[HN Gopher] The Sphere
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The Sphere
Author : adrianhon
Score : 136 points
Date : 2024-07-02 16:27 UTC (2 days ago)
(HTM) web link (mssv.net)
(TXT) w3m dump (mssv.net)
| Carrok wrote:
| > Las Vegas' combination of climate disaster and themed/immersive
| indoor environments feels distressingly prophetic.
|
| The author calls the story of the film garbage, I think the
| article is garbage.
|
| Such a pretentious collection of nonsense statements and non-
| questions.
| i_use_arch_btw wrote:
| It ends with,
|
| > Given panoramas' use as propaganda for war and colonialism, I
| don't want to valorise the past or the present. It's not hard
| to imagine incredible uses for the Sphere's technology. But
| like the places it best simulates, the Sphere's ultimate
| service may be as a refuge from the heat of the world.
|
| lol
| rzimmerman wrote:
| Yeah that's an obnoxious take. Having a film about human
| climate impact in an air-conditioned desert venue is ironic
| and worth calling out. But not everything ought to be viewed
| through the lens of "colonialism = evil". It's a big screen.
| spondylosaurus wrote:
| I feel compelled to defend Las Vegas as a permanent resident:
| all things considered, we're doing pretty good. Water gets
| reclaimed and treated before being pumped back into Lake Mead.
| Massive solar power adoption. Desert living is perfectly fine
| so long as you're not using all your water rights to do
| something dumb like growing alfalfa.
|
| (All the air travel for tourism is another story, climate-wise,
| but that would apply regardless of whether it took place in the
| desert or anywhere else :P)
| gumby wrote:
| I was there last week for the Dead and it was really quite good.
| Didn't feel "huge", the sound was good (didn't need a huge sound
| system on stage) and the graphics ( which usually I find a
| distraction) were quite good.
|
| I find Vegas pretty boring but this was worth the trip.
| JoBrad wrote:
| A friend of mine has seen several Phish and Dead concerts
| there, and the videos they showed me are amazing.
| google_expat wrote:
| It has been renamed from "The Sphere" to the even more
| pretentious "sphere(tm)".
| mock-possum wrote:
| "Drop the 'the.'"
| loufe wrote:
| Is it a matter of pretention or rather them rebranding to open
| the doors to having more than one "Sphere(tm)"?
|
| IIRC the idea for a Sphere(tm) was dropped for London, but
| keeping "The" in the title, to their credit, does give them
| impression it is the "one and only".
| google_expat wrote:
| Proper branding is to skip the capital letters, the name is
| all lowercase. "sphere(tm)". Owner is a trust fund kid who
| has no discernible skills and still manages to mismanage
| everything he's been handed on a silver platter. Pretentious
| should have been his middle name.
| Scene_Cast2 wrote:
| What he's describing seems quite similar to the term "presence"
| in VR.
| taneq wrote:
| > Add in monocular cues of depth perception like motion
| parallax and lighting, and you get a startling level of
| presence, especially if viewers can't move.
|
| Sounds like they're talking about the same thing. :)
| gwern wrote:
| > The one exception arrived when the film cut to the interior
| of a cave. Up until this point, every shot had been outdoors
| or underwater. They looked good but didn't really showcase
| the Sphere's strengths as a wraparound display, since it's
| easier to fool depth perception with a clear blue sky versus
| a detailed interior. But gazing up at the walls and ceiling
| of the cave, I genuinely felt like I was there. > > Frankly,
| if someone told me they'd had this experience at the Sphere,
| I'd have dismissed them as insufficiently discerning, no
| matter the size or resolution of the screen. And yet here we
| are: I was convinced.
|
| Yeah, this sounds exactly like 'presence' for a seated VR
| experience. And I suppose for the same reason: no matter
| where you look, there the Sphere or VRHMD is.
| renewiltord wrote:
| It's a great experience. The movie Postcards from Earth is very
| immersive and I enjoyed that. The storyline is a pretty standard
| degrowther story so not innovative but it depicts it beautifully.
| It's definitely a striking theatre and a very enjoyable venue. It
| has a sort of futuristic Tomorrowland feel, which I enjoyed.
| rzimmerman wrote:
| I went to see the Dead there and it was fantastic. The sound was
| excellent and they used the beam-forming to have the vocals sound
| like they were coming from the stage below, while the instruments
| seemed non-directional. The haptic chairs were killer fun for
| Drums and Space. The Dead usually do about 10 minutes of
| improvisational percussion (Drums) and about 10 minutes of sonic
| exploration (Space). Watching Mickey Hart play the Sphere (seats,
| visuals reacting to his sounds, and of course the sound itself)
| was the coolest part.
|
| The visuals were so engaging that I had to look away to avoid
| motion sickness once or twice. My brain got used to it quickly.
| Totally worth the trip and fantastic. One complaint was the lack
| of bathrooms.
| wayeq wrote:
| > One complaint was the lack of bathrooms.
|
| burying the lead here!
| leptons wrote:
| It seems like there are bathrooms.
|
| https://www.thesphere.com/plan-your-visit/maps
| aleph_minus_one wrote:
| > It seems like there are bathrooms.
|
| > https://www.thesphere.com/plan-your-visit/maps
|
| By the way: In Firefox (127.0.2), Clicking the "View Map"
| button next to some map just opens an empty tab.
| leptons wrote:
| I hope you don't think I made that website. I'm not sure
| why you would reply to me with a bug report.
| arcanemachiner wrote:
| HN is kinda hard to read on mobile, can you tweak the CSS
| while you're at it?
| aleph_minus_one wrote:
| > I hope you don't think I made that website.
|
| Of course you (likely) didn't. But since Firefox is quite
| popular among people who care about privacy on the
| internet (a relevant part of the HN audience), I gave
| this information as a kind of public service announcement
| (PSA) that might be relevant for the HN readers.
| block_dagger wrote:
| *lede :)
| canadiantim wrote:
| *LED :)
| wayeq wrote:
| thanks, TIL
| afro88 wrote:
| It genuinely took me 5 seconds to realise the first image was a
| photo from inside the Sphere, as opposed to the article being
| about spherical spaces in caves.
| thanatos519 wrote:
| I just want to know what they feed it. Can I send them an NxM mp4
| as a pitch?
|
| I know a lot of people who take acid in Vegas and I think a crazy
| fractal animation would look great on this device.
| porphyra wrote:
| The image on the screen is 16K (16,384x16,384) driven by 25
| synchronized 4K video servers. [1]
|
| They have a dedicated camera with an amazing custom big sensor
| (77.5 mm x 75.6 mm with a 18024 x 17592 px resolution).
|
| [1] https://theasc.com/articles/sphere-and-the-big-sky-camera
| fezz wrote:
| a video on the camera system:
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fSUlbcpZJmA
| oceanplexian wrote:
| U2 was fantastic, and they really took advantage of the format
| but Postcards from Earth was awful. They didn't correct a lot of
| the video so you'd have things like pillars and objects like
| trees that were curved. And the cheap tickets are at least $100.
|
| The other problem was that the story, [Spoiler Alert] has an
| environmentalist theme but it was being told on the world's
| largest LED screen in a giant air conditioned death star in the
| middle of the desert. I found this kind of ironic.
| japhyr wrote:
| > I found this kind of ironic.
|
| And the main message was "It's okay, we'll just go out and
| recreate Adam and Eve on other planets until Earth has had time
| to heal."
| fabbari wrote:
| The kicker for me was: only few people are allowed back the
| recovered Earth. Any guesses about who gets to go back and
| enjoy a pristine Earth?
| lawlessone wrote:
| > Any guesses about who gets to go back and enjoy a
| pristine Earth?
|
| The guy who makes electric cars or the one that runs an
| online catalogue?
| brookst wrote:
| Environment is a theme, but not sure about environmentalism. I
| am pretty sure the message is "don't sweat it, we can always
| get another one when we mess this one up".
| igmor wrote:
| Been there yesterday, can confirm what the author wrote about
| immersion. Cathedral and opera scenes are something I have never
| experienced before, fully blown away. The storyline is garbage.
| timvdalen wrote:
| Everything I had heard about this so far suggested to me that
| this was a full half-sphere wraparound display, interesting to
| see that it's not!
| jimbobthrowawy wrote:
| I didn't know the display on the inside was only 16K, that seems
| pretty low for the size of the thing.
|
| Seems like the author got the best non-VIP seat he could too. I
| wonder how the worst seat (or non-seat, like an isle) in there
| fares for immersion.
| adrianhon wrote:
| Author here: Postcard from Earth only allows people to sit in
| more central seats, whereas music performances let people sit
| and stand much closer to the edges. In other words, it's
| probably not that bad if you're in the worst seat, though
| definitely not as good.
| hn_throwaway_99 wrote:
| FWIW I saw U2 there in decent but not great seats, and I
| thought it was amazing. There is a scene where they
| "deconstruct Las Vegas", so at the end you're just left with a
| vista of the Nevada desert, and it was so realistic and bright
| that I felt like I was outside.
| dahart wrote:
| Saw Dead from the floor, which is very close to the screen.
| There was some distortion, but it was still pretty immersive
| and worked reasonably well for the surround shots/sequences,
| though I did have to swivel and look around behind me. One of
| the nice things about a sphere, of course, is that there's
| always a fairly undistorted view across from you. The Wikipedia
| article has a shot from a very low+side seat:
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sphere_%28venue%29#Opening
|
| The sound system + sphere geometry is also interesting for
| similar reasons, you get good sound no matter where you sit. I
| even brought ear plugs because concerts are always too loud,
| but didn't need them in the Sphere show, they seemed to use
| their ability to achieve uniform coverage to set the volume at
| loud enoug but non-ear-destroying levels. (The WP article also
| talks about the sound system.)
| ChrisMarshallNY wrote:
| Had a friend that went there, a couple of months ago. He had the
| cheap seats, even though he could have easily afforded the VIP.
|
| He said it was _amazing_.
|
| Like the early IMAX, though, I'll bet making media for this
| sucker will be eye-wateringly expen$ive.
| BiteCode_dev wrote:
| While the sphere is more modern, and features the very hyped
| exterior LED screen, the concept of a sphere with a cinema screen
| wrapped inside it is quite old.
|
| 30 years ago, la geode already existed in Paris :
| https://www.lageode.fr/
|
| I got good memories of this as a kid, and if you are in the area,
| it's definitely a must-do in the city. Especially since it's
| attached to one of the most fun science museums you'll get to
| visit with a lot of interactive bits.
|
| I do want to get into the sphere to experience what 3 decades of
| progress have given us.
| kkarakk wrote:
| the website says the geode closed down in 2018 for renovations.
| the website was last updated in 2022.
|
| wikipedia says the geode is closed til september 2024
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/La_G%C3%A9ode.
|
| what kinda shenangigans are going on there?
| BiteCode_dev wrote:
| French administration would be my first guess :)
| howard941 wrote:
| More than fifty years ago a similar venue existed at Walt
| Disney World. It was a ride through a wrap-around ovoid. Very
| immersive.
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/If_You_Had_Wings
| joenot443 wrote:
| It's a shame that some folks passed their judgement on The Sphere
| before the project was done. The people who I know who've been
| were hugely impressed and said it was an engineering marvel.
| Others were quick to quote a video essay by a 17yo about how it's
| an idol to our dystopian indulgence.
|
| If it were in Cambridge I could understand the objections to the
| aesthetics. But this is Vegas! The style guide is basically just
| "go ham".
| awwstn wrote:
| Dead & Co. at the Sphere was an unforgettable life experience. So
| much creativity in what they did with the visuals to honor the
| history of the band, its San Francisco roots, and the canvas the
| Sphere gave them. I'm going back in August!
| block_dagger wrote:
| I went opening night and was a bit disappointed with many of
| the visuals. Apparently not all of the rendering was done so I
| missed some of the better ones. I'm also going back in August
| to see the show again, hopefully with improved scenes.
| paulnpace wrote:
| The Sphere is primarily for concerts. I refer to the movie
| currently running as their matinee show. Sure, it brings in some
| revenue but it isn't why they built the thing.
|
| I think the choice of the movie was poor. People don't go to the
| Strip to see some dystopia thing. MSG needed to pick something
| actually entertaining.
|
| At least they did not stick with the original name of "MSG
| Sphere" for the venue.
| whalesalad wrote:
| "Postcard from earth" gave me strange scientology vibes towards
| the end. I walked out because everyone around me was talking and
| using their cameras to record the entire thing. I would not go
| back to that venue.
| dahart wrote:
| > my guess is that most viewers are 20m from the screen
|
| The point being made in context here is valid, about depth
| perception and immersion, but picking nits, to me this guess
| doesn't feel right at all in terms of describing the viewing
| experience. The main viewing area is center front, opposite from
| the "good" seats in the middle, and there's nothing within 20m of
| it, or even 50m I'd speculate. The good seats are probably 80m
| away, and most of the rest are further. No matter where you sit,
| the undistorted view is across from you, you tend to look away
| from the very closest part of the screen. So people on the sides
| might be close to their side of the screen, but are primarily
| looking at the stuff across from them and in the center front.
| The parts that are within 20m are designed to be periphery no
| matter where you are. Except for the floor, where I might have
| been within 20m, but I was looking at the band 20m away, and only
| looking at the screen for stuff much further.
| adrianhon wrote:
| Author here: I was being overly conservative with the 20m, yes.
| Assuming the cutaway view in the post is to scale (it's from an
| architectural firm), it shows the inner screen dome is quite a
| lot smaller than the exterior structure - perhaps 70-80m tall;
| so 40-50m might be more accurate.
| dahart wrote:
| Oh your statement might be correct, that the average distance
| to closest point on the screen probably is about 20m, and
| guaranteed to be less than 1 radius (more like 0.5 radius
| perhaps.) If the cutaway is accurate, and it probably is, the
| interior is smaller than it feels like. So I may be
| underestimating how far away 20m is. I felt further than 20m
| away standing on the floor, but I probably wasn't. But, what
| I'm really saying, is that the direction to the closest point
| and the average viewing direction are only similar for the
| best center seats, and they're as much as orthogonal for the
| bad seats, the further away from the center you sit. The
| average view is probably greater than 1 radius, you're
| generally looking across the center of the sphere. I am
| picking a bit, but this is also an important part of why
| there are no terrible seats, the viewing experience is more
| uniform because the view across does not correlate with your
| distance from the nearest point. I think this relates to why
| it feels immersive and works.
| adrianhon wrote:
| That's fair - the spherical view does so much!
| NickInSF wrote:
| I'm surprised people aren't bringing up the "original" Sphere.
| Vegas had an Omnimax dome 45 years ago! I have fond memories of
| it as a kid. The entire theater was comprised of speakers on
| which spherical movies were projected. It's a shame it never got
| more traction.
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IMAX#Dome_and_Omnimax
| EvanAnderson wrote:
| There's an operating Omnimax dome at the Cincinnati Museum
| Center at Union Terminal. I don't know how it compares to The
| Sphere but if you're close by it's worth the trip in my
| opinion.
| bentt wrote:
| I am curious how they handle motion sickness, aka "vection" which
| we are so familiar with now because of VR.
|
| https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4403286/
|
| The basic rule is... don't accelerate the camera, positionally or
| rotationally, basically ever. You can present constant velocity
| or rotation, but even then it's risky.
|
| It takes a lot of discipline to not move the camera
| inappropriately in an environment like The Sphere. Hollywood
| people don't like to be told that the camera shouldn't pan,
| track, etc. But really, it shouldn't... unless you want a whole
| bunch of very uncomfortable, sad, sick people in the audience.
| block_dagger wrote:
| The Dead Forever show includes a moment of rotation that got me
| a bit queasy. It was kept to a minimum, but would have been
| nice if they avoided the camera motion.
| kkarakk wrote:
| They basically take you out of the sphere viewing area and put
| you in a room created for that purpose ie a blacked out
| soundproofed room with 2 chairs in it.
|
| source: my sis got overwhelmed by the sphere's antics and was
| escorted out to that room. it doesn't seem to be mentioned
| anywhere on their website.
|
| sis said it was a very jank experience overall but it did calm
| her down.
| austin-cheney wrote:
| Sooo much whining about the heat outside. God forbid he should
| have to walk outside knowing its a desert.
|
| Its the dry heat, so its really not that bad. The only thing that
| makes it bad is perception when rapidly changing from
| artificially cooled air conditioning. With this in mind I also
| found it perplexing he kept mentioning climate change, probably
| because he couldn't take the heat. If you get used to the climate
| you have substantially less need of environmental control factors
| like air conditioning, your appetite decreases to compensate for
| the heat, and instead your thirst for water (not sugary garbage)
| greatly increases. Those factors result in physiological changes
| that alters a person's perception to their natural environment,
| but whatever.
|
| I have lived in Kuwait for several years and its tied with Death
| Valley, California as the hottest place where people live at
| around 129.3F. (The actual hottest place on the surface of this
| planet is the Danakil Depression of Ethiopia.) Yes, I promise,
| you can get used to 110F degree weather and be just fine for
| hours so long as you continually hydrate and protect your eyes
| and skin from excess sun exposure.
| dahart wrote:
| Just last night my brother brought up the famous Bill Paxton
| quote from Aliens...
|
| "It's hot as hell in here."
|
| "Yeah, man, but it's a dry heat"
|
| https://youtu.be/MGSsu6pfOoY
| aabajian wrote:
| If you want a real surreal experience, I suggest visiting
| Carlsbad Caverns, or a similar enormous cave system. I suspect
| the awe the author felt was the same sensation as being in an
| enclosure larger than any building. Think about being in an
| aircraft hanger then multiple the size by ten. There simply
| aren't any human-built structures as large. The sky becomes rock
| and it's just _different_ than any place you 've ever been.
| sandworm101 wrote:
| Carlsbad is big, but there are bigger indoor spaces out there.
| Carlsbad's "big room" is 625 ft wide, and 255 ft high at its
| highest point. That is big, but things like stadiums get
| bigger. Carlsbad is long too (4km) but as a cave length isn't
| really perceptible. NASA's vehicle assembly building is 720 ft
| by 520 ft and 530 ft high, roughly the same but much higher
| than Carlsbad.
|
| Tropical Islands Resort is a tropical water park (Germany): 690
| feet wide and 351 feet high.
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tropical_Islands_Resort
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Tropical_Islands_Halbe_14...
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(page generated 2024-07-04 23:01 UTC)