[HN Gopher] Power Metal: is it really about dragons? (2018)
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Power Metal: is it really about dragons? (2018)
Author : guardienaveugle
Score : 269 points
Date : 2024-02-24 07:47 UTC (15 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (notes.atomutek.org)
(TXT) w3m dump (notes.atomutek.org)
| gnatolf wrote:
| This is lovely!
|
| Since I always struggle with the ton of subgenres, some lyric
| based clustering is as good as anything to separate genres.
|
| Maybe we should run this on all that has electric guitars...
| lukan wrote:
| "some lyric based clustering is as good as anything to separate
| genres"
|
| I think melody and rhythm are kind of important, too (otherwise
| a minstrels verbal recitation could count as power metal). But
| it definitely is a good metric.
| gnatolf wrote:
| I wonder whether bands are more consistent in style of play
| over their lifetime, as compared to lyrics or other
| 'metrics'. It's probably easy to find all types of
| variance/consistency.
|
| My hunch would be that the more specific and entrenched a
| genre is, the closer these bands stick to their styles (and
| lyrics).
| lukan wrote:
| "My hunch would be that the more specific and entrenched a
| genre is, the closer these bands stick to their styles (and
| lyrics)."
|
| They usually also have the problem, that their fans often
| don't like them to change. They want more of what they
| know, but better. Not different (especially in entrenched
| genres).
|
| Turisas for example, a band making songs mainly about
| vikings. I watched them live a few years ago - was quite
| good, but the band made remarks that they do not take the
| whole viking thing that serious (nostalgic buisness they
| called it) and would rather play something else. And they
| did one song in the end, in a quite different style
| (sounded like futuristic metal) but the audience was not
| thrilled - they were there for viking and glorious battle
| metal. So this is what Turisas are still playing, this is
| what brings them money, but they have not made a new album
| in over 10 years, but how can you make a good album, with a
| theme you don't find that exiting anymore?
| powermetal wrote:
| If you want that, ideally you should spin up a new band
| name for a project thats too different in style from a
| band whose style you have already established. Its not
| that people resist change, thats how thrash metal bands
| changed into death metal slowly and the invention of
| death metal is highly celebrated. But it was a slow and
| organic change. Typically bands that have some sense
| about this tend to spin up a different name if they want
| to play something totally different from their existing
| band.
| lukan wrote:
| In general, for sure. Only some big bands have managed to
| change their style and have their fans follow them. For
| most a different band would make the most sense. And I am
| only guessing about Turisas, but they probably should
| have done so, but it was probably more comfortable to
| make money with the established hits and name. Starting
| something new is not easy, after all.
| necromantic wrote:
| If the musicians are already famous from one or other
| particular band, then they should easily pull up a strong
| fan following for their other projects too. Just look at
| how many people look up the large number of random
| projects of Speckmann even if say they had found out the
| band "Master" first.
| justforasingle wrote:
| I found power metal because I was looking for a more positive
| sub-genre of metal. What I was listening to before often had
| ahrimanic themes - death, violence, satanism etc.
| Semaphor wrote:
| I'm not big into power metal (I prefer death, violence and
| satanism ;)), but let me recommend you an extremely positive
| power metal band that I absolutely love: Fellowship from the UK
| https://fellowshipmetal.bandcamp.com/album/the-saberlight-ch...
| bogdan wrote:
| I grew up on power metal and nowadays I mainly listen to two
| genres: black metal and classical music. One of the things they
| have in common is that I can't understand a word in either. I
| really appreciate that because I find lyrics in songs
| distracting and most of the time cringy.
| spindle wrote:
| I'm the same. Fortunately for me, I don't understand
| Japanese, and there's some great Japanese power metal - e.g.
| Marge Litch and Alhambra.
| mikub wrote:
| Almost the same for me, It's either blackmetal, classic or
| some ambient which works best for me when I want to
| concentrate on something. But sometimes I still need to
| listen to some good old cheesy Powermetal, sing along and
| feel like I should start immediately to conquer the world to
| defeat all the evil that is out there. ;)
| aerhardt wrote:
| I can't listen to music with vocals at work, but I still
| listen to power metal 20 years later in quite a few contexts
| - gym, car, walk, simply active listening. I can't argue with
| the quality of the lyrics being cringey though.
|
| I've always thought it's a combination of the genre being
| niche and being founded on a set of lyrical themes that are
| restrictive - and maybe particularly challenging -, and also,
| the fact that _a lot_ of these bands aren 't from English-
| speaking countries. The bands from anglo countries like
| Kamelot tend to write acceptable lyrics within the power
| metal context (Manowar lyrics are hilarious at times and
| arguably well-written, but they are not power metal IMO).
| There are some noteable exceptions to non-anglo bands with
| polished lyrics, like perhaps Nightwish or Blind Guardian,
| but a common occurrence otherwise is to find shitty English,
| which at least for me is an instant turnoff.
| mikub wrote:
| I can imagine some lyrics can be hard to listen to for an
| english speaking native. Manowar made a german version of
| "Heart of steal" it's called "Herz aus Stahl" it's so bad
| when I heard it for the first time I thought "Oh man I hope
| we don't sound that bad to all the people who speak english
| when we're singing english."
| aerhardt wrote:
| I don't know if it's that bad... In my experience the
| English lyrics from these euro power metal bands are ~98%
| good, but then there's the odd line that has you reach
| for a thesaurus to see if that's real English or they've
| pulled it out of their butts, and most of the time it's
| the latter. It's pretty off-putting, it would be
| perfectly OK if that was it, but it often brings your
| attention to the fact that the lyrics are very weak in
| general.
| ethbr1 wrote:
| Did some dialog work for a German game company when I was
| younger.
|
| In one of the raw scripts I received from the German
| side, I remember staring at "medicament" for a long time,
| before looking it up.
|
| So yes, I know the feeling. :)
| devonkim wrote:
| FWIW, Kreator, Scorpions, Destruction, Sodom, and
| basically every other German metal band probably have
| better English than most native speaker groups for the
| past 40+ years. Americans in particular seem to do quite
| poorly at speaking other languages partly because to be
| American, particularly in cities, one needs to know
| several dialects given the many different creoles and
| vernacular groups due to the country being so massive and
| diverse.
| Bahamut wrote:
| Interestingly enough, I believe while Kamelot was founded
| in the US, most of the members are from Europe currently.
|
| One thing I learned ~15 years ago was that Nightwish
| commissioned lyrics from lyricists (one such commissioned
| person told me himself I believe a year or two after Dark
| Passion Play was released - they never used what he wrote
| for them though) - maybe that helps give the polished
| impression for some.
| DinaCoder99 wrote:
| There's a lot of overlap between metal and classical music
| (by which I mean orchestral, symphonic, and chamber, not the
| specific age). Something about the composition and structure
| of the music activates similar parts of my brain, and both
| are excellent to work to.
|
| (Of course, there's only so far you can push this--some metal
| bands are much closer to pop or jazz, and some classical
| music is quite distinctively its own thing.)
| nickjj wrote:
| > There's a lot of overlap between metal and classical
| music (by which I mean orchestral, symphonic, and chamber,
| not the specific age).
|
| Yep, there's a whole bunch of bands in the symphonic
| deathcore genre. Shadow of Intent, The Archaic Epidemic,
| Lorna Shore and Immortal Disfigurement are a few that come
| to mind.
| rendaw wrote:
| Lyrics in metal I assume? Otherwise that's a rather wide
| brush.
| Blackthorn wrote:
| If it's not cheesy, it's not power metal. Eventually you just
| realize that you're a cheesy person yourself and embrace it.
| scruple wrote:
| I listen to mostly non-English European black metal at work
| for the same reason.
| aerhardt wrote:
| I found power metal when I was a kid because one of the things
| I like the most about rock and metal are operatic but growly
| vocals. I consider some of the singers in this list, like Jorn
| Lande (Masterplan, Ark), Oliver Hartmann (At Vance) and Michael
| Kiske (Helloween) some of the best singers in the history of
| rock, period.
| Scarblac wrote:
| What's the genre of Electric Callboy called? Partycore?
|
| See songs like We Got The Moves on YouTube. Music can be really
| heavy and still all about fun.
| powermetal wrote:
| Power metal is either brazen ego worship and/or or similarly
| (to death metal) talking of topics like mass murders and rapes.
| Though unlike the more neutral/clinical approach of death
| metal, power metal lyrics usually come from an angle of
| glorifying these things.
|
| edit: I am merely relaying the common lyrical subjects of the
| genre. I made no judgment whether its a good or bad thing.
| powermetal wrote:
| Examples:
|
| _" Deathrider" (Omen)_
|
| Death rider, you've taken the earth by storm
|
| Death rider, out of sin and hatred you were born
|
| Ride against the wind, shameless killer in the night
|
| Rape another village, before the break of light
|
| Trample down the ashes, grind them with your hate
|
| Take another helpless life, before it's too late
|
| _" Harder than Steel" (Jag Panzer)_
|
| You put their heads on the grinding wheel
|
| Give 'em hell 'cause you're harder than steel
|
| Oh, you're harder than steel, yeah, ya feel
|
| All for yourself and no one else
|
| -------------------------------
|
| Now of course you can say its just two examples, but it seems
| to be a decent representative of common themes in power metal
| lyrics. Obviously the best way to find out would be
| performing a similar data analysis as the article.
|
| edit: These are both famous power metal bands, in case there
| was a feeling they were from any other genre:
|
| https://rateyourmusic.com/release/album/omen/battle-cry/
|
| https://rateyourmusic.com/release/album/jag-panzer/ample-
| des...
| Exoristos wrote:
| Your experience of the lyrics might benefit from learning
| about literary devices. For example:
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apostrophe_(figure_of_speech)
| ?... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiperspectivity?wprov
| =sfti1
| swman wrote:
| I enjoy death metal because it is aggressive and brutal. It
| also spans everything from just good ol' vengeance music to
| literally galactic conquest.
|
| Whatever the case, this kind of music helps me CRUSH the
| problem at hand. When nothing seems to be working, headbang for
| a little bit or make a solo mosh pit in my office, and then get
| back to DESTROYING the problem.
| feldrim wrote:
| Impressive work. I believe Encyclopaedia Metallum[0] would be a
| better source for the corpus, though the noise rate would be
| higher as there are many one-song/single/demo album bands, along
| with bands making music in multiple genres in different eras in
| their lifetime.
|
| 0. https://www.metal-archives.com/
| btown wrote:
| The ability to find lyrics on lyric sites would be a reasonable
| proxy for sufficient popularity, I'd imagine.
|
| On a semi-related note, when talking about large genre-specific
| corpuses, https://vgmdb.net has a fascinating scope definition
| across all things game and animation adjacent, including both
| the massive doujin (fan-made) music scene and the full
| discographies of many j-pop artists and composers, all
| annotated by franchise adjacency with (often) full staff
| credits: https://vgmdb.net/forums/showthread.php?t=22321
|
| It's a fascinating corpus and one I'd love to analyze deeply
| one day.
| hypercube33 wrote:
| For metal lyrics the go to used to be dark lyrics but it
| never shows in search results.
| camel-cdr wrote:
| Encyclopaedia Metallum is an amazing resource, it's also quite
| scrapable. I managed to quickly throw thogether a set of small
| bash scripts to crossreference the midgard [0] leaks with metal
| artists.
|
| [0] The midgard (Nazi online shop) sales record was leaked,
| including personal information, so I won't link it here
| hn_go_brrrrr wrote:
| Is that cross-reference published anywhere?
| YeGoblynQueenne wrote:
| What did you find? We know there's plenty of far-right ideas
| in black metal but other sub-genres?
| DeathArrow wrote:
| I listen to Power Metal only because it is the closest genre to
| classical Heavy Metal (Iron Maiden, Ozzy Osbourne,Motorhead,
| Judas Priest) and almost no band sings classical Heavy Metal
| anymore.
| Semaphor wrote:
| > almost no band sings classical Heavy Metal anymore.
|
| That's just not true, at all. Just look for the "trad[itional]"
| genre. I don't enjoy it, but there are a lot of releases there.
|
| edit: Or just combine heavy metal and either hard rock or
| thrash on something like RYM, that should also give you a lot
| of those. Here's Hard Rock + Heavy Metal for the 2020s:
| https://rateyourmusic.com/charts/top/album/2020s/g:all,hard%...
| dazzawazza wrote:
| I'll seed you Seven Sisters (UK), Riot city (Can), Traveler
| (Can), Toledo Steel (UK), Road Wolf (Austria), Bullet (Swe),
| Crazy Lixx (Swe).
|
| Take those to BandCamp/Metal Archives and look for "bands like"
| these and you'll see there are hundreds of UK, Canadian and
| Swedish bands.
|
| There is also the ever awesome Jorn (Swe) still putting out
| amazing Heavy Metal.
|
| Hope that helps. No need to listen to power metal ;)
| einherjae wrote:
| Jorn is (Nor), not (Swe)
|
| - A Norwegian
| kriberg wrote:
| I'll fetch the oars. These folks need a visit
| dazzawazza wrote:
| I'll never accept Norway's separation! /s
|
| A Brit here... sorry. Epic singer either way.
| dleslie wrote:
| Traveler is amazing, I second that recommendation.
|
| Also, a point of interest: Riot City and Traveler are both
| from Calgary.
|
| Vancouver, Calgary and Quebec City are sort of the trio of
| metal in Canada; AFAICT.
| asadotzler wrote:
| This. Also, it more closely butts up against a couple of other
| metals I enjoy including symphonic.
| pjgalbraith wrote:
| There's been a huge revival of traditional heavy metal over the
| last 10 or so years. Look up NWOTHM for a list of some of the
| bands.
| mindcrime wrote:
| Try some of these out:
|
| https://www.youtube.com/@NWOTHMFullAlbums
| powermetal wrote:
| Trad revival is a big thing these days. But I think there is
| something subtle about even older power metal that sometimes
| makes it a bit different from something you'd class as "plain"
| speed metal. Its a bit hard to put in words precisely. But that
| is why I love the genre so much. I am not so much into pure
| speed metal or thrash metal.
| YeGoblynQueenne wrote:
| Oh man, you're so gonna love this:
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_wave_of_traditional_heavy_...
|
| This should probably be your next stop:
|
| https://www.youtube.com/@NWOTHMFullAlbums
|
| And here's a small selection of some of my favourites from that
| new wave:
|
| https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLsmrGn_1E13fBQkyefFGu...
| tgv wrote:
| > Bands from Spain ... have an average of more than 1600 words
| vocabulary
|
| > Country, Nr of bands
|
| > Spain, 1
| aerhardt wrote:
| A pity, because there was a vibrant power metal scene here in
| the 90s and 2000s. They mostly sang in Spanish though.
| anthk wrote:
| Spain had Basque speed metal bands, but not Power. Also
| there's Reno Renardo but it's an obvious parody of Metal, a
| la Nanowar.
| darkwater wrote:
| Big Nanowar fan here, but I would not day they parody
| metal...I mean, they obviously do but at the same time they
| actually like metal. So, it's not your typical parody, it's
| more kind of an inside joke.
| anthk wrote:
| The same with Reno Renardo, obviouly they do tons of
| references to the most known bands.
| aerhardt wrote:
| I can't tell from your comment whether you're saying that
| there were no power metal bands in the Basque Country, or
| more broadly in Spain... If it's the latter: there was
| absolutely a power metal scene in Spain. Avalanch, Warcry,
| Dark Moor (in the article) were power metal all the way and
| extremely prominent in the broader metal scene - they were
| some of the biggest metal bands of the early 2000s.
| Saratoga and Tierra Santa were not strictly power metal,
| but very closely adjacent (especially the latter, both
| lyrically and musically). There were plenty of smaller
| bands trying to make it in the space, too.
| anthk wrote:
| Yeah, I forgot about Warcry and Avalanch. Tierra Santa
| definitively had some overlap with Power Metal.
|
| I was about to say 'Basque Power Metal' bands. Berri
| Txarrak it's more akin to Rise Against. Su Ta Gar it's
| speed metal with some thrash influences.
| TheAceOfHearts wrote:
| It would probably make the analysis a bit difficult, but it
| would be interesting to see it incorporate more international
| bands.
|
| Some bands are still going strong, although my favorite band
| Mago de Oz feels like it definitely peaked between 2000 and
| 2010 with the release of the Gaia albums. I'm not sure that
| I'd call all their albums power metal, but some of their
| newer stuff is definitely more power metal-y.
|
| If anyone is looking for a great Spanish metal album, I'd
| recommend checking out Gaia II: La voz dormida. It tells a
| really ambitious story with amazing music to back it. And it
| ends with an epic 21 minute song that I don't even know how
| to describe.
| aerhardt wrote:
| I don't think Mago de Oz was power metal, but their early
| 2000s material definitely had some influences, since power
| metal was such an important current in European metal at
| the time.
| anthk wrote:
| Mago is Folk Metal. Also, before Gaia there was Finisterra
| which was everywhere.
| lukan wrote:
| "2000 and 2010 with the release of the Gaia albums"
|
| That is when I was listening to them and did not follow on
| them later on. Did they produce anything interesting after
| that? Even just a single good song?
| Semaphor wrote:
| Mago de Oz has been active since 1989 and just released
| another album this year. Lepoka is a more folky band that
| nevertheless sound very much MdO inspired. Still alive and
| kicking :)
| agravier wrote:
| Oh hey Matt nice to see you around here. This post is popular,
| maybe release the code? :)
| iosonofuturista wrote:
| I second this motion... I really want to apply this to stoner
| doom and really see if it's all about "bong" "wizard" "weed"
| "mammoths" or not!
| robin_reala wrote:
| Ah, another MWWB fan.
| anthk wrote:
| OFC Gamma Ray is the least Power Metal band. Gamma Ray it's like
| blending Helloween and Pet Shop Boys. Still, a lot of albums from
| GR surpass Helloween. Yes, even the Keeper one.
| aerhardt wrote:
| Not my favorite band by a stretch, but Gamma Ray is 100% power
| metal, and nothing in it reminds me remotely of Pet Shop
| Boys... If anything, it's the unshakeable Helloween influence
| that brings the melodic happy metal vibes.
| kriberg wrote:
| That's just the Kai Hansen doing his thing. He's also been
| quite active as a producer.
| anthk wrote:
| Yes and no. The first records are a genius mix blending power
| metal and synth like rhythms.
|
| I think there's a noticeable difference from the block of
| 'Heading for Tomorrow' until 'Insanity...' and 'The Land of
| the Free'.
|
| Then there's a pure power metal band.
| aerhardt wrote:
| Only in Hacker News would I find a post about data science and
| power metal. Geeky af, but rad!
| hypercube33 wrote:
| I think it's mutually inclusive since the interests are shared
| by some - I've found a bunch of business intelligence nerds at
| metal festivals running stats on everything they can get data
| for.
|
| For example the metal cruise festival I go on has a group that
| made their own bands on board tracking app and they release
| stats on who wants to see what bands and if people marked later
| that they enjoyed it, etc.
| tekla wrote:
| Have you literally never been on a metal forum?
| aerhardt wrote:
| > Have you literally never been on a metal forum?
|
| Is it common to talk about data science in metal forums?
| Semaphor wrote:
| FWIW, I posted this on a pretty active metal discord, and
| only one person found it interesting.
| wodenokoto wrote:
| Article says source code to be released. Since it is from 2018, I
| assume it already has been released. Anyone have a link?
| toastedwedge wrote:
| I couldn't find it, either. I looked around their Github and
| Twitter going back to 2018.
|
| I would wager it was a case of life getting busy,
| unfortunately, as happens to us all.
| scop wrote:
| I only recently discovered Blind Guardian. Typically listened to
| thrash, rarely power metal. Man, what excellence. Brilliant
| vocals, great choruses, distinct and unique sense of melody both
| on guitar and vocals. Something I really love about them is that
| vocals, guitars, and drums all have very prominent and distinct
| parts. In many bands I feel like one instrument will often
| dominate and the band becomes boring. I.e. great vocals, no
| guitar solos or great guitar but could care less for vocals. When
| I started listening to Blind Guardian and heard a chorus for the
| first time, I thought "Dang that was awesome, but I bet the
| guitar solo will suck or not exist"...and MAN was I wrong.
| Brilliant vocals _and_ brilliant guitar work. And then that
| drumming is just always _going_. My life is 2% better for having
| found them.
| ykonstant wrote:
| Blind Guardian carried me through high school on the backs of
| dragons.
| scop wrote:
| Goosebumps reading that. On the back of dragons!
| NamTaf wrote:
| In fairness, early BG very much aligns more with speed metal,
| which is a fairly close sibling to thrash. It was that vector
| that got me into them more than my latter appreciation for
| power metal in all its bombastic soaring-vocal glory.
| powermetal wrote:
| European/german power metal bands tend to be more speed metal
| based. American power metal retained closeness to heavy metal
| more. I would recommend him to try out bands like Helstar and
| Jag Panzer next.
| scop wrote:
| Good point. Hearing that low E quickly chug gave me a known
| point of familiarity that allowed me to explore with
| enjoyment.
| taneq wrote:
| Hah, wow, I went through a massive Blind Guardian phase. Love
| their stuff.
| mikub wrote:
| I still consider "Nightfall in middle earth" one of the best
| albums of all times. I remember waiting in front of the
| recordstore on the releasday in 1998, came home and listened to
| it from start to finish a few times while reading the newest
| "Rock Hard" magazine, good times. Even today it's one of the
| few albums I still enjoy listening from start to finish.
| mynegation wrote:
| The start of "Into the storm" after Morgoth says "She, the
| mistress of her own lust" on a spoken intro track gives me
| the shivers to this day and I still consider it the best
| banging start of the album I have ever heard.
| scop wrote:
| "Into the Storm" is just brilliant. Punching intro, vocals
| come in for a little "soft" intro themselves, and then
| vocals go _hard_ ("where can I run") and we're off to the
| races. I'm typically a guitar guy, but man I really enjoy
| Hansi's talents to compose vocals...mixing moods, styles,
| speed, all in the span of a few verses. Reminds me of "Time
| Stands Still". That second verse comes in real self-
| reflective and interior like ("I stand alone") and then
| BOOM "I dare you!!!".
| senderista wrote:
| I discovered that album in 1999 (via Hansi's "Demons and
| Wizards" project with Iced Earth), and it's one of the few
| metal albums I still listen to regularly 25 years later. (It
| really helps if you've read some of the Silmarillion, of
| course.) Hard to pick a favorite track since it's so
| consistently excellent, but maybe "The Curse of Feanor" gets
| the most play.
|
| Also, attending a BG concert at the old Graceland in Seattle
| back in 2004 or so and singing along to "The Bard's Song"
| with a few hundred other fans who knew all the words was
| definitely a peak geek moment.
| qiller wrote:
| I definitely consider NIME to be best BG album. They tried to
| replicate the same level of complexity in their follow up
| albums, but the sound engineering and mixing just never felt
| the same. NIME sounds crisp and clear and every after is too
| layered and muddy
| hypercube33 wrote:
| One thing that's changed my metal taste is going to metal
| festivals that mish mash everything together and making an
| effort to just go see bands who I have no idea about even if I
| listen to their music and am unsure about liking it.
|
| One of my favorite things about metal is how diverse it is and
| sometimes it just gets silly even if it appears absolutely
| serious - I think seeing the bands when they are having the
| most fun let's them try things you won't see in their music or
| videos or even on a regular tour.
|
| In case anyone is into video games and power metal and lives
| somewhere near Madison WI there is a festival called Mad With
| Power my wife found last year that falls into the bucket of how
| is this even a thing but it's a joy to experience.
|
| There are also a few metal cruises I've been on that are
| absolutely not what you'd expect and are mostly people hugging
| everyone and have things like cupcake decorating classes.
| ethbr1 wrote:
| If you ever get a chance, I'd recommend seeing either of the
| Trans-Siberian Orchestra touring bands. Their show is a
| pretty spectacular mishmash of everything... and Christmas.
|
| Sadly, Vitalij Kuprij just passed. :/
|
| https://www.nme.com/en_au/news/music/trans-siberian-
| orchestr...
| Slartie wrote:
| > There are also a few metal cruises I've been on that are
| absolutely not what you'd expect and are mostly people
| hugging everyone and have things like cupcake decorating
| classes.
|
| What cruises are you talking about? I've been on seven
| iterations of the US-based 70kTons cruise, which AFAIK is the
| oldest and biggest metal cruise. And while people there are
| generally very friendly and awesome, I've never seen cupcake
| decorating classes. Instead, people were discussing drum
| techniques, beer and whisky, metal music and
| concerts...pretty much exactly what you'd expect on such an
| event. The most exquisite topics were probably politics and
| costumes (there's sort of an unofficial costume contest on
| the last day of that cruise).
| aerhardt wrote:
| Here in Spain they were arguably the biggest power metal band
| ever. Shirts with their art were very common - a tier below
| Maiden shirts, but putting up a respectable fight in
| popularity. They also filled some of the best venues - not
| stadiums, but the tier right below, the premium venues, which I
| think is a great achievement for such a niche genre.
|
| When I was a kid I loved some of their classics like Mirror
| Mirror, but I wasn't as much into them as some of my entourage,
| as I preferred other styles of vocals. Recently however I've
| come to appreciate them again because Spotify suggested "Sacred
| Worlds" from the album Edge of Time. I love fully orchestrated
| metal - Metallica's S&M with the San Fran Symphonic or
| Nightwish's Once with the London Philarmonic - and "Sacred
| Worlds" is an absolute banger within this rare subgenre.
| hn_go_brrrrr wrote:
| Scorpions with the Berlin Phil is also fabulous.
| aerhardt wrote:
| Thanks for the recommendation, I knew they had done that
| but had never listened to it. Love me some Scorpions and of
| course Berlin Philarmoniker is cream of the crop.
| senderista wrote:
| It's funny, "Mirror Mirror" is the biggest hit from NIME but
| it's my least favorite track on the album. I'm not a huge fan
| overall of ANATO but "Precious Jerusalem" might be their most
| epic chorus ever.
| aerhardt wrote:
| I had forgotten about that one - it was actually my
| favorite cut too. The chorus is indeed a banger - extremely
| creative. I think Mirror Mirror was the more popular track
| because it had an anthem quality to it. Easier to sing with
| your friends at a bar or a concert, while Precious
| Jerusalem is pretty much progressive metal.
| dalmo3 wrote:
| Oh the little bridge before the chorus is even more
| majestic, gives me goosebumps every time.
|
| I used to "hate" ANATO for a long time but now it's easily
| my favourite from them and every time I listen to it it
| gets better. It's one of a handful of albums that to this
| day I can sit down and do nothing but listen to the music.
| No multitasking. (Though I guess trying to pick out each
| vocal track _is_ a very multitasking activity).
| ponector wrote:
| Powerwolf is another great band with orchestrated metal
| albums.
| scop wrote:
| Love S&M 1&2, "All Within My Hands" being maybe my favorite
| from the two albums.
|
| One thing of note: I essentially only listen to metal and
| classical. Everything else is dead boring to me. -\\_(tsu)_/-
| Helmut10001 wrote:
| Blind Guardian is well known in Europe, but very little
| overseas. I went to a concert once and the mood was really
| good. The crowd sang for themselves for half an hour. The band
| was going for 3 hours altogether. Everyone was friendly
| (nothing else I expected with power metal).
| a_gnostic wrote:
| > but very little overseas
|
| Except in Japan (1).
|
| 1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mwPlMB_dAo8
| mlinhares wrote:
| And all of South America. They could do a concert in almost
| any big city in Brazil and fill up the place. And also not
| sing, as people would sing every single song for them.
| mlinhares wrote:
| A Blind Guardian concert in Latin America might have been
| the closest thing I've ever had to a religious
| experience, now that I think about it.
| Klonoar wrote:
| Japan and Metal have a unique relationship at this point.
| scop wrote:
| I don't know much about it, other than knowing some of my
| favorite bands have huge followings there. Can anybody
| educate me how the Japanese metal scene functions? Are
| there certain genres that have a hold or is it totally
| diverse?
| znpy wrote:
| Had a very similar feel when I discovered Domine as a
| teenager... the temes are also very varied. You can see what
| the band was reading (in terms of fantasy novels) through the
| years :)
| mtlmtlmtlmtl wrote:
| If you like thrash and great vocals, check out Forbidden if you
| haven't. Late 80s early 90s technical thrash whose singer has
| some wild range. Twisted Into Form is their best album IMO.
| Their reunion album Omega Wave is also excellent.
| nihilius wrote:
| Take a look at
| https://www.last.fm/de/music/Demons+&+Wizards/Touched+by+the...
| and https://www.last.fm/de/music/Savage+Circus/Dreamland+Manor
| On mobile right now but I think these are second bands from
| blind guardians lead singer and guitarist. Maybe take a look at
| the Wikipedia page. I don't know wo exactly right now. It's a
| while ago i listend to them. But it was great at the time.
| Tornhoof wrote:
| A thread about Blind Guardian and there is no obligatory link
| to a crowd singing The Bard's Song?
|
| Let me remedy this https://youtu.be/i-IcX_bccFc
| 082349872349872 wrote:
| So is there anyone else doing concept albums like Nightwish'
| "Endless Forms Most Beautiful"?
| tmoravec wrote:
| Many of the bands. Sticking to power metal and just from the
| top of my head: Rhapsody of Fire and related bands, Avantasia,
| Blind Guardian, Sabaton, Kamelot, Iced Earth, Gloryhammer,
| Ayreon and related bands (not quite power metal but the overlap
| in audience is large I believe)...
|
| I would even guess that in this genre, more albums are concept
| than not.
| agubelu wrote:
| I'd like to use this thread to spread the word of our lord and
| savior Powerwolf. I discovered them just over two years ago and
| they immediately became my favorite band: their mix of themes,
| aesthetic and impressive vocals are amazing. Plus they're a ton
| of fun live and sound just as good :)
| tmtvl wrote:
| I dunno, I got one of their albums on Google Play Music (before
| Google killed it) and it just didn't grab me the way Hammerfall
| or Grand Magus did. The album I picked up is 'Blessed And
| Possessed', so I dunno, maybe I just picked up their
| 'Demolition', to make a Judas Priest parallel.
|
| Which of their albums would you recommend to start with?
| hn_go_brrrrr wrote:
| I really enjoy _Blessed and Possessed_ , so I don't think
| your analogy holds, unfortunately. If you want to give them
| another try, _Sacrament of Sin_ is worth a listen.
| generationP wrote:
| _The Sacrament of Sin_ is their best; almost every song on
| that one is great. It 's one of the rare examples of a band
| that was boring and bland at first and then greatly improved.
| _Call of the Wild_ is a close second. On their other albums I
| like 1-2 tracks each.
| fallinditch wrote:
| For those who like metal and are open to more experimental and
| avant garde, progressive styles I highly recommend the 2023
| albums by Thantifaxath and Blut Aus Nord. But the best metal
| album of 2023 (surely! IMHO) is Terrasite by Cattle Decapitation.
| These bands are producing complex, esoteric, heavy music, no
| dragons.
| LesZedCB wrote:
| terrasite is a phenomenal nomination for AotY 2023.
| awaythrow999 wrote:
| You can't kill the Metal -- TenaciousD
| aerhardt wrote:
| I've commented on a lot of tangential topics in this thread, but
| regarding the article, I find the clustering really impressive. I
| know _a lot_ of these bands and going by feel I broadly agree
| with a lot of the groupings. Perhaps it 's not exhaustive or
| perfect, for example I would intuit Blind Guardian to be much
| closer to Demons & Wizards, because both of those bands share
| lyricists and themes, but the analysis otherwise nails many of
| the tuples. For example, Helloween - Gamma Ray - Masterplan or
| Edguy - Avantasia, where both groupings' bands shared lyricists.
| I also agree with other not-so-obvious groupings like Kamelot -
| Angra - Stratovarius or Falconer - Dream Evil - Hammerfall -
| Nocturnal Rites.
|
| Kudos to the author!
| RajT88 wrote:
| Big metal fan here, as are some of my friends.
|
| The Power Metal genre is less popular here in the US for sure.
| For example as great as the playing is for bands like Rhapsody my
| friends and I always found them too silly to get into.
|
| Some other bands make the cut of course. But why this resistence
| to the genre in general?
|
| My working theory is one of culture: Songs about dragons and shit
| probably resonate a lot better if you grew up in a places filled
| with castles and shit. That is simply not the US and very much is
| Europe.
| coffeebeqn wrote:
| Good question - especially since everything else in that realm
| is quite popular in the US. D&D, lord of the rings etc. Maybe
| it's considered more cheesy here? I remember thinking it was
| kind of cheesy growing up in Europe and listening to various
| types of metal
| a_gnostic wrote:
| Tennessee, Texas, Minnesota, and California have castles. They
| pop up all over the U.S. if you look hard enough. Some of them
| are fassades, and some of them are 100% legit imported organic
| homegrown European.
| RajT88 wrote:
| There was one where I used to live:
|
| https://historicelgin.com/pratts-castle
|
| It was largely unknown in town. Contrast with trips I have
| taken to Europe (yes even work trips) where randomly I would
| come across a castle. For example in Swansea near the train
| station there was a castle a couple blocks from a TGI
| Friday's. It is different over there!
| gs17 wrote:
| https://castlesy.com/ has a big list of "castles" in the US.
| powermetal wrote:
| Its nothing to do with the USA. Older metal genres are in
| general quite niche today. Death metal and black metal is
| ubiquitous everywhere. Power metal and speed metal are
| relatively obscure these days.
| Slartie wrote:
| A friend from the US I got to know on a US-based metal cruise
| (I'm German myself) told me that US metal concerts and European
| concerts are quite different: there's a lot of clapping,
| hopping and similar engagement routines in European concerts,
| while US concerts, at least according to him, apparently are
| more static, with maybe some fist pumping, but otherwise mostly
| people with crossed arms looking serious.
|
| If that's true, there might indeed be a cultural difference in
| the breadth of metal fans from the US and Europe, which might
| as well lead to the more "happy" metal styles like power metal
| be more favored in Europe.
| RajT88 wrote:
| That seems fair. Unless the band has really worked the crowd
| up, which then you might get mosh pits and crowd surfing. I
| saw Haken last night, and it was as you said, bunch of people
| standing around (granted the venue was an old movie theater,
| so it's not like you could move around much with the seats in
| the way). Meshuggah a couple years back was pretty similar.
|
| Bands like GWAR never disappoint, though. Some bands back in
| the day which were like that as well: Pantera, System of a
| Down, Metallica (pre-black album). In Flames recently had a
| decent mosh pit going on when I saw them.
| arrakeen wrote:
| > My working theory is one of culture...
|
| my theory is that because most of the bands are writing lyrics
| in english and it's not their native language, they don't quite
| grasp just HOW ridiculous their lyrics tend to be.
|
| please don't take this as a negative, because to me it's a
| positive. they sing those ridiculous lyrics with full passion
| without a hint of irony-- and that's why i love them. american
| power metal is a bit too wink-wink-nudge-nudge-amirite-guys?
| generationP wrote:
| > For people who might not know, Rhapsody of Fire broke into in
| two bands, one keeping the original name and the other becoming
| Rhapsody.
|
| Ehm, this is not what happened. In 2006 Rhapsody became Rhapsody
| of Fire to avoid some trademark dispute. Then they split around
| 2009, though the main chunk is still called Rhapsody of Fire
| whereas the spinoff is called Luca Turilli's Rhapsody.
| Bahamut wrote:
| The trademark dispute was with the Rhapsody streaming service -
| I don't think it was ever announced, but I suspect the
| streaming service paid them money to change their name since
| the band definitely came first.
| mongrelion wrote:
| I remember when this happened.
|
| I tried googling a bit but I couldn't find quickly enough an
| article that mentions Rhapsody, the streaming service, as the
| other party in the trademark dispute.
|
| However, I do remember the whole thing when it happened
| because I had just discovered the band.
|
| Feels like ages ago
| max_sendfeld wrote:
| Similar post in this context: Symphonic Metal Bands: Nerdiness vs
| Kickassery -- A statistical analysis
|
| https://medium.com/@WolframHempel_82303/symphonic-metal-band...
| at_a_remove wrote:
| I have to say, despite my closest approach to power metal being
| doom/stoner rock, I am very much enjoying everyone geeking out on
| their preferred niche genre. No matter where you look, there's
| history to learn and jargon to master.
| chipuni wrote:
| Yes. Yes, it is really about dragons.
| golergka wrote:
| I know that unique word count is not a perfect way to measure
| "sophistication" of the lyrics, but I still find it funny that
| the "best" metal band has less than a half of Aesop Rock's
| vocabulary given how some metal fans look down on hip-hop.
| (That's not an attack on them, I'm a huge fan of both).
| yumraj wrote:
| Not Power Metal, but I thought I'll take my chances.
|
| Any recommendations for someone who loves _Rammstein_ , despite
| only knowing 2-3 words in German?
|
| I haven't found many while searching for industrial metal.
| dmsayer wrote:
| static-x, especially the older stuff.
| crtified wrote:
| People not familiar with metal music may find it interesting to
| learn that actor Sir Christopher Lee - or, Lord of the Rings's
| "Saruman" - was an active part of the power metal scene in the
| later stages of his life.
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_Lee#Music_career
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