[HN Gopher] Electro-agriculture: Revolutionizing farming for a s...
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Electro-agriculture: Revolutionizing farming for a sustainable
future
Author : foota
Score : 47 points
Date : 2024-10-25 18:46 UTC (4 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.cell.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.cell.com)
| Aspos wrote:
| For those wondering what electro-ag is: convert CO2 into acetate
| --a carbon-rich compound that can fuel crop growth without
| sunlight.
| westurner wrote:
| "Electro-ag"
|
| "Electronic soil boosts crop growth" (2023)
| https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38767561#38768499 :
|
| > _Electroculture_
|
| > "Electrical currents associated with arbuscular mycorrhizal
| interactions" (1995)
| https://scholar.google.com/scholar?cites=3517382204909176031...
|
| Electrotropism: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrotropism
| haccount wrote:
| What the op article suggests is using GMO plants that no
| longer use photosynthesis but instead drive their metabolism
| based on products derived from CO2 electrolysis and simple
| chemical man made compounds.
|
| Plant-made plants, like industrial chemical plant-made.
| westurner wrote:
| Is that more efficient than [solar-powered] industrial
| production processes that synthesize directly from CO2?
| https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40914350#40959068
|
| What about topsoil depletion and compost production?
| gene-h wrote:
| It's 4x more efficient at solar to food production than
| regular plants with the potential to get a 10x
| improvement.
| westurner wrote:
| What are the downsides?
|
| I read that it was [Vitamin E] acetate in carts that was
| causing EVALI lung conditions?
|
| What nutrients does it require synthetic or natural
| production of, and how sustainable are those processes?
|
| Have the given organisms co-evolved with earth ecology
| for millions of billions of years?
|
| Acetate > Biology: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acetate
| Windchaser wrote:
| Hmm, this article is about using electricity and CO2/H2O to
| make chemical feedstocks that would grow plants. The plants
| would "eat" the chemical feedstocks, instead of "eating"
| light.
|
| It's not about using electric fields to direct plant growth;
| that's a different thing
| westurner wrote:
| Perhaps electro-agriculture is an all-encompassing term, or
| a new usage in this context
| haccount wrote:
| It's technically impressive in a way but it's also a dystopian
| hellscape enabler technology.
|
| The article even takes the opportunity to mention that It could
| be useful during "solar geo engineering events and nuclear
| winter". What kind of insane geo engineering event is envisioned
| where food crops cannot grow under natural sunlight and all food
| we eat is from GMO plants and mushrooms only?
|
| Did I mention the health inspiring carbon-monoxide step in the
| electrolysis process to produce the food for the plants? I did
| now.
| zemvpferreira wrote:
| A thousand atomic bombs are a dystopian hellscape enabler
| technology. Food that can grow without sunshine is a dystopian
| hellscape survival technology.
|
| You could not have this more backwards.
|
| EDIT: Unless you mean that someone would launch 1000 nukes on
| the belief that they could survive the impending hellscape only
| because of electro-ag mushrooms which is a possibility I strain
| to believe.
| haccount wrote:
| Harvesting Monsanto(tm) Dark-gro(tm) leafless GMO tomatoes
| with a cold LED headlamp in an underground bunker to the
| background hum of the electrolysis system that churns out
| megawatts worth of carbon monoxide feedstock.
|
| Not dystopian?
| Windchaser wrote:
| I think he's saying that the nuclear winter is the
| dystopian scenario. The technology that allows you to
| _survive_ the dystopia is not, by itself, dystopian. The
| technology that _creates_ the dystopia (like nuclear
| weapons) are dystopian.
|
| Worth noting that this same technology could let us reduce
| US agricultural land use by ~80-90% and rewild those same
| lands. Is having vast tracts of unspoiled wilderness
| "dystopian"?
| mometsi wrote:
| Look at lucky Mr haccount here, with his fancy brand-name
| produce. You call that dystopian? Here we just slurp our
| 10% white vinegar straight out of the acetate reactor for
| 300 kcal per liter.
| nomel wrote:
| > What kind of insane geo engineering event is envisioned where
| food crops cannot grow under natural sunlight
|
| For off-world, being able to dig a big hole, plug the leaks for
| atmosphere, and grow plants in it seems like it could be
| useful.
| metalman wrote:
| could,bla bla bla,algea,Cupriavidus necator,bla bla extremophile
| bacteria,bla bla,could,fungi,bla
| bla,yeast,could,bla,might,may,bla,bla,electro-ag feedstock,bla
| bla,could,Genetic engineering approaches can be taken to enhance
| plant acetate metabolism.31 In other organisms, acetate
| utilization has been improved by overexpressing bla
| bla,might,acetate,acetate,acetate,acetate,bla bla,could trying to
| make bugs look good,I think
| goda90 wrote:
| Would a heterotrophic adult plant have all the same micro-
| nutrients that a photoautotrophic adult plant has? I can imagine
| while one might grow lots of cellulose, maybe there are chemicals
| that just end up never being made by the plant cells or taken up
| via the roots in those conditions.
|
| I'm reminded of suggestions to point a fan at hydroponic herbs in
| order to enhance flavor. Just water, air, light, and dissolved
| nutrients isn't enough for them to be delicious. The plant needs
| some degree of stress or variation while growing.
| roughly wrote:
| This is known among wine growers as well - you need to stress
| the plant to get interesting grapes, otherwise you just get
| sugar water.
| beedeebeedee wrote:
| I'm not completely sold on it, but one of my friends is adamant
| that this approach powered by hydrogen deposits make all of our
| climate change issues (and other societal issues) into non-
| issues. I just wouldn't want it if it isn't done equitably.
|
| https://www.usgs.gov/news/featured-story/potential-geologic-...
| goda90 wrote:
| At a global industrial scale, we're pulling lots of carbon out
| of the ground for energy and its ending up as carbon dioxide in
| the atmosphere with big consequences. We should also consider
| the implications of pulling hydrogen out of the ground at
| global industrial scales and it ending up as water vapor,
| trapping atmospheric oxygen in it. Generated hydrogen at least
| has a closed loop on water and oxygen from the atmosphere.
| tfourb wrote:
| The lengths some people will go to to avoid dealing with nature
| ...
|
| It is pretty preposterous to claim something is "sustainable"
| that will use man made energy when the alternative is a natural
| process powered by the sun, for free. There are plenty of
| agricultural systems out there that use a fraction of the energy
| required by conventional industrialized agriculture while still
| being sufficiently productive.
| waynenilsen wrote:
| Electricity to food via synthetic chemistry feels inevitable.
| Casey Handmer has discussed in detail. Probably starts out with
| electricity + air to ammonia first.
| krunck wrote:
| > The demand for food production is intensifying with a rapidly
| growing population, yet farmers around the world face
| unprecedented challenges owing to shifting climatic conditions.
|
| How about we stop creating so many people? We don't have to eat
| vat grown slop if we just realize that there is a limited
| capacity for this planet to provide us with real, nutritious
| food.
| CorrectHorseBat wrote:
| That's a solved problem, the population is projected to peak
| before the end of the century.
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