[HN Gopher] Tiny World Map
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       Tiny World Map
        
       Author : bopjesvla
       Score  : 331 points
       Date   : 2024-04-21 11:21 UTC (11 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (github.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (github.com)
        
       | thriftwy wrote:
       | I woule adjust city density based on surroundings. I remember
       | getting lost in Maps.me while in northern Russia: zooming out
       | will not display any tiny villages of the area whereas zooming in
       | will not place any of those on the screen. So you got a blank
       | slate.
       | 
       | Meanwhile, displaying every suburb of a metropolis possessing a
       | town status may be superfluous.
        
         | globular-toast wrote:
         | Interesting comment. I guess it should be optimised for density
         | uniformity somehow.
        
           | marcosdumay wrote:
           | That's the way to do it. You get the map area, divide it by a
           | constant and get the number of stuff your map should display.
           | Then it's a matter of getting the largest-n stuff from the
           | database.
        
         | RetroTechie wrote:
         | You can always zoom to a level such that there's nothing there.
         | And if all that _is_ there is a few small villages, then
         | "nothing there" isn't far of the mark anyway.
         | 
         | If you include smaller cities to 'fill in blank spaces', then
         | either:
         | 
         | a) You'd have to drop a bigger city/suburb elsewhere. Not
         | display a 1M town to be able to display a 10k town in thinly
         | populated area elsewhere? Hmmm...
         | 
         | b) Or the app get bigger. Which defeats the purpose of having a
         | tiny world map.
         | 
         | Want more detail? Just use some other app.
        
       | msephton wrote:
       | I was unable to find Easter Island.
        
         | xioxox wrote:
         | Yes, many of the islands are missing even if they have labels
         | (e.g. Faroe Islands). It would be nice if there was just a blob
         | there at least.
        
           | msephton wrote:
           | Agreed. I get that there has to be a trade off between size
           | and coverage, but if it's a map it should really have the
           | option - at least - for the person implement it to choose
           | density. Personally, I'd want every island to be at least
           | shown as a blob.
        
           | carlosjobim wrote:
           | The label is a blob.
        
           | rob74 wrote:
           | I noticed the islands too (apparently only islands above a
           | certain size "qualify" - of the Canary Islands you only get
           | Gran Canaria and Tenerife, of the Galapagos Islands only
           | Isabela, of the Azores - nothing), but all European
           | "microstates"
           | (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_microstates) are also
           | not shown, some of them (Liechtenstein, San Marino) not even
           | as labels.
        
         | 082349872349872 wrote:
         | high compression is usually lossy
        
         | playingalong wrote:
         | At least there is New Zealand.
        
       | sodimel wrote:
       | Really cool project!
        
       | keepamovin wrote:
       | This is SOO Good! Thank you for making this.
       | 
       | Just as an idea: I think your demo should include an optional
       | "Locate Me" button that requests geolocation perms and prints the
       | lat long point on the map.
        
       | ImHereToVote wrote:
       | Great product. Would be awesome if you could generate a smaller
       | version depending on which part of the world you are biased
       | towards.
        
       | rozab wrote:
       | This is cool, but the shorelines are very low detail. A few towns
       | in the UK are off in the sea, meanwhile Greenland and Northern
       | Canada are hogging all the vertices.
       | 
       | It looks as though the Mercator projection is already being
       | accounted for in the detail level, but it would be good to
       | deprioritize unpopulated areas.
        
         | nolok wrote:
         | This notably lead to making it not very usable at all in
         | islands or achipelago area. Even the philippines, with a lots
         | of islands sure but several ones of them being rather large, is
         | not usable.
         | 
         | French polynesia doesn't even exists on the map.
        
           | dorfsmay wrote:
           | Neither is Saint Pierre et Miquelon. There is the island of
           | la Reunion but no name, and the name for Ibiza but no
           | island...
           | 
           | I hope those can be fixed, I love the concept.
        
         | zimpenfish wrote:
         | > A few towns in the UK are off in the sea
         | 
         | And some, notably Manchester, are entirely absent.
        
           | noizejoy wrote:
           | > And some, notably Manchester, are entirely absent.
           | 
           | But Wrexham is shown - so the priorities seem correct. ;-)
           | 
           | [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wrexham_A.F.C.#2020%E2%80%9
           | 3pr...
        
           | ta1243 wrote:
           | Developer is clearly from Liverpool :D
           | 
           | It's odd - they've got places like Stockport, Salford, Oldham
           | etc, just not Manchester. Manchester has the highest
           | population of the boroughs in Greater Manchester
        
         | dansky wrote:
         | Nice project! It may be useful to select the included places
         | also by QRank of Wikidata [1] so notable islands will appear,
         | despite low populations. An SQLite DB of QRank [2] was also
         | posted here in HN a while ago.
         | 
         | [1] https://qrank.wmcloud.org/ [2]
         | https://github.com/hikeratlas/qrank
        
           | Aachen wrote:
           | (Saving people a click for link#1: qrank sorts Wikidata
           | entries by their pageviews across Wikipedia, Wikiquotes,
           | Wikibooks, etc.)
           | 
           | I'm not sure that an online popularity contest should be the
           | input for a base map. I understand the reasoning that they're
           | more likely to be viewed by someone, but it's also a bubble:
           | is Wikipedia / are Wikimedia projects as popular in Asia as
           | this base map will be? Is that used for the same purpose as
           | this base map? Should something be shown on a map when
           | there's a lot of drama about it rather than because a lot of
           | people live there?
           | 
           | I see the advantages also, like if literally nobody lives
           | there but it's an interesting or large landmass then there's
           | cause for it to be included. I just don't think this is the
           | right (objective, fairest) importance measure to use
        
         | perrygeo wrote:
         | The simplification was sloppy all around. Entire nations are
         | missing in the Caribbean. These are basic quality control
         | checks.
        
         | s0rce wrote:
         | Same with the Alaska Panhandle, lots of uninhabited complex
         | shoreline.
        
         | FinnKuhn wrote:
         | There also seem to be some bugs in this, just look at Hamburg,
         | Germany...
        
         | Aachen wrote:
         | The ratio/prioritisation of detail in cities to shorelines
         | seems oddly skewed towards including more cities over having
         | accurate borders or shorelines
         | 
         | It's showing an entire province in the Netherlands as
         | disconnected from the rest of the country, like it's an island
         | (it's not), but knows to name five cities inside of that
         | province, several of which basically on top of each other. (The
         | inclusion of the _afsluitdijk_ , on the other hand, is
         | unnecessary detail imo but I get that it's hard to
         | programmatically select those tweaks about what's considered
         | land which it needs to draw and just some sea infrastructure)
         | 
         | I should open a ticket on the issue tracker but am not logged
         | in on mobile so the best I can do atm is an HN comment. If
         | someone else has a moment and feels the same way, feel free to
         | cite this comment towards shifting the ratio a little! Or
         | introducing a minimum separation distance between cities, or
         | getting a smaller overall file, whatever the ideal solution may
         | be but the current ratio is a tad unnecessary
        
       | danparsonson wrote:
       | This is really nice although I'm finding the progressive loading
       | a bit unreliable - sometimes tiles don't display if I zoom and
       | pan quickly at the same time. I'm using FF 125.0 on Android.
        
       | _ache_ wrote:
       | I made the same (offline first, very small, vector based) but
       | with a focus on i18n. So it's available in all languages of the
       | United Nation (except Spanish because I just forgot, shame on me,
       | could be made in a couple of hours).
       | 
       | The name of the countries (and cities) are the official one
       | declared at the UN. So, yeah, the official short version of UK is
       | "United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland".
       | 
       | https://map.ache.one/en
        
         | barlog wrote:
         | Fabulous.
         | 
         | I read your rail ads story with interest.
         | 
         | Great perspective.
         | 
         | Su Qing rashiiShi Dian deshita from ja-JP
        
           | _ache_ wrote:
           | Thank you very much. How lovely.
        
           | gascoigne wrote:
           | Oh thank you for pointing this out!! I loved watching the ads
           | and reading _ache_'s commentary. Wonderful work.
           | 
           | https://ache.one/articles/rail-and-advertising for the
           | interested.
        
         | idoubtit wrote:
         | That's nice, but quite buggy. "Cape town" appears in South
         | Sudan, though the country is not named. Erythrea is also
         | missing its name. And there are 2 Somalia blocks, with
         | different colors.
         | 
         | My own experience is that it's rather easy to draw a light map
         | and deal with i18n. There are several open data sources and
         | libraries. The hard problem is purely administrative. If you
         | have data tied to most countries, there's certainly a mismatch
         | with your source for a map, and you have to build a custom map
         | yourself.
         | 
         | There is no consensus on what a country is. A few examples of
         | divergences: Western Sahara is officially a country, but
         | practically it's always been occupied by Morocco. Somalia is a
         | mess, with Somaliland and Puntland being de facto independant
         | coutries though noone acknoledge them officially. Between these
         | two categories, Greenland, Nue and a few others are not fully
         | independant.
        
         | konstantinua00 wrote:
         | "i18n" is very not internationalized abbreviation...
        
         | keraf wrote:
         | Not sure if the star is supposed to indicate the biggest city
         | or the capital, but if it's the latter, Tanzania has it wrong.
         | The star is on Dar Es Salaam but the label over it says Dodoma,
         | which is the name of the actual capital but it's more in the
         | center of the country.
        
       | _ache_ wrote:
       | It's very good !
       | 
       | - Get the islands back !
       | 
       | - Limit the zoom level to not pass through the land
       | 
       | - Make the Capital city maybe in light bold or slightly bigger to
       | differentiate them
       | 
       | - Fix long name
       | 
       | - Some cities disappear when you zoom.
        
       | yosito wrote:
       | This is cute, and I can imagine there are some use cases for it.
       | But I was disappointed to find out that it doesn't even have the
       | 150km2 island that I live on. Maybe a bit too small for most
       | cases.
        
         | sgtnoodle wrote:
         | It's funny that it doesn't have the great lakes. I guess it
         | doesn't have any internal bodies of water.
        
       | zekrioca wrote:
       | Interesting project! Would it be possible to add other types of
       | boundaries?
        
       | ytdytvhxgydvhh wrote:
       | Interesting that some relatively recent changes of preferred
       | names like Czech Republic->Czechia and Macedonia->North Macedonia
       | are on there but not Turkey->Turkiye and East Timor->Timor-Leste.
        
       | nakedrobot2 wrote:
       | Considering the coarseness of the borders, I am very surprised
       | this takes up as much space as it does. It seems like the total
       | data size is well under the threshold of utility vs. filesize. If
       | it were double the size, the borders wouldn't be so janky, for
       | example.
        
         | Aachen wrote:
         | The full file is some 700K without gzip compression
         | 
         | > all the data present in the complete version except for
         | country borders and shorelines. This reduces [the size] by 200k
         | 
         | So about 29% is border/shore data, 71% is city names and
         | locations
         | 
         | Imo a lot of cities could be dropped, especially when they're
         | on top of each other (not visible until you've zoomed in so far
         | to see a grey landmass and that city name) to make the
         | shorelines more accurate
         | 
         | I'm also not sure how often a general location on a world map
         | is needed. Wouldn't one more often want a low-KB map of the
         | surrounding highways and transit lines one can use to reach the
         | POI whose website you're currently looking at, for example? A
         | version for every few km2 on the planet could be built and you
         | could have quite a lot of useful detail at a tenth of the size.
         | Global low poly also has its purposes, like tracking the space
         | station I guess, but it seems much rarer
        
       | diamnom wrote:
       | This should really include capitals even if they are smaller than
       | 40k and star them in some way
        
       | xipho wrote:
       | Very cool. I've long wanted to make an 8-bit throwback style
       | "species page", think an EOL or wiki-page, or our own TaxonPages
       | effort (example at
       | https://orthoptera.speciesfile.org/otus/850075/overview). I'd
       | like to see how much (symbolic) information you could pack into
       | simplified figures etc, this would fit right in to answer the
       | question "where in the world can I find the species, roughly".
        
       | shadowpho wrote:
       | Wow the large file is <1MB, that's efficient
        
       | teo_zero wrote:
       | Is there a reason why New Dehli doesn't show up at any zoom
       | level?
        
       | pentagrama wrote:
       | This runs really smoothly on my midrange phone. On the GitHub
       | page it doesn't mention if there is translated versions, I will
       | consider it if there is a version in Spanish.
        
       | jimmyrocks wrote:
       | This is really cool! I'm super impressed at how quickly it loads
       | on my phone.
       | 
       | Really great idea to compress the spatial data into Paths.
       | 
       | I would suggest using Natural Earth data instead of OSM so you
       | could drop the ODbL license.
       | 
       | It'd also be really cool if you included the tool that converts
       | the spatial data into Paths.
        
       | majkinetor wrote:
       | Those 2 banners about usage are so prominent and distracting
       | without the option to hide them. It makes it unusable for me.
        
       | thinkingemote wrote:
       | Love the service worker idea. What other things could service
       | workers do with maps?
        
       | BodyCulture wrote:
       | Lots of errors, why does this exist? What is the use case for a
       | map without precision?
        
         | echoangle wrote:
         | That's stated in the description. As a fallback and when you
         | only need general location.
        
       | LeifCarrotson wrote:
       | I think I love the idea - solve the problem of "you zoomed out
       | too far, now wait for the server to load tiles for the continent
       | you just asked to be rendered" - but I'm not sure what the use
       | cases are where I need to know where West Bloomfield Township is
       | in relationship to Waterford Charter Township (both suburbs of
       | Detroit) but not what state they're in or even that the _Great
       | Lakes_ exist.
       | 
       | I would like to see a lot more data put into coastlines and a lot
       | less into subdividing major metropolitan areas.
        
       | jokoon wrote:
       | seems a bit weird to use a service worker to do an offline
       | version... the tutorial linked is long and worthless if you want
       | people to quickly install and use it, you need to either make a
       | shorter more concise tutorial.
       | 
       | imagine somebody loses internet access, he can't really open this
       | thing to just access a map, I don't understand.
       | 
       | why not just provide a html file with the tiles encoded as base64
       | or something similar? just provide a zip file... I am not a web
       | developer, this seems like a good thing, but deployment is
       | 1/10... minimalist things are supposed to be very easy to deploy.
       | 
       | EDIT: just saving the page, and it works. I don't understand what
       | the service workers are for. web dev has mysterious ways.
        
         | likeclockwork wrote:
         | That's what service workers are for.
         | 
         | This service worker explicitly caches all the resources the app
         | needs to run then intercepts requests for those resources so
         | all the JS that depends on the resources still runs while
         | you're offline.
         | 
         | If you had visited the site in the past, even if you were
         | offline you would be able to go to that URL and the service
         | worker would serve everything needed from cache.
        
       | mattlondon wrote:
       | I think I would have personally liked to have seen less small
       | towns, and more major roads.
        
       | NeoTar wrote:
       | I was interested to learn that the 10.000 largest settlements in
       | the world gets you get down to 48.000 population. I'm still
       | trying to work out if that is a surprising figure or not.
        
       | lloydatkinson wrote:
       | I think there's a flaw in this idea.
       | 
       | > By default, the map displays the 10,000 most populous cities
       | added to OpenStreetMap. At the time of writing, this encompasses
       | all cities and towns with a population of at least 48,000:
       | 
       | Statistically speaking, if you're closer to or even in those
       | cities, you are more likely to have access to better network
       | quality and speed. It's when you're in the more remote areas (or
       | not near a population centre of 48,000 people...) that this
       | project would be more useful.
       | 
       | If this map is only 300KB zipped and as it mentions offline-
       | first, then surely a 1MB version would get you even better
       | fidelity and more remote locations?
        
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       (page generated 2024-04-21 23:00 UTC)