my doorbell
I didn't have a doorbell before (multiple reasons) and my house
feels unwelcoming without one. So I built a doorbell app that uses
a QR code - visitors scan the QR code to ring the doorbell and I
get notified on my phone. Here is an example of the QR code I have
on my door. You can scan it and say hello:
https://www.thebacklog.net/img/2024/10/show-hn.png This was also a
great excuse to build my first app for Android and iPhone. I'd
love to get some feedback before I spend more time polishing the
app. Please try it out and feel free to ask me any questions! No
logins or accounts needed.
Author : dirkc
Score : 105 points
Date : 2024-10-29 08:03 UTC (14 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (dingdongdoorbell.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (dingdongdoorbell.com)
| 123pie123 wrote:
| >Having a doorbell does not need to be complicated.
|
| I'm not sure if your and my definition of complicated are the
| same in this case
| dirkc wrote:
| True. What are you comparing it to if I may ask - a traditional
| doorbell or a modern smart doorbell?
| block_dagger wrote:
| A knock.
| themoonisachees wrote:
| The user interface for a doorbell (smart or dumb) is a a
| single button that you press, with your finger. Compare that
| to take out my phone, find a way to scan a qr code, scan it,
| install an app (?!?!), press a single button with my finger,
| on the app.
|
| This is even supposing that I want to do that to begin with
| (I know for sure delivery drivers are never doing it).
|
| Good job on the project, I really mean it. It doesn't matter
| what you do, it matters that you've achieved it and for that,
| congrats. But as a practical semi-object, this has to be one
| of the worst ways possible to solve the problem.
| dirkc wrote:
| That is a valid point. The visitor does not need to install
| the app, but it's still more complicated than pushing a
| button.
|
| From the owner's perspective I imagine it's at least a
| little bit simpler to install an app and put up a QR code.
| Although if they have to print it out themselves I guess
| all bets are off.
|
| > Good job on the project, I really mean it. It doesn't
| matter what you do, it matters that you've achieved it and
| for that, congrats. But as a practical semi-object, this
| has to be one of the worst ways possible to solve the
| problem.
|
| Thank you, those are kind words. I doubt that this is the
| worst possible way in every context, but working towards
| better solutions is why we share stuff and ask/give
| feedback :)
| sebtron wrote:
| Just curious, what does a "modern smart doorbell" do exactly?
| nkozyra wrote:
| Typically transmit video to phones, which is also pretty
| trivial with about $20 of hardware.
| thomascountz wrote:
| A text or call on said smartphone.
| atoav wrote:
| That was my exact first thought. That seems to be _a lot_ more
| complicated than a traditional bell, except for the fact that
| you don 't have to run two wires there (a thing most places
| will already have there).
|
| I mean this could be a okay solution for a very certain set of
| circumstances, but making your visitors scan a QR-Code seems
| like bad UX, why not have them fill out a form while you're at
| it?
|
| If I had a situation where it was impossible to run wires
| through the wall I'd install a old-school knocker on the door
| and a knock sensor on the inside. UX is intuitive and the knock
| sensor can still send me things to the phone if I like that.
| gregmac wrote:
| > If I had a situation where it was impossible to run wires
| through the wall ...
|
| Wireless doorbells can be found for tens of dollars. You can
| get them with multiple receivers you can place around your
| house.
| iamjfu wrote:
| Nice work!
|
| I wonder if instead of complexity you should call this a cheaper
| alternative to a smart doorbell?
|
| I don't think many of us think of smart doorbells as particularly
| complex. However, they could be out of budget for many.
|
| Alternatively, you could market as privacy respecting, where a
| smart doorbell is always recording.
| dirkc wrote:
| Thank you! Those are good points. I'm still trying to figure
| out what the differentiating factor is for other people. For me
| it's the ease with which I can replace a QR and receiving a
| notification even when I'm not home
| fph wrote:
| Is there a captcha, or can people ding-dong-ditch you from a
| continent apart?
| mingusrude wrote:
| This is a good feature enhancement, to check the location of
| the ding-donging party.
| nkozyra wrote:
| Though since it's trivial spoofed I don't know why you'd
| bother.
|
| Something like this really needs a periodic refresh or some
| proximity proof like NFC.
| swah wrote:
| At this point just knock!
| Towaway69 wrote:
| Crazy the doorbell replaced knocking and now the internet
| is replacing doorbells.
|
| Who invented doors? Perhaps that's where it all went
| wrong. /s
| nkozyra wrote:
| We're willing to offer a $7M seed at a $50M valuation for
| your knock technology.
| Dilettante_ wrote:
| Something something Knockchain
| dirkc wrote:
| Only if you knock technology uses AI :)
| nkozyra wrote:
| And only if by "uses AI" you say it has AI inside the
| hardware but really it's a network-enabled thin client
| that calls out to a server wrapping GPT calls.
| dirkc wrote:
| Right now you can ding dong ditch if you have the code. As
| others mentioned using location could help. Or maybe a one-
| time-pin?
| filcuk wrote:
| Honestly, for serious use - yes, but there is a fun aspect to
| the app. Have a friend or remote partner print the code, and
| ring a doorbell when they want to get in touch, or just as a
| reminder they'rethinking of you? Like a message, but without
| the 'baggage'
| beAbU wrote:
| On early-days facebook you could "poke" someone. Like a
| virtual empty message, it had no meaning or "baggage"
| linked to it, other than that the poke-er was thinking of
| the poke-ee at that moment.
|
| About a decade before that, we kids basically only had SMS
| text messaging, and it was very expensive in my country,
| mobile data doubly so. There was however a "please call me"
| feature, where you could send a "please call me" text to a
| friend free of charge. We used to send please call me's to
| one another all the time, not because we wanted to be
| called, it was just the cheapest form of digital
| communication.
| ultrafez wrote:
| The poke feature is back! It was re-introduced this year
| some time.
| danhau wrote:
| I love this sort of thing, very cool idea. I think it makes for a
| great weekend project to implement something similar yourself.
| dirkc wrote:
| Agreed, if you're into hacking your own doorbell, there are a
| lot of really cool examples online of projects people have
| done.
|
| I'm considering setting up an ESP to integrate my old bell's
| chime with the QR code.
| dghf wrote:
| This does seem like it might be prone to pranksters copying a
| particular doorbell code and putting it outside someone else's
| house (or several houses), distributing fake flyers that include
| it ("Scan here for a chance to win a cruise!"), and so forth.
| nkozyra wrote:
| My immediate thought was: get an esp32 with an eink display and
| regenerate the code every ten minutes, but of course we've left
| the extremely easy realm quickly.
|
| But I agree I wouldn't want a static QR code linked to anything
| that could bother me.
| atoav wrote:
| Then, why not hook up a button to said ESP32 and improve the
| UX by multiple magnitudes?
|
| Oh.
| cinntaile wrote:
| I know I know. The QR link can resolve to a captcha/puzzle
| that needs to be solved before it actually rings!
| nkozyra wrote:
| Also we'll serve ads on it.
| kfarr wrote:
| Choose the quarter pounder in all of the photos...
| dirkc wrote:
| It will use a LLM to interview you and decide if you are
| allowed to ring the doorbell
| ibaikov wrote:
| But LLMs cost money so it'll need a monthly subscription
| with tiers (for visitors too!)
| kfarr wrote:
| Please insert 25 cents to continue this call
| dylan604 wrote:
| Choose the quarter pounder with e.coli in all of the
| photos would be beneficial to the vendor as well
| EGreg wrote:
| I build apps for a living, that solve real-world problems.
|
| Static QR codes make no sense by themselves because they can
| be replayed. Same goes for "pay with your face" biometrics.
| The person is supposed to confirm something on THEIR OWN
| phone, to authenticate themselves and their location. Then
| the QR code to scan can indeed be static. Since the person's
| phone has to have the Internet anyway to make requests,
| simply change the interface on the PHONE.
|
| QR codes printed on a flyer or wherever are meant to "start
| the conversation". The authentication can happen right after.
| But keep in mind that, by themselves, they are not enough.
| For example, if you're trying to do a ticketing system or
| attendance where people scan a QR code, they can just forward
| it to their friend. Better to have them PRESENT a QR code to
| be scanned.
|
| Having said that, WiFi access points and captive portals are
| better. Because once you authenticate, the next time is
| seamless. They can be used to take attendance in classrooms,
| and much more, seamlessly. (Except if it a person's phone is
| off. So then they have to come up and manually register, or
| you have to find that out by having a challenge during class
| that actually requires phones.)
|
| ATTENDANCE ONLINE:
|
| While I'm at it, I will mention one more thing.
| Authentication and "presence" can also include face
| recognition and eye tracking. There are lots of models for
| Tensorflow's JS port, such as "blazeface", that can do it in
| real-time. You can present a computer interface on your own
| wall and the person is authenticated with their face. But
| remember, once again, that this should only be used for _your
| own_ software within _your own_ organization, which you
| presumably trust. Because it can be replayed and spoofed by
| whoever has access to the back-end.
|
| Anyway, for remote learning, this becomes really useful
| because (e.g. during the pandemic) the teacher can have an
| on/off signal which M of N students are paying attention, and
| which are drifting off or walked away from the computer --
| all WITHOUT seeing their video feeds. So it enhances privacy.
|
| We've built a simple tool where students can open a
| background tab for instance, which watches where their
| attention is, while they use whatever sites. The tool is
| deployed by the teachers.
|
| If you want to prevent tech-savvy students from spoofing this
| attendance, you have to ship some of the code, signed with
| your own HMAC or private key, every time, and do it in a
| third-party iframe so their JS code can't simply override it.
| They would have to rewrite the code in the time that the
| secret key for the HMAC changes (every 10 minutes). For that,
| they'd need to install their own user-agent, and very few
| students are going to go that far. But yes, if people do have
| their own user-agent, then they can pretty much do any kind
| of replay attack for attendance. Something to keep in mind.
|
| The only way I have found, to do attendance reliably online,
| in the presence of adversaries capable of wielding their own
| user-agents _and_ rewriting code on the fly, is to have them
| join a videoconference and show a signed QR code on their
| phone while also completing challenges with their face. The
| private key might have to come from an agency that saw them
| arrive in person. The only way to defeat this is to corrupt
| the agency, making it give out a lot of private keys, and
| then deploy deepfake video avatars at scale (the kind DARPA
| wants to do) to complete all challenges. At that point, they
| AI is probably good enough that you prefer the bots to humans
| anyway LOL.
|
| SYBIL ATTACKS
|
| I will also say a word about sybil attacks. The best ways I
| have found to prevent them are imposing a cost (but those who
| can recoup the cost will still do it) or grandfathered
| accounts. The problem with grandfathered accounts is that
| people can deploy software to automate existing accounts, and
| do it occassionally enough to avoid detection. The only way
| to prevent cheating in tests, for example, is to flip the
| classroom and have the students take the test in class. They
| can do it on their phones, as long as their phones notify the
| teacher when they put the app in the background. (However,
| there are still problems with phones that allow multiple apps
| side by side and don't tell the apps.)
|
| In case you are wondering, we are building some of this stuff
| on https://teaching.app
| gruez wrote:
| >all WITHOUT seeing their video feeds. So it enhances
| privacy.
|
| I'm sure your app doesn't actually stream the video back to
| the server, but how do I as the user, know that? All I can
| see is you requesting camera permissions and you saying
| "trust us bro" that you're not streaming the feed back to
| your server.
| EGreg wrote:
| You can say that about literally any app or piece of
| software, as a regular user you just "trust" WhatsApp to
| do end-to-end encryption, or websites to not read your
| email and try your password on other websites
| https://xkcd.com/792/
|
| Mostly, in our use case, it's because students are
| already willing to open their camera to teachers, when
| they demand it, and this is actually considered a more
| effective and private "upgrade" for everyone.
| saaaaaam wrote:
| How to massively over engineer a simple doorbell!
|
| I don't mean this in a mean way and realise that your comment
| was mention the spirit of the conversation :)
| barryrandall wrote:
| You could also just use a cheap pet-compatible motion sensor
| and sound the chime when there's motion on the porch.
| middayc wrote:
| there is probably very little cost in changing the QR code,
| almost like changing a password in an odd case that anything
| like this happens.
| sam29681749 wrote:
| Wouldn't you also need to reprint the barcode? Get it's
| probably unlikely to happen, but there seems to be a lot more
| friction than changing a password.
| nkozyra wrote:
| You could rotate them at random so you're only printing a
| dozen or so.
|
| But again, still more hassle than helpful and if you forget
| to switch it the problem remains.
| quesera wrote:
| Easily pranked yes, but not that different from other cases
| which turn out to be non-problems in daily life.
|
| People could also print flyers with your phone number on them.
| Add your email address to spam lists. Etc etc.
| c22 wrote:
| Swapping codes on two adjacent houses would be pretty amusing.
| maaaaattttt wrote:
| I think this could be solved by asking the last name of the
| person/family you want to ring the bell for, once the QR code
| URL is loaded. This doesn't solve the issue of: what if
| multiple appartements want to use this solution as a doorbell?
| Then you'd have to add the name on the QR code and it's back to
| square one.
| NicuCalcea wrote:
| I'll be honest, if I have to scan a QR code and fill in a
| form to let someone know I'm at their door, I'm turning
| around and going home.
| ozim wrote:
| Not even trying to knock on the door?
| dirkc wrote:
| Pranking is a legitimate concern. What do you reckon the worst
| case scenario to be and what do you reckon are reasonable
| pranks?
| 0x457 wrote:
| Generate a new code when it happens? It's not like you have to
| keep the same QR code for some comptibility reason.
| GJim wrote:
| "R2-D2 you know better than to trust a strange QR code".
|
| Scanning QR codes outside a trusted environment (e.g. a workplace
| stock keeping system) is asking for trouble. Security advice now
| routinely recommends not deploying QR codes on your products, nor
| encouraging your employees/users to scan strange codes.
|
| It's like 1995 all over again.
|
| EDIT: In response to doubters below
| https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cz472gy8nd9o
|
| Besides, to paraphrase Dubya: "Goatse me once, shame on...shame
| on you. Goatse me--you can't get goastsie'd again."
| echoangle wrote:
| Why do I hear this so often? Isn't the risk exactly the same as
| clicking random links on the internet? Do you do a background
| check before opening an external link to a story on hacker
| news? The risk is exactly the same as when you scan a random QR
| code.
| TrianguloY wrote:
| Qrs may have other data, not only links, and there is always
| the extra (but minimal) risk of a vulnerability in the qr
| reader itself.
|
| Other than that, it's the same as clicking a link on an
| email, yes.
| pacifika wrote:
| You can hover over a link to see the destination, this isn't
| always possible with a qr code as it depends on the client
| app
| gruez wrote:
| How many people actually hover/long press every link before
| clicking, especially on sites with UGC that allow for link
| spoofing (eg. <a
| href="http://evil.example">http://site.example</a>)? If
| you're paranoid to do that, you can probably figure out how
| to audit qr codes before opening them. On iOS it's trivial
| to make one in Shortcuts. On Android, Firefox confirms the
| link before opening.
| pacifika wrote:
| If the native tooling always confirmed a qr code then I
| think you'd be right. Until then it's security practices
| not paranoia.
| echoangle wrote:
| And what does that tell you? How do you detect malware from
| the URL? Do you have a whitelist of known-good domains and
| don't visit anything else?
| pacifika wrote:
| The http protocol uses human readable addresses for a
| reason.
| echoangle wrote:
| Yes, to make addresses memorable, not to detect malicious
| hosts. If I give you a random .com-domain, how do you
| determine wether it is safe? And do you actually do it if
| it's the link of a hacker news post, for example?
| master-lincoln wrote:
| Can you provide a source for that? I have never heard that
| before and it seems ridiculous to me. The advice connected to
| QR codes I suggest is to not make the reader app auto-visit
| decoded links, but just show decoded content.
| edent wrote:
| Sorry, that's utter bobbins.
|
| QR codes can contain a limited set of data. There's no
| possibility of a buffer-overflow or malicious program.
|
| Every QR reader I've seen shows you the destination before
| taking you there.
|
| It _might_ be a scam website - but that 's no different to
| seeing an poster and manually typing in the address.
|
| Yes, QR codes can contain an auto-generated email or premium
| SMS. But they won't send automatically. The user remains in
| control.
| jy14898 wrote:
| > QR codes can contain a limited set of data. There's no
| possibility of a buffer-overflow or malicious program.
|
| Source?
| jillesvangurp wrote:
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QR_code
| gregmac wrote:
| > It might be a scam website - but that's no different to
| seeing an poster and manually typing in the address.
|
| Disagree, because:
|
| * QR codes are opaque to humans. You can't visually tell if
| one is legit or not.
|
| * QR codes often use URL shorteners, so that the URL
| contained is just https://exam.ple/4pTF6x4M9 is not unusual.
|
| Someone can replace a QR code with a sticker overlay and link
| to a phishing site. Replacing a URL on a poster is also
| possible, of course, but harder to make look convincing in
| the first place and significantly simpler to detect.
| edent wrote:
| * Printed URls are also opaque. How do you know if the
| correct website is whatever .com or whatever .org?
|
| * Printed URls often contain shortened links.
|
| I'd argue that most QR sticker overlays are _also_ pretty
| inept. See a sample at https://shkspr.mobi/blog/2024/07/qr-
| code-hijacking-attempts-...
| jillesvangurp wrote:
| The risk is exactly the same as clicking on a link on the
| internet. There is no additional risk. You could type the link
| in your browser manually after decoding and the exact same
| thing would happen. That's because most QR codes are simple
| links. The ones that aren't are things like cards, wifi
| credentials, etc. But most of them are links. You click on them
| by scanning them. The same mechanisms that make using the
| internet a mostly safe experience that billions of people enjoy
| on a daily bases, also apply to qr codes. Because it's the
| exact same browser that opens them.
|
| So, use common sense here. Links and QR codes are everywhere.
| And people click or scan them all the time at their own
| discretion.
|
| This is not like 1995 all over again. All the same protection
| mechanisms that we've put up since then for links also work for
| QR codes. There's no real difference between a link I email you
| and a QR code that you encounter in the wild. You click or scan
| them and a browser opens and does its thing. I mention email
| here because email clients typically don't really restrict what
| you can do with links in them. There's a reason for that:
| people send a lot of links via email and links are useful. So
| the fact that some bad actors send people evil links via spam,
| is not enough reason to disable the feature.
|
| QR codes are just a way to provide links for people to "click".
| It's not even a new way because they've been around for quite
| long. The US and Europe are late to this party. Most of the
| rest of the world already runs on QR codes for quite some time.
| Especially places like China and Japan.
|
| Ps. I run a company that uses QR codes a lot. They solve a lot
| of issues for us. IMHO they are severely underused currently.
| dirkc wrote:
| That is a valid concern, you are not the only person to have
| raised this.
| Waterluvian wrote:
| I unwired my doorbell and never looked back. It's been one of the
| best decisions I've made about my house. If you get past the FOMO
| you might love it too. Why does the world get an interrupt button
| for your home?
| sam29681749 wrote:
| Visitors?
| ndsipa_pomu wrote:
| A doorbell is just an easier and more polite version of
| knocking on your door. Do you also do something to prevent
| people from knocking on your door (e.g. a pit trap in front of
| it)?
| Waterluvian wrote:
| Yeah but there's a slide down to the ball pit.
| ndsipa_pomu wrote:
| That sounds fun. Any problems with it filling up on
| Halloween or do you just empty it often?
| Waterluvian wrote:
| There's a "Complaints" button that opens another trap
| door to another ball pit. It's actually ball pits all the
| way down (though to be perfectly honest I haven't
| tested). What's important is that I haven't received a
| single complaint.
| ChoGGi wrote:
| Probably the same thing I did, left the button. It's a lot
| more peaceful not having random people bother me at home.
| Dilettante_ wrote:
| Absolutely unhinged(based)
| pratibha_simone wrote:
| I would want a NFC one tbh.
| sam29681749 wrote:
| What's the advantage of this over a traditional doorbell + a
| phone (which everyone already has)? If I'm home, I can hear them.
| If I'm not, they can just message/call me.
| master-lincoln wrote:
| Traditional doorbell needs an electrically powered button on
| the exterior. Phone needs visitor to have your private contact
| info or you would need to publicly add a note with that to your
| door.
| sam29681749 wrote:
| If you don't want to use electricity, you can have a knock.
|
| What reason would you want to be notified of unknown visitors
| knocking on your doors when you're away? The only people I
| can see fitting this description are delivery drivers &
| salesmen?
|
| Further, what if you're home and your phone is in another
| room, is on silent, or is dead?
|
| What is you have a spouse or housemate? Do both of you get
| notified?
|
| And there's also a subset of people who get frustrated by
| having to use QR codes in restaurants, who I suspect would be
| equally frustrated by this.
| eesmith wrote:
| There are battery powered remote doorbell buttons. Eg, $29 at
| Ace Hardware, with a 100 foot range -
| https://www.acehardware.com/departments/hardware/safety-
| and-... .
|
| Also, a _real_ traditional doorbell is mechanically coupled
| to the bell, with no electricity at all.
| ale42 wrote:
| QR solution needs the visitor to (a) have a smartphone with
| charged battery and (b) Internet connectivity. Quite common,
| but wont work for everybody.
| sam29681749 wrote:
| Grandma delivering cookies is out of luck. To be fair, if
| you don't have a phone you could just knock. But then you
| could just knock to begin with.
| wink wrote:
| I know it's situational, but going to a party where you don't
| have the host's number? Also in general if you want to be rung
| at a temp. location but not hand out your phone number? (e.g
| meetups at company premises where you only have a door bell at
| the wrong location)
|
| I wouldn't call it a real replacement, but I can see a dozen
| uses.
| hoherd wrote:
| > going to a party where you don't have the host's number
|
| What? Door bells worked before phones existed.
| wink wrote:
| See my sibling comment, not all apartments have accessible
| door bells.
| sam29681749 wrote:
| Don't all apartments have an intercom? I suppose I just
| assumed they did.
| quesera wrote:
| Larger buildings with many units usually do have
| intercoms with two-way audio (and sometimes one-way
| video) and the ability for the resident to remotely
| unlock the door. Sometimes these work via telephone or
| Internet, so the resident does not even have to be home.
|
| Smaller buildings with just a few units usually just have
| simple dumb wired doorbells. And they are usually not
| broken.
|
| Different cities/neighborhoods have a different mix of
| larger and smaller buildings.
|
| This QR code idea is interesting, because it lets you go
| from dumb to smart, bypassing all of the steps that would
| normally be necessary (cost, approval, installation,
| maintenance, etc).
|
| It's not as "good" as Nest etc, but it gets you most of
| the way there for almost none of the hassle.
|
| Not for me, probably, but interesting.
| sam29681749 wrote:
| Doorbell or knocking solves this? What are the other uses you
| can think of? Genuinely curious because I don't see them.
| wink wrote:
| I've been to several meetups here where the company has
| larger offices in a high rise tower and e.g. the meetup is
| on the 4th floor but the door bell rings in the 3rd floor
| reception, and because it's after work, no one is there.
| People arrive in a 30min window, so someone would have to
| stand at the entrance, or put signs everywhere, or let
| people wait. As I said, situational, but "scan code to let
| someone's personal phone buzz and not have their personal
| phone number posted anywhere" works as one case.
|
| The other one was a party at someone's apartment and I only
| had their IRC and twitter handle but not their phone
| number, and they had a key pad at the entrance (long story,
| not their fault) and I didn't have the number. And yes, I
| tried to ping them but they seemed to ignore their phone so
| I had to wait for other guests to arrive anyway.
|
| My third example would be temporary event locations where
| there simply is no door bell or the organizers are not
| where it would ring and again, a phone works but it would
| leak the caller's number and the organizer's number whereas
| I suppose you can just uninstall the app or have different
| URLs generated that stop buzzing after a while.
|
| Situational, as I said.
| sam29681749 wrote:
| 1 & 3 seem reasonable applications for this, but I don't
| see it as a replacement for a doorbell. 2 seems just like
| a minor organisational blunder.
| dirkc wrote:
| I have a few ideas about this,
|
| One thing I've found useful so far is that the notification
| sound is different from my phone/message chime, so when I hear
| it I know it's someone at the door.
|
| I'm curious to hear what other people think?
| edent wrote:
| This is a brilliant idea! Love the "take a photo" at the start. I
| assume (if you answer) it will go through WebRTC?
|
| Might be nice to play a "ding dong" sound in the browser?
| dirkc wrote:
| Currently it isn't doing WebRTC, but that is the idea. Although
| I'm not sure if I want to add audio and/or video?
| NKosmatos wrote:
| Good for you that you build your first mobile app(s) and for
| having an inventive mind, but please be aware that there are many
| many "bad" people out there that will abuse/prank/exploit simple
| ideas like yours. Keep yourself safe and don't allow people to
| disturb you in ways you haven't imagined. Unfortunately this is
| the state of the world right now :-(
| dirkc wrote:
| Thanks for you concern. I need to look into different
| safeguards to prevent abuse. Right now I'm trying to see if
| there is at least some use
| riiii wrote:
| Doorbell URL:
| https://dingdongdoorbell.com/bells/5muj34dpDCzdyABV/
| severak_cz wrote:
| Feedback: Bad UX. After scanning your example code I got page
| which asked me to take photo and I get really confused because I
| thought you want me to scan QR code again but there is no way to
| switch to other camera of my phone.
|
| Overall this feels too complicated. Unfriendly to people without
| smartphone or mobile internet. I understand this is DIY
| equivalent of camera doorbell, but I would definitely prefer some
| no-name chinese radio doorbell both as one ringing and
| maintaining it.
| dirkc wrote:
| Thanks for the feedback. I agree that the UX needs lots of
| improving - I'm wondering if more instructions on the QR code
| or the page for the doorbell would work better?
|
| While a cheap radio doorbell might be better in many cases,
| there are still circumstances where it's not suitable. I'm
| trying to figure out which those are?
| gruez wrote:
| >I'm wondering if more instructions on the QR code or the
| page for the doorbell would work better?
|
| In general you should display a prompt explaining why a
| permission is needed (eg. "we need access to your camera to
| camera to take a picture to send to the owner, click allow on
| the next screen to allow."), and only ask for permissions
| after the user accepts the first prompt.
|
| However in this particular case you shouldn't have to request
| camera access directly. Using <input type="file"
| accept="image/*" capture="user> will display an system
| interface (ie. from the browser or OS) to allow the user to
| take/select an existing picture. It also already has preview
| and front/back camera selector built in, so you don't have to
| implement that yourself.
|
| https://developer.mozilla.org/en-
| US/docs/Web/HTML/Attributes...
| dylan604 wrote:
| If you're at the point of asking permissions, might as well
| grab the location data as well. You could then verify that
| the person hitting the QR code is actually on your front
| step which would eliminate all of the false positives like
| the replay attacks, copies being used in other locations,
| etc.
| dirkc wrote:
| 100% agree with explaining before asking permission.
|
| I'll have a look at using the `capture` attribute on an
| input. My initial idea was to do video over webRTC, but the
| selfie version works okay for a first version
| dylan604 wrote:
| There are tons of cheap wireless units available that just
| use a bit of sticky tape to "install" the button to the door
| and then you can place the receiver/bell where ever you want.
| These work well and are much more understood by visitors.
|
| Of course, you would not have learned your first iOS/Android
| app with that approach. Maybe that's the better lesson to
| learn though--not everything needs to be an app
| biercarsten wrote:
| So while I find that idea interesting, I would rather prefer
| knocking or texting on the doorstep of peoples homes.
|
| I might have a situation where the QR Code makes sense
| though. I'm renting a location for a party at the top of a
| building, which is only accessible by transponder cards. So
| there is no door bell or anything. Instead of having someone
| letting the guests in, this could be an alternative.
| langsoul-com wrote:
| Nfc touch doorbell would also be cool. Though, I do feel it's too
| technically advanced for most people to use.
| dirkc wrote:
| That would be cool - the QR could also be a RFID tag. But like
| you mention, that would also be more advanced
| AndrewOMartin wrote:
| I think I walked past this in a European capital city, could that
| have been your doorbell (city not specified for obvious reasons)?
| Or are other people already using this?
| dirkc wrote:
| I doubt that it was one of mine, I'm much further south.
|
| I'd be very curious to hear more about it
| jillesvangurp wrote:
| I recently visited a friend in Finland. In Finland it's common
| for apartments to not have doorbells downstairs. Instead the door
| has a pincode that people use to get in which are typically
| shared with friends when you invite them.
|
| Except those pin codes are now commonly disabled for security
| reasons. So, I was waiting downstairs wondering what to do and in
| the end just called my friend after which he came downstairs to
| open the door. That works of course but a QR code would be a good
| alternative.
|
| Even if it just contained a tel:// link with the phone number. I
| love QR codes for low tech solutions like this.
|
| This stuff doesn't have to be hard. And you don't even need an
| app for this. Just print your own code with your phone number,
| email address, etc. (from any of a vast number of web based
| generators) and put it near the door with some instructions.
| nabla9 wrote:
| Choose better UX design.
|
| 1. Get a QR code to put at your door
|
| 2. Visitors scan the QR code using their smartphone camera
|
| 3. Get a notification on your phone wherever you are!
|
| OR
|
| 1. Install doorbell at your door.
|
| 2. Visitors press the doorbell using any of their extremities.
|
| 3. Get a notification on your phone wherever you are!
| Weetile wrote:
| Not to mention a QR code excludes many people such as children
| and the elderly who might not have phones
| dirkc wrote:
| Good point, I'm hoping that this increases access rather than
| decrease it. In my neighborhood there are plenty of homes
| without doorbells.
| saaaaaam wrote:
| Maybe those people don't want people to bother them. I keep
| the buzzer in my apartment turned off a lot of the time
| because random people buzz it trying to deliver things to
| my neighbours. We have a concierge desk for that.
| quesera wrote:
| I probably agree with your premise (it's not clear), but:
|
| Scenario 1 (QR code) puts 100% of the infrastructure on the
| client (visitor) side, and scenario 2 (Nest, Ring, etc) puts
| 100% of the infrastructure on the server (resident) side.
| [Edit: strained metaphor perhaps, and yes both scenarios
| require connectivity infrastructure]
|
| So these are completely different methods of achieving the same
| goal, and there are easily imaginable cases where one scenario
| would be preferable over the other.
|
| Usually, server-side makes the most sense. Certainly in the
| case of a traditional wired or wireless dumb doorbell, it's
| simpler.
|
| But there are cases where server-side is difficult or
| impossible, especially if you want "smart" features like photos
| or routing or two-way interaction. Higher cost, permission from
| property owner if renting, etc.
|
| Pushing the infrastructure to client-side solves these
| problems. Most users will have the client infrastructure in
| their pocket already. No wires. No new piece of hardware to
| maintain, repair, keep charged, etc.
| aaronax wrote:
| You can get a wireless doorbell for $25 which will require no
| permission from any reasonable property owner.
| quesera wrote:
| But this gives you the functionality of a $200 system
| (Nest, Ring, etc) for ~zero cost, _and_ not all property
| owners will approve a Nest camera on their porch.
| michaelt wrote:
| The way I see it, Nest and Ring are a $20 doorbell, plus
| a $10 range extender so you can hear the bell if you're
| out the back, plus a $170 home CCTV system because you're
| in a high crime area.
|
| Seems to me a QR code removes the $170 bit that was a key
| part of the Ring camera value proposition.
| quesera wrote:
| The "ring me even if I'm not at home" feature has some
| value also.
|
| And for people who do not live in high-crime areas, but
| might want the other features of a Ring camera, the value
| distribution would necessarily be different.
| rootusrootus wrote:
| I'm in a very low (nonexistent, really) crime area and I
| like the camera on the doorbell. Not worried about anyone
| breaking in, but being able to tell at a glance whether
| it's a package, a neighbor, or a salesman ... that's
| valuable.
| beAbU wrote:
| How is scenario 1 100% on the client side?
| quesera wrote:
| Bad metaphor perhaps. Attempted to clarify above.
| c22 wrote:
| If I'm already holding my phone in my hand why wouldn't I
| just call you?
| mikedelfino wrote:
| The pizza guy, your neighbor, and firefighters don't always
| have direct access to your phone number.
| dylan604 wrote:
| Choose better UX design from visitor's perspective
|
| Knock on the door while ignoring anonymous QR code that could
| have been left by anyone
| dirkc wrote:
| This is my nr 1 question, will visitors scan the QR or will
| they still prefer to knock/phone?
| dylan604 wrote:
| I hate it when people call/text me to say "I'm here". You
| know what else you could do to let me know that you're
| here? Knock or ring the bell. It's definitely a
| generational thing though. Having lived in a time with and
| without devices, I'm really thankful that I didn't grow up
| never not having a device. This is a good example of unable
| to think of how to operate without a device
| quesera wrote:
| Some places don't have functional doorbells, and some
| doors are too far from living space for a knock to be
| heard.
|
| Some renting situations make solving those problems
| difficult, annoying, or impossible.
|
| But yeah, generally a doorbell is a pretty reliable tool.
| dylan604 wrote:
| > Some places
|
| That's probably true, but I don't live in some places. I
| have a door with a knocker and a doorbell.
| Calling/texting me is so damn annoying and pointless. You
| knock/ring, I get up and answer the door. You text/ring,
| I might ignore it or at least it could take time to go to
| where it might be sitting other than in my hand.
|
| If you live in one of these "some places", I doubt the
| landlord is going to be very happy about people
| plastering various QR codes on their property, especially
| if "some place" is a multi-tennant property which
| typically already have a system in place
| quesera wrote:
| > _but I don 't live in some places_
|
| Great. I don't think OP made this thing explicitly for
| you.
|
| And I'm not attempting to persuade you into choosing this
| doorbell option.
|
| For others, who are not you, and who have different
| living situations than yours, this could be an
| interesting option.
| ozim wrote:
| I disconnect that shit because of unwanted use.
|
| Mailman, flyers, delivery not for me, neighborhood kids
| pushing wrong buttons or just fooling around.
|
| If I have delivery scheduled or there is scheduled
| maintenance for building I will connect it for that day.
| Even delivery guys sms/call me when they are in area to
| check if they should drop by with parcel anyway.
|
| People like friends/family don't drop by without calling
| sending a message. There is no unscheduled visits since I
| was teenager.
| c22 wrote:
| I hate when people ring the doorbell. I'd rather they
| just walk in so I don't have to get up.
| markerz wrote:
| Wow that's a surprisingly aggressive comment. I'll share
| why I used to text and call "I'm here". I've had many
| experiences where the residents had dogs that would
| absolutely lose their minds and bark non-stop or go crazy
| when you ring the doorbell. It's just a better experience
| when their owner opens the door and there's a guest.
| Other times, my friends lived in a multi-unit apartment
| and I didn't want to bother 5 other people who I didn't
| know. Other times they lived with their family and,
| again, just didn't want to talk to them that time.
| -shrug- but I guess these are examples of not being able
| to think without a device.
|
| For you, if you're expecting guests, just tell them to
| ring your doorbell. Get rid of the ambiguity and give
| them comfort in knowing the "right" thing to do. You
| clearly gave it some thought and have strong opinions
| about it. I'm sure other people are just trying to be
| considerate in a generation where they mostly grew up
| living with lots of other people.
| michaelt wrote:
| _> For you, if you're expecting guests, just tell them to
| ring your doorbell. Get rid of the ambiguity and give
| them comfort in knowing the "right" thing to do_
|
| I'm not the person you're replying to, but the way I see
| things, if I put a button on the front of my house
| labelled "visitors, please press me" and then I got mad
| at my visitors for pressing it, that would be _super_
| weird behaviour on my part. The button _is_ the
| permission.
|
| People who don't want visitors to press the bell either
| remove it, or tape a bit of cardboard over it or
| something.
| camtarn wrote:
| Well, usually.
|
| Our doorbell, which was non-functional from when we moved
| in until we moved out eight years later, and which we
| were always planning to fix 'next week', is a good
| counterexample.
|
| Not that we'd get mad at people for ringing the doorbell,
| but we were very glad that people usually figured out
| they had to knock.
| markerz wrote:
| Sure, I think if a doorbell exists, it's fine to press
| it. For me, I just don't want to get overwhelmed by their
| barking dogs or greeting 4 other people. Sometimes, I'm
| just not in the mood and just want to see my friend one-
| on-one. I'm not doing it for other people. I'm doing it
| for myself because I find the experience of calling
| someone when I arrive to be a lot more pleasant in some
| cases. Those cases happen to occur more often when my
| friends are young. i.e. living with lots of other people
| or with their parents and family dogs.
| vikingerik wrote:
| One reason I and a number of people do that: to cover the
| possibility you might be at the wrong door/house or
| ringing the wrong doorbell.
|
| I had both of those problems at my previous residence. It
| was an apartment complex with some N1/2 addresses.
| Visitors would often miss that bit and be at the wrong
| door. On top of that, the doorbells were
| counterintuitive: they were arranged vertically, but the
| bottom doorbell would ring the top apartment and vice
| versa, so I forever had visitors and deliveries ringing
| the wrong bell (and actually mostly for the other units
| ringing mine.)
| rendaw wrote:
| Also if someones just dropping by (unscheduled delivery,
| sales) and I'm asleep, or watching a movie, or whatever I
| don't want to be disturbed, and if I have a question for
| my neighbors similarly I don't want to bother them if
| they're busy. Phones have snooze mode, most doorbells
| I've encountered don't.
| ozim wrote:
| I usually text/call when I visit people not so often like
| once a year or once in couple years because usually I
| don't remember exactly which number it was.
|
| If I go somewhere couple times a year I usually feel
| quite comfortable using doorbell.
| graemep wrote:
| I get annoyed by people knocking instead of ringing the
| doorbell. I am less likely to hear a knock.
| jaymzcampbell wrote:
| I do this all the time even when I know I'm at the right
| place as my friends have young kids and I usually turn up
| around when they might be in bed, so I tend to just
| message my mate I'm there to see that I'm ready and
| outside. Both of us are in our late 40s.
| rimunroe wrote:
| I would not scan the QR code because that's way less
| trouble. If the owner insisted on it I'd do it, but I'd
| roll my eyes and wondering why the owner thought this was
| an improvement.
| eddieroger wrote:
| Option 2 requires power, which not all doors have. There are
| wireless doorbells, but perhaps OP doesn't want to have to
| remember to charge or swap batteries.
| saaaaaam wrote:
| While option 1 requires connectivity, which not all doors
| have. I live in a large apartment block. There is zero phone
| signal at my front door. WiFi, yes, but I'm not giving some
| random access to my WiFi network.
| netsharc wrote:
| My app idea is to tell guests to "Connect to this SSID to
| knock", and have a way of scanning for new MACs on the
| network and notifying the door owner... /s
|
| For security of course it'll be an SSID that doesn't
| connect to anything else, because hey, we care about
| security. ;-)
|
| Another app is: "connect to this SSID and ping6
| 2345:0425:2CA1:0000:0000:0567:5673:23b5 to ring doorbell!".
| saaaaaam wrote:
| This sounds far too simple for something as complex as
| dealing with unsolicited attendance notification
| injections occurring at randomly defined intervals
| against a primary public<>private security surface.
|
| Particularly when you consider that some of those
| attendance injections may contain potential threats or
| unsolicited commercial messaging, or be designed to cause
| interference with predefined private processes, or even
| be designed just to consume processor cycles in
| unnecessary communication processing across the security
| layer.
|
| While I like your implementation suggestion it feels a
| little lightweight for something this important. Please
| revisit the scope and come back with a more fully fleshed
| out project proposal.
| toss1 wrote:
| The other good thing about Option#2 is that visitors do not
| have to give you their mobile phone number (which they are
| doing by sending the text).
|
| Just because they are at your door for some reason does not
| mean they want to give up what has become their mobile ID.
| People are starting to get protective of it with good reason,
| since there are so many attacks using the Mobile #/ID...
|
| Also, as pointed out elsewhere, the static easily duplicated QR
| code has issues for you, but it would also be easy for someone
| to slap a malicious QR code over your static one, disabling
| yours and enabling their scam...
|
| Maybe I'm just the wrong generation, or live in a place that
| still has winter, but a QR code where I need to get out my
| phone, take off my glove in winter, activate the camera to
| scan, etc., seems a lot less welcoming.
|
| One thing that _is_ good about your QR code option is that you
| do receive notice anywhere _and_ you do have their mobile
| number, so you can reply immediately with a text or call, such
| as "sorry, I'm running late, not quite home yet, I'll be there
| in 10min". Ofc, you could also post your mobile number below
| the wireless doorbell.
|
| Perhaps Option #3 would be a doorbell that can display a
| scrolling message, so
|
| -- wireless doorbell
|
| -- sends text to you
|
| -- you can reply to doorbell (e.g., "coming downstairs now", or
| "traffic, be there in 5min", "pls call me at 987-654-3210",
| etc.)
|
| This way, no one needs to reveal their mobile number, but
| everyone has the advantage of mobile communications, albeit
| with a small bandwidth.
|
| ?
| itake wrote:
| I think a note feature explaining why they are there would be
| useful.
|
| Knocking or a physical doorbell noise is fine for my house. But
| if I'm not home, they have no way to communicate with me unless
| they leave a note on the door, which requires them to have
| paper and me to not be traveling for days.
| dirkc wrote:
| I agree, I've missed this feature myself. I wonder if the QR
| could be your away doorbell, "Gone fishing, leave a message"
| itake wrote:
| I don't want people to know when I am out of the house. It
| drives me crazy when solicitors leave ads on my door
| handle, b/c I can be out of town for weeks.
| sangupta wrote:
| And not everyone carries a smartphone to scan QR code - read,
| elementary kids coming over every evening to play :)
| voytec wrote:
| I can see some potential for people with hearing loss. I've seen
| apartments and houses of such folks, with some small dedicated
| bulbs or even normal ceiling lights flashing furiously on all
| over the house upon someone ringing the doorbell. A doorbell
| signaling smartphones, making smart wrist watches vibrate etc,
| could be reasonable in such cases. But it could be still a plain
| uncomplicated button next to the door.
| dirkc wrote:
| Thanks, I haven't heard that perspective before.
| account42 wrote:
| A "smart" doorbell that can notify you in various ways makes
| sense - even without hearing loss you may not always be able to
| hear the doorbell (headphones).
|
| Expecting guests and random strangers to go out of their way to
| accomodate that is not ideal. I don't know how I would react if
| I had to scan a QR code to ring a doorbell but chances are I
| would leave.
| ale42 wrote:
| Now someone might want to check for neighbors having such QR
| codes on their doors and replace them with QR serving ads (and
| accessorily ring the "bell" application), or just with something
| unrelated (like a page to install a rogue app).
|
| On a side note, a delivery person might actually not want to scan
| the QR code because (a) if you do this all the day long, it take
| much more time than pushing doorbell buttons, and (b) if they use
| their professional devices to do this, they might either have
| that URL blocked, or scanning a "random" QR code might be against
| their company's policies because it might expose them to security
| risks (imagine a phishing page with the login interface of the
| delivery company, or a site serving malware).
| xyst wrote:
| iOS debuted a feature called "App Clips" awhile ago (2020?) that
| would be perfect for this.
|
| Most phones have an NFC reader as well so should work with
| Android too.
|
| Similar concept:
|
| 1) person taps phone against "door bell"
|
| 2) sends notification to user(s)
|
| 3) optionally, send "selfie"
|
| IIRC, app clips needed to be very small in size. So something
| like this could work, even in low bandwidth situations (ie, poor
| signal strength)
| dirkc wrote:
| Thanks for the suggestion! I understood "app clips" to be like
| notifications, but sounds like they are worth looking into.
| zaxomi wrote:
| I wish my annoying neighbor would get this, because then I can
| post the code online and have the whole world knocking on his
| door at all hours of the day.
| JohnFen wrote:
| Your house seems _more_ welcoming with a QR code? Scanning it
| seems like a hassle for visitors. I 'd probably just knock.
| account42 wrote:
| You'd knock? Depending on our relationship I'd just leave.
| Especially after being asked to take a photo - I already
| dislike video doorbells but sending a picture via an app where
| it will be stored for who knows how long is not something I'll
| go along with.
| JohnFen wrote:
| I answered assuming that the house belongs to a friend or
| loved one, or that I have some important reason I want the
| occupant's immediate attention. In those situations, I'd
| knock.
|
| I do very strongly prefer a QR code thing to something like a
| Ring (as long as the QR code isn't going to a service such as
| Ring), though, but neither is better than knocking.
| rahimnathwani wrote:
| I thought about keeping my existing doorbell button and chime,
| but adding an ESP32 plus hall effect sensor, to detect when the
| doorbell chime is being powered and trigger a notification over
| wifi.
|
| It seems a bit convoluted, though. Is there a DPST momentary
| button I can use instead (removing the need for the hall effect
| sensor)? I searched on digikey but 'DPST momentary' came back
| with results that were too bare (just the button), expensive ($50
| per unit) and had a long lead time (8 weeks).
| tofof wrote:
| Why would you use a hall effect sensor at all, or a dpst for
| that matter? You just need two resistors.
|
| Just tap the dc leg between the bell and the chime into a
| voltage divider - for a 16V doorbell to a 3.3V esp32 io pin,
| r1=15k and r2=3.3k is exact - and you're done.
| rahimnathwani wrote:
| Thanks. This makes much more sense.
| tzs wrote:
| How common is DC in home doorbell systems? Most doorbell
| wiring diagrams I've seen in the US show systems that appear
| to be all AC.
| dirkc wrote:
| Reading through the comments I realize the subheading on the site
| is not sending the right message:
|
| > Replace your doorbell with a QR code
|
| The purpose of the app is to create a doorbell for
| instances/contexts where there isn't one. Not to replace
| currently working doorbells.
| HPsquared wrote:
| "Print out your own virtual doorbell!"
| turtlebits wrote:
| Knock? Even if there is a doorbell, I prefer to knock as it's
| less disruptive.
| tln wrote:
| Interesting idea...
|
| Cheap wireless doorbell is $5 delivered from Amazon. That's your
| biggest competition for the straightforward case. And that's
| easier to install, and easier to use.
|
| There are plenty of scenarios where a Qr -> optional form ->
| notification is useful, eg hosting an event -- so maybe
| explore/emphasize those rather than the simple approach.
|
| Fighting abuse and the resulting customer service, bad reviews,
| etc will be a constant drain/challenge.
|
| There might be some market overlap with generic notification apps
| like Pushover.
| dirkc wrote:
| Thanks, that's good feedback!
| ramses0 wrote:
| I'm actually your target market here, but I want to replace my
| old exterior garage-door keypad with a (weather-protected) QR
| code. Same same, but text/twilio/home-assistant URL to allow me
| to trigger/confirm the garage door opening, probably IFTT.
|
| Agree also with the "scan this code when you arrive to the
| party" => are you here? Y/N => notification. Pop a geo-
| permissions prompt and geo-fence "YES" in certain cases, and
| you're getting somewhere.
| rootusrootus wrote:
| For your own garage door, if you are going to need your phone
| anyway to scan the code, why not just use regular automation
| tools? I.e. Just press a button on your home screen and
| you're done. Something like Home Assistant can do that easily
| enough.
| dmonitor wrote:
| Why QR over NFC? NFC's tap-to-activate functionality is
| usually way faster than my camera app
| oefrha wrote:
| I don't see this as a doorbell, I see it as a QR code that can be
| trivially reproduced and used to trigger notifications on your
| phone by anyone from anywhere at any time, basically completely
| anonymously. Not a great idea.
| stainablesteel wrote:
| this seems silly
|
| seeing as you need an internet connection to access whether the
| doorbell has been rung, you may as well connect a physical
| doorbell to an app that monitors this and gives you a
| notification on your phone without the need for a QR code
|
| the QR code is just a hassle
| sureIy wrote:
| This feels like a mocking app of today's Reddit post requiring an
| app to operate an elevator.
|
| Kinda silly in any case. If you want to use a QR, just point it
| to your phone number so I can call you and talk to you.
| G_o_D wrote:
| Rather use NFC TAG, INSTEAD SCANNING QR REQUIRES SPECIFIC APP,
| HELL EVEN IN 2024 I DONT KNOW HOW TO SCAN QR WITHOUT 3RD PARTY
| APP, AND I HAVE GOOGLE LENS AND RELATED APPS DISABLED
| rvnx wrote:
| Click the Camera app, then point at the QR code and press the
| link
| G_o_D wrote:
| Rather use NFC TAG,
| ovi256 wrote:
| My old fantasy of "scan an NFC tag and it brings up an UI on your
| phone to do things to the machine bearing the tag" applies here
| too.
|
| Easily add a control panel to machines that can't easily have one
| (because of cost etc). Or a debugging panel for improved UX over
| the usual "three LEDs giving you a code you have to look up in
| the user manual".
|
| NFC is better UX (less user taps).
|
| For an easy PoC, make an NFC tag that connects you to an SSID and
| opens the captive portal usually used for Wi-Fi auth as the
| control panel.
| G_o_D wrote:
| Also there are rfid based smart stickers with microconteoplers
| abailable
| voytec wrote:
| You're focusing on an app, instead of ringing person's UX and
| _the_ doorbell itself.
|
| My suggestion: find a niche, like a doorbell for hearing impaired
| home owners. Otherwise you'll be recreating Nest. Google won't
| buy identical product twice, to kill it. A generic Nest-like
| product has little chances to take over the market.
|
| A button feels more natural and is much more approachable over an
| QR code. QR may be a nice fail-over for when no one is opening
| the door in reaction to knocking or pushing a button. But QR as
| the main method? Maybe for evolving markets or harsh
| neighborhoods where wireless doorbells get stolen - if that's
| even a thing.
|
| You're looking into providing value to home-owners, by making it
| easier for someone outside their homes. In most cases this dumb
| button that makes some sound inside the house just works. Little
| area for improvement here, for most people.
|
| Your potential market for people willing to stick a QR code on
| their door are:
|
| > "I'm hearing-impaired. Please use below QR code if I don't hear
| you knock"
|
| > "I'm not opening? chat with me here [QR code]"
|
| | this is your potential target. You already see that most
| comments in this thread tell you that people don't want QR codes
| on their doors. You have an idea for a solution still looking for
| a problem. Accessibility around hearing loss may be one.
|
| You can help people. And from a business perspective, you may be
| able to get government grants for such project, which may be
| better for you than crowd-sourcing. And, you may get customers
| who get their purchases partially covered by gov health programs,
| if you properly interact with related accessibility-related gov
| bodies (YMMV around the world of course), apply for getting your
| stuff assessed for free advertisements inside hearing loss-
| related clinics etc. And again - you can make a product that
| makes impaired folks' lives better. Win-win.
|
| There are multiple ESP32-based doorbell projects (I like this
| one[0]) that can be expanded easily with code changes. I can't
| really see how a QR code is better. Make your product either
| equally interesting to public or covering some niche use-case.
| And again: Nest...
|
| [0] https://tristam.ie/2023/758/
| saaaaaam wrote:
| Hey! Welcome, valued visitor! You'll notice I don't appear to
| have a doorbell. Don't worry, this is for your convenience and
| mine.
|
| If I'm out and about you'll be able to contact me, and I can tell
| you that I'm unable to answer the door right now but I value your
| visit.
|
| All in real time!
|
| Let's get started: simply solve the puzzle below. The solution
| will let you work out the code to unlock the box next to my door.
|
| When you unlock the box scan the QR code inside, which will allow
| you to connect to my WiFi guest network.
|
| Once you're connected scan the second QR code to open the virtual
| doorbell selector. You can then select the appropriate message
| for your visit.
|
| Unable to connect?
|
| Simply knock on the door and wait. If I'm home I'll surely answer
| soon enough. If I'm not home or don't want to be disturbed you
| should use your own judgement: if it's urgent trying shouting
| through the letterbox, or maybe wait a while and then return
| later!
| isoprophlex wrote:
| Your privacy is important to us! All interactions with this QR
| code doorbell are recorded for the purpose of training and
| quality improvement. If you do not want your data to be stored,
| please opt out by scanning the second QR code below the QR code
| doorbell. This doorbell uses cookies to enhance your bell
| ringing experience. Using the QR code doorbell implies your
| consent to the use of cookies and similar technology. To reject
| the use of cookies and similar technologies, please scan the
| third QR code below the QR code doorbell.
| dirkc wrote:
| In the right circumstances that sounds like fun - a mini escape
| room before you can visit your friend :)
| saaaaaam wrote:
| I'm wearing mittens >:-#
| turtlebits wrote:
| Why does this need an app? Why not just send me a text, or
| better, yet just an SMSTO link? (ie SMSTO:+1123456:Open the
| door!)
| flkiwi wrote:
| As a hack, this is great. As a thing I would actually use? Very,
| very unlikely.
|
| - I would never use a random QR code in public and I wouldn't ask
| anyone else to.
|
| - Pranking seems like an issue.
|
| - If I know someone, they'll text me they've arrived. If I don't
| know someone, there are two main cases: delivery person, who is
| going to pound the door and leave immediately (and I'll get a
| notification of delivery); and religious proselytizers, political
| door-knockers, and solar company sales people, none of whom I
| care remotely about talking to.
|
| Again, as a project, this is delightful. But as a thing to
| incorporate into my home, I can't see the use case.
|
| EDIT: Also, criminals. They're not going to use a QR code to see
| if I'm home.
| andrewstuart wrote:
| I went down a rabbit hole several years ago with this concept.
|
| I built much of the code front end and back end then abandoned it
| because I just could not summon the belief in the idea as a
| startup.
|
| I was focused on QR codes as entry points to buildings and
| companies, with integrated guest book functionality.
|
| This was pre-covid so QR codes had not yet become something
| everyone knew how to drive and mobile phone implementation was
| not yet universal.
|
| Also being pre-covid every still went to the office to go to
| work.
|
| I came up with many names and registered many domains I think one
| of them was paperdoorbell.com and many other such variants.
| coretx wrote:
| It has been a while since a _useful_ new app came along! Thank
| you, i appreciate it to the point I'd be willing to pay for it.
|
| Feedback: Teach people to never ever scan a QR code if they don't
| know for a fact who created it. For if you don't, you'll be part
| of the crowd who is conditioning people to scan all the QR codes
| they can find without thinking...
| anon115 wrote:
| if you improve the UX on this thing I think im not a businessmen
| but i think you would be competing against 'Ring'
| weiwio wrote:
| It made me immediately think of the sign in and sign out QR code
| for my kid's preschool haha. Interesting idea!
| qkhhly wrote:
| I have a better idea: using a QR code as your door key.
|
| * Install a lock that does not have any external mechanism to
| unlock it. No key holes, no password pad, nothing. So there will
| be no lock picking in any way.
|
| * Use your peep hole as a camera.
|
| * Show a QR code to said camera.
|
| * Door unlocks if QR code is correct.
| otterley wrote:
| What's the failsafe mode? (e.g. battery is dead, mechanism
| fails, etc.)
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