[HN Gopher] A New Jersey couple survived the Alaskan wilderness ...
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A New Jersey couple survived the Alaskan wilderness on a homestead
Author : gds44
Score : 65 points
Date : 2024-05-20 18:38 UTC (4 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.bbc.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.bbc.com)
| John23832 wrote:
| They discuss eating bear, just a reminder for everyone that bear
| meat is a prime harbor for worms and parasites. On top of the
| fact that, like expressed in the article, it's frankly not good.
| downrightmike wrote:
| All the toxins in the food chain end up in the apex predators
| kibwen wrote:
| This is why you should be careful eating raw fish.
| bagels wrote:
| Cooking doesn't remove heavy metals, does it?
| jorts wrote:
| It does not.
| stcredzero wrote:
| _> All the toxins in the food chain end up in the apex
| predators_
|
| Is there an analogy for media and information?
| thsksbd wrote:
| It's basically the same process, mathematically.
|
| \rant
|
| Each level up increases the concentration of toxin because
| the n-th level is eating the (n-1) level which has a higher
| concentration than the (n-2) level that the (n-1) ate.
|
| Similarly, if we posit that _all else being equal_ [1] a
| sociopath is more likely to go up a hierarchical level,
| then the nth level is promoted from the n-1 level that is
| more sociopathic than the n-2.
|
| I also believe that presidential democracies are more prone
| to this concentration of sociopaths because voting the
| higher offices is more divorced from the voter (ie you dont
| know who you are voting for personally and are more easily
| mislead). Parliamentary (or congressional seats) democracy
| is more resistant to psychos. Monarchies are immune (except
| for genetic inheritance), but of course come with their own
| set of problems.
|
| \rant
|
| [1] a similar assumption is made for toxins.
| hentrep wrote:
| Your last sentence is subjective. I grew up eating bear sausage
| and it was delicious. Perhaps owing to differences in black
| bear diet/meat vs Alaskan bear. This article seems to
| corroborate my suspicions:
| https://www.outdoorlife.com/hunting/bear-meat/
| porkloin wrote:
| Trichinosis is incredibly common in Alaska's bear population.
| As with any kind of game meat, thoroughly cooking to
| recommended temps is highly encouraged. Plenty of people get
| away with eating undercooked meat for years, but you don't
| have control over the randomness of what an animal you hunt
| was exposed to. Trich is no joke and can seriously injure
| you.
|
| https://www.adfg.alaska.gov/index.cfm?adfg=disease.muscle2
|
| > All bear and lynx meat should be considered possibly
| infected.
| rolph wrote:
| yeah, game meat really should be well done, thin cuts that
| get to temperature all through.
|
| organ products, from game are kinda risky.
| doodlebugging wrote:
| Trichinosis can kill you too. I can't find the story link
| but I read years ago that one of the few German POWs to die
| in captivity in the US during WWII at Camp Hearne in Texas
| died from eating undercooked pork which also sickened a
| couple of other POWs and maybe one of more of the guards.
|
| With that said, pioneers and mountain men ate bear meat.
| They preferred bear paws due to the high fat content I
| think.
| rolph wrote:
| yes your right, the time of year, dictates diet, and general
| diet influences the meat.
| RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote:
| > I grew up eating bear sausage and it was delicious.
|
| Isn't sausage the goto thing when you want to take meat that
| would otherwise be nasty and turn it into something
| palatable?
|
| I don't think you statement contradicts the parent post about
| bear meat being not good
| a2tech wrote:
| Correct. That and chili. I grew up without a lot of money
| and have eaten every game animal in North America and I can
| tell you that there isn't any wild game that can beat the
| cheapest of ground beef for flavor or usefulness.
| petsfed wrote:
| I disagree, but your odds of having a bad time with game
| meat are much higher. I liken it to the early days of
| craft beer. If you wanted an acceptable beer that
| wouldn't wow you, but never surprise you, you could
| always drink budweiser. But if you felt like playing six-
| pack roulette, pick up your local microbrew. Could be
| awesome, could be terrible, you won't know until you've
| taken a drink.
|
| Domestic goose is better than wild goose, but grass-fed
| elk (that is, ranched elk) just tastes like beef.
| Likewise with grass-fed bison. Truly wild elk has that
| gaminess to it that I really appreciate. I've a recipe
| for venison burger casserole that is utterly flavorless
| when made with ground beef. Bear sausage is only good
| when its _heavily_ mixed with actual pork, and spiced to
| hell and back.
|
| Deer and pronghorn that graze on sagebrush actually taste
| sagey. If that's your jam, its fantastic.
| hiatus wrote:
| > I can tell you that there isn't any wild game that can
| beat the cheapest of ground beef for flavor or
| usefulness.
|
| Not even duck? That is a bit surprising.
| SheepSlapper wrote:
| As a hunter, I have to disagree. Properly harvested deer,
| elk, and bear are all amazing, and I'd take any of the
| three over the lowest common denominator ground beef.
| Actual cheap ground beef is garbage.
|
| I buy half a cow every year from local farmers, and I'd
| put my ground elk up against that ground beef any day
| (though I do have to add suet because elk is so lean). In
| fact, nobody that I serve elk to knows that it's elk
| until/unless I tell them.
|
| If your wild game tastes bad, you messed up somewhere
| along the line. Get it cold as soon as possible, keep it
| clean, and the meat will be great.
| s1artibartfast wrote:
| Sounds like you need a better cook. I love game meat and
| find most ground beef disgusting.
|
| The main advantage of commercially produced beef,
| chicken, and pork is that you can eat it rare & raw.
| John23832 wrote:
| > Your last sentence is subjective.
|
| Sure. I think that's stating the obvious though.
| rolph wrote:
| that smell, when your yard dog, is soaked from the rain, after
| rolling in fishwaste. thats sorta the smell of cooking bear
| meat, theres a lot of grease, and fat.
|
| ! Dont Cook it in Your House !
|
| it often ends up feeding sled dogs.
| alfalfasprout wrote:
| Black bear that feeds on mostly berries, etc. during spring is
| actually quite delicious.
| carabiner wrote:
| This is NSFL, but there are numerous pictures and videos of
| bears trailing tape worms from their anus.
| cgh wrote:
| Your first point is much less of a big deal than you think.
| Cook it thoroughly (easiest way is to simply grind up the meat
| first) and you're fine.
|
| I don't agree with your second point. It's pretty good,
| especially spring bear. That said, I avoid bears that eat a lot
| of spawning salmon in the fall.
|
| People have eaten bears for literally millennia, especially
| indigenous North Americans. It's not some recent thing that we
| are wrong to do. They are a natural prey animal in eg BC, where
| they live in high densities.
| John23832 wrote:
| > It's not some recent thing that we are wrong to do.
|
| Who said it was wrong? I said bears harbor parasites (they
| do), and that the meat is bad (which is my opinion, I guess).
| maxerickson wrote:
| A reminder for all the people that are going to accidentally
| eat some bear?
| kibwen wrote:
| _> In April 1964, Alaska was struck by a magnitude 9.2 megathrust
| earthquake that devastated much of Anchorage._
|
| This is a sidebar that I think is historically underappreciated.
|
| Take a look at this incredible graphic, which goes up to 2005:
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lists_of_earthquakes#/media/Fi...
|
| For the period from 1906 to 2005, half of all the energy released
| by all recorded earthquakes came from just _three_ events, one of
| which being the Alaskan quake.
|
| Logarithmic scales are scary.
| brianbreslin wrote:
| Indonesia having over 2000 earthquakes a year is wild!
| grecy wrote:
| That earthquake in Alaska cracked swimming pools in California!
| IncreasePosts wrote:
| Sounds like they _didn 't_ survive the Alaskan wilderness on a
| homestead, and instead survived in a city or in a provided
| structure while occasionally heading out into the wilderness and
| wasting their time producing nothing much of a value.
| fxtentacle wrote:
| Sounds like they divorced and then the father died in a car
| accident while trying to make life in the wilderness work. And
| the mother moved to the city and never came back, which helped
| her have a long life with her daughter, so probably that was
| the better decision.
| justusthane wrote:
| Sort of tragically ironic that he died in a car accident
| while trying to live outside of modern civilization.
| solardev wrote:
| Are there any successful tales of Alaskan homesteading? It
| seems like we fetishize those foolhardy lone wolves like this
| couple or Alex McCandless from Into the Wild, but where are all
| those people who moved out there and actually managed to live
| happy, simple lives?
|
| One of my favorite book series is Woodswoman, about a lady who
| set out into Vermont to build herself a lakeside cabin from
| scratch and made a living off maple farming. The several books
| detail her trials and tribulations, but also her joyful swims
| and happy encounters with the neighbors.
|
| I would love to hear about more encounters like that in Alaska,
| not just the people who trek out there but never make it.
| GlibMonkeyDeath wrote:
| Two examples I can think of off-hand:
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Proenneke
|
| and
|
| https://www.jeanaspen.com/about-us
| slackfan wrote:
| Plenty. But here's the rub, most that do do not want to be
| seen, heard, and care very little for the internet. The life
| also is not simple.
| octopoc wrote:
| Yeah a friend of mine married a lady who grew up in the
| Alaskan wilderness. The family was desperately poor yet
| still had an airplane, interestingly. They were the kind of
| people who don't use the internet at all.
| tula wrote:
| Dick Proenneke is one of the more well-known ones. He built
| his cabin all on his own, filming the whole process, as well
| as his life there. He lived in his cabin for thirty years.
|
| https://www.nps.gov/lacl/learn/historyculture/proennekes-
| cab...
| s1artibartfast wrote:
| Im honestly curious where this hostility is coming from?
|
| Ideas of value are obviously subjective.
| ramesh31 wrote:
| There's an obsession with the old ways. As if they were
| better. As if sitting in a cabin in the woods and breaking
| your back every day to not die of starvation is some kind of
| accomplishment. It's not.
| s1artibartfast wrote:
| I think it obviously is a difficult accomplishment. I agree
| that some people probably romanticize the "old ways" and
| more radical forms of self-reliance, but ultimately it is
| question of taste and interest.
|
| I have enough experience with it to know it is far harder
| than most people imagine, but still think there is a lot
| that I think is positive about it.
| fifilura wrote:
| Is running a marathon an accomplishment?
| IncreasePosts wrote:
| I would call it more of an honest statement about what
| happened there, as opposed to an overly positive one.
|
| Having said that, I do have a long-standing issue with the
| relatively small group of people who try to go their own way
| from society without a modicum of understanding about what
| kind of work and skills will be required. As well as an issue
| with the larger group of people who cheer on these folks and
| either enable this behavior or become subject to this
| behavior themselves.
|
| Where do my feelings on the subject come from? Well, "into
| the wild" was required reading my freshman year of college.
| And I was forced to engage in dozens of discussions treating
| McCandless as a tragic hero, instead of an idiot.
|
| My issue isn't necessarily with people wanting to get away
| from mainstream society, but it is going about it in an
| absolutely boneheaded manner. I have an immense amount of
| respect for people like dick proenekke
| s1artibartfast wrote:
| That makes sense, and I share your sentiment about the
| naiveite and idiocy for some of these people. that is to
| say, I think the dream of self-reliance is a noble one, but
| simply holding a noble ideal doesnt make someone
| praiseworthy. Execution speaks volume.
|
| I think what I was most reacting to was your statement
| "wasting their time producing nothing much of a value". I
| took this to mean value to the greater community, and I
| strongly disagree that this should be the main benchmark
| which people should be judged against. It strikes me as
| oddly entitled to their labor.
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