[HN Gopher] Almost all new car sales in Norway last month were EVs
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Almost all new car sales in Norway last month were EVs
Author : jayantbhawal
Score : 54 points
Date : 2024-09-14 19:36 UTC (3 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (qz.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (qz.com)
| LUmBULtERA wrote:
| > Norwegians pay higher taxes on cars they purchase that pollute,
| and lower ones on low and zero-emission cars. The country also
| taxes bigger cars more than smaller ones. EV drivers often pay
| lower parking fees and can use bus lanes, too.
|
| The first two sentences make sense! Not the last one though.
| After driving an EV for a few thousand miles, ive realized they
| are so superior to ICE for my use case. I hate driving ICE
| vehicles in the occasions I still do now.
| ubercore wrote:
| They're usually combo bus/taxi lanes. Do you think it doesn't
| make sense because busses should still be prioritized over
| private vehicles?
| LUmBULtERA wrote:
| That's my thinking, yes.
| ubercore wrote:
| Anecdotally, it's not really an issue. I've never seen a
| bus hindered by EVs, and honestly most people don't even
| tend to use them anyway.
| pcl wrote:
| Yeah, I can't get my head around that. Why do so many EVs
| sit in traffic when they don't have to?
| ubercore wrote:
| I mean, I don't live in the biggest city in Norway
| (Stavanger), but the places there are bus lanes tend not
| to be the places with the worst traffic problems. And
| there are roundabouts everywhere, with very few traffic
| lights, so traffic flows pretty well overall.
| Sakos wrote:
| I wonder. Are people who aren't well off able to afford cars if
| nearly all cars sold are EV?
| LUmBULtERA wrote:
| I think this is just about new car sales? Less well off can
| still by used ICE, which is what they would be anyway. Or
| even used Model 3 are in the low $20k USD here. Used Chevy
| Bolt are $10-20k, some leafs are cheaper.
| pcl wrote:
| A new Tesla and a Camry are about the same price, given the
| ICE taxes.
|
| So no, many people can't afford cars, but actually the EVs
| are the affordable options.
| mttch wrote:
| I just bought a second hand EV for 4k, cheaper than and ICE
| of the same age.
| theshrike79 wrote:
| Depends on your definition of not well off.
|
| I think the age of $1000 beaters is going to disappear. Just
| the raw metals in a completely dead EV battery are worth more
| if you recycle it.
|
| Even more if it's only "dead" for EV use, there's still
| dozens of kilowatts of usable capacity for other uses as-is.
| pcl wrote:
| In Oslo, the bus lanes on the highways are only accidentally
| available to EVs currently.
|
| They were open for years as a means to foster EV adoption. But
| once sales took off, the local government tightened the screws
| -- you needed an EV and also at least two people in the car to
| get access to the bus lane.
|
| But! When they printed the new signs, somehow a double negative
| slipped through, and the text on the (many) signs said that you
| could only use the bus lane if you were driving alone in an EV.
| Obviously not the intent.
|
| But currently, all the signs have the double negative condition
| crossed out, and all EVs continue to be able to use the bus
| lanes.
| LUmBULtERA wrote:
| Ha, that's funny! That's similar where I am in the US too,
| early on there were EV exemptions to some carpool lanes, but
| that's phasing out as EVs are normalized.
| aaomidi wrote:
| Agreedish. In the US I don't think I'd support higher taxes for
| non EVs because cars are unfortunately a necessity here and EVs
| are (mostly artificially through govt policy) expensive.
|
| But yes to your point of ICE cars suck. They're so much more
| impressive engineering than EVs but that complexity is also
| their downfall imo.
| barbazoo wrote:
| Could still tax based on weight to encourage people buying
| smaller cars.
| erik_seaberg wrote:
| How many cars sold are new? How many owners have garages for
| charging?
| nine_k wrote:
| Norway has put like 30 years of efforts into building up
| impressive electric transmission and EV-charging
| infrastructure. Check out e.g. these articles:
|
| https://cleantechnica.com/2023/03/08/how-norway-became-the-w...
|
| https://www.mckinsey.com/industries/automotive-and-assembly/...
|
| Also note that the amount of habitable land in Norway is rather
| limited, so you don't get to drive hundreds of miles over flat
| highway-friendly terrain, like e.g. in the US Midwest.
| erik_seaberg wrote:
| > Since more than 82% of EV users in Norway charge their
| vehicles at home, housing associations can apply for grants
| that subsidize up to 50 percent of the cost of buying and
| installing communal chargers.
|
| I'm familiar with parking in your own garage and charging, or
| parking on the street with no infrastructure, but I don't
| understand how far away these chargers would be and whether
| they're usable overnight.
| theshrike79 wrote:
| Basically there's communal parking in the housing
| association's property, you can use the chargers there to
| charge. It's just a normal parking space, but with a
| charger.
| ubercore wrote:
| Level 2 chargers are super common on a lot of houses, and there
| are plenty of other options around most towns and roads.
|
| I tend to see mostly new cars, no clue what the breakdown is,
| though.
| mttch wrote:
| Who needs a garage for charging? I've got a 7kWh charger on my
| driveway but no garage. Over the road there are chargers on the
| street lamps. Where I live I've even seen charger cables run
| inside gullies under pavements for people with no driveways.
| waynecochran wrote:
| The government essentially makes it unreasonable to buy any other
| type of car. Also gotta love that sweet sweet North Sea oil. So
| what happens to all that oil? I am sure it only emits lollipops
| and unicorns when it is burned.
| paulryanrogers wrote:
| At least they're using the oil exports to break their own
| dependence on it. They'd be even more foolish to double down on
| it.
| standardUser wrote:
| Americans can get a used Nissan Leaf for $10-$20k and it would
| accommodate virtually any daily commute plus side trips without
| ever spending a dollar on gas. I continue to be baffled year
| after year as to why more Americans don't go that route. At least
| those with detached homes or otherwise easy access to charging.
|
| If nothing else, the fact that most Americans don't by a cheap EV
| as a _second_ car (assuming they have need of one) is
| particularly baffling.
| eastbound wrote:
| Social signaling is important. Whether you like the game or
| not.
|
| To not: In Europe, social signaling works in favor of biking...
| but only among a certain type of people (let's say
| vegetarians). But it's a circle of friends really hard to
| maintain because they also veto you if you take _any_ non-
| ecologic decision.
|
| So, long story short, social status signaling cannot be
| cancelled by ecologist status signaling. Seems like we'd have
| to appease tensions on both sides...
| pcl wrote:
| In Norway, there are plenty of cycling enthusiasts (for
| around-town transit, commuting, and exercise / fun) with all
| sorts of dietary approaches. I don't think there's any
| meaningful vegetarian / cycling correlation there.
| pcl wrote:
| Relatedly... a friend is looking for a power inverter for an
| otherwise-fine 2015 Leaf. Anyone here know where to source one?
| Axsuul wrote:
| The Nissan Leaf is not that practical. There's a reason why
| SUVs are the most popular type of car in the US.
| dijit wrote:
| I thought we already understood that US large car sales was
| the result of the individualist culture and perceived
| improvements in safety from being in a heavier vehicle during
| a collision
| ahartmetz wrote:
| > There's a reason why SUVs are the most popular type of car
| in the US
|
| Not practicality for sure! The trunks of at least mid-sized
| SUVs are small and the trunks of mid-sized estate wagons are
| quite large. SUVs have a raised vehicle floor, which is
| terrible for driving dynamics, removes interior space, and
| adds air resistance.
|
| SUVs are staggeringly stupid vehicles, but fashionable.
| Personally, I like some fashions, and others I ignore and
| avoid as hard as I can - SUVs are firmly in the latter
| category.
| bobthepanda wrote:
| One funny side effect of pickups and SUVs being sold for
| suburbanite egos is that some actual tradespeople and
| farmers have started importing tiny Japanese kei trucks
| because the cargo volumes are the same or higher than a
| modern American vehicle.
| f3d46600-b66e wrote:
| 1) new Evs are still more expensive than new gas cars 2) in
| some states, the registration fees are higher (+$225 in
| Washington State) 3) if it's your only car it may be a bit
| limiting, unless you are willing to rent a gas car on occasion.
| Physkal wrote:
| From experience living in southern America you will get
| ridiculed, pummelled to the side of the road, and blinded by
| F350s and Silverados. And constantly told it's your fault for
| having a car they couldn't see over their 8 ft hood.
| thechao wrote:
| The Tesla dealer told me to get a paint kit when I picked up
| my car, a few years ago; he called it the Tesla Texas Tax.
| People (used to) go out of their way to ding my car.
| aprilthird2021 wrote:
| There's a reason a used Nissan Leaf is so cheap. In EVs, once
| the battery is done, the car is done, as replacing the battery
| is expensive. The more the battery is used, like any battery,
| the less capacity it has, the faster it drains, the lower your
| mile range.
| vinni2 wrote:
| > Norway has a slew of incentives in place that encourage
| residents to buy electric vehicles instead of gas cars.
|
| They have been slowly taken out.
| rullopat wrote:
| So the only way to push all people to buy EV right now is...
| distort the market with taxes on combustion engine vehicles.
| paulryanrogers wrote:
| Alternatively you could look at it as pricing in previously
| overlooked externalities of ICE vehicles.
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