[HN Gopher] Infinitone Microtonal Saxophone
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Infinitone Microtonal Saxophone
Author : brudgers
Score : 38 points
Date : 2024-06-23 05:26 UTC (2 days ago)
(HTM) web link (xerocraft.org)
(TXT) w3m dump (xerocraft.org)
| brudgers wrote:
| Composition for the Infinitone here,
| https://youtu.be/56fLizLEn6Y?si=o20KmVemkuHid2RX
| matheist wrote:
| Interesting, see also the glissotar (https://glissonic.com/) for
| a purely analog variation. That one is more analogous to a
| fretless guitar (if the linked sax is more analogous to a guitar
| with adjustable frets).
| jnichols35 wrote:
| Wild that they may have come to basically the same design as
| the Moe[0].
|
| It seems they reached out to Bart Hopkin when they were trying
| to patent it[1].
|
| [0] https://barthopkin.com/instrumentarium/moe/
|
| [1] https://barthopkin.com/more-moe/
| zengid wrote:
| I was running to the comments to post this too. The Ininitone
| is an impressive mechanical achievement, but I think the
| glissotar has much more potential to catch on.
| amadeuspagel wrote:
| I made a web app to play microtonal music with touchscreens:
| https://slidesynth.com/
| amelius wrote:
| Cool. One issue: not all wave shapes play at the same volume.
| amadeuspagel wrote:
| That's due to clipping. For a sine or a triangle, you'll hear
| clipping at a volume where a sawtooth or square still sounds
| fine.
| amelius wrote:
| OK, but imho for the interface it would be better if they
| all had the same subjective volume.
| amadeuspagel wrote:
| I've updated this, so that the gain is the same for all
| waveforms now (before it was half for sine and triangle).
|
| However, sawtooth and square are still louder because
| they're made of three osillators (spread based on touch
| surface).
|
| Another reason for the difference between waveforms is
| multitouch, this is also something that sounds different
| for different waveforms.
| zooch wrote:
| If you switch from sine to square or sawtooth the change in
| volume is jarring.
|
| Waveforms having the same amplitude doesn't mean the ear
| hears it at the same volume. There's more frequencies
| contained in different waveforms and the ear is more
| sensitive to certain ranges.
|
| A smoother representation of the waveforms might contain
| the first 5 - 10 frequencies of Fourier series but even
| then you need to compensate with a change in amplitude.
|
| It's not a DAW, it's a web app, and the users will
| appreciate the favor.
| brudgers wrote:
| Wilsonic is a microtonal tool by Ervin Wilson,
| https://wilsonic.co/
| zengid wrote:
| needs some mouse love too! very trippy!
| mauvehaus wrote:
| This seems like a lot of effort to go to to avoid buying a
| trombone.
|
| (Former HS trombone player. Go ahead with the jokes, I love them
| because I've lived them)
| pnathan wrote:
| As soon as I got a few lines in I was like,
|
| "So, a trombone... with extra steps"
|
| (Also if you want to slide, any fretless instrument is good! )
| bitbckt wrote:
| As a current semi-pro trombonist, I had the same reaction.
|
| Relevant aside: Alan Kaplan has been recording Jacob Collier
| transcriptions for his YouTube channel. Check out "Moon River".
| drewcoo wrote:
| Playing a trombone usually does not mean playing microtones in
| tune.
|
| Imagine a greater-than-twelve-tone chromatic scale.
|
| Or go listen to some Harry Partch. Partch's compositions sound
| to me more like gamelan than someone noodling on a trombone.
|
| https://www.harrypartch.com/bio
|
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lQGvmaH-ce0
| waffletower wrote:
| Partch is a good recommendation -- with a fairly large focus
| on microtonal percussion -- but you do dismiss the trained
| trombonists who actually train and perform microtonal works.
| It isn't necessary to disparage a viable microtonal
| instrument to make your point.
| waffletower wrote:
| The infinitone appears to be more like a dynamically scaled
| instrument, unlike the trombone, which is influenced by
| electronic instruments such as the Kaossilator and Cosmovox.
| amelius wrote:
| > There are twelve semitones in every octave and they make up
| just about all the music we hear in the West today.
|
| Is it just me, or is this strict division into semitones making
| e.g. piano music sound like it's slightly off-key at times?
| mauvehaus wrote:
| HN discussion of "The Saddest Thing I know about the Integers"
|
| https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8682782
|
| Original article is offline, it seems :-(
|
| EDIT: archive.org to the rescue!
|
| https://web.archive.org/web/20240123154411/https://blogs.sci...
| amelius wrote:
| Is there a video that demonstrates the difference?
| npsimons wrote:
| It's not short, but I was introduced to the concept in a
| video series on FLOSS Linux audio tools: https://www.youtub
| e.com/watch?v=hdPPPeq82hw&list=PLf_MTToSAx...
|
| Specifically, you can play with it yourself with a tool
| like ZynAddSubFX's (https://zynaddsubfx.sourceforge.io/)
| virtual keyboard, where you can enable microtonal under
| scale settings and tweak to whatever tuning you want (see
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hdPPPeq82hw&t=669s for
| where the video above starts showing this).
|
| A simpler and shorter video discussing the history of just
| intonation and equal temperament, with examples:
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bCYcS57eCqs
| jfengel wrote:
| Yep. There are many different ways to tune a piano, none of
| them perfect. A tuning that is just right for one key will
| leave real howlers in others. (Literally "howlers"; it's called
| a "wolf tone")
|
| https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interval_(music)
|
| Actual pianos are usually tuned in a way that sounds pretty
| good most of the time, without ever sounding perfect.
| singleshot_ wrote:
| "Well-tempered" (yes, like the clavier).
| IsTom wrote:
| Pianos are tuned differently, they use stretch tuning and will
| be pretty out of tune with other instruments at both lowest and
| highest notes (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piano_tuning#/medi
| a/File:Rails...)
| fernly wrote:
| You have a good ear, you are hearing the small errors inherent
| in "twelve-tone equal temperament"[1] which is a compromise
| between numerical ideals and practical instrument-making.
|
| [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/12_equal_temperament
| brudgers wrote:
| Equal temperament is used to allow playing in arbitrary keys
| without retuning...for example D and E flat are equally in
| (and out of tune) with equal temperament. With Pythagorean or
| Just tuning, instruments are tuned to a specific key (or set
| of related keys).
|
| Which is to say historically, equal temperament is mostly a
| result of compositional and performance concerns rather than
| manufacturing limitations.
| card_zero wrote:
| The word saxophone comes from the Middle English _sax,_ "knife",
| and the Ancient Greek _phonos,_ "murder".
| ogig wrote:
| The word comes from the surname of the inventor, Sax, and
| phono, sound.
|
| https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolphe_Sax
| contingencies wrote:
| Hrrm. Looking at the electronics apparently it's an array of
| servos mounted to a tapered rectangular prism base geometry sheet
| metal chassis held together through welding. Listening to the
| recording they seem to 'click' audibly when closing off holes. I
| wonder if it would be feasible to introduce a non-clicky approach
| and/or a non-servo approach, for example by integrating on-PCB
| linear actuation and some form of non-metallic seal contact. Non-
| servo would also have the benefit of greatly reducing instrument
| weight. On-PCB would also have the benefit of greatly reducing
| cost, assuming a working mechanism can be found with adequate
| torque. Happy to offer what assistance I can if there's a contact
| point.
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