[HN Gopher] Selling 'Ghost in the Shell'
___________________________________________________________________
Selling 'Ghost in the Shell'
Author : zdw
Score : 198 points
Date : 2024-05-06 14:48 UTC (5 days ago)
(HTM) web link (animationobsessive.substack.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (animationobsessive.substack.com)
| XorNot wrote:
| Ghost In The Shell suffers from really dragging in the middle.
|
| There's a bunch a bunch of sequences which go on just way too
| long for the total amount of plot in the film, and there's a lot
| of missing context for the main character's motivation: we just
| kind of get a couple big exposition dumps, but no real feel for
| who the Major is or why the core conceit of the plot matters to
| her.
|
| The Stand Alone Complex series, conversely, is amazing.
| cjk2 wrote:
| Glad to hear that. I am about to get on the SAC wagon.
| Malcolmlisk wrote:
| I remember enjoying the episodes who were outside of the
| central plot from SAC and SAC2. That episode when they explain
| the past of the sniper character and how he got recruited by
| the major was amazing and I watched it over and over.
| BLKNSLVR wrote:
| It would make a great stand alone movie.
| pjc50 wrote:
| Now this is a matter of taste, but I _love_ the slow moments
| where the film just pans over city scenes with no dialogue.
| Just a little time to breathe and look at the art in the middle
| of the action. It 's a film that posits a bunch of questions
| about human vs machine and then declines to answer them in
| favor of letting you think about them.
| wccrawford wrote:
| I don't agree with you, but it's really sad that you're getting
| downvoted for having an opinion and explaining it. I'd
| understand it on Reddit, but this is HN, and it's supposed to
| be better here.
| bullfightonmars wrote:
| I didn't get SAC back when it was on Adult Swim. Seeing it
| randomly and out of order it seemed stale, slow, and too dense.
| But watched in sequence it is a fantastic bit of scifi.
| nanna wrote:
| I feel like I haven't seen an anime in years that's been in the
| same league as Akira or the great Miyazakis (Spirited Away,
| Princess Mononoke, Totoro). Yes i'd be brutal and include
| Miyazakis following works in that list, from Howls Moving Castle
| to The Boy and the Heron. Ive seen lots of incredible animation,
| sure, but nothing like the cinematic depth.
|
| What am I missing? What should an old fart who's becoming
| convinced things were better in the old days put myself infront
| of?
| cjk2 wrote:
| There is good stuff out there. I watched Pantheon and
| Scavengers Reign recently, both excellent, but not old stable
| anime.
|
| Scavengers Reign: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NWQH8cMpWTU
|
| Pantheon: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_HJ3TSlo5c
| duggan wrote:
| I'm slowly working my way through Scavengers Reign, it's
| absolutely brilliant -- somewhere between Alien and Stanislaw
| Lem's The Invincible.
| chpatrick wrote:
| It reminded me of Lem's Eden as well.
| The5thElephant wrote:
| Not enough people know about Pantheon.
|
| However both Scavenger's Reign and Pantheon feel distinctly
| different from Japanese anime. They have a much more Western
| aesthetic eye visually, narratively, and especially in terms
| of music I feel.
| rapnie wrote:
| Dammit, they are in other livestream imperiums than where I
| dwell :(
| cjk2 wrote:
| There are other ways!
| urza wrote:
| Pantheon is amazing. Especially the ending.
| giuseppe_petri wrote:
| I've not seen Pantheon, but from the trailer it seems very
| close to Neal Stephenson's "Fall, or Dodge in Hell".
| austin-cheney wrote:
| My favorite is Patlabor 2.
|
| Here is the Japanese cultural explainer (spoiler):
| https://youtu.be/ybLKmO5Kq5A?si=bzIEK436EeWF_o5s
| flobosg wrote:
| I haven't watched it yet, but reading this article a while
| ago got me interested:
|
| _' Patlabor 2: The Movie' has stunningly realistic aerial
| combat_ - https://taskandpurpose.com/culture/realistic-
| aerial-combat-m...
| pjc50 wrote:
| I didn't understand why people kept recommending this until I
| spotted that the director is Mamoru Oshii, director of GitS.
| It's perfectly reasonable as a standalone film without having
| seen 1. And it's good in the same ways as GitS; mix of
| action, political thriller, and lingering artistic set piece.
| yrro wrote:
| You'll probably enjoy Jin-Roh: The Wolf Brigade as well.
| gbuk2013 wrote:
| This is heavily biased by my preferred genre of anime but here
| are some my favourite more recent anime series off the top of
| my head:
|
| Full metal Alchemist: Brotherhood
| https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fullmetal_Alchemist:_Brother...
|
| Attack on Titan https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attack_on_Titan
|
| Mushishi https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mushishi
|
| Frieren: Beyond Journey's End
| https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frieren
| Tor3 wrote:
| Strangely (maybe), but Attack on Titan I can't stand, and I
| didn't care much for any of the Full metal Alchemist ones,
| but Frieren is one of the absolutely best shows I've ever
| watched.
| justinclift wrote:
| > Attack on Titan
|
| Ugh. Such an incredibly padded, dragged out story. :( :( :(
|
| Maybe the first season was decent, but after the 3rd season
| it was mostly just boring to the point where skipping
| episodes didn't miss anything.
|
| Never bothered to watch anything after about the 3rd season.
| It became far too tedious.
|
| ---
|
| Yeah, Frieren was good. It closely matches the manga version
| of the story, though the manga goes on quite lot further
| story wise.
|
| Should be plenty more seasons of material ready for
| adaptation there. :)
| gbuk2013 wrote:
| Still working my way through season 3 so may change my
| mind. :) Any recommendations?
| justinclift wrote:
| Yeah, I wrote a whole list a few comments up (or down).
| You can't miss it. :)
|
| As a quick thought, have you seen Cyberpunk Edgerunners,
| and Made in Abyss?
|
| For stupid fun (mood dependent), then probably One-Punch
| Man:
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One-Punch_Man
|
| It's super famous these days, so you've probably already
| seen it. ;)
|
| Personally, I also really liked "Hai to Gensou no
| Grimgar" due to its focus on character growth rather than
| action:
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grimgar_of_Fantasy_and_Ash
|
| But, not everyone's a fan.
| gbuk2013 wrote:
| Cyberpunk Edgerunners was good, Made in Abyss was too but
| I have to say it got borderline too depressing for me by
| the end of the last season.
|
| OPM I really can't stand - dropped it just after a few
| episodes. :)
|
| Hai to Gensou no Grimgar had a lot of promise with a
| different take on the common theme, but pity it looks
| like it will not be continued. :(
| justinclift wrote:
| Yeah, that's a fair point. I haven't yet watched the 3rd
| season of Made in Abyss. Have been hesitant to do so due
| to its reputation. ;)
|
| ---
|
| Hai to Gensou no Grimgar has both manga, and light
| novels, that stretch on for many more chapters past the
| anime. The Manga was good and continues on well from the
| anime. After reaching the end of that I picked up the
| light novels to continue on further.
|
| Unfortunately (around novel 13 I think?) the author
| clearly didn't know what to do with the story and it
| turned silly and boring, so I moved on to other stuff. :(
| gbuk2013 wrote:
| Somehow I never got into reading manga, probably a good
| thing too - I checked my MAL stats and I says I have
| watched 330+ shows and I know I have been lazy and not
| rating all of them ...
| justinclift wrote:
| Heh Heh Heh
|
| Since you're not into Manga, this url probably won't be
| of interest then: ;)
|
| https://mangakatana.com/manga/kaiju-no-8.24869/c1
|
| * If you visit it, make sure you have an ad blocker. Too
| many ads otherwise.
|
| * Japanese manga is read from right to left, the opposite
| of western comics. Just saying. :)
| blarg1 wrote:
| I read 9 or so of the grimgar books, the story became
| really stupid until I had to give up. The anime ended at
| the right time.
| robertlagrant wrote:
| The plot suddenly shoots forward in the 3rd season, from
| memory. The season where they start explaining everything.
| tiniuclx wrote:
| Frieren is a modern classic, with some of the best animation
| I've ever seen & deals with the themes of companionship and
| regret in a surprisingly mature way. It would be my
| recommendation for sure!
| Arisaka1 wrote:
| Frieren is amazing. I went in without knowing anything
| about it, and I ended up loving it enough to recommend it
| to my parents (they also loved it).
| ngc248 wrote:
| Mushishi is so atmospheric and just amazing
|
| Also for some madcap anime FLCL ... that is quintessential
| anime for me.
| justinclift wrote:
| That's definitely a "depends on your taste" thing. :)
|
| [The below are mostly series rather than movies]
|
| For something that's really interesting, and also family
| friendly, Den-noh Coil is really good:
|
| * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Den-noh_Coil
|
| ---
|
| A similar "feel" kind of thing (family friendly) to the above
| is The Orbital Children:
|
| * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Orbital_Children
|
| ---
|
| For stand out story, probably Made in Abyss:
|
| * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Made_in_Abyss
|
| Due to the animation style, it looks like a kid/teen focused
| show at first. Don't be fooled, it's _really_ not.
|
| It has some incredibly complex (dark) themes. DON'T let young
| people watch that one (emotional trauma likely!).
|
| ---
|
| If something "a bit different" is on the cards, then Cyberpunk
| Edgerunners is extremely good (I reckon):
|
| * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyberpunk:_Edgerunners
|
| That's more of a Eastern+Western collaboration styling wise
| rather than pure Japanese anime. It's still a really good watch
| though. :)
|
| ---
|
| Another western style one that's really good is Scavengers
| Reign:
|
| * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scavengers_Reign
|
| ---
|
| Movies wise, probably Redline (2009) and Belle are the first to
| mind for me:
|
| * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redline_(2009_film)
|
| Very unique animation style, not everyone's cup of tea. ;)
|
| * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belle_(2021_film)
|
| Also family friendly. :)
| Filligree wrote:
| Orbital Children is a literal sequel to Dennou Coil. But I'm
| sure you're aware of this. :)
| justinclift wrote:
| Ahhh cool. Didn't actually remember that, though I had a
| faint feeling they were related. :)
| wodenokoto wrote:
| It's hard to understand if you are including Boy and Heron or
| not. If you are, then obviously there are recent master pieces.
|
| But I'd say you are in for a treat: Satoshi Kon.
|
| Perfect Blue, Paprika, Tokyo Godfather are all cinematic master
| pieces!
|
| I also mostly agree with the hype that surrounded "Your Name",
| although I don't think Makoto's other works are nearly as
| impressive.
| lhl wrote:
| Your Name (2016, Makoto Shinkai) and Ping Pong the Animation
| (2014, Masaaki Yuasa) are both IMO top notch (and the creators
| are active and have extensive oeuvres). The Shape of Voice
| (2016, Kyoto Animation (RIP)) was also much acclaimed. Of
| these, I recommend Ping Pong the most (and Yuasa's other works
| as well).
|
| I suppose for more sci-fi/fantasy, Rebuild of Evangelion
| (2007-2021) might be interesting, although to me, its
| popularity in Japan and why the retelling was made is actually
| more interesting to me than the works themselves. It didn't win
| any particular awards or acclaim, but I was a fan of the
| incredibly stylish manga series, and I personally enjoyed the
| Blame! (2017, Hiroyuki Shesita) CGI anime film for those into
| the Japanese post-cyber-apocalypse sci-fi aesthetic.
|
| I think these days, the economics of anime has driven more
| interesting work into series rather than features. Recently
| some memorable ones I've enjoyed are Steins;Gate (2011-2015,
| White Fox), Devilman: Crybaby (2018, Studio SARU), Cyberpunk:
| Edgerunners (2022, Trigger), Pluto (2023, M2), and Frieren
| (2023, Madhouse).
| mauvia wrote:
| Have you tried any of Satoshi Kon's movies?
|
| Tokyo Godfathers is an amazing and deeply human christmas
| comedy about homeless people in the Tokyo streets, filled with
| magical moments of cinematography.
|
| Paprika is a less lighthearted story about inner lives, dreams
| and ambitions set across a sci fi backdrop where people are
| learning to enter each other's dreams and link them together.
| It has gorgeous dreamscapes and an amazing soundtrack as well
| as a fascinating plot and interesting characters.
|
| Thre's also Makoto Shinkai's movies, which have good
| cinematography and interesting themes and soundtrack, as well
| as somewhat interesting characters (though a bit samey). Your
| Name is excellent, with Weathering with You and Suzume being
| good but not great. 5 Centimeters per second is nice as well.
| Children who chase lost voices underground is his most Ghibli
| movie and I'd say it definitely gets the tone and aesthetics
| right for the Nausica/Mononoke era of Ghibli.
|
| On the Ghibli side, I quite enjoyed Studio Ponoc's Modest
| Heroes, which was a collection of shorts by Studio Ponoc (which
| has some Ghibli Veterans in it as well as younger talent I
| believe). Kanini and Kanino has the adventure elements and
| aesthetics, Life ain't gonna lose has the small child PoV
| element, Invisible has the social elements.
| spacechild1 wrote:
| I was just about to recommend Satoshi Kon! Unfortunately, he
| only directed four movies before he died of cancer at the age
| of 47. What a tragic loss!
|
| I also enjoyed "Your Name".
| ekianjo wrote:
| Your Name makes no sense at all in hindsight after the
| first watch but it was amusing.
| spacechild1 wrote:
| I guess I need to rewatch it :-D
| livueta wrote:
| On Kon, Paranoia Agent is also excellent. And if we're taking
| 2000s shows into account, I also have to mention Kuuchuu
| Buranko in that category of Paranoia Agent-reminiscent
| sociologically interesting shows.
| Gigablah wrote:
| Satoshi Kon's Millennium Actress is one of the best movies I
| have ever seen.
| nicolas_t wrote:
| Yes, it's one of those movies that marked movie. The music
| is also very interesting, distinctively different from most
| anime movies.
| DavidPiper wrote:
| Seconding: Paprika was amazing (and hard to avoid comparing
| to Inception, which came out a few years later). Millenium
| Actress and Perfect Blue are burning a hole in my bookshelf -
| still haven't got to them.
|
| Also seconding Your Name - hits the whole emotional spectrum,
| even on second and third watch when you know what's
| happening.
|
| As lesser-known recommendations from Ghibli, I think Porco
| Rosso and From Up On Poppy Hill are both underrated-and-good
| in their own way, though they don't quite leave the impact
| that some of the others do.
| windowshopping wrote:
| "A Silent Voice" is the best anime film of the 2010s in my
| opinion and comes closer to matching Miyazaki than anything
| else I've seen, in terms of the power of storytelling. Miyazaki
| is still better, but it's extremely good.
|
| I also enjoyed "Wolf Children" a lot. As others have said,
| "Your Name" is stellar too, and "5cm/sec" is pretty damn
| excellent.
| 0xDEADFED5 wrote:
| Texhnolyze
| Madmallard wrote:
| Cowboy Bebop: The Movie
|
| Your Name
|
| Violet Evergarden
|
| Perfect Blue
|
| Paprika
|
| Metropolis
|
| There's a bunch of great animated movies.
|
| If you're referring to series then among the best Seinen
| classics are shows like:
|
| Berzerk (1997)
|
| Monster (2004) [My personal favorite]
|
| Cowboy Bebop
|
| Steins:Gate
|
| Vinland Saga (newer)
|
| Frieren (newer)
|
| There's a lot of Shounen classics as well, my favorite probably
| being
|
| Full Metal Alchemist: Brotherhood
|
| granted there's several tropes in it that aren't going to be as
| enjoyable to watch on repeat for older folks. But the
| storytelling and plot is practically like Breaking Bad but in
| anime form.
| bostik wrote:
| Paprika is good, but I wouldn't elevate it to greatness.
| Whereas, for me, _Perfect Blue_ makes the cut. The odd thing
| is, they both essentially explore aspects of the same theme:
| subjective reality and what happens when those of different
| individuals ' collide. But they do that in very different
| ways...
|
| And thank you for bringing up Metropolis, that film tends to
| be underrated.
| boppo1 wrote:
| EVA should not be missed, regardless of how weird and gross
| it can be for some. I watched it for the first time a year
| ago after hearing so much about it.
|
| The first five or six episodes are an awful slog, and then
| there's an exponential curve up through 'quite good' into
| 'great' then 'I understand why this will print money
| forever'.
|
| If you're sold but confused how to watch: start with the
| original release and then watch End of Evangelion; both on
| netflix.
| YurgenJurgensen wrote:
| All these people giving recs are doing it wrong. You can
| determine if an anime is worth your time by merely looking at
| the title and what the source material is and the following
| simple system:
|
| Candidates start with 5 points. If they have a positive score
| after applying the system, they're at least worth checking out
| (although they will not necessarily be good). If not, you are
| likely wasting your time.
|
| 1) Every word in the title past the third is worth -1 point.
| This includes particles and abbreviations.
|
| 2) Each word in the subtitle is worth -0.5 points.
|
| 3) Any of the following words or close synonyms are worth -2
| points on top of any other penalties: Academy, Ability, Cheat,
| Dungeon, Elf, Game, Goblin, Harem, Hero, Idol, Isekai, Level,
| Loop, Maou, MMO, Mob, Online, Overlord, Party, Player, Re(used
| as a prefix), Reincarnation, "The Animation"(verbatim only),
| Vampire, Villainess, Virtual, VR, VTuber, Wizard
|
| 4) Subtract an additional point for every word that implies
| this is a remake, spinoff, adaptation or sequel, such as "Kai",
| "Gaiden", "2nd" (3rd, etc.), "New", et cetera.
|
| 5) Even though you already subtracted a point for "Isekai" in
| step 3. If the title contains the word "Isekai", subtract an
| additional 5 points.
|
| 6) Apply the following adjustment based on the source material:
| History: +3 (Applying only to direct adaptations of historical
| events, not merely using historical theming) Literary Fiction:
| +2 Original Work: +1 Other: +1 OVA: +0.5 Live Action: +0 Web
| Animation/Motion Comic/Music Video: +0 Comic: +0 Video Game: -1
| Light Novel: -1 Writeup of someone's D&D session: -1 CCG: -2
| Web Novel: -5 Mobile Game: -10 "Multimedia Project" (This is
| just a mobile game that doesn't exist yet): -10 Social Media
| Post: -100
| ojhughes wrote:
| I really enjoyed "Re:ZERO - Starting Life in Another World"
| despite it scoring -11.5 using your system (Isekai translates
| to another world)
| YurgenJurgensen wrote:
| If you hadn't seen Now and Then, Here and There, or Twelve
| Kingdoms, or read Red River, then maybe it'd seem fresh and
| interesting, but I dropped Re:Zero pretty early. Good genre
| fiction still has something to say about the real world,
| and Re:Zero felt like it was trying so hard to subvert
| genre expectations set by other fiction that it forgot
| that.
| nicolas_t wrote:
| Ok, as someone who both loved Now and Then, Here and
| There and Twelve Kingdoms, I want some recommendations
| from you :) Those two series were really great.
|
| But I do agree with you, they were great because they
| actually had something to say about the real world.
| YurgenJurgensen wrote:
| There's not a lot else like them in anime, so none of the
| shows I'm about to list are good for the same reasons
| that those two were good.
|
| Shinsekai Yori was great, and a rare case of high-effort
| worldbuilding that actually delivers on its premise.
| Highly spoilable.
|
| If Akiba Maid Sensou is not my anime-of-the-decade for
| this decade, I will be very surprised, but it assumes you
| understand both yakuza culture and maid cafe culture and
| I'm not sure what someone who doesn't would get out of
| it.
|
| Hana to Alice, Satsujin Jiken might not even be anime,
| since it relies extremely heavily on 1:1 rotoscoping, but
| it is short and doesn't really look like anything else.
|
| Gankutsuou also gets a ton of points for being visually
| distinctive, and (at least at the time of release, maybe
| that's not true anymore) being the most faithful
| adaptation of Dumas' original to video despite casting a
| blue-skinned space vampire as the Count.
|
| Princess Tutu is a fantastic use of popular ballet as a
| framing device that was doing the whole 'meta-narrative'
| thing long before it was cool.
|
| Mononoke (not the Ghibli film Mononoke-hime) is a good-
| looking take on the classic supernatural detective genre.
|
| Id:Invaded is also a supernatural detective story, which
| manages to be entertainingly audacious without ever
| really feeling like it was just going for cheap shock
| value.
| glandium wrote:
| > I'm not sure what someone who doesn't would get out of
| it.
|
| They would get the final scene of the first episode.
| bullfightonmars wrote:
| Ha. Stuff like this is entertaining but it is not what I
| would call good. It's like the reality tv of anime. Cheap
| wish fulfillment fan service.
|
| There have been some legit good series recently that play
| with these fantasy genres, have solid writing and
| animation.
|
| * Friern: Beyond Journey's End - an extremely sentimental
| coming of age tale that explorers children raising parents,
| loyalty, and platonic love.
|
| * Delicious in Dungeon - a really silly story that subverts
| the dungeon crawling genre by crossing over with the
| food/cooking genre and playing with all kinds of
| genre/tropes.
|
| * Pluto - a classic scifi morality tale on what it means to
| be human. This series tried really hard to be a modern
| Ghost in the Shell. It was successful in some ways and fell
| flat in others. Definitely worth watching though.
|
| There are lots of entertaining anime out now, but so little
| of it is well made or written. Maybe that's ok though. I
| still watch lots of the low quality stuff because it's like
| popcorn/candy and is easy to watch.
| scns wrote:
| > fan service
|
| I really enjoyed Shokugeki No Soma, got a Crunchroll
| account to keep watching it.
| jwells89 wrote:
| I'll echo the titles you recommended, but given what the
| MC goes through in Re:Zero I'm not sure that it falls
| into the bucket of wish fulfillment nearly as much as
| most shows of its genre do. I can't think of many people
| who'd want to be the MC.
| msp26 wrote:
| Petty much yeah. Agreed on historical anime/manga generally
| being higher quality by default. The research required tends
| to filter hack authors.
|
| Have you read Magus of the Library?
| YurgenJurgensen wrote:
| I have not. I have a completely different set of criteria
| for choosing manga because their production process is so
| different than for anime. I have a tendency to only buy
| physical copies, so if something never catches my eye in a
| book shop, or never makes it into a book shop, I will
| probably never even know it exists if it's not by an author
| I already know.
| sterlind wrote:
| I'm amused that Hetalia: Axis Powers gets the highest
| possible score.
| YurgenJurgensen wrote:
| Only the first season. (And appropriately, I didn't think
| later seasons were as good when the novelty wore off.)
| npinsker wrote:
| Actually an amazing heuristic, double-jeopardy-ing isekais
| gives me confidence in your taste. Would love to hear some
| recs of yours if you have any.
| card_zero wrote:
| So basically you're steering us away from all the series
| based on mangas based in turn on "light novels" based on fans
| writing on the website Shosetsuka ni Naro, "Let's Become a
| Novelist":
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sh%C5%8Dsetsuka_ni_Nar%C5%8D
|
| Which invariably feature the reincarnation of ordinary people
| in an RPG fantasy world, that is, the genre "isekai":
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isekai
|
| Fair enough, I guess, they're silly and unabashedly cliched
| and are not Miyazaki. But I watched a few and kind of liked
| them: _How a Realist Hero Rebuilt the Kingdom, I 'm in Love
| with the Villainess, My Next Life as a Villainess: All Routes
| Lead to Doom!, Parallel World Pharmacy._ (That's four
| different titles, to be clear.)
|
| I could comfortably watch another right now, I'm tempted by
| _Reborn as a Vending Machine, I Now Wander the Dungeon._ But
| I would not like to watch GITS, which exists in my mind as a
| vague painful memory of a self-important plot about cyborgs
| and a lot of characters jumping around on rooftops and
| shooting at each other. It 's a "neo-noir cyberpunk action
| thriller", as Wikipedia puts it, or in my terms "not any
| fun". But I guess it was seminal and genuinely important at
| the time.
| internet101010 wrote:
| The vending machine show is actually decent once you get to
| like episode 3.
| cess11 wrote:
| OK, so what would Chainsaw Man get?
| bmacho wrote:
| That's a long elaboration of an old joke.
|
| More seriously, no, you can't "determine if an anime is worth
| your time by merely looking at the title and what the source
| material is". Especially if you don't have anything to watch,
| and all the false positives (plenty!) have infinite negative
| value.
| edgarvaldes wrote:
| I'm not into anime, but I would like to see some recent
| series. But! I want an anime with adult MC, no power levels,
| no schools, not about magic, no mechas, no overtly sexual
| (inuendos, jokes). No exaggerated facial gestures. Something
| like the overall tone of Legend of the Galactic Heroes but
| more recent.
| justinclift wrote:
| From the other angle, what's the absolute crappiest anime
| you've seen and would steer everyone away from?
|
| The stand out crappiest anime I'm aware of is the "Blade
| Runner: Black Lotus" series:
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blade_Runner:_Black_Lotus
|
| Truly terrible in every aspect. Story, animation, dialog, etc.
| Outstandingly bad. :(
| ogurechny wrote:
| > What am I missing?
|
| Everything that is not in "Studio Ghibli" wide angle fairy tale
| style? A number of external films have imitated it, some of
| them better than the other.
|
| As a side note, "Studio Ghibli" is also not at all equal to
| "Hayao Miyazaki".
|
| Say, "Madoka Magica" is certainly large scale, but in totally
| different style. "Denno Coil" and "Eizouken" has that sense of
| adventure you can't really describe. And "Drifting Home" is
| magical, nostalgic, and colourful in its own manner.
|
| I you need some "respected opinion", here's a list:
|
| https://www.bfi.org.uk/sight-and-sound/lists/50-key-anime-fi...
|
| It's... okay. Everyone -- for a certain definition of attentive
| viewers -- knows most of those.
|
| It is not wise to limit yourself to movies. As mentioned,
| animated movie is a big investment that can flop at once, while
| series can be steered somehow in a different
| production/financing direction, or can become a good
| merchandise source. Therefore, a lot of movies are more or less
| straightforward derivatives of existing hit works which rely on
| the fan crowd. Those make money for more experimental original
| works.
| bpiche wrote:
| Browse some ranked lists (series and OVAs) over at
| MyAnimeList.net. Tons of good stuff out there. Though, things
| were better in the old days. No arguing that.
| livueta wrote:
| If we're specifically talking stuff from the last few years,
| and if shows count, I gotta put in a word for ODDTAXI. Feels
| like a mashup of the best parts of Yuasa Masaaki and Kon
| Satoshi works.
| blarg1 wrote:
| The Sky Crawlers,
| hwbunny wrote:
| Watch Redline, Demon City Shinjuku, Ergo Proxy, Psycho Pass,
| GITS series (not the netflix animated crap), Berserk, Ninja
| Scroll, Jormungandr, Black Lagoon.
| BLKNSLVR wrote:
| I watched Redline recently. The animation is worth seeing but
| the "story" is paper-thin.
|
| Ergo Proxy I just didn't get.
|
| Psycho Pass I really enjoyed; good depth of story and
| exploration of the pros and cons.
|
| GitS series is probably my favourite anime, and very high up
| in my favourite anything.
|
| Berserk is good, and descends into Evangelion-level insanity
| as it progresses.
|
| Ninja Scroll is forever a classic. Worth a re-watch every
| 5-10 years. I'm due.
| hwbunny wrote:
| Redline animation is WORTH SEEING? :DDDD Man, that's the
| absolute top ever created.
|
| People really are ungrateful and deserve the borderline
| idiotic Attack of the Titans rather than these classics.
| autarch wrote:
| I highly recommend "Keep Your Hands Off Eizouken!" It's an
| anime that's a love letter to anime about making anime where
| the anime-making becomes part of the anime. It's quite a trip,
| and it's got great energy and love for the medium.
| boppo1 wrote:
| Patlabor 2
| FL33TW00D wrote:
| Shinsekai yori
| tauwauwau wrote:
| Here's a list of some old and new ones, that an old fart might
| enjoy
|
| Monster (Chasing a serial killer)
|
| Ergo Proxy (Can't describe it)
|
| Samurai 7 (Sci-fi variant off 7 samurai)
|
| Last Exile (Post appocapltic world with lots of flying
| machines)
|
| Kino's Journey
|
| Mushishi
|
| Time of Eve
|
| Gargantia
|
| Baccano
|
| Durarara
|
| Psycho Pass
|
| Arslan Senki
|
| Sunaboju (Desert Punk)
|
| Witch Hunter Robin
|
| Hunter x Hunter (old not new)
|
| Texnolyze
|
| Darker than Black
|
| Black Lagoon
|
| Great Teach Onizuka (One of the old and best)
|
| Gintama (Comedy, It's at the level One Piece and Naruto
| disgusing as Comedy, you have to get past 30 episodes)
|
| Kabaneri of Iron Fortress (Just for animation quality)
|
| Beck (Music career)
|
| Golden Kamui
|
| Terror in Resonance
|
| Ping Pong Animation (Don't let the animation fool you, it's one
| of the best stories)
|
| Area 88 (Story ends abruptly, watch at your own risk)
|
| Ashita no Joe (Old anime, boxing genre)
|
| Valkyria Chronicles (War story)
|
| Scissor Seven (Comedy, Chinese, assassin, in a strange world)
|
| Shura no Toki (Martial arts, 3 generations)
|
| A Record of Mortal's Journey to Immortality (Chinese
| cultivation genre, 3D good animation, faithful adaptation of
| one of the good novels in this genre)
|
| Swallowed Star (Chinese cultivation genre Sci-fi variant, great
| 3D animation)
| nurettin wrote:
| Is there any reason FOTN isn't in there?
| latentsea wrote:
| Started watching GTO and so far 3 episodes in it's about him
| lusting after 16 year olds?
| metalspoon wrote:
| Patema Inverted is in the league there, graphics wise. It's
| crazy how nobody had ever tried the idea of the character pov
| of falling towards the sky. The immersive feeling is real and
| genius.
| mitthrowaway2 wrote:
| I strongly recommend _Wolf Children_. It 's on par with
| Miyazaki's best. A really moving and heartwarming film.
|
| On the flipside of the spectrum, _Grave of the Fireflies_ and
| _In This Corner of the World_ are excellent but tragic WW2
| films told from the Japanese civilian perspective. _Grave of
| the Fireflies_ in particular is a difficult watch, but worth
| seeing once.
| djaouen wrote:
| Ahh, anime's heyday. I remember borrowing Samurai Champloo on VHS
| from my friend around that time when I was in high school... good
| times!
| duggan wrote:
| Champloo came out in 2004, wasn't VHS a distant memory by then,
| or was I just "living in the future"? :)
|
| Sure you're not thinking of Cowboy Bebop?
| djaouen wrote:
| It might have been. Even then, I remember thinking that it
| was odd that it came on VHS. Thanks for the trip down memory
| lane!
| pjc50 wrote:
| Could well have been a "fansub" circulating on copied VHS.
| justsomehnguy wrote:
| [not the OP]
|
| I find it quite amusing what many people (including myself
| sometimes) have a pretty blurry memory about when we moved
| from VHS.
|
| But I think it mostly contributes on what for some people VHS
| were a dominant media for quite a while, because they didn't
| had the means to see the digital media.
|
| It's easier to understand what the first [commercially]
| successful DVD player was PlayStation 2, which became
| available ~2001. Before that DVDs were quite a costly[0]
| endeavour.
|
| But at the same time people with the access to a computer
| (and a local 'everything for $15' totally-legit-shop) had the
| benefits of DivX ;) releases on a plain CD-ROMs, which every
| home computer had.
|
| Some anecdata: I first seen Blade (1998) on VHS, but The
| Matrix (1999) on DivX rip, yet (I think) Spirited Away (2001)
| on VHS. I frequented a local VHS rental (because a friend
| worked there and so it places it up to 2002? 2001?) so I had
| seen a lot of films on VHS, but again, by 2002 it was a meme
| how people searching for _XXX_ on DC++ got XXX (2002)
| instead.
|
| [0] https://www.hometheaterforum.com/community/threads/your-1
| st-...
| duggan wrote:
| This is fascinating, and yeah, since I was a teenager
| around then, VHS probably just became ancient history as
| soon as I could play DVDs.
| runamuck wrote:
| Disney released "Cars" on VHS in 2006. (The last big studio
| VHS release)
| christiaanb wrote:
| Perhaps the only anime where the voice actor for one of the
| Dutch characters actually speaks proper Dutch (as opposed to
| e.g. German or very broken Dutch). Although they picked a weird
| translation for the concept of boss/chief/ranking officer, and
| they chose "opperhoofd"; which as a Dutch person is something
| you associate as a person that is the head of a tribe, not
| ranking officer.
| Murskautuminen wrote:
| Actually, the term opperhoofd was used by chief ranking
| officers of the Dutch trading companies in Japan.
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VOC_opperhoofden_in_Japan
| christiaanb wrote:
| Ah, did that know that! That makes the voice acting and
| script even better then.
| bostik wrote:
| I hadn't realised _Jin-Roh_ was from the same creator. And I can
| see why it wasn 't a success: _Jin-Roh_ is dark, properly
| dystopian, confusing, and unforgiving. But underneath there is a
| retold story of the little red riding-hood, in the original Grimm
| fashion.
|
| The wolf wins.
| GauntletWizard wrote:
| Jin-Roh is but part of Oshii's other magnum opus, The Kerberos
| Saga: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kerberos_Saga . I haven't
| read the second half, which wasn't available in english when I
| first saw Jin Roh, but I've heard that The Red Spectacles and
| StrayDog are great if you liked it, but hard to find. I should
| retry that search one of these days.
| mmaniac wrote:
| I found Jin-Roh's use of the Red Riding-Hood narrative to be
| much more subversive than a mere retelling. Both lead
| characters alternately play the role of red riding-hood and the
| wolf, luring each other in and betraying each others' trust at
| differing stages in the story. At the same time, neither truly
| wants to harm the other, but it's the human society they exist
| in which compels them to.
|
| The last shot of the movie is the Rotkaeppchen storybook lying
| in tatters in a puddle.
| slillibri wrote:
| FYI, Masamune Shirow is the creator of Ghost in the Shell.
| Mamoru Oshii directed the anime adaptation.
| imp0cat wrote:
| Oh it's nice to see Animation Obsessive here. Their blog
| https://animationobsessive.substack.com/ is worthy of a
| subscription - most of their articles are both informative and
| very well written.
| chambers wrote:
| I rewatched Ghost in the Shell recently and I was struck by how
| poorly it aged. Its animation holds up but its story felt weaker
| than I remembered. Like the director reached for something deep,
| couldn't get ahold of it, and then covered his tracks behind
| wordy philosophy.
| maxglute wrote:
| >director reached for something deep, couldn't get ahold of it
|
| Translation/writing/dub wasn't very strong at the time, I can
| see how ppl feel now (and felt at the time) the
| headiness/philosophizng was filler for robot tanks and augment
| porn, but it was all there in the source manga by Shirow. IMO
| reaching for something deep about is what the series is all
| about, just explored more competently in shows like SAC where
| they had many hours to deep dwelve into many subjects.
| jajko wrote:
| To watch some classic in anything but original language is
| proper insult to the source and always subpar experience.
| Would you watch say Bicycle thieves with some yeager-speak
| variant too?
|
| I know 0 japanese but never ever watched any of their produce
| in anything but japanese with eng subs. Even though EN is not
| my primary language but one I grok easily without subs
| needed.
|
| Sure, people are lazy and have tons of excuses, but they are
| just that. If you(anybody) couldnt otherwise as a kid, do
| yourself a favor and re-experience it again in better form.
| thfuran wrote:
| But the English subs are the translation. You're going to
| need to learn Japanese to experience it in the original
| language.
| p_l wrote:
| The original manga delivers it better because...
|
| ... Shirow filled in gaps between panels with tons and tons of
| notes, discussing details, sometimes pointing to source
| material, etc.
|
| One of the worst things about it is that none of the GitS 1.0,
| 1.5 and 2.0 come with bibliography section - they _need_ it.
| ranger207 wrote:
| Ghost in the Shell was one of the first animes I saw, but while
| I quickly switched from dubs to subs, I only rewatched GitS
| subbed fairly recently. The subtitles are far better than the
| dubbed audio, and I'd encourage anyone who has only seen it
| dubbed to attempt watching it subbed instead
| BLKNSLVR wrote:
| Just like DNS
|
| Always subs!
| mejutoco wrote:
| What do you think about the matrix (the movie)?
| Der_Einzige wrote:
| I don't understand this at all. It's a story about model
| merging. The stuff in that movie is more pertinent than ever!
| marci wrote:
| The story of how MajorMeat/Phantom-Dense-XXb-fp64 and a
| 2501Silicon/MoE-XXb-64bit finetuned with the Whole-Internet
| Dataset frankenmerged.
| FranOntanaya wrote:
| I never felt it was any different. The 95 movie was always the
| more mystical take, for story the SAC series was better,
| specially 2nd GIG.
| jwells89 wrote:
| SAC/Second GIG were a rare case of the entire production
| firing on all cylinders. Even its English dub was leagues
| better than the average (and IME, somewhat necessary for
| those who can't understand Japanese; even as a subtitle
| watcher of 20+ years I sometimes have trouble following subs
| in SAC because the dialogue is so dense and technical). Shows
| like that don't show up often.
| sbarre wrote:
| How old were you when you first saw it?
|
| I know when I go back to movies that "blew my mind" when I was
| a teenager or in my early 20s, now 30 years later, they're
| rarely as incredible as I remember them being..
|
| I'm older, wiser and with more life experience, and it's
| therefore much harder to "blow my mind" as they say..
| dimator wrote:
| For this reason, I prefer not to rewatch movies that really
| touched me when I was younger. I would rather they hold that
| place in my heart unchallenged. I'm sort of defending my
| younger, wide-eyed self.
| Shinchy wrote:
| I'm not sure what others are saying, I re-watched Ghost in the
| Shell again recently and I had forgotten just how brilliant it
| is. There is something pure about it that you just don't find in
| modern anime, something that really resonated.
| YurgenJurgensen wrote:
| That something is acetate.
| xorbax wrote:
| This is why I think Akira can't be surpassed. Not just
| because it was done on acetate, but because of the level of
| skill and consideration required to animate that way. You
| can't just undo that brush stroke onto the cel and try
| something else.
|
| As much as technology has democratized the field, I think it
| also lowers the heights. I desperately hope I'm wrong and
| just old, but I haven't met someone who puts up something
| that they think is better. Maybe it's just because we're in
| the transitory phase - but digital animation has been around
| for decades at this point. Maybe it's Ikea versus
| handcrafting, and the shift is in the expected quality rather
| than the art elevating itself to meet priors.
| doublepg23 wrote:
| I think the democratization means the heights won't be big-
| budget corporate things, they'll be on YouTube or Patreon.
| cedilla wrote:
| Akira was a big budget corporate thing though. It's
| technical excellence came from having the budget to
| employ multiple highly skilled animation leads and
| hundreds of animators drawing hundreds of thousands of
| cells.
| fidotron wrote:
| Conspicuously though Akira is a product of the manga
| industry and not the anime one. This is why it deviates
| from the norms in so many respects.
| cedilla wrote:
| Akira is a cult classic and a pivotal point in anime - much
| more in the US than in Japan. If you don't know of a film
| surpassing it in skill and consideration in the thirty
| years since it was made it probably says more about your
| exposure to anime. Maybe it's just that Cyberpunk is less
| popular now and the big genres are of less interest to you.
| lupusreal wrote:
| The big genres of modern anime seem to predominantly be
| pandering to base weebs. Waifu shit meant to sell body
| pillows. Where is all the serious animation like Magnetic
| Rose at?
| breckenedge wrote:
| Eras that produce masterpieces are unsustainable.
| lupusreal wrote:
| I think animation done in computers _can_ be excellent, but
| is disadvantaged because computers make it easier to do
| thinks quick and cheap and the economics of animation
| incentivises taking that direction.
|
| Redline is a rare example where I think it's done well.
| bch wrote:
| > Redline is a rare example
|
| Tekkonkinkreet
| warcher wrote:
| Watch into the spider verse sometime if you want to see
| what modern tech can be when it's fully unleashed, versus
| kept under budget.
| giuseppe_petri wrote:
| > You can't just undo that brush stroke onto the cel and
| try something else.
|
| That's why you animate with pencil on paper first.
| maxglute wrote:
| Every part of GiS has been, per article "endlessly ripped off,
| referenced and remixed". Whatever one liked about original GiS,
| there's a derivation out there that turns dial to 11 and makes
| the original feel basic in retrospect. But that's testimony to
| GiS greatness.
| satvikpendem wrote:
| There is a common trope about this very effect: https://tvtro
| pes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/OnceOriginalNowC...
| hwbunny wrote:
| Any examples that make GiS inferior to a copycat?
| jonathanlydall wrote:
| I watched The Shining for the first time in around 2012 and
| when commenting to an older friend about it I said something
| to the effect of "It's good, but I didn't feel it was
| exceptional." to which he replied saying that "Yes, but
| consider that it was the first real film of that genre, it
| only seems "okay" today because you're comparing to all the
| films of the same genre which came after and were largely
| influenced by it."
|
| I don't know enough about films to know that if he said was
| accurate, but it's stuck with me.
|
| I was about 16 when The Matrix came out and I find it
| interesting asking people who were born after it came out
| what they think about it, if they've seen it their reaction
| is typically (much like me with The Shining) "seemed
| alright", while for me at the time the movie was phenomenal
| and in terms of many of its special effects, unlike anything
| I had ever seen before.
| ghaff wrote:
| There are a number of films: The Matrix, the original Star
| Wars, Jurassic Park, Avatar, I'm sure many others that were
| just so different and jaw-dropping in many ways when they
| first came out--in those cases because of effects of
| various types mostly--that it can be hard to appreciate
| their novelty at the time.
|
| Some stand up better than others.
| ethbr1 wrote:
| Citizen Kane, Casablanca
|
| Appreciating "modern" before modern times requires taking
| the production date into context _and_ being aware of
| what contemporary media was doing.
|
| Unfortunately, the entire reason you're watching famous
| media decades later is because contemporary media is
| comparatively boring.
|
| F.ex. How many people who have seen Citizen Kane have
| seen Louisiana Purchase?
| https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1941_in_film
| ghaff wrote:
| Those are two of my favorite films. But Citizen Kane was
| largely unique as opposed to a precursor of a type. And
| Casablanca just put everything together in a package that
| really wasn't that distinct from plenty of other love
| stories set against a WWII backdrop on the surface.
| ethbr1 wrote:
| To me, both Citizen Kane and Casablanca feel pretty
| revolutionary in editing, compared to what was prevalent
| at the time. But this has intrigued me to do some '41/42
| comparisons.
| troupo wrote:
| In comparison to many of the lazy movies of today I find
| The Matrix still as jaw-dropping. Even the two sequels
| tried to push the envelope.
|
| But the original one was just so brilliantly made
| rvba wrote:
| The matrix to some degree is inspired by Ghost in the
| shell .
| JKCalhoun wrote:
| The "Lord of the Rings" novel is that way too to anyone not
| steeped in fantasy. It might be hard to imagine for many
| people these days that "elves" and "dwarves" strictly meant
| children's fairytales before Tolkien. Magical rings, wizards,
| dragons with tunnels of gold ... seems so cliche now it is
| easy to see why someone would wonder what the big deal about
| Tolkien is.
| inhumantsar wrote:
| same deal with neuromancer
| paul80808 wrote:
| I have to disagree with both. I help a colleague teach a
| class in which students often read necromancer, and it
| often has a deep impact on them. The cloned ninjas and
| laser weapons are uninteresting to them for the reasons
| mentioned above, but the Necromancer + Wintermute dynamic
| and central plot is fascinating to them.
| cgriswald wrote:
| I think it's slightly different. Tolkein made fairy tales
| grow up, but people already had some familiarity with
| these things. Tolkien gave them a new way to think about
| those things.
|
| Gibson's strength was that he could describe--in an
| accessible way--concepts that were quite foreign to most
| people at the time.
| AlotOfReading wrote:
| Elves and dwarves didn't strictly mean children's fairy
| tales prior to Tolkien. There's plenty of semi-popular
| prior art where they feature, like the _Worm Ouroboros_ or
| _The King of Elfland 's Daughter_. Poul Anderson also
| published _The Broken Sword_ the same year as LOTR, which
| shows a lot of the same influences as written by a very
| different author.
|
| Tolkien's importance is that the specific kinds of
| creatures he wrote became the default for virtually all
| subsequent authors and the popularity/quality of the works
| were pivotal in establishing fantasy as a "proper" genre.
| thefaux wrote:
| Plus Wagner's ring cycle.
| wongarsu wrote:
| Not the original GIS, but GIS: Standalone Complex is still
| one of the best examples out there of "realistic" special
| forces action scenes. A lot of screen time spent getting all
| the pieces into position, culminating in just a couple
| seconds of fast-paced action.
| chaostheory wrote:
| Ghost in the Shell: Standalone Complex is much better. Movies
| don't have enough time to tell the story when there's a lot of
| political intrigue.
| rekabis wrote:
| The author fails in their understanding of Anime's history in
| North America.
|
| While certain series such as The White Lion, Astroboy, Space
| Battleship Yamato (marketed over here as Starblazors) and Captain
| Harlock did see airtime first, it was Robotech - the Harmony Gold
| Frankenstein of three completely unrelated Anime series - that
| kicked off the process in 1984. It was Robotech that threw rocket
| fuel onto the burning embers of fandom in North America. Akira
| just helped the process along.
| YurgenJurgensen wrote:
| There was very little "anime" in North America. If you prefer
| your animation with an acute accent, you're better off looking
| in France.
| kagakuninja wrote:
| As a member of the underground anime scene, starting in the
| late 70s, I have a different perspective.
|
| Harmony Gold did nothing to actually promote anime, beyond
| hyping their own products. Robotech was the English translated
| anime that happened to be on air in the US when the necessary
| conditions for the anime explosion were in place.
|
| Those conditions were:
|
| Affordable VCRs (in the 70s, they cost as much as a small car).
|
| The Usenet / internet (for coordinating, sharing information,
| and creating tape sharing networks).
|
| Low cost computer video platforms for subtitling (e.g. Amiga +
| Video Toaster).
|
| In terms of popularity, people forget that Speed Racer, Kimba,
| etc were broadcast on network television, and had far more
| impact on popular culture than Robotech, which was syndicated.
|
| Captain Harlock ironically what got me interested in anime in
| the late '70s. It was not widely broadcast in the continental
| US, until Harmony Gold's despicable hack job which came after
| Robotech.
|
| One source of subtitled anime in the 70s was from Hawaii, which
| has a significant Japanese population. But to get that required
| having contacts with one of those very expensive VCRs.
| lowbloodsugar wrote:
| What they did with "Battle of the Planets" o_0
| CoastalCoder wrote:
| I too was surprised that Robotech didn't appear in the article.
|
| It played during my school summer vacation (U.S.), and I was
| rivetted. It's nearly [0] the first Japanese animation I ever
| saw, and I was absolutely rivetted.
|
| I have no idea what viewership numbers were like at the period,
| but _I_ was certainly hooked. And I was entering my high-school
| years where I 'd have spending money from part-time jobs, so I
| was definitely an untapped market.
|
| [0] Another commenter mentioned Battle of the Planets, which
| I'd forgotten about. I liked that too.
| BoingBoomTschak wrote:
| Just a notice that all Blu-Rays of the 95 GITS are completely and
| hopelessly mangled (cropped, blurred and black crushed). The only
| "good" version is an old HDTV rip that was hand-remastered by
| Judgment; but with heavy smoothing in the process, a film grain
| shader to mask this is recommended.
|
| BD:
| http://comp.judging.it/content/Koukaku%20Kidoutai/1080p-3/BD...
|
| HDTV:
| http://comp.judging.it/content/Koukaku%20Kidoutai/1080p-3/Ju...
| SuperNinKenDo wrote:
| That's beyond heartbreaking. Everything is somehow getting
| worse but I'd held out hope that something universally
| considered a masterpiece might get better treatment. Do you
| know if a better release exists in Japan?
| BoingBoomTschak wrote:
| My wooden peg leg and the parrot on my experienced and still
| active privateer shoulder tell me no.
| cjk2 wrote:
| That is the way. Arrr.
| ethbr1 wrote:
| Anime piracy and subtitles, even with globalization, is
| on a different level. Especially with the detail and
| effort that goes into some fansubs.
| cjk2 wrote:
| Yeah exactly that. I had a crunchy roll subscription but
| shitcanned it in the end because the quality of the
| releases is an order of magnitude better from the
| pirates.
| Apocryphon wrote:
| Eh, we lost the original moon tapes and George Lucas
| suppressed the theatrical _Star Wars_ cut. Very common even
| in the modern era for this sort of thing to happen.
| nicolas_t wrote:
| At least for the theatrical Star Wars cut there's an
| excellent fan restoration 4k77 based on a 35mm IB
| technicolor film scan. The amount of work fans do to
| restore work they care about more than the corporate owners
| is always both amazing and heartwarming.
| BoingBoomTschak wrote:
| If you want another known bad case:
| https://sephirotic.wordpress.com/2015/10/11/neon-genesis-
| eva...
| philip-b wrote:
| Where do I get this HDTV rip?
| ykonstant wrote:
| nyaa, most easily
| hapticmonkey wrote:
| The 4K Bluray copy I have seems to be an improvement over both?
|
| Note: This is the HDR screenshot so colours look wrong unless
| tonemapped to a SDR display.
|
| https://i.imgur.com/PFVzuYi.jpeg
| BoingBoomTschak wrote:
| Still some cropping and way too much DNR, but not as bad as
| the 1080p BDs indeed. Some people recommend it over the HDTV
| source (which was a bitstarved WMV3 encode) for its better
| handling of action sequences (i.e. without horrible
| macroblocking).
| photochemsyn wrote:
| GITS is highly relevant today, but I can understand why the
| Hollywood remake gutted the original story, because GITS is a
| highly subversive work that directly attacks the authoritarian
| state's bureaucratic power structure. It's also the story of the
| transformation of a loyal servant of one of the state agencies,
| Major Kusangi, into an independent rogue agent who abandons that
| power structure in alliance with some form of synthetic
| intelligence, Project 2501.
|
| What sets it apart from similar rogue spy stories is the heavy
| emphasis on philosophical concepts - the Ship of Theseus in the
| context of a cyborg human whose every part has been replaced over
| time, the nature of self and other in the context of the merger
| of the Major's identity with that of P2501, the point at which
| obedience to the authoritarian state is abandoned and the
| rationale for that choice - all notions that make established
| power structures uneasy, and which accounts for the atrocious
| garbled plot line of the Hollywood remake.
| rvba wrote:
| They botched the remake since it was done by incompetent
| people. That was (still is?) the time where Netflix was trying
| to build a library so they threw random people at random
| projects.
|
| Death Note Remake / live action film was botched too
| bellboy_tech wrote:
| GITS is amazing as a design universe. The more you dig into the
| manga or movies (even the SACs) the deeper you get sucked in to
| what could be. From the vision of mind interfaces to the dream of
| mind across the net. It was WAY ahead of it's time and still
| stands up today.
|
| Every crevasse of the original Manga contains deep thought out
| design on what digital life could become. What constructs we
| become once we crossed that digital/biological line.
|
| Love it. Happy to buy into the sell.
| downrightmike wrote:
| If you want a deeper look into the worlds of Anime at the time,
| I recommend: Anime Architecture : Imagined Worlds and Endless
| Megacities, Hardcover
| https://www.thamesandhudsonusa.com/books/anime-architecture-...
|
| Its a really cool book
| jrajav wrote:
| The SAC series were also intensely thoughtful and well-written,
| with softly stated political intrigue and philosophical musing
| that somehow doesn't ever devolve into navel gazing.
|
| Really a must watch anime series if you like anime or even just
| sci fi at all.
| hdt91 wrote:
| I'm seeing quite a few recommendations for good shows in the
| comments, under an article about GITS and Mamoru Oshii, but
| surprisingly no one has brought up the two other fairly well-
| known (?) works: Angel's Egg and Urusei Yatsura 2. The first one
| just got the news about a 4k upgrade next year and first time
| Western release, while the other has few reasons to be a stand-
| alone movie of the same manga besides the main cast. Both are
| sometimes incredibly trippy and heady with the hypnotic 90s look,
| which seem to be much fewer in the modern anime but I haven't
| really kept up with new stuff these days as well as animation
| styles certainly evolve over time.
| mmaniac wrote:
| I'm a fan of most of Oshii's work, and Angel's Egg is a
| particular favourite, but it's not hard to see why it's rarely
| recommended. The film has very little narrative and it leans
| heavily on visual symbolism.
| kibwen wrote:
| The best way to sell Angel's Egg to the people predisposed to
| seeking out anime is to mention its influence on Dark Souls
| 3: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T9wSol7JdG0
| mmaniac wrote:
| This comment had the reverse effect on me - Dark Souls 3
| has been on my backlog for a while, and I'm now more keen
| to play it :)
| AdmiralAsshat wrote:
| Mentioning that Yoshitaka Amano worked on it might also be
| a draw for some people.
| segmondy wrote:
| I have literally watched this movie 10x easily, and it's my
| "Continue Watching" menu in Netflix right now. Such a brilliant
| movie.
| a_t48 wrote:
| Same. For a while it was my comfort pick for a movie to have on
| while going to bed.
| AI_beffr wrote:
| anime is a completely pointless topic in my opinion. i honestly
| feel like it has no future because of AI. even if there is
| something that resembles anime in the future, it will all be
| drawn and probably written by AI. what is the point of that? and
| looking back, the only thing that made anime so good was that it
| was niche. GITS for example, while touching on interesting
| concepts and being beautifully drawn, doesnt have a very good
| story. it was niche enough, small enough and nimble enough to
| touch on cool, ahead-of-their-time concepts that hadnt yet broken
| through to mainstream. but beyond that, it doesnt really do much.
| most anime that ive seen is extremely violent, has meandering
| dis-jointed writing, etc. not of much value to anyone above the
| age of 16.
|
| watching GITS now is even more disappointing because all of the
| transhumanist, cyberpunk themes that are touched upon arent cool
| anymore. they are reality now. AI is here and its a real thing
| that we have to deal with. soon we really will have to deal with
| the concepts seen in GITS. and its just tired and disappointing
| because it wont be like a cool anime, it will be horrible and
| dangerous and disgusting. society will be shattered..
| sram1337 wrote:
| I don't think most people value the aspects of anime that you
| are highlighting as highly as you do
| cynicalsecurity wrote:
| Reality sucks, got it.
| tecleandor wrote:
| Feels weird not finding the name of Masamune Shirow even once in
| the article (or the comments here, at least the last time I
| checked)
| wodenokoto wrote:
| Why?
| lowbloodsugar wrote:
| Just Google him.
| edu wrote:
| He's the author of the original manga. Which is as good as
| the anime, if you haven't read it I strongly recommend it!
| glandium wrote:
| He's mentioned in the comments there.
| lowbloodsugar wrote:
| Saw it at the theater. What a time to be alive! And then three
| years later we get The Matrix!
| gpderetta wrote:
| Rumour is that the sale pitch[1] for The Matrix was the
| Wachowskis showing GITS to the producers and saying "We wanna
| do that for real."
|
| (and wow, it was only three year later).
|
| [1] https://www.theguardian.com/film/2009/oct/19/hollywood-
| ghost...
| mark_l_watson wrote:
| I really like both the animated series and the movie with
| Scarlett Johansson.
|
| I am well into my 70s, and GITS appeals to my memories of
| Barberella and Flash Gordon comics.
| yieldcrv wrote:
| > That story started in the early '90s, in London. A local
| businessman saw Akira at an art film screening.
|
| Exhibit A on why I looooove movie screenings
|
| Imaging seeing a bunch of quirky short film misses from amateur
| producers that at least take initiative, to seeing _Akira_. in
| the early 90s. an advanced style in a medium nobody had really
| explored with a cohesive well thought out message. And you're
| like "and this story and director came out of where? Japan?"
|
| today that would share similarities to the idea of something
| wholly unexpected in the entertainment world came out of Iraq,
| but without any fanfare just an exhibit at a small industry event
| in your town
| jonhohle wrote:
| > an advanced style in a medium nobody had really explored with
| a cohesive well thought out message.
|
| Only of you ignore Miyazaki. Nausicaa and to a lesser extent
| Castle in the Sky aren't cyberpunk, but definitely pushed the
| state of the art and storytelling forward with universally
| applicable narratives. I'm not saying Akira isn't good or that
| the viewing wasn't serendipitous, but it certainly wasn't alone
| in what was happening in Japan at the time.
| riffraff wrote:
| > America and Europe saw their first major "anime boom" during
| the '90s.
|
| I'm not sure that's true, we had a ton of anime in Europe in the
| 80s already.
|
| Capitan Tsubasa aired in 86 in Italy and 88 in France, and I'm
| pretty sure we had a lot of Go Nagai stuff before that.
| Enydosnes wrote:
| As far as I'm aware, France was a relative outlier in Europe in
| regards to popularity of Japanese media with it preceding more
| widespread adoption in popular European culture.
| gpderetta wrote:
| Indeed, Mazinger was an household name in Italy even earlier
| than that.
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