[HN Gopher] Tmpmail: Temporary email right from your terminal wr...
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       Tmpmail: Temporary email right from your terminal written in POSIX
       sh
        
       Author : thunderbong
       Score  : 142 points
       Date   : 2024-08-14 14:03 UTC (1 days ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (github.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (github.com)
        
       | vessenes wrote:
       | Love this. Nota bene, it uses 1secmail.org's API on the backend.
       | Still love it.
        
       | xelxebar wrote:
       | Started running my own email server about 10 years ago for
       | essentially this use case. Every entity I need to give an address
       | to gets a unique, randomly-generated one. I figured this would
       | let me spot the leaks.
       | 
       | After roughly 1000 addresses handed out, surpisingly only two
       | sources end up receiving spam: 1) addresses that I've posted on
       | public forums, and 2) the address I use for patches to GNU
       | software.
        
         | nobody9999 wrote:
         | >Every entity I need to give an address to gets a unique,
         | randomly-generated one. I figured this would let me spot the
         | leaks.
         | 
         | I do the same, except I don't use a randomly generated address.
         | Rather, I use something that identifies who it is. e.g., if I
         | had a relationship with Tesla, the email address would be
         | 'tesla@myemaildomain'.
         | 
         | What (if anything) is the advantage of using a randomly
         | generated email address over the scheme I use?
         | 
         | N.B., I'm not dissing your strategy at all. I do exactly the
         | same. I'm just curious about the "randomly generated" bit.
        
           | jmuguy wrote:
           | I would guess just speed of creating the addresses/not having
           | to worry about using same address twice accidentally
        
           | dasyatidprime wrote:
           | Not the parent commenter, but I've encountered "people from
           | the counterparty organization get confused and wonder whether
           | you're part of it too / pretending to be part of it too".
           | This can be mitigated with some obscuring transformation.
        
             | nobody9999 wrote:
             | >Not the parent commenter, but I've encountered "people
             | from the counterparty organization get confused and wonder
             | whether you're part of it too / pretending to be part of it
             | too". This can be mitigated with some obscuring
             | transformation.
             | 
             | A fair point. Thanks!
             | 
             | Personally, I can't be bothered and when (not if -- the
             | scenario you've outlined has happened with me) folks get
             | confused, I just explain that I do it to fight spam and
             | they generally just nod agreeably. Whether they get it or
             | not isn't my concern -- knowing whose user database has
             | been pwned is.
        
           | xelxebar wrote:
           | When I started, I wanted the addresses to look as innocuous
           | as possible in order to avoid unnecessary explanations.
           | Filling out paperwork that people hand inspect is one case
           | where that can cause issues. I have also heard of people
           | getting filtered as potential spam accounts when the email
           | address matches the service name or whatnot.
           | 
           | Anyway, I just use pwgen to generate plausible-looking
           | addresses: pwgen -A0 10 1. They often look like realistic
           | abbreviations of names.
        
             | nobody9999 wrote:
             | Thanks! It makes sense, but I'm too lazy to bother.
             | 
             | I haven't seen my email get filtered, even after more than
             | a decade, but I suppose it could happen.
             | 
             | If I do run into something like that, I can always fall
             | back on pwgen. Thanks again!
        
             | rsync wrote:
             | "I have also heard of people getting filtered as potential
             | spam accounts when the email address matches the service
             | name or whatnot."
             | 
             | I have heard of that as well but many years in I have not
             | experienced it.
             | 
             | I do the same thing the person you are responding to does:
             | 
             | nameofservice@domain.com
             | 
             | ... and they all just go to my inbox with a descriptive tag
             | in the subject that I insert with procmail.
        
           | Z7YCx5ieof4Std wrote:
           | > I do the same, except I don't use a randomly generated
           | address. Rather, I use something that identifies who it is.
           | e.g., if I had a relationship with Tesla, the email address
           | would be 'tesla@myemaildomain'. > I almost use the
           | methodology except I add ramdom characters at the end.
           | Tesla.ahcdk@domain.com
           | 
           | Reasoning is that its most likely if you have tesla@ you will
           | have facebook@ tesco@. When adding characters you can filter
           | on the . + 4 characters
        
             | GoblinSlayer wrote:
             | I heard facebook doesn't allow emails with "facebook" in
             | them. Alternatively you can give facebook.te@ address to
             | tesla and tesla.fb@ address to facebook, nobody will figure
             | it out :)
        
               | nobody9999 wrote:
               | >I heard facebook doesn't allow emails with "facebook" in
               | them.
               | 
               | Where, exactly, did you hear that?. I can confirm that's
               | not the case.
               | 
               | My FB email address is a bare 'facebook@myemaildoman' and
               | hasn't been a problem. Ever.
               | 
               | That said, I set that as my FB email address more than a
               | decade ago, so I guess things may have changed since
               | then.
        
             | nobody9999 wrote:
             | >Reasoning is that its most likely if you have tesla@ you
             | will have facebook@ tesco@. When adding characters you can
             | filter on the . + 4 characters
             | 
             | I get you, and it's a good idea if you're using someone
             | else's domain (e.g., gmail.com, protonmail.com, etc.) to
             | make sure you have a unique email address.
             | 
             | Since I own -- and host my own domain for my emails (as
             | does the OP, IIRC), that's not necessary, as the domain
             | name itself makes the email address unique -- since I'm the
             | only one who uses it. As such, I can (and do) just filter
             | on 'facebook', 'tesla' and 'tesco' directly.
        
         | ForOldHack wrote:
         | I cannot thank you enough for your contributions to GNU.
         | 
         | I always use the dingleberry subdomain that goes nowhere,
         | except when an actual human interviense. Goes straight to the
         | bitbucket, and 1 out of 10 gets a pervue to see if I need to
         | add the source to my reject list which my ISP keeps peeking
         | into for changes to their reject list.
        
         | JOnAgain wrote:
         | The real value of this, IMHO, is that it makes it much harder
         | to match you against services and in ad platforms. Hashing
         | email addresses is the primary way user data is exchanged.
        
         | Szpadel wrote:
         | I use self hosted anonaddy instance for such purpose and have
         | dedicated alias for each registration.
         | 
         | It forwards received emails to my main mailbox with added
         | header telling me source email with note about where I used
         | that address.
         | 
         | that way I discovered few sites that were bought by some entity
         | and that sold my email to some crypto 3rd party
        
           | mvelbaum wrote:
           | 1. does anonaddy support ARC?
           | 
           | 2. are you able to reply to the email?
        
             | Szpadel wrote:
             | 1. In case dmarc is not passed you get extra red banner
             | with warning to forwarded email
             | 
             | 2. Yes you get special email to reply-to field that allows
             | sending from alias, but you have to make sure you remove
             | included banner containing alias deactivation URL from
             | quoted part of reply. You can disable this header but in my
             | case I needed to reply only few times
        
         | alchemist1e9 wrote:
         | I've recently been the target of many attempts to hijack my
         | gmail account, including even phone calls with live agents
         | impersonating google "security team". Successfully hijacking my
         | gmail address could be catastrophic for me and others I assume.
         | 
         | Anyway I was wondering if self hosting an email server might
         | allow for a security layer for those of us sophisticated
         | enough. Especially if we own our own domain. Ideally my email
         | address with access to financial services would have 2FA to
         | both read and send emails for example. Don't even think there
         | are clients or protocols but perhaps with self hosting this can
         | be rigged up with various tricks like port security opening
         | only with a 2FA message.
         | 
         | I'd be curious what other perspective on this issue is.
        
           | jamal-kumar wrote:
           | It's a decent amount of upkeep and cost, but I get paid do it
           | for a bunch of clients who desire this for their companies
           | and have my own which is humming along great. If you go the
           | route of a script to set everything up I found iredmail to be
           | the most mature and reliable solution, even if the upgrade
           | path is super manual at least it gives you a chance to know
           | at what point things went wrong rather than having to pour
           | over logs to fix something broken that is running in
           | production. It also pairs nicely with open source failover
           | solutions and if you need enterprise support they're
           | extremely responsive. Bonus points for getting it working
           | with your phone for backups of contacts, calendar and notes
           | with CalDAV or whatever to really decouple yourself from
           | cloud services with shady terms (I had to pay for an app on
           | my phone for this to really work, but it works great).
           | Setting your whole mailserver up manually is also an option ,
           | but be prepared to sink like a month of time into learning
           | how the hell to do that. This is technology from the 1970s
           | with a ton to get it working in the modern world after all.
           | 
           | Just be wary that you'll have to upgrade kinda often. I keep
           | subscribed to github alerts for iredmail as they're really
           | prompt about notifying their customers when they need to
           | patch security holes.
        
             | alchemist1e9 wrote:
             | That's very helpful. Thank you.
             | 
             | Who do you recommend as a very secure registrar?
        
           | xp84 wrote:
           | A perspective I've read on this (Granted, this was at least 5
           | years ago) was that it was paradoxically much harder to
           | compromise a Google account than it is to hijack a domain
           | from many registrars. I read an account by someone who had a
           | custom domain and the attacker had social-engineered the
           | registrar into allowing him access, then he proceeded to
           | update the MX, directing the email into the attacker's
           | server.
           | 
           | This probably varies from one registrar to the next, and
           | hopefully all have stepped up their game somewhat since that
           | time, but it left an impression on me and caused me to update
           | a lot of my accounts to my Gmail. Obviously, nobody is going
           | to be able to call into a customer service desk and talk them
           | into updating the gmail.com MX record, so for someone to
           | illicitly gain access to mail sent to <me>@gmail.com either I
           | have to be pwned myself (leaked a credential somehow) or
           | there has to be a global 0-day exploit affecting it. In the
           | latter case I am personally willing to bet that mine would
           | not be the first one (or even in the top 10 million) accounts
           | that the hackers would try, so I sleep pretty well.
        
             | alchemist1e9 wrote:
             | I understand. For me this raises the question of who is the
             | most secure and reliable registrar for a US citizen. The
             | security of a self-hosted approach appears to be determined
             | by the security of the MX records, the self-hosted server
             | security, and the IP security of the server.
             | 
             | With the increasing authoritarian tendencies of governments
             | it seems worth considering since they can clearly pressure
             | the big tech companies to access or hijack your email
             | address.
        
               | nobody9999 wrote:
               | >The security of a self-hosted approach appears to be
               | determined by the security of the MX records, the self-
               | hosted server security, and the IP security of the
               | server.
               | 
               | Don't forget DMARC/DKIM/SPF. They're necessary these days
               | as well.
        
               | alchemist1e9 wrote:
               | Definitely and I assume learning all of those will
               | provide enhanced security layers also.
               | 
               | I'm looking into MarkMonitor as a registrar with advanced
               | security systems.
        
             | dredmorbius wrote:
             | I've lost several Google accounts through excessive
             | authentication requirements with no viable alternatives.
             | 
             | Fortunately I'd anticipated such issues and largely
             | abandoned the platform.
             | 
             | I have one account which I care about somewhat. I have to
             | remember to log into that at least once per year to retain
             | it or it will also be lost.
        
               | dredmorbius wrote:
               | The last time this happened:
               | 
               | <https://toot.cat/@dredmorbius/111105389290062668>
        
               | alchemist1e9 wrote:
               | So what is your secure email approach? Any thoughts on
               | this problem would be interesting.
        
             | alchemist1e9 wrote:
             | I'm looking into MarkMonitor as a possible registrar with
             | extreme security features.
             | 
             | I think gmail is very dangerous they can delete your
             | existence by accident and they don't even have a human to
             | contact.
        
         | singron wrote:
         | I do the same, and the only leak was target giving my email to
         | a pork-related class action lawsuit.
        
         | dspillett wrote:
         | _> surpisingly only two sources end up receiving spam_
         | 
         | Quite a few of mine get junk:
         | 
         | * A couple that have been subject to leeks or hacks, that I
         | haven't got around to changing yet (linked-in for example)
         | 
         | * A fair few were given to businesses that are no longer in
         | operation (hosting providers, online stores) who presumably
         | sold their contacts databases to make a few pennies before
         | finally closing up
         | 
         | * Also some junk senders seem to have worked out that the sub-
         | domain I use for the per-entity addresses is a catch-all, I
         | need to address that at some point.
        
           | data_maan wrote:
           | > Also some junk senders seem to have worked out that the
           | sub-domain I use for the per-entity addresses is a catch-all,
           | I need to address that at some point.
           | 
           | Could you elaborate how you'd address that?
        
             | dspillett wrote:
             | There are a few options I've thought of, including these
             | ones off the top of my head:
             | 
             | 1. Just enable each on first use, instead of using a catch-
             | all at all, though there is a danger there of bounces due
             | to mistakes on my part.
             | 
             | 2. Keep the catch-all but send to a junk folder unless the
             | destination address is on a white-list, this has the
             | advantage that if I forget to add the new address (or do it
             | incorrectly) no mail is lost as I can move it out of junk
             | after the fact (as long as I notice within 30 days).
             | 
             | 3. Generate the addresses either fully or as <picked-
             | portion>.<truncated-salted-hash-of-that>@sub.domain.tld, so
             | ea588e3be96e89.8177be49@sub.here.com or
             | SomeShop.499ec679@sub.there.com, and use programmatic
             | filtering to decide where the messages go (junk unless the
             | hash matches). The disadvantages of that are needing to
             | have access to the generator at any time I need an address,
             | difficulty giving addresses verbally (there would be
             | transcription errors), and it does nothing for existing
             | addresses.
             | 
             | Option 2 is probably the winner there.
             | 
             | Every now and then I think of another option then dismiss
             | it as overcomplicated or otherwise not workable.
        
         | sam_perez wrote:
         | Hah, that is much fewer than I would have expected.
         | 
         | Too bad you can't do the same with phone numbers.
        
       | ForOldHack wrote:
       | Imagine a threaded mail reader with this feature from say, 1987?
       | I would pay for a threaded HN news reader.
        
         | nextos wrote:
         | Gnus is not too far from that if someone maps HN to NNTP.
         | 
         | I think there are some HN to NNTP bridges available.
        
       | xelxebar wrote:
       | After trying a few different CLI mail clients---mutt/neomutt,
       | s-nail, etc.---I've come to love the approach of mblaze[0],
       | _i.e._ just a collection of commands to interact with maildirs,
       | which can be separately managed by OfflineIMAP or whatever.
       | 
       | I'm curious how mblaze+offlineimap compares to other similar
       | setups: nmh[1], fdm[2], and getmail.
       | 
       | [0]:https://github.com/leahneukirchen/mblaze
       | 
       | [1]:https://www.nongnu.org/nmh/
       | 
       | [2]:https://github.com/nicm/fdm
        
         | rakoo wrote:
         | Shameless plug because tpis is also my approach: combine with
         | fzf and a few shell scripts and the sky is yours
         | 
         | https://sr.ht/~rakoo/omail/
        
           | nonrandomstring wrote:
           | Nice use of Unix philosophy and some well said things about
           | why. Thanks for sharing these.
        
             | rakoo wrote:
             | Thanks !
        
         | user3939382 wrote:
         | I wish there was a CLI imap client with a conversation view as
         | seamless as Fastmail or Gmail. I found mutt to be very clunky.
        
           | katzinsky wrote:
           | Have you tried using threads in mutt? Having them collapse by
           | default seems to reproduce what I remember the gmail
           | experience being.
        
           | tetris11 wrote:
           | gnus was pretty good for conversation chains
        
           | rakoo wrote:
           | Try sup: https://github.com/sup-heliotrope/sup
           | 
           | or its spiritual successors based on notmuch
        
       | jonstewart wrote:
       | I thought from the headline this was about _sending_ email right
       | from the terminal, and I thought, well that's easy, just telnet
       | to sendmail on port 25 and say HELO.
        
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