[HN Gopher] Solar and Batteries Make Up 81% of New US Electric-G...
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Solar and Batteries Make Up 81% of New US Electric-Generating
Capacity in 2024
Author : toomuchtodo
Score : 19 points
Date : 2024-02-15 21:45 UTC (1 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (cleantechnica.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (cleantechnica.com)
| JoeAltmaier wrote:
| A neat trend. But still renewables are a small fraction of
| electrical generation capacity in the US. Dominated by gas, even
| the renewable slice (< 20%) is dominated by hydroelectric. Which
| hasn't changed in 50 years, even gone down a bit. Second is wind.
| Solar is a scrap of a scrap.
|
| A long, long way to go to complete renewable energy.
| toomuchtodo wrote:
| https://www.spglobal.com/marketintelligence/en/news-insights...
| ("US Interconnection Queues Analysis 2023")
|
| https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=55960
| ("Renewable generation surpassed coal and nuclear in the U.S.
| electric power sector in 2022")
|
| https://pv-magazine-usa.com/2022/11/02/u-s-to-deploy-550-gw-...
| ("U.S. to deploy 550 GW of new renewables by 2030")
|
| China deployed more solar last year than total US solar
| generation capacity, so while work, it can be done.
|
| https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/chinas-installed-sol...
| ("The country built in excess of 216 gigawatts (GW) of solar
| power this year, the data indicated, underscoring the scale and
| pace of China's solar build out.")
|
| Currently, the U.S. PV manufacturing industry has the capacity
| to produce PV modules to meet nearly a third of US domestic
| demand.
|
| https://www.energy.gov/eere/solar/solar-manufacturing
| nateglims wrote:
| The second link is interesting since it covers actual
| generated energy. The others are kind of convoluted and need
| to be more clear on what the capacity measurement is since
| most renewables have significantly lower capacity factors
| than nuke, gas and coal.
| toomuchtodo wrote:
| Which is why the battery uptake mentioned in this piece is
| of note. It firms renewables and steals grid service
| revenue from thermal generators. Pulls the uptake
| trajectory of renewables closer to vertical.
|
| Only one coal fired generator in the US is currently
| economical to run vs new renewables.
|
| https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2023-03-07/end-of-
| co... | https://archive.today/2owbd
|
| https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/jan/30/us-coal-
| more...
| ThisIsMyAltAcct wrote:
| I think wind dominates hydropower now
|
| https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=427&t=3
| pfdietz wrote:
| Say you don't understand exponential growth without saying you
| don't understand exponential growth.
| JoeAltmaier wrote:
| There's no way solar can grow geometrically for long. It
| consumes real estate like there's no tomorrow. Land is
| limited; sunlight is limited. It has a hard, hard limit.
|
| Unlike many other kinds of power generation, which are land-
| frugal and work 24 hours a day.
|
| So, let's rethink who doesn't understand growth.
| balderdash wrote:
| I think the promising thing is that as we get more batteries on
| the grid, it will enable more renewables penetration as a
| percentage of the grid as a whole
| jacquesm wrote:
| Yes, absolutely, this compound effect is very important. Also
| interesting is that with every EV that gets added to the grid
| this effect improves even for the ones that can't deliver the
| power back later if it is economical to do so. They effectively
| serve as capacitors.
| jacquesm wrote:
| That's nice, but there is a long way to go, also it would
| probably be better to see batteries as a part of the 'storage'
| bracket, after all the batteries don't generate electricity, they
| store it. It's a bit like lumping fields of grain in with bags
| for grain. The one is useful all by itself, the other can't
| function without some other generator doing its job first.
|
| Typically the use for storage in the form of batteries is to play
| arbitrage with power prices around solar noon to farm it back out
| again when power is more expensive, for instance early evening or
| the next morning. Longer term storage also works but tends to be
| more capital expensive and isn't really an option just yet,
| though there are some edge cases where it may already work on
| (slightly) longer timescales.
| danielheath wrote:
| > The one [solar] is useful all by itself
|
| Not in a power-grid context; it'll over-volt the grid sometimes
| and under-volt it other times.
|
| In the specific context of "understanding generation supply to
| a grid", working in terms of "load supplied by a system of
| solar & batteries" makes the math drastically simpler.
| auspiv wrote:
| Nice headline but batteries do not generate electricity
| Animats wrote:
| _" The Gemini solar facility in Nevada plans to begin operating
| in 2024. With a planned photovoltaic capacity of 690 megawatts
| (MW) and battery storage of 380 MW, it is expected to be the
| largest solar project in the United States when fully
| operational."_
|
| That's about 60% of the capacity of one unit at Vogtle nuclear
| power station, and Vogtle has four units.
|
| Also, adding the solar capacity to the battery capacity to get a
| gigawatt makes no sense. Either you're charging the battery,
| which takes power from the solar array, or you're discharging the
| battery because it's dark and the solar array is idle.
| bryanlarsen wrote:
| Gemini took 2 years and cost $1.3B. Vogtle cost $34B for 2
| units and took 12 years for those 2 units.
|
| Edit: Gemini took 4 years from project submission and 2 years
| from construction start. Vogtle took 19 years from project
| submission and 12 years from construction start.
| exoverito wrote:
| In large part because of constantly shifting requirements,
| obstructionism, and various forms of lawfare. The US has
| become terribly inefficient at large infrastructural
| projects, see the CA HSR project which is massively delayed
| and over budget. China does not have this problem, and has
| been rapidly expanding their nuclear capacity.
|
| A standardized reactor design and regulatory certainty would
| enable the economies of scale and accrual of institutional
| knowledge to efficiently build new power plants. In response
| to the 1973 oil crisis, France massively expanded their fleet
| of nuclear reactors which were producing more than 70% of
| their electricity in about 15 years. If the political will is
| there, it can be done.
| bryanlarsen wrote:
| Gemini also qualifies as a large infrastructural project;
| it was delayed by concerns about the tortoises living in
| the area and challenges from local environmental groups.
|
| China does similar projects in about 6 months. IOW, China
| does solar projects about 8X as fast as the US. OTOH it
| does nuclear projects in about 5 years, about 4X as fast as
| the US.
| i_am_proteus wrote:
| I agree that summing the two values to a GW seems disingenuous,
| but there are more scenarios than the two you described.
|
| For instance, it's possible to discharge the battery during the
| day, as well. If peak load is in the afternoon, the plant could
| be charging the battery during the morning and mid-day when
| specific demand on that plant is less than 690 MW, then
| discharge the battery to have (temporary) output of 1 GW.
| barney54 wrote:
| Batteries are not generating capacity.
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(page generated 2024-02-15 23:01 UTC)