[HN Gopher] Janet Jackson had the power to crash laptop computer...
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Janet Jackson had the power to crash laptop computers (2022)
Author : mellonaut
Score : 81 points
Date : 2024-09-13 19:44 UTC (3 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (devblogs.microsoft.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (devblogs.microsoft.com)
| segasaturn wrote:
| This is a fun article but seriously lacking in details... musical
| frequencies crashing hard drives, including hard drives of
| laptops within earshot? That's a pretty extraordinary bug so I
| hoped there would be more elaboration. I also wonder if that
| patch to block those frequencies is still in effect.
| dvh wrote:
| Shouting in data center increases disk latency:
| https://youtu.be/tDacjrSCeq4
| anyfoo wrote:
| I wouldn't call it a "bug", more "unfortunate physics". Still
| possible to guard against that, specifically. (There will
| always be more "unfortunate physics", for example I bet that
| the hard disk also fails if I smash it against a wall at
| 100mph, but nobody's going do care designing a consumer HD that
| stops exhibiting that specific behavior.)
| hyperhello wrote:
| " I would not have wanted to be in the laboratory that they must
| have set up to investigate this problem. Not an artistic
| judgement."
|
| Then what is it?
| pclmulqdq wrote:
| A desire to generally not listen to one song loudly over and
| over? I think after the 1000th time, anyone is going to fall
| out of love with any song.
| aidenn0 wrote:
| Yeah, I had to listen to part of the All-4-One version of _I
| Swear_ hundreds of times while reproducing a bug. It 's not
| pleasant.
| Jtsummers wrote:
| If you were setting this up in a lab to test you'd be playing
| the same song on repeat trying to recreate the circumstances
| and effect, possibly at different volumes and playback speeds
| and other things until you isolated a particular portion that
| caused the crash. Then you'd play back that portion. And all of
| this would be at a level people could hear. So you'd be hearing
| the same song over and over in an otherwise quiet lab. Even if
| you liked the song, you'd hate it by the end of the day (or
| spend the day wearing earplugs).
| lcnPylGDnU4H9OF wrote:
| John Mulaney - The Salt and Pepper Diner
|
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aYIwPu50Fic
|
| "For years, scientists have wondered: 'Can you make grown men
| and women weep tears of joy by playing Tom Jones' _It 's Not
| Unusual_?' And the answer is yes, you can, as long as it's
| preceded by 7 _What 's New Pussycat_s."
| throwawayQQOWJF wrote:
| I just read it as "I am glad I did not have to
| debug/troubleshoot such a crazy-sounding crash" -\\_(tsu)_/-
| klyrs wrote:
| I don't want to sit next to a cannon when it's going off. No
| artistic judgement on the 1812 overture; I just don't wanna be
| there.
| anyfoo wrote:
| I would not have wanted to be in a laboratory that is set up to
| play my most favorite song very loudly over and over again,
| either.
|
| I don't think it's an artistic judgement.
| pclmulqdq wrote:
| Adam Neely has a good video on this effect, explaining why it is
| specifically the Janet Jackson song in question:
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-y3RGeaxksY
| gpvos wrote:
| Do read the follow-up, and maybe also the Adam Neely video about
| this, linked both there and in another comment here.
| jasoneckert wrote:
| 5400rpm laptop hard drives were notoriously sensitive to external
| force because of their thin metal construction and low power
| motor.
|
| I remember having a MacBook Pro with a Toshiba 5400rpm hard drive
| that failed shortly after I rested it on an HVAC unit in our
| server closet (the HVAC unit happened to be the perfect height
| off the floor for doing work while standing). Just to be sure
| that was the cause, I had the drive replaced under warranty, did
| the same thing again and it died again after only a short while
| of using it on that HVAC unit.
|
| After Apple replaced the drive a second time, I instead used a
| crash cart as a laptop desk and put a sign on the HVAC unit that
| read "Don't put laptops on here."
| netsharc wrote:
| > "Don't put laptops on here."
|
| With an explanation why not? I feel like having that, instead
| of a "Here Be Dragons" note would be more helpful, so someone
| won't ignore the sign thinking "It'll be fine".
|
| Also it'd be funny if the sign is still there even though all*
| laptops have SSDs now...
| dylan604 wrote:
| They're also sensitive to being yelled at too.
|
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDacjrSCeq4
| vlovich123 wrote:
| > And of course, no story about natural resonant frequencies can
| pass without a reference to the collapse of the Tacoma Narrows
| Bridge in 1940.1
|
| Yes it can because it turns out it wasn't an issue with resonant
| frequencies & it's just promulgating an incorrect (but catchy)
| story.
|
| > Just four months later, under the right wind conditions, the
| bridge was driven at its resonant frequency, causing it to
| oscillate and twist uncontrollably. After undulating for over an
| hour, the middle section collapsed, and the bridge was destroyed.
| It was a testimony to the power of resonance, and has been used
| as a classic example in physics and engineering classes across
| the country ever since. Unfortunately, the story is a complete
| myth.
|
| > You can calculate what the resonant frequency of the bridge
| would be, and there was nothing driving at that frequency. All
| you had was a sustained, strong wind. In fact, the bridge itself
| wasn't undulating at its resonant frequency at all!
|
| I recommend reading the article but the long & short is it's
| something called "flutter" and they even have a video of the
| problem.
|
| [1]
| https://www.forbes.com/sites/startswithabang/2017/05/24/scie...
| jdiff wrote:
| There's a footnote indicated by the superscript 1 in your
| quote:
|
| > 1 Follow-up 2: Yes, I know that the Tacoma Narrows Bridge
| collapse was not the result of resonance, but I felt I had to
| drop the reference to forestall the "You forgot to mention the
| Tacoma Narrows Bridge!" comments.
|
| Damned if you do, damned if you don't, and damned if you do
| both, even.
| ptero wrote:
| It's closer to "damned if you knowingly make grossly
| incorrect statements even if you put a small footnote saying
| OK, I know it is not correct". And damned right that you are
| damned in this case :)
|
| I would much prefer a reference to the event with the
| clarification, in the same paragraph, that it is due to a
| different phenomenon. My 2c.
| lelandfe wrote:
| Think I missed the grossly incorrect part
| dylan604 wrote:
| way back when I was in a group that marched a lot, it was
| touted that marching formations do not march across bridges and
| fallout during the bridge crossing. I'm not saying it is
| accurate. Just stating that resonance myths regarding bridges
| are pretty ingrained. Not once did that marching formation
| follow a route that had a bridge, but I always wanted to see
| how it would be handled. Play into the myth--like holding your
| breath while passing a cemetery--or just keep going.
| ryandrake wrote:
| My first thought was that filtering a set of frequencies out from
| the laptop's sound output doesn't seem to be a good solution that
| addresses the root cause. This only corrects it for those laptops
| running that OS software, and does it at the cost of reducing the
| quality of the device's audio for all applications. What about
| other laptops playing the song, or just living room speakers
| playing it? What if I, as a user of the laptop, was doing audio
| processing and needed the sound card to faithfully output
| frequencies that I commanded it to play?
|
| But there's a follow-up article that addresses all of that:
| https://devblogs.microsoft.com/oldnewthing/20220920-00/?p=10...
|
| TLDR is it's cheaper to throw your audio quality under the bus
| than to recall the defective laptops/drives and replace them with
| a design that works. :(
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