[HN Gopher] The life-changing magic of Japanese clutter
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The life-changing magic of Japanese clutter
Author : herbertl
Score : 24 points
Date : 2024-10-11 17:11 UTC (5 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (aeon.co)
(TXT) w3m dump (aeon.co)
| SoftTalker wrote:
| Man I hate clutter so much. Or I should say, I really like being
| in a tidy, uncluttered space. But my own house is pretty
| cluttered. Not sure how that happens.
| rad_gruchalski wrote:
| You like it uncluttered because you live in a cluttered space.
| creer wrote:
| The japanese clutter photos though are all of older businesses.
| Older smaller businesses accumulate clutter in the US or western
| Europe just the same. Just like your home, a small business
| accumulates stuff - at least tools, cute objects, postcards sent
| by customers and friends, orphaned stock that has been for sale
| for 20 years and would be more likely to sell on ebay but the
| manager is busy, etc. The main reason is probably that they are
| not a priority to the manager who has been slowing down and feels
| busy enough with more important tasks. They are not "an
| aesthetic" - not deliberate. Just usually a product of
| circumstance.
|
| Occasionally they are an aesthetic but then again in the US also
| - see for example The Pawn Shop restaurant in San Francisco
| (where you bring a token object to be admitted).
| AlienRobot wrote:
| Clutter is really beautiful. I wish there was a tutorial on how
| to design cluttered interfaces. Everything is about minimalism
| nowadays. I like how in some interfaces you don't have a weird
| icon for deleting things, you just have "del". 3 letters are
| worth an icon.
| alanbernstein wrote:
| Minimalism is in direct opposition to first-order
| retrievability.
|
| Very common example: home kitchens have cabinets, commercial
| kitchens have shelves and racks. When speed really matters, the
| cabinet doors need to go.
| tedd4u wrote:
| Our home kitchen has cabinets that are mostly transparent
| glass. Worst of both worlds? The clutter is easily visible
| but access is slowed. Really though, I think there is a
| purpose: doors keep the dust and grease of the kitchen
| environment away from the items in the cabinets.
| AlienRobot wrote:
| But why is speed the only thing that matters all the time?
|
| Kitchens still have cabinets. Where are my cluttered websites
| at?
|
| I don't think every single website needs "speed." Specially
| when I go to some websites sometimes and they have a 2
| megapixel PNG as favicon but a minimalist, border-rounded
| flat designe Wordpress theme.
| alanbernstein wrote:
| It's ok for every person to have their own preferences on
| this. Gmail has an information density setting, I always
| keep mine at "compact", and I can't relate to anyone who
| uses another option. But it doesn't bother me that they do.
| CrimsonCape wrote:
| I think you are overestimating the ease of building UI
| controls. WPF for Windows represents the most advanced
| system that Microsoft developed, it's very complicated, and
| there's no real equivalent API for web. The concept of
| WPF's Visual allows deep customization of a control and
| lets you build your own primitives. You could build your
| own Clippy.
| m3kw9 wrote:
| At home, feeling relaxation is important. Some interface,
| vibe is as important as the interface like music apps for
| example. You don't want some monotone ui that can kill vibes.
| Music UI is probably the hardest to do
| ValentineC wrote:
| I'm suddenly reminded of this article:
|
| https://randomwire.com/why-japanese-web-design-is-so-differe...
| mock-possum wrote:
| > For Morse, the lack of stuff was less a product of aesthetics
| than of economics. He was frustrated that other critics had
| failed to consider 'that the nation is poor, and that the masses
| are in poverty.'
|
| > By turns reverential and condescending, ideas of Japan's
| enlightened design sensibilities swept Western society.
|
| Western colonizers are _obsessed_ with the myth of the noble
| savage. It's the exact same treatment Americans gave to natives -
| oh look how minimal, how simple, how in touch and in tune with
| nature they are.
| acureau wrote:
| Or perhaps we as people just tend to idealize foreign cultures,
| because from our perspective they're different and interesting.
| You could view it as patronizing or endearing. You don't have
| to look far to find the exact opposite happening all over the
| world.
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westernization
| mrweasel wrote:
| Isn't it like this with most cultures. People from the outside
| lock on to something in a foreign culture, idolises it, promotes
| it as unique and special to an embarrassing level. It completely
| ignores that each Japanese person is just as unique as any
| American, Brit, Italian or Dane.
|
| That being said, there is something beautify about the clutter
| that comes out of Asian cities with their limited space and
| abundance of people, which allows odd specializations. Though you
| can fine some of the same beauty in small shops and business in a
| city like New York, where space is also at a premium.
| johnea wrote:
| Nice article!
| jacknews wrote:
| "How is it that the same culture that reveres minimalism also
| delights in maximalism, too? "
|
| That temple is a great example of maximalist minimalism. Sure
| there's great detail, but it's all neatly framed in a simple
| layout, with a repetitive pattern, etc.
|
| Actually that sums up all the examples. They may be messy in a
| way, complex, detailed etc, but they're still constrained to
| simple patterns and layouts (square shelving, etc), so not really
| maximalism at all, in fact.
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