[HN Gopher] Quitting Engineering to Pursue Art Full-Time
       ___________________________________________________________________
        
       Quitting Engineering to Pursue Art Full-Time
        
       Author : Tomte
       Score  : 147 points
       Date   : 2024-04-27 10:26 UTC (3 days ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (www.staysketchy.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (www.staysketchy.com)
        
       | jncfhnb wrote:
       | > In business theres a term called "Total Adressable Market," or
       | TAM. This is basically everyone in the world who could buy a
       | product in a given category. What's the TAM for a product like
       | fishing rods? Well, that would be everyone in the world who likes
       | fishing...
       | 
       | > The reason we mention this is because when Pablo first started
       | selling his art online, he created all his posts strictly in
       | Spanish - his native language. Over time, he felt that this was
       | limiting him, so he started making posts in both English and
       | Spanish, and then eventually just English.
       | 
       | The bit about cutting out Spanish entirely suggests this is not a
       | lesson in maximizing one's TAM
        
         | tsunamifury wrote:
         | TAM vs ROI is a thing... obviously.
        
         | choilive wrote:
         | Yeah, it's more like min-max'ing your TAM. Minimize effort in
         | areas that don't have any return and maximize the areas that
         | do. Business 101.
        
         | paulcole wrote:
         | YC startup idea:
         | 
         | AI generated-articles designed to give computer programmers
         | dopamine hits when they get to correct a small
         | error/issue/discrepancy.
         | 
         | Like Zyns but distracting.
         | 
         | Maybe it's like a reward. Fix a tough bug and your manager
         | sends you an article where you get to point out that the author
         | is incorrectly using "strawman fallacy."
        
           | jncfhnb wrote:
           | You could probably get a better ROI offering opportunities to
           | make snarky, condescending comments
        
             | paulcole wrote:
             | Go through my comment history lol. I've been giving it away
             | for years!
        
           | fragmede wrote:
           | Zyns?
        
             | margalabargala wrote:
             | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zyn_(nicotine_pouches)
        
               | fragmede wrote:
               | Thanks. That's what I found via Google but I don't use
               | them so I wasn't sure of the connection and that it
               | wasn't some app or library that the kids are using these
               | days that I hadn't heard about.
        
               | margalabargala wrote:
               | Nah, just a physical item representation of "single
               | serving thing that makes the happy neurotransmitters"
        
           | margalabargala wrote:
           | This is basically the idea behind various word puzzles. See:
           | https://www.nytimes.com/crosswords
        
             | paulcole wrote:
             | Great point. Sudoku is one of my favorites in the word
             | puzzle genre.
        
         | cmgriffing wrote:
         | I had one interesting thought while reading that section.
         | 
         | It seems that a lot of effort has been put into tooling for
         | translating to and from English. It's probably much more effort
         | invested than for other languages, so by using English he
         | actually is increasing his TAM because the translation tools
         | are better adapted to many other languages from English.
        
           | Dalewyn wrote:
           | Or to put it another way:
           | 
           | Spanish can understand English.
           | 
           | English can't understand Spanish.
           | 
           | Speaking English you can communicate with English and Spanish
           | without also speaking Spanish, kill two birds with one stone.
           | 
           | The virtues of a lingua franca.
        
             | renewiltord wrote:
             | Funny how dominant languages of the past have died but now
             | the lingua angla feels forever. I wonder if that's how it
             | feels to be at the height of some culture's age: it feels
             | immortal. Then it falls and is only remembered as the past:
             | either as humorous, or as sophisticated, but not meant for
             | normal use. We shall cement this one by creating AIs in the
             | American image.
        
               | coldtea wrote:
               | The Roman Empire seemed forever for those living within
               | it too!
        
               | wddkcs wrote:
               | That cement will always crumble, but the next empire will
               | probably be built with it's pieces. It's no accident that
               | the current global language is a derivative of the last
               | 'worldwide' language, Latin, which itself flourished from
               | its relationship to Alexander's Greece, a language which
               | stole its alphabet from the semitic empires. Nothing new
               | under the sun.
        
               | _heimdall wrote:
               | The same can be said for empires in general. Dominance
               | seems forever until it isn't, and often the "higher you
               | go the faster you fall" idea plays out.
               | 
               | There are plenty of signs that the US could be in the
               | midst of its own empire failing. Whether that actually
               | plays out is something we wouldn't know for decades or
               | centuries, but there sure are a lot of parallels to
               | failed empires of the past.
        
       | tithe wrote:
       | > "If you're getting hate, that's a good sign." ...In the past,
       | he used to engage with them...Now, he doesn't get too involved.
       | 
       | Did he mean to say "passion" in this case? How is hate a "good"
       | sign of engagement? If someone has an opinion and is willing to
       | share it with me, I'd hope they could do it in a constructive way
       | (but I wouldn't call that "hate", and this is the Internet he's
       | talking about).
       | 
       | Imagine being surrounded by 100 people hurling insults at you,
       | telling you you're no good and your product / service / art
       | sucks. How is that a "good sign"?
       | 
       | Edit: Maybe the assumption is "For every hater, I find 10 people
       | that _do_ like it", so the realization is that "I'm reaching
       | people," and the underlying prayer is that "And hopefully,
       | they're not _all_ haters."
        
         | j7ake wrote:
         | It's the unrecognized but genius artist fallacy: many great
         | artists were unknown and poor when they did their best work.
         | 
         | Therefore, since I am unknown and poor, I must be a great
         | artist.
        
           | enneff wrote:
           | That's not it at all. Almost all art is just quietly ignored.
           | If people have strong feelings about your art then that's a
           | huge win.
        
         | doytch wrote:
         | I think the argument here is that hate (which is a subset of
         | passion) is not the purely negative thing that we immediately
         | think it is. Especially in art. When people _hate_ art the art
         | has served its purpose. Art's intention (to paint with
         | heinously broad strokes) is to create emotions and drive
         | thoughts. That's a very different intention than a
         | product/service and they shouldn't be compared in that sense.
         | 
         | But also:
         | 
         | > Afterall, it's good for engagement and the Instagram
         | algorithm.
        
           | free_bip wrote:
           | Arts intention is whatever the artist makes it out to be. If
           | an artist wants their work to be loved, not hated... Well
           | then this doesn't really apply does it
        
             | theideaofcoffee wrote:
             | Even if the artist wrote their own citation of a work
             | saying "I intended it for it to be loved, and that's the
             | only correct interpretation", it's still not correct if one
             | subscribes, as I do, to the literary-focused "the death of
             | the author('s authority)" once they release it. They really
             | don't get a say how it's taken once someone else perceives
             | it.
             | 
             | I think the parent's free use of 'hate' stands in for a
             | conflict in emotion and interpretation this way, and less
             | it being completely despised or loathed.
        
             | tithe wrote:
             | Does the artist control that outcome, though? The clear
             | communication of their art's intention? Whether their work
             | is loved or hated?
             | 
             | If you're creating art because you enjoy doing it, and if
             | you're performing / putting it on display because you think
             | it has value and others might enjoy it too, then I can't
             | think of any reaction other than love and encouragement
             | (implicitly via purchasing or explicitly via encouragement)
             | that would suffice in keeping one motivated to share it
             | with others.
             | 
             | Now, amidst any hate I might ask myself "Did I do the
             | absolute best according to my ability? Is there anything
             | else I can improve?" From this perspective, hate is amazing
             | as fuel because it's an effective way to eliminate your
             | perceived faults (assuming you take it personally, which
             | I'd wager most artists do).
        
         | bongodongobob wrote:
         | It's what artists do to lie to themselves so their entire life
         | doesn't seem like a waste of time. I went from music to tech.
         | Art is full of completely delusional hacks.
        
           | BriggyDwiggs42 wrote:
           | I mean, that does sound like something someone who switched
           | from music to tech would say, but it's also a little true.
        
             | bongodongobob wrote:
             | I made a career out of it and made it to regional status.
             | If you want to pay your bills, you need to hit national
             | level or teach music. It's a fucking grind and you
             | naturally age out.
        
               | egypturnash wrote:
               | I've been watching one of my friends keep on pushing at
               | the grind and it looks super gruelling, he's been
               | drifting from programming to running the mixer board at a
               | lot of local shows and it's _impossible_ to hook up with
               | him to hang out any more. I dunno how he does it.
        
           | harwoodjp wrote:
           | I assure you that your life in tech, waging for a boss, is a
           | waste of time.
        
             | bongodongobob wrote:
             | Nah, steady paycheck, health insurance, don't need
             | roommates, can afford the nicer things in life. Gigging and
             | touring is fun in your 20s, but starts to drain you. This
             | is much better.
        
           | neocritter wrote:
           | Tech is also full of delusional hacks. You find them
           | everywhere. Delusional hack artists are more fun.
        
         | tester457 wrote:
         | Your edit is the goal, it's why content creators have a new
         | influx in views after getting "canceled". People who forgot the
         | youtuber existed before cancellation come back to see what's
         | going on.
         | 
         | In this case, hate is attention that helps algorithms. It's why
         | shortform media is usually inflammatory, you get more
         | engagement out of it.
         | 
         | Hate and other powerful emotions are a good sign, they can
         | promote you to people who don't hate you.
        
         | ambicapter wrote:
         | I think this is just a "content creator" realizing, but not
         | admitting to themselves, that the algorithms that spread their
         | content (that they're banking on to get paid) have "figured
         | out" that humans' strong negative emotional reaction has a
         | higher engagement potential than strong positive reactions,
         | thus those who generate the most hate are those who get
         | seen/paid the most.
        
         | blargey wrote:
         | If you're selling a product or service promising objective
         | utility for a user, maybe. Art is just...there, though. Maybe
         | games can promise functionality that a consumer can expect to
         | have working, but most mediums don't.
         | 
         | Without objective functionality, "Haters" in an art context
         | only have one thing to be vitriolic about - their own
         | subjective aesthetic taste. Thus their words cannot contain
         | anything of value to the artist.
        
         | AlbertCory wrote:
         | In the movie biography of Tom Wolfe (RIP), his daughter tells
         | of reading some of the vicious things people said about him,
         | and asking him if this didn't bother him.
         | 
         | He said, "No, of course not. You're nobody 'til somebody hates
         | you."
         | 
         | So if you despised them first and said something that touched
         | them that deeply, I could see considering that a success.
        
       | __loam wrote:
       | Hell yeah
        
       | gexaha wrote:
       | > Just get started. Start selling in the real world
       | 
       | That's all nice, the problem is though that the market is in
       | decline right now
        
         | nachox999 wrote:
         | There are billions of dollars floating around in the market,
         | it's just a matter of knowing how to catch them
        
       | Animats wrote:
       | This looks more like pursuing Instagramming full time.
        
         | iamacyborg wrote:
         | Instagram is the marketing channel but you still need to put in
         | the work to have something to promote.
        
           | onemoresoop wrote:
           | fiddling with printers and plotters isn't the hard part, most
           | likely the marketing part is because anything sells if you
           | find the fools.
           | 
           | The whole stick of this article strikes me as marketing in
           | the first place.
        
             | salomonk_mur wrote:
             | I'm pretty sure you are severely understimating the amount
             | of work that goes into quality art pieces, no matter the
             | medium.
             | 
             | Also, thinking of customers as "fools" only makes sense if
             | you believe you are selling/producing garbage. If what you
             | make has value, then whoever buys it is no fool.
        
               | onemoresoop wrote:
               | You're also underestimating the amount of great quality
               | art that simply doesn't sell. Hence the power of
               | marketing. And the art that sells for lots and lots of
               | money is also marketing and financial gimmicks the art
               | world does behind the scenes. Unfortunately it's not
               | quality that matters, it's the notoriety of the artist.
               | It goes back to marketing in circles.
        
               | coldtea wrote:
               | Maybe you're overestimating the amount of art in those
               | art pieces!
        
             | nachox999 wrote:
             | If someone buys something voluntarily, it's because it
             | holds value for that person, not because they're a fool.
             | The key lies in the 'voluntarily'.
        
       | FrustratedMonky wrote:
       | With AI hitting Art, and the Engineering Job Market right now, is
       | it a toss which is the worse choice?
        
         | iamacyborg wrote:
         | Art has been a poor career choice for a long time before the
         | current state of AI
        
           | onemoresoop wrote:
           | Not if you're truly into marketing and art is a second
           | thought. Most 'artists' of this type sell copies because that
           | easy money. But if you're not good with marketing you end up
           | stockpiling copies of your art that nobody wants.
        
         | tkiolp4 wrote:
         | Regardless of AI, isn't it equally hard to start a business (no
         | matter how small)? OP made it (it seems), but chances are
         | against one. I think this applies now, 10 years ago and will
         | apply 10 years from now.
         | 
         | We only see posts of the successful ones, though.
        
         | tayo42 wrote:
         | Ai isn't making paintings, taking photographs, sculpting or
         | making things.
         | 
         | Ai does a very narrow part of what art is.
        
           | holoduke wrote:
           | It can enhance it though. I can draw my own painting ask my
           | local ai to fill in the gaps or to upscale it a bit etc. Is
           | the art part gone then?
        
         | temp0826 wrote:
         | AI is hitting engineering now too, no? (Sure in small ways now,
         | but I imagine it would be one of the first targets considering
         | it is engineers doing it)
         | 
         | Since covid I left tech and have been working at ayahuasca
         | retreat centers (assisting and managing) and apprenticing.
         | Frankly I can't imagine a career less at risk to AI
         | replacement!
         | 
         | Maybe someone should start a job board for AI-proof gigs.
        
       | datadrivenangel wrote:
       | Reminds me of the classic: "Sorry I missed your comment of many
       | months ago. I no longer build software; I now make furniture out
       | of wood. The hours are long, the pay sucks, and there's always
       | the opportunity to remove my finger with a table saw, but nobody
       | asks me if I can add an RSS feed to a DBMS, so there's that :-)"
       | 
       | https://github.com/docker/cli/issues/267#issuecomment-695149...
        
         | lolinder wrote:
         | I missed this! HN discussion (with an elaboration by the
         | author/woodworker) here:
         | 
         | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24541964
        
         | passion__desire wrote:
         | I remember a quantum information theorist went to become a hard
         | labourer in construction because he thought "physical labour is
         | food for the soul"
        
           | monster_group wrote:
           | And I want to become a quantum theorist. I think being able
           | to manipulate symbols on paper and explain the universe is
           | food for the soul. Grass always seems greener on the other
           | side. :-)
        
         | ein0p wrote:
         | Could they add AI to that table saw so it removes fingers more
         | efficiently, that's the pressing question we're facing today.
        
           | gnarbarian wrote:
           | no AI just natural stupidity
        
           | Avicebron wrote:
           | Not only that does it do that, but it will automatically send
           | an assessment to your insurance provider indicating that you
           | were using it incorrectly and therefore not eligible for
           | coverage! The valuation is through the roof
        
         | m463 wrote:
         | and that right there is why RSS is dying. :)
        
       | timwaagh wrote:
       | Talk about failing upwards
        
       | antirez wrote:
       | Well, he is using code as a tool, as a mean to reach his goals. I
       | believe this is the best way to write code, after all. Should
       | almost be the only sensible way. It's just that in 2024, having a
       | programming job is 90% of times doing things you don't care with
       | tools you don't want to use. The problem is not programming
       | itself.
        
       | helboi4 wrote:
       | Bruh I was just opening up my computer to apply for a CS masters
       | to advance my career as a languages & humanities degree holder
       | turned SE who always wanted to do art. Now I'm back to thinking I
       | should try and work on art until it can take over my career.
       | 
       | It's sort of upsetting that doing something I'm bad at (SE) makes
       | me more money than anything I'm good at. Feels like it traps me.
        
         | greenie_beans wrote:
         | i'm also a humanities degree holder turned software engineer. i
         | recently quit my job so i can work on my art. do it!!!!! my
         | spirit is so much better. fuck computers.
        
         | ezekg wrote:
         | I went from art to software. I feel like software is the
         | ultimate form of creative expression.
        
       | tayo42 wrote:
       | This is why I never really tried. I thought I could sell art but
       | it's a grind and political. It seems like either you can work
       | constantly to sell art to fund making art or half ass it at some
       | corporate job, make a ton of money and make art?
        
         | boppo1 wrote:
         | Corporate jobs don't leave much time to really make art unless
         | it's halfassed garbage.
        
           | tayo42 wrote:
           | Thanks I guess I've been making half assed garbage lol
        
         | Gigachad wrote:
         | People seem to make a decent living doing furry art
         | commissions. Looks like far less grind than other kinds of art
         | and also not corporate.
        
           | anal_reactor wrote:
           | I saw a graph somewhere that vast majority of income from
           | OnlyFans is earned by a small number of top performers. I
           | assume that something similar happens in the furry community.
        
           | rgmerk wrote:
           | I dunno, the 500th commission of Bandit and Lucky's Dad doing
           | *censored* probably gets pretty tiresome as well.
        
       | artur_makly wrote:
       | Congrats on following your passion. The Universe will reward you
       | ( one way or another )
       | 
       | just curious, with 245K followers on Insta.. how many units/month
       | are you selling?
        
       | AlecSchueler wrote:
       | I did this some years ago myself and I want to say the only thing
       | I miss is...agile working! Throw your tomatoes now.
       | 
       | It's fantastic to work in this field and very fulfilling but I
       | consistently find the quality of teamwork and coordination to be
       | much lacking compared to my engineering past. I wish I could sit
       | down with a group of musicians and give them a bunch of Jira
       | tickets to work on for the sprint before the upcoming rehearsal.
        
         | onemoresoop wrote:
         | > I wish I could sit down with a group of musicians and give
         | them a bunch of Jira tickets to work on for the sprint before
         | the upcoming rehearsal.
         | 
         | They'd most likely become your little slaves if you paid them.
         | The reason people put up with such bureaucratic systems and
         | bosses is the pay. And many quit in frustration for lower pay
         | and more freedom.
        
         | greenie_beans wrote:
         | i've never met a great instrument player who needed jira for
         | solo practice. tomato ** 100000, with a chorus of violins.
        
         | jokethrowaway wrote:
         | What happened to people before processes?
        
       | redbell wrote:
       | If I were to transition from software engineering, I'd prioritize
       | a role that meets the following criteria:                 1.
       | Minimizes screen time and doesn't rely heavily on computers for
       | productivity.            2. Allows me to disconnect after work
       | without constant notifications or calls.            3. Offers
       | stability, requiring minimal adaptation to new trends or
       | technologies.            4. Lastly,  and more importantly, not
       | easily replaceable by AI in the near future.
        
         | dottjt wrote:
         | Any ideas on actual roles?
         | 
         | I think the thing that kills me is the mental exhaustion of
         | software development. Just thinking about how to solve problems
         | all day is mentally taxing.
        
           | tithe wrote:
           | Construction trades (e.g., any role involved in building a
           | house).
        
           | bradly wrote:
           | Get a portable Laguna or Woodmizer saw mill. Optional kiln.
        
           | redbell wrote:
           | IMHO, _Farming_ is the ideal switch for a techie.
           | Technically, you are switching from the likes of _Matrix_ to
           | speaking to animals.
           | 
           | Another activity that I believe would bring more joy than 99%
           | of jobs, if not _all_ , is _charity_.
        
             | tetromino_ wrote:
             | Are you speaking from experience? Personally - speaking as
             | someone who had needed to plant, hill, water, weed, and
             | harvest plenty of sacks of potatoes by hand as a child - I
             | would say that coding is vastly preferable over farming;
             | and in fact, that most things are preferable over farming.
        
               | andoando wrote:
               | I've wondered for a while now, how difficult is
               | sustainable farming now if you incorporated all the
               | modern technologies?
               | 
               | It should be ridiculously easy to self sustain with all
               | this stuff we've built! Instead we just work just as long
               | to produce ton of crap that does nothing for our
               | happiness.
        
               | _heimdall wrote:
               | I'm doing it with almost none of the modern technologies.
               | Loving it so far, but it definitely isn't for profit.
               | Farming is a losing business these days, few make profit
               | that isn't effectively living off of government
               | subsidies.
               | 
               | I wouldn't trade it for the world at this point though.
               | Its a very strange, and satisfying, experience to raise,
               | butcher or harvest, and cook food that you raised on
               | farm.
        
               | andoando wrote:
               | How long does it take you in a day?
               | 
               | I had saved up a good amount of money (before losing it
               | all lol, where I could do this). I was thinking about
               | buying some nice land, setting up an aquaponics farm, and
               | just running some solar farms/generators.
               | 
               | No fret from me if you want to do it all by hand, but
               | there really ought to be a middle ground between living
               | as if it was the 1800s and working 8-10 hours day at a
               | desk.
        
               | _heimdall wrote:
               | It very much depends on what you want to grow/raise and
               | how you want to manage it. If your goal is to feed your
               | family, you can pretty easily do that with a few hours of
               | good work in a day when its all setup.
               | 
               | We don't do absolutely everything by hand, but we
               | definitely avoided many of the modern approaches. We have
               | 13 cows, 9 chickens and 20 chicks that just hatched, and
               | a small garden (~3500 sq ft).
               | 
               | There's always certain jobs that take all day or multiple
               | days, like cutting our fields (~50 acres),
               | planting/harvesting, and butchering a pig was a huge
               | undertaking given that we've never done anything like it
               | before. On average, I'd say we put it 6-8 hours a day
               | split between two people, with the occasional days of
               | both working 8-10 hours each.
        
           | spicyusername wrote:
           | Teacher seems to fit some of those.
        
         | ertgbnm wrote:
         | Masseuse or physical trainer are the only jobs that I can think
         | would qualify.
         | 
         | No screen time, no one needs a midnight massage (although your
         | work hours would probably not be 9-5.), not reliant on
         | technology, and going to take a while for AI to replace.
         | 
         | Very few good jobs fulfill criteria number 2.
        
           | kodt wrote:
           | Don't most physical labor jobs and trades fulfill number 2?
        
         | chasd00 wrote:
         | if you live in a place with lots of sun and rain you can make a
         | pretty good living owning a yard service and employing a small
         | crew. A childhood friend of mine in FL worked as a mower and
         | then bought the business when his boss was ready to retire. I
         | think he does well into 6 figures and supports his family with
         | it.
         | 
         | edit: i will say he and his crew are pretty amazing at what
         | they do. Speed and quality is unbelievable (it's been 20 years
         | since i've seen him work though)
         | 
         | edit2: i've also heard of people buying a backhoe, dump truck,
         | and a trailer and making 6 figures doing random contracts.
        
         | InitialLastName wrote:
         | I hear that being a utilities locator is good work. Pretty much
         | all your requirements, plus:
         | 
         | - lots of outside time and exercise built into the day
         | 
         | - independent work
         | 
         | - low credential barrier to entry
        
         | bityard wrote:
         | These are the roles I seriously considered and actively
         | explored to some degree or another.
         | 
         | 1. Electrician. It's not something you can just jump into, even
         | if you're the type who can grok 100% of the theory, equipment,
         | and electrical code overnight. Even after you're all trained
         | up, you have to rank up through various levels, most of which
         | require working under someone else for X number of years. It
         | takes a decade or more before you really have much of a choice
         | of what you get to work on, and start making decent money. In
         | other words, it's a serious career change on-par with doctor or
         | lawyer, just with much less pay.
         | 
         | 2. Aircraft mechanic. I love planes. Aircraft are expensive
         | machines. Getting them repaired and maintained and also
         | extremely expensive. So being an aircraft mechanic should be
         | lucrative, right? Sadly, no. I don't know where the money goes,
         | but most aircraft mechanics make significantly under under the
         | median wage and don't have much flexibility on where they can
         | work.
         | 
         | 3. Pilot. I would LOVE to fly airplanes and get paid to do it.
         | But this is also another whole career in and of itself. The
         | training costs are extremely exorbitant. A regular job would
         | have me away from home more often than not. According to Real
         | Pilots, airlines are some of the worst employers to work for.
         | But all that aside, I would be a poor pilot because I have a
         | hard time mentally keeping track of numbers. And pilots have to
         | memorize and juggle an insane (to me) amount of numbers just to
         | land safely. I couldn't memorize more than about three numbers
         | for more than 10 seconds or so even at gunpoint.
         | 
         | 4. Real estate investor. Lots of people get surprisingly rich
         | from this. But it is a lot of work. The idea is pretty simple:
         | buy a run-down house at a discount, fix it up well enough to
         | rent, re-finance it to get your money back out, and then you
         | effectively have an income-producing property for free. Take
         | that money and go do the same on another one. The problem with
         | this is that the devil is in the details. Every deal is
         | different and unless you're lucky enough to have a mentor
         | willing to share resources and vet your deals, you are GOING to
         | mess it up. I tried this and it didn't work out for two big
         | reasons: 1) I can stay on top of projects, but running all
         | aspects of a business myself is not for me. And I could not
         | find anyone that I trusted to partner with. 2) The sudden large
         | increase in interest rates in the middle of my rehab meant that
         | refinancing was not a viable option. I was forced to sell the
         | property after it was done. I broke even monetarily, but gained
         | a lot of wisdom. I might dip my toes into the water with a
         | simpler strategy in the future, but that's a good 5-10 years
         | off.
         | 
         | 5. YouTuber. YT was nice in the beginning, but has consistently
         | been giving the shaft to content creators while keeping all the
         | profits for themselves. On top of that, I found that I really
         | hate editing video.
         | 
         | Right now, I've made peace with the fact that my current
         | destiny is getting paid fairly good money to sit in front of a
         | screen for 8 hours a day. The goal at this point is to sock
         | away as much as I can into index funds, to grow it as quickly
         | as possible, and retire early enough that I can essentially
         | devote my whole day every day to hobbies, grandchildren (if I
         | have them), and friends (if I have them).
        
         | narrator wrote:
         | Something that fits all of that is a career as a professional
         | athlete. Are you any good at golf? ;)
        
         | _heimdall wrote:
         | I can strongly recommend taking advantage of the engineering
         | salaries while you have access. 15 years in and I finally quit
         | my software career to start up a homestead/farm with no debt.
         | 
         | Closest I've come to a new job so far was almost taking a job
         | at a local sawmill, I just haven't quite tied up my own
         | projects yet to commit the time. Its run by an older local guy
         | who has been milling for decades. The list of things I could
         | learn from him is very, very long and access to good lumber is
         | a great perk.
        
           | sleepingreset wrote:
           | you win life.
        
         | singleshot_ wrote:
         | In case anyone is looking for the dead opposite, I highly
         | suggest practicing law.
        
         | senthil_rajasek wrote:
         | If you can relax requirement #3 then stand up comedy comes
         | close.
         | 
         | p.s : professional stand up comic here, been trying to quit my
         | day job for 14 years :-)
        
       | Joel_Mckay wrote:
       | Live the dream, and create something beautiful.
       | 
       | Some retire early =)
        
       | squigglydonut wrote:
       | Funny that "always be selling" is a core principle of his art. I
       | would describe him more of a businessman than artist. Maybe
       | designer. But an artist does not care about money. The art comes
       | first. Buyers must wait.
        
       | ojbyrne wrote:
       | "robots known as pen plotters" is a nice marketing twist that I
       | don't think I've heard before.
       | 
       | https://www.hpmuseum.net/exhibit.php?class=4&cat=24
        
       | BenFranklin100 wrote:
       | I've known a couple guys who've done this. In 18 months both were
       | back to work as full time programmers.
        
       | lasermatts wrote:
       | This really hits home.
       | 
       | I recently quit my job as a robotics engineer -- and I've been
       | painting a lot more and have noticed the quality of my work has
       | gone up. In the past few weeks I've had more sales than I had in
       | the year prior as I was doing it nights and weekends.
       | 
       | Super cool to read about other engineers-turned-artists and how
       | they approach their work!
        
       | datascienced wrote:
       | What sort of Engineer? I am guessing a mechanical engineer?
        
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