[HN Gopher] Requirements for Japanese Text Layout
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Requirements for Japanese Text Layout
Author : nxobject
Score : 36 points
Date : 2024-02-25 09:48 UTC (13 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.w3.org)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.w3.org)
| nxobject wrote:
| Everything you wanted to know about Japanese typography, and
| more.
| tkgally wrote:
| Yes, indeed. I've had a professional interest in Japanese
| typography for many years, having worked on many Japanese
| dictionaries and other publications, but this document contains
| much that I didn't know.
| ngcc_hk wrote:
| Very interesting. And provide both Japanese and English version
| (both separately and together) is a God sent.
| sylware wrote:
| Isn't text shapping more in the unicode scope than in w3c scope?
| phonon wrote:
| This isn't glyph shaping, it's text layout.
| sylware wrote:
| Which is called text shaping.
|
| ????
| dhosek wrote:
| text shaping is not a thing. Unicode provides some basic
| parameterization (e.g., indicating where valid line breaks
| can occur in a text), but does not provide much more in the
| way of layout specification, nor should it. It's a text
| encoding specification, not a typography specification. You
| will also notice that it does not include, e.g.,
| specifications about Latin alphabet typographic ligatures
| either (e.g., f+f+i - ffi). The existence of some ligatures
| in the Unicode standard is a sop to backwards compatibility
| with older encodings only (this is also why Unicode
| includes superscript/subscript digits, box drawing
| characters and a number of inconsistencies in how different
| scripts are managed).
| re5i5tor wrote:
| In season 2 of Tokyo Vice, they show character Jake, a reporter
| for newspaper Meicho Shimbun, using a native Japanese "word"
| processor to type in his stories. Really fascinating and seems to
| be authentic.
| dhosek wrote:
| I remember being absolutely fascinated by the ability of
| 1980s/early 1990s Japanese laptops to manage input with a
| standard keyboard. Especially given the computing resources of
| the time, it seemed like serious dark magic.
| wahnfrieden wrote:
| Web has great support for Japanese. Apple native support on iOS
| and macOS is relatively abysmal, with piss poor support for basic
| needs like ruby text.
| nxobject wrote:
| Yeah - my understanding is that, if you really want a cross-
| platform product, you'll have to license a commercial engine.
| wahnfrieden wrote:
| I like using web views including rendering them to png or pdf
|
| Apple has some janky old UIKit and less-so AppKit support for
| Japanese that's portable to use from SwiftUI so I get by
| without needing web views for every label. However it's still
| nice to just use a web view for primary content.
|
| There's zero input support for advanced Japanese features on
| native Apple platforms basically, like ruby text editing, but
| they can be bolted on cleverly with work. Or just use a web
| view.
| o11c wrote:
| Hm, I'm having a weird and interesting issue with this website.
|
| I'm using Firefox ESR with the (recommended) Auto Tab Discard [1]
| extension to save memory for idle background tabs. Unlike prior
| extensions AFAIU this _should_ be using largely native browser
| code paths.
|
| When I return to the jlreq page after it has idled out, all the
| Japanese text comes back and the "English" button is inoperative
| until I click one of the other language options.
|
| Whose bug is this?
|
| [1]: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/auto-tab-
| disc...
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(page generated 2024-02-25 23:00 UTC)